Range Report 155 A-Max issues

McLarenross

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Hey guys. Im having hell at 800 with the 155 A-Max. Here is my load, 308 Win, 155 A-Max, Winchester Brass, CCI primer, 46.3gr RL-15, Remington 700 20" barrel. Chrony says I am averaging 2775fps with this load.

Actual dopes

100 - 0
200 - +0.6
300 - +1.3
400 - +2.4
500 - +3.9
600 - +4.9
700 - +6.3
800 - ????

JBM says to get that trajectory I the bullet is actually going only 2600fps using the G7 BC of .212, and it is super sonic to about 900 yards.

Yesterday I was working the rifle out and had no issues getting a modest group out to 700. The wind was absolutly calm, there was a storm about 6 hours out so I was shooting in the calm before it hit. Im shooting a cardboard box that is 2 feet wide and 6 feet tall with a black aiming point at the top. When I moved back to 800 I shot 5 rounds and went down to check the target and there were no shots on the target with 7.3mils dialed. I thought that was weird, and maybe I still shot under the target?? So I went back to the line and dialed it up to 7.7mils and shot another 5 rounds. Still nothing on paper. WTF?? SO I thought maybe I am over adjusting and shooting over the target. So I dialed it back down to 7.0mils and put an aiming point in the middle of the card board and shot 5 more. This time I got one clean hole about 0.8mil low and one keyhole about 1 mil low but no clue where the other 3 shots went. What the hell is going on?? Is the bullet going subsonic earlier than I think and massively destabilizing and going all over the place? Does the 155 A-Max suffer the same issues as the 168 SMK when it goes subsonic? Ive got some 155 SMK 2155s, should I try them? Their G7 is only 0.002 higher and they are not as consistent bullet to bullet as the A-maxs.
 

DALLAS ROOTS

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

You need lapua 155 scenars, the amax is shaped like a football. 2700fps out of a 20" is way to slow, drop those amaxs and get some Lapua and push them around 2800 to 2900 to get the BC of a 175smk. Which is going to be in the 45 to 4fgr and up area.
 

McLarenross

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

Yea I know. Damn Scenars are twice the price of the A-Maxs though. Im a cheap ass! I guess Ill break down and buy a box.

Where are you getting yours? I cant find them in less than 1000rd bulk boxes right now.
 

vman

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

Scenars are twice the price of a-maxs?

Jeeez you americans must have good price on local stuff ey

Here in australia, 100 scenars costs me $56, 100 amax's costs me around $75 !!!
 

9H_Cracka

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

Brian Litz's web site does a pretty good job of documenting what a turd the 155 AMAX is compared to the other 155-155.5 offerings available.

A red tipped turd, by any other name, is still a turd. And flies like a turd.
 

McLarenross

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

So is that my issue? Why is the 178 A-Max so great in comparison to the 155? Side by side they are very similar except for length. They both have the same boat tail, the same ogive length, same tangent ogive, even the same red tip!!! Would I really benefit from switching to the 155 Matchking 2155 just due to bullet design?
 

9H_Cracka

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

Skip the 2155; the 2156, Scenar, and 155.5 Berger are where you need to be sniffing around, along with upping your velocity at least 100 FPS.

I love the 2155 - accurate, not picky, easy to load. The others eclipse it (and the AMAX) in down range retained velocity and wind drift, so are worth the effort to get them shooting well given the situation you are trying to resolve.
 

ChadTRG42

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

There are higher BC options than the 155 A-max. But you're running the 155 A-max pretty slow right now. If you up your charge and get more speed, you will be alright. Look in the 308 Win loads section, and you'll get a good idea on where you need to be. If you can get 2850-2900 fps, you should be ok.
 

MitchAlsup

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: McLarenRoss</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Man your killing me. I have 500 of the 2155s. </div></div>

I always found the 2155s accurate and perfectly capable inside 500 yards or so. So, run through these, and when they run out, get a lot (1K) of the more modern 155s and see what happens then.
 

JamieD

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I ran them in my .308 your years and did well out to 1000. It was 24" and was a little warm on the load at 2900fps. I really like how explosive they were on Varmints. Not the highest BC but a good bullet.

JamieD
 

McLarenross

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ChadTRG42</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are higher BC options than the 155 A-max. But you're running the 155 A-max pretty slow right now. If you up your charge and get more speed, you will be alright. Look in the 308 Win loads section, and you'll get a good idea on where you need to be. If you can get 2850-2900 fps, you should be ok. </div></div>

I worked all the way up to around 2850fps but accuracy was dropping off and I was starting to get sticky bolt lift. I was using .mil brass then though and have switched to Winchester brass so I will go back and rework up and see what happens. Ill do it with the 2155s too cause I am outta the A-Maxs.
 

softcock

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

..." <span style="font-style: italic">I worked all the way up to around 2850fps but accuracy was dropping off and I was starting to get sticky bolt lift</span>."
.
(imho) your Only issue with you not being happy with all your workup is your Barrel . you are wasting your time with load workup's with any brand of 155's . ( You have a 20" Barrel ) & you will 'Never' get the Vel. needed to make you happy before pressure climbs . Because (inho) if you can not do in the High 2900 fps.vel. & more with 155's you are wasting your time and need to stick to 175 ' or similar weight bullets with the 2700 fps vel. that will perform .
155's & .308 are nothing new. To do it 'Right' on the barrel length, you need (24-inch of 'Bore' length) to make it worth your while or don't do the 155's . Speed is your friend with 155's and that is it's only upper-hand, & it is a good upper-hand to have. But you wont get it with a 20" barrel .
.
 

Mr Flannel

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: _9H</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Brian Litz's web site does a pretty good job of documenting what a turd the 155 AMAX is compared to the other 155-155.5 offerings available.

