100yard vrs 50yard groups

[haptoshoot]

It seems that I have sorted out the problems with my new MK II TR and it is shooting similar groups to my custom 10/22. Now I want to get down to some serious work at 100yards before moving to 200 yards.

I have shot three targets for each rifle at 100 yards recently both shoot in the low 240's for the 100 yard comp.

As I look at the group size at 100 it is right at 3 inches for 25 shots. At 50 yards it shoots .75 for a 25 shot group.

Is it typical that the 100 yard groups are more than double the 50 yard groups? As I look at the shooters that are scoring high 240's and Carters 250's the groups are a bit smaller......I was wondering how much smaller their 50 yard groups arecompared to 100yards.

i have not done any long range ammo testing yet. Just using Wolf MT not sorted which is what shot best at shorter distance.

I am asking this as I want to know what I'm aiming for group wise.

 

[buffybuster]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

While Wolf MT is excellent ammo for the price and gives good groups at 50yds, the larger ES will show up in larger groups at 100 and 200yds. The real match 22lr ammo has a much tighter ES with translates into tighter groups. Also the wind begins to play a large factor at 100yds and beyond.

 

[skatz11]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

Past 50 yards I think that wind becomes a big factor for 22LR. For 25 shot groups thats pretty impressive if you ask me. Give 200 yards a try, its a lot of fun watching the bullets drop onto the target.

 

[haptoshoot]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

I did not mention that my vertical spread is 3MOA ot 100yards and windage is 1 MOA in calm or steady wind. I am shooting prone using a 6inch bipod and rear bag. I am sure some of it is me.....

I am just amazed at a .4 moa vertical spread at 50 yards and a 3 MOA spread at 100. I expected it to be closer to 2x larger not 6x larger! i am extpecting to test more and better ammo at 100 yards sonn and then learn to sort it if needed.

with the right sun angle im enjoying seeing the bullet and its shadow converge on the target at 100! Wat cool. Still need a t 20 moa base to get to 200...

 

[TOP PREDATOR]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

haptoshoot, try shooting it with a rear bag, you'll notice them shrink up a bit. of course the comps we shoot are without rear support, but with the rear bag from a bench you'll see a difference.

i'm still a little hestitant believing when i hear of the mkii doing moa at 100 yards, as with all the time and ammos i've tried with mine, the best i clicked off was 1.75" outside edge group.

so far in all the rimfire spots i visit i hear the 1" group thing, but never a photo of it. that's not saying someone will shoot at 50 and call it 100. still, when it comes to a 25 round string, there's usually that 1 or 2 rounds that messes up the "wonder group" at 100, and i 'd wager it's tough to keep 25 rounds in an 1" at 50 yards time after time consistantly from anything less than a benchrest rig.

i'd say in reality 2" to 2.5" would be a good group at 100 yards, with anything less than 2" being a great group.

 

[woogie_man]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

Just go to the range and do it

I have started the same way you did.... not really knowing what would happen. I have since been able to hit at 100 yards, 200 yards, and a few at 300 yards. Now mind you, that no real groups were taken, but at the 200 yard mark I was hitting clay pigeons with each shot.

I am usina a Russian CM-2 single shot target rifle.

I am sure that your rifle will do the same.... just go out and give it a try. It is a blast to hear the shot, and then a bit later hear the ring from the target. And even better to see the looks on peoples faces when they realize what you are shooting, and how far you are shooting.

 

[SmallBoreSnipers]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

For me it's totally visual. If I shoot 25 rounds at the 2.5" gong, my group will be about 2.5" (excluding a couple misses). If I shoot for points I'll usually put 25 into about a 2" group. Aim small miss small. This is why I turn the target over to draw a smaller circle on the competition targets. I usually draw it in red. My eyes seem to really like that over black. At 50 I'm putting 25 rounds in about 1". I wouldn't really worry about your groups too much. They're pretty good to me. JMO.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: buffybuster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">While Wolf MT is excellent ammo for the price and gives good groups at 50yds, the larger ES will show up in larger groups at 100 and 200yds. The real match 22lr ammo has a much tighter ES with translates into tighter groups.</div></div>

My experience exactly...

Low ES trumps "what my rifle likes" at 50 yards once you get out there.

 

[JoeMartin]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

I figure at my age (54) and with my eyesight now, my groups are going to open up. Still, looking at the reality of the shooting I'm doing,,, acceptable groups at 25 & 50 yards with open iron and peeps, along with pretty much staying in the black with open iron sights & peeps at 100 yards, as well as hitting a 5" circle gong with a scope from 200 yards on average of 88% to 92% of the time out of 25 shots,,, I'll take this. Afterall, I'm still doing it with a .22lr just like you are.

Also, we'll all have highs and lows in our shooting, but that's what keeps it interesting.

 

[haptoshoot]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

I appreciate all of the feedback. As always some great nugets of informaton that will help out.

However it appears that I was not clear when asking my original question .......

How much do your group sizes increase when moving from 50 to 100 yards. Mine increase from just under MOA to roughy 3 moa at 100 yards is this to be expected as a caracteristic of the 22 lr.I am refering to 10 shot groups and a rough average of all. Not refering to my best 3 shot groups.

Thanks

 

[haptoshoot]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TOP PREDATOR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">haptoshoot, try shooting it with a rear bag, you'll notice them shrink up a bit. of course the comps we shoot are without rear support, but with the rear bag from a bench you'll see a difference....... </div></div>

BUSTED......I am embarassed to admit that I have been shooting the 100 comps with a rear bag. Your post encoraged me to re read the rules for all comps. Not sure why i thought we could shoot 100/200 yards suported. My bad. After reading this I shot several 100yrd targets this week unsuported and actually scored a few points higher than Ive been shooting supported recently.

It seems that I was able to ride the stock and follow through after the shot better than when supported. This is exactly the oposite of what I expected.
I 've also noted when working on prone position at 50/100 yards that it is quicker for me to get back to a natural POA when shooting with a sling vrs bipod.

Just when I think I'm starting to understand and get it.............

 

[Elian_BHZ]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

The opposite happens to me.

For example im shooting 2 or 3 m.o.a average groups at 50 meters and i get better groups at 100 or 150 groups for example 1,5 o 2 m.o.a grops.

Graphical example: At 50 meters 1 and 1/4 inch group and at 100 meters 1.5 inch group.

It supposed the group sould be worse at more distance. That is something that use to happen to me and a friend shooting with a CZ 452 Varmint / and a CZ 452 Lux, both using 4-16x50 mildot scopes ...

Weird isn't it ?

 

[buffybuster]

Re: 100yard vrs 50yard groups

Here's an old thread of mine about 100, 200, 300yd accuracy.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthre...true#Post927035