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UNCOMMANDED STRIKER PISTOL DISCHARGES

Edsel

Edsel

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Minuteman
Jun 9, 2013
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#1


In the wake of the SIG P320 drama, there's been a whole bunch of these types of videos online.

Way too many.

Looking at what he's doing...

1754193433550.png


...loading the trigger on this particular Glock with a fastener does the following:

1754193366038.png


1. Negates the Trigger Safety (dingus)
2. Negates the Firing Pin Block
3. Negates the Drop Safety
a. Negates the "Soft Primer Strike Safety" by fully loading the Striker​
b. Negates proper "Sear Engagement"​

What is the point of this maneuver, though?

In a loaded / cocked Glock with the finger off the trigger, safeties 1. through 3b. are doing their thing.

When "riding the reset," you negate 1. and 2., but safeties 3a. and 3b. perform their functions (well, if you’re really good - maybe only 3b.).

When tensing the trigger with that fastener, you're leaving the sear 3b. hanging by the skin of its teeth, something hard to do with your finger in practice because of that final “10% hump” (see subsequent posts below).

What exactly are these Glock videos trying to prove?
 
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#3
Makinchips208 said:
Is the point just to show that safeties CAN be defeated and you can get something happen?

Maybe he is lampooning the following video?

Click to expand...


Maybe…

They end up demonstrating that one has to go to great convoluted lengths to get these multiple consecutive safeties to fail (in Glocks, at least).

I took out my special cutaway Glock 19 just to gaze upon its inner workings again, and to make myself feel superior to all others
LAUGHTER_05.gif
 
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#6
IMG_6947.jpeg


Fired, striker released.

IMG_6948.jpeg


Cocked, maybe 50% tension?

IMG_6949.jpeg


Trigger to the wall, maybe 50% + 40% tension, additional 10% to overcome that final hump before actually firing?

IMG_6950.jpeg


Very light pressure on trigger, sear displaced slightly posteriorly and inferiorly. Maybe 3/4 to as much as the entire sear’s thickness engaging the striker in the absence of any pressure on the trigger.

IMG_6951.jpeg


More pressure on trigger. More movement posteriorly and inferiorly, less of the sear’s total thickness engaging the striker.

IMG_6952.jpeg


Right before firing. Hanging not so much by the skin of its teeth (see first post), as there’s still that final “10% hump” to overcome prior to actually releasing the striker.



An actual video!
 
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#7
Edsel said:
View attachment 8739908

Fired, striker released.

View attachment 8739909

Cocked, maybe 50% tension?

View attachment 8739910

Trigger to the wall, maybe 50% + 40% tension, additional 10% to overcome that final hump before actually firing?

View attachment 8739913

Very light pressure on trigger, sear displaced slightly posteriorly and inferiorly. Maybe 3/4 to as much as the entire sear’s thickness engaging the striker in the absence of any pressure on the trigger.

View attachment 8739914

More pressure on trigger. More movement posteriorly and inferiorly, less of the sear’s total thickness engaging the striker.

View attachment 8739915

Right before firing. Hanging by the skin of its teeth, but there’s still that final “10% hump” to overcome prior to actually releasing the striker.



An actual video!
Click to expand...

That’s really cool. Does it have the ability to see the channel that the part of the sear rides in to keep it from disengaging the striker until far enough back?
 
#8
Makinchips208 said:
That’s really cool. Does it have the ability to see the channel that the part of the sear rides in to keep it from disengaging the striker until far enough back?
Click to expand...

IMG_6957.png


You can see part of the cruciform section at work from the rear, but it’s kind of tight…

Difficult getting the area illuminated with a flashlight and capturing and image with the phone simultaneously :ROFLMAO:
 
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#10
I usually carry a Glock 33 as a pocket pistol but with an empty chamber.
My Sig 1911 in 357 Sig on the other hand always has a loaded chamber.
My Sig P320 in 357 Sig is a Frankenstein built from two separate Sig P320's and has an external safety.
It is carried with a loaded chamber.
As a trained Root Cause Investigator, I can tell you human observation and memory of what occurred is the last place one looks for objective evidence of what occurred.
I believe most (All?) of these non-commaned discharges are the result of holster interference or mis management of routine cleaning and incorrect reassembly.
The Remington Trigger comes to mind where I actually witnessed an uncommanded discharge.
Checking sights before deer hunting, my God Son's 700 was sitting in the rests loaded and discharged.
His recollection is that he DID NOT touch the trigger but no amount of testing could replicate the uncommanded discharge.
Therefore no firearm is 100% safe and a long as you have it pointed away from a person, you should be OK.
Spontaneous discharge in a holster is most likely due to interference that may or may not be replicated.
-Richard
 