A red tipped turd, by any other name, is still a turd. And flies like a turd. </div></div>

Now THAT's funny.

x1 - get rid of the A-Maxes, I've found them to stink in many weights and sizes
 

Wild_Bill

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

We have had all sourts of trouble with A Max's we have even had lead in the bore of 223's with 80gr a MAx's the only thing we can work out is split jackets as they are completly encapsulated. if you get a good batch and they suit your individual barrel they are OK but it also says something that Hornady is looking at a non tipped 225gr Match HPBT and 285gr 338 HPBT projectiles and not A MAx's because of the issues and problems making them perfect batch to batch. if youy like Hornady try some of the new 178gr HPBT projectiles or like others have said the new 155gr MatchKing or the lapua they work well with a BC close to the 175-178's and extra velocity can be obtained. Also try some ALpua cases they handle pressure better than Win cases and might help you with velocity. Also what powder are you using? try Varget or H4895 they should give you a good compromise of velocity and lower pressure.
 

quickdraw

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I just came back in from shooting some 155gr A-Max. I'm shooting a Rem 700LTR with a 20" barrel. At 2600', 85-90*, Lapua brass Varget powder they are running right at 3000fps. I was getting consistant hits on steel out to 1000 meters with about 39moa.I have found them to shoot nice and buck the wind OK also.
 

softcock

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

Your getting 3000 vel with a 20" barrel ? & 39 moa holdover & 155's @ 3-k vel. does not sound right ? . Do you mean 29.0 moa ???
I am doing 1-k @ 28.25 moa holdover . with 155 vld's and 3020 Vel. . no way the Amax-155 are that big a turd compared the the 155vld's @ 1-k ?
.
 

quickdraw

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I took my soft dope off of "Shooter" on my phone. Showed 38.5 for my rifle with 155"s moving 3000fps. Got prone and shot and I ended up at 39moa. When I just run soft dope with JBM it shows 33moa. Shooter factors in my rifle also and ended up almost right on target. I was also running some 168gr A-Max at 2700fps. 1000 meters Shooter showed 42.5moa and I ended up at 43moa.
 

chpprguy

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I am running 155 Amax's out of a 22" Rock with no issues...
consistent hits to ~ 1200 yards ( I am 7300' ASL)
running Varget and getting a pretty consistent 2880 fps
9 mils elevation to 1000 yards....FWIW

For some reason (I think it's me) I can shoot a better group at 300 than I can at 100 yards and they shoot better when I run my can....
 

Grump

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

M1A medium heavy barrel and I could not get ANY 155s to work reliably well. 1.3 MOA was the best, IIRC. Sierra 2155s, Noslers (I think), A-Max, a few Lapuas, and even a box of old Bergers.

Three different powders, two primers. I really tried.

Even tried bumping velocity to an unsafe 2850 fps or more and accuracy dropped to 2.5 and 3 MOA.

Maybe it was because my barrels (two of them, BTW) were a bit long in the throat and I was loading to mag length and none of them really jump that well. But I've heard too many tales of others jumping them just fine.

But your account of a keyhole at only 800 yards??? Where are you, the bottom of Death Valley?
 

Blaster4

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

there are a bunch of things you could try...like a different powder...brass...seating depth...etc.

I agree you with what some others have stated that with a 20" barrel you should be running a bullet with a better BC...The guys I see running 155gr anything at matches is always running it fast...like mentioned above 2900+fps...

I tried to do the light bullet thing early on in my competitive career...I worked up a great 155 load that was super fast and a great 178 load that was as fast as it could get safely...bottom line in the wind...the real wind...the heavier bullet was always tighter...always. I would shoot in the same conditions with both and the 155's woould just leak off the edge at 1K either one side or the other while the 178's would hit inside the edge.

To be honest unless I shot Palma I would never ever think of running a 155 at long range ever again. the 168 is even better than a 155 and nobody even uses that unless you can crank it over 3k...

unless you are above sea level...like over 2500' its not gonna be a fun day.

Respectfully,

KJ
 

mavrick10_2000

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dallas12</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You need lapua 155 scenars, the amax is shaped like a football. 2700fps out of a 20" is way to slow, drop those amaxs and get some Lapua and push them around 2800 to 2900 to get the BC of a 175smk. Which is going to be in the 45 to 4fgr and up area. </div></div>

He's not going to get 2900 FPS with a Scenar or AMAX out of that barrel with Varget he'll get closer with RL15 but still not there. My 26" SPS could get Scenars and Amax up to about 2943 at 26". With the same load at 47.4gr Varget I'm getting 2783 once I had the barrel chopped to 20".

Some after market barrels like, Rock, Bartlein, Schneider, Broughton could get close or do it at 20" but not with a factory Remmy pipe.

JBM was within .1 mil for me at that distance. Go with JBM and adjust accordingly. It won't be much more than .1-.2 mils difference IME.
 

McLarenross

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

So whats yalls consensus? With my rifle do I need to keep working on the 155s(Scenar) or should I jump to the 175-178 class? I havent shot any 178 A-Maxs cause I cant find them(common problem) but the 175 SMKs just didnt do it in this rifle.
 

Blaster4

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I would go online and find some 178 AMAX's...order up a few boxes and enjoy the rest of the shooting season. 178's and Varget are a match made in Heaven.

Respectfully,

--KJ
 

Rob01

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: McLarenRoss</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I havent shot any 178 A-Maxs cause I cant find them(common problem) </div></div>

Not if your search skills are up to snuff.
wink.gif
Check Gun Stop www.gunstop.com
 

Rob01

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

2600fps should do it but you shouldn't have a problem getting more velocity. I run them around 2700fps pushed by Varget.
 

Rob01

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Re: 155 A-Max issues

I only use Varget but I have heard of others using RL15 and getting good results.