Gunsmithing Stupid Question - how to take off J Allen butt stock pic rail

[Baron23]

I'm embarrassed to have to ask....and I will also direct this question to MDT who now owns J Allen IP and is selling some accessories....but I'm trying to get the butt stock off hand/butt stock pic rail off so I can install a J Allen bag rider.

This is the stupid part....its one hex head bolt....but I can't find ANY hex wrench size to fit this little bastard. It is not the same bolt head that is on the bag rider, it seems to be different than any other bolt in the chassis, and I cannot find either an ASE or metric wrench (hey, I had to at least try) to fit.

The bolt head seems to be fine, its not stripped or dinged, but I cannot find a wrench size to fit this sucker.

Has anybody done this and might give me a steer.

And yes, I tend to not work on stuff too much as my super power seems to be that I'm really good at breaking things (and I have examples! haha) so I could use a hand here if anybody has any info they can share with me on this.

Cheers and embarrassed to have to ask.

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

Measure it with a calipers and let us know what the dimension across the flats is.

 

[Baron23]

Measure it with a calipers and let us know what the dimension across the flats is.

By across the flats you mean inside the hex head from one flat to another?

Its small but I will give it a go.

Thanks....and yes, I still feel like an idiot having to ask this question....sigh, just one of the indignities of older age! haha

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

Sure. You said hex head so I figured it looked like this:

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

Or does it look like this:

 

[Baron23]

Or does it look like this:

The later...I should have called it an allen head...or allen key... bolt, perhaps? But yes, the later.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

Yeah, measure it with a calipers if you can. I've found a lot of the screws for attachments are either 1/8" or 3mm.

 

[ForgeValley]

3/32 on mine.

 

[Baron23]

Yeah, measure it with a calipers if you can. I've found a lot of the screws for attachments are either 1/8" or 3mm.

@CavScout85
thanks for taking the time to reply

This is the screw/bolt in question. And yes, 3/32 is damn close but will not slip in far enough to secure a grip on it. You can see just a bit of buggering where I tried to get a 3/32 to fit (used two different sets of allen wrenches).

I measured .092" (2.35mm) inside dimension of the allen head...3/32 is .09375"....but, this is very difficult to measure and I wouldn't put too much emphasis on my .092" figure....I don't have a high grade caliper and the inside dimension jaws of the one I had fit in there but they are a bit fat and I wouldn't say its all that accurate.

I'm suspecting that it is indeed 3/32" as CavScout so kindly replied but that I may have a just slightly off allen head bolt. It seems like with a bit of a light hammer tap I may be able to get the 3/32" in there...but as I said, I'm really talented at screwing stuff up and would hate to end up having to have it drilled out because I completely buggered it.

I have an acquaintance from the club who is a machinist and part time gunsmith....may well be time to visit him, let him pound a 3/32" allen key in there, and move on.

Comments....aside from the fact that I'm a numb nuts? haha

 

[Baron23]

@MinnesotaMulisha
@CavScout85

Ok, never mind! haha

It occurred to me to pull out my Fix-it-Sticks allen a heads and THAT 3/32" fit perfectly and its out now.

I think I need a much better set of allen wrenches and throw the junk I'm using now out. Two sets....neither 3/32" would fit.

So, not only did I say I was an idiot in the posts above.....I just proved it to everybody on the board...sigh.

Have a good night fellas and thanks again for taking the time to reply.

 

[Krob95]

The AI chassis’s have a stupid Allen head size too that unless you have high quality tools, it’s too loose or too tight. It’s a pain dealing with these little screws. Glad you got it figured out!

 

[Baron23]

The AI chassis’s have a stupid Allen head size too that unless you have high quality tools, it’s too loose or too tight. It’s a pain dealing with these little screws. Glad you got it figured out!

Thanks my friend. That indeed appears to be the case. And the Allen keys I have aren’t really junk and I have never had an issue w them...until now.

But they certainly aren’t professional quality.

I’m not even sure I like this dang bag rider! LOL.

I’ll give it a try when I get back next week from a GA quail hunt. But, if I put the pic rail back on, at least now I have an Allen I know fits.

Hope you and yours are still doing well.
cheers

 

[PinesAndProjectiles]

@MinnesotaMulisha
@CavScout85

Ok, never mind! haha

It occurred to me to pull out my Fix-it-Sticks allen a heads and THAT 3/32" fit perfectly and its out now.

I think I need a much better set of allen wrenches and throw the junk I'm using now out. Two sets....neither 3/32" would fit.

So, not only did I say I was an idiot in the posts above.....I just proved it to everybody on the board...sigh.

Have a good night fellas and thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Bondhus Allen wrenches. You can buy a set that has both standard and metric. Best Allen wrenches I've used and you don't have to finance them for three years to put the Snap On guys kids through college.

Metric & Inch Hex (Allen) Balldriver® Long Arm L-Wrench Combo Set, 22pcs .050” to 3/8

www.suncoasttools.com

 

[Baron23]

Bondhus Allen wrenches. You can buy a set that has both standard and metric. Best Allen wrenches I've used and you don't have to finance them for three years to put the Snap On guys kids through college.

Metric & Inch Hex (Allen) Balldriver® Long Arm L-Wrench Combo Set, 22pcs .050” to 3/8

www.suncoasttools.com

Thank you for the recommendation and link. I believe I will get a set.

Cheers