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#12
Budrichard said:
I usually carry a Glock 33 as a pocket pistol but with an empty chamber.
My Sig 1911 in 357 Sig on the other hand always has a loaded chamber.
My Sig P320 in 357 Sig is a Frankenstein built from two separate Sig P320's and has an external safety.
It is carried with a loaded chamber.
As a trained Root Cause Investigator, I can tell you human observation and memory of what occurred is the last place one looks for objective evidence of what occurred.
I believe most (All?) of these non-commaned discharges are the result of holster interference or mis management of routine cleaning and incorrect reassembly.
The Remington Trigger comes to mind where I actually witnessed an uncommanded discharge.
Checking sights before deer hunting, my God Son's 700 was sitting in the rests loaded and discharged.
His recollection is that he DID NOT touch the trigger but no amount of testing could replicate the uncommanded discharge.
Therefore no firearm is 100% safe and a long as you have it pointed away from a person, you should be OK.
Spontaneous discharge in a holster is most likely due to interference that may or may not be replicated.
-Richard
Click to expand...
Remmington knew they had a defective trigger. The bean counters didn't want to spend the additional 5 cents per rifle it would cost to put Mr Walkers redesign into production.

I have never heard of any of the other popular striker fired pistols going off while in a proper holster.
Like someone once said " I never experienced a tire blowout but there is enough evidence out on the highways that they occur much more frequently than we think."
 
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#16
Thump_rrr said:
Remmington knew they had a defective trigger. The bean counters didn't want to spend the additional 5 cents per rifle it would cost to put Mr Walkers redesign into production.

I have never heard of any of the other popular striker fired pistols going off while in a proper holster.
Like someone once said " I never experienced a tire blowout but there is enough evidence out on the highways that they occur much more frequently than we think."
Click to expand...
Exactly. Lack of experience does not change reality.
 
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#17
Thump_rrr said:
Like someone once said " I never experienced a tire blowout but there is enough evidence out on the highways that they occur much more frequently than we think."
Click to expand...

"Ah dun handloaded hunnerds o' thousands o' rounds evah since muh granpappy taught me, an' never heard this here problem."

But none of us have handloaded hundreds of thousands of rounds for hundreds of thousands of different chambers.

Sometimes, it's just cognitive bias, a big frog croaking in a tiny little rain puddle kind of thing :ROFLMAO:

Doesn't help that we're predisposed to this because of our manifest destiny and innate exceptionalism brainwashing from an early age...
 
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#20
While I believe that most striker pistols are perfectly safe for combat/ duty use, this does help reinforce my belief that hammer fired pistols are superior. In essence we are already carrying single action pistols with some striker fired designs so I’d rather just carry a 1911 or 2011 cocked and locked, or what I believe to be the most reliable pistol ever devised, the HK USP in that same fashion. These other videos are pretty silly though, The SIG 320 design is inherently flawed and unsafe due to its fully pre-cocked striker, lack of a trigger dingus, trigger and trigger guard dimensions, as well as a potential design flaw. You have to bypass the trigger dingus of a Glock to make it function as they demonstrate in the video and inadvertent contact with the trigger is highly unlikely to make that happen on a Glock.
 
#21
JCS 4052 said:
While I believe that most striker pistols are perfectly safe for combat/ duty use, this does help reinforce my belief that hammer fired pistols are superior. In essence we are already carrying single action pistols with some striker fired designs so I’d rather just carry a 1911 or 2011 cocked and locked, or what I believe to be the most reliable pistol ever devised, the HK USP in that same fashion. These other videos are pretty silly though, The SIG 320 design is inherently flawed and unsafe due to its fully pre-cocked striker, lack of a trigger dingus, trigger and trigger guard dimensions, as well as a potential design flaw. You have to bypass the trigger dingus of a Glock to make it function as they demonstrate in the video and inadvertent contact with the trigger is highly unlikely to make that happen on a Glock.
Click to expand...
Brother a 1911/2011 design is my favorite design and I build a bunch for friends and family but it has a problem of hammer follow you just don’t normally get with a Glock so o can’t say it’s superior for reliability. However if built with the best tool steel parts it comes damm close

As to the USP. Just freaking bulletproof but I hate how high they sit in your hand

Sig 320 I won’t allow on range I run. Just too many instances of bang for no legitimate explanation. Shame because another bulletproof weapon is a Sig 226
 
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