Range Report 175/185 Berger Otm, or other? .308

[demolitionman]

I've got a 308 that is an absolute hammer with 175smk's. I'm not interested in shooting solids like the Werner flatlines but I am looking to make a bullet change to step up in bc from my trusty smk. Are the Berger Juggernauts aka OTM's in the 175 and 185 variety still top of the rung or have other .30 cal eclipsed even those? I've been real into 6.5 for most of my shooting career and am not real up on .30 caliber 308 bullet choices. VARGET will be the propellant used.

 

[308pirate]

Might want to go the other direction and look at 155 grain Palma bullets. Run the ballistics on any of them @ 2950 - 3000 fps (achievable in a 24" barrel) and compare them to a high BC 175 - 185 bullet going 2600 - 2650.

Obviously if you can push Berger 185s to over 2700 fps you win but the recoil may be harsh.

 

[mark5pt56]

Look into PP2000MR and the 185's. When I had my 22" WInchester (.308) I was slinging them over 2700, no pressure, but I knew they were at the top end. I don't recall the charge weight but they did very well at 1k. I had a truck axle barrel and a Badger brake-glad I did.--actually not bad but stout.

 

[Dave62677]

43.5 varget 185jugg = 2725fps out of my 27" bbl

 

[308pirate]

Look into PP2000MR and the 185's. When I had my 22" WInchester (.308) I was slinging them over 2700, no pressure, but I knew they were at the top end. I don't recall the charge weight but they did very well at 1k. I had a truck axle barrel and a Badger brake-glad I did.--actually not bad but stout.

Do you recall any dope for that load? Running JBM on a Berger 185 @ 2700 it's still outperformed to 1000 in drop and drift by a Sierra 155 2156 @ 2950

 

[rijndael]

43.5 varget 185jugg = 2725fps out of my 27" bbl

Who made the brass?

 

[gigamortis]

I've recently switched from 178 Amax to 175 Berger OTMs. Currently running 42.5gr Varget in Lapua brass at 2.850" jumping .020". . They are flying at 2730 fps out of my 26" Shilen barrel. This is 60fps faster than my node with the 178 Amax. The Bergers show less pressure signs due to their shorter bearing surface. Reportedly, the 175 OTMs were developed with the goal of being jump friendly at mag length and fly through the trans sonic zone cleanly. The front shape of the OTMs remind me a lot of the 175 MK, but the boat tail is longer for a better BC. Think of the 175 OTM as a MK on steroids.

 

[mark5pt56]

Do you recall any dope for that load? Running JBM on a Berger 185 @ 2700 it's still outperformed to 1000 in drop and drift by a Sierra 155 2156 @ 2950

I don't, sorry.

 

[Dave62677]

Who made the brass?

Lapua ,

i got 2725fps out of my trued R700 action 308match chamber w/27" par-nor bbl.

for the exact ammo, i only got 2660 out of my AXMC 24" 308 bbl.

 

[tnichols]

I've got a 308 that is an absolute hammer with 175smk's. I'm not interested in shooting solids like the Werner flatlines but I am looking to make a bullet change to step up in bc from my trusty smk. Are the Berger Juggernauts aka OTM's in the 175 and 185 variety still top of the rung or have other .30 cal eclipsed even those? I've been real into 6.5 for most of my shooting career and am not real up on .30 caliber 308 bullet choices. VARGET will be the propellant used.

Whats your barrel length and twist rate? 185 Juggs were extremely accurate in my 20” AI, BUT, it has a1:12 twist and the barrel length really hampered being able to push them. Twist rate was marginal for that bullet.

 

[FCS]

Do you recall any dope for that load? Running JBM on a Berger 185 @ 2700 it's still outperformed to 1000 in drop and drift by a Sierra 155 2156 @ 2950

I've yet to see a 155 SMK 2156 win the drift battle over a 185 Juggernaut in the real world..

I ran #s at JBM:
Berger 185 @ 2700:
1000 yards the drop is 346.1", drift is 81.9" and energy is 740 ft lbs.

Sierra 155 2156 @ 2950:
1000 yards the drop is 330.5", drift is 98.3" and energy is 521 ft lbs.

SMK 155 2156 wins drop but does not win drift or energy on target at 1K yards. SMK 155 2156 has 16.4" more drift than does the 185 Berger but the SMK is 15.6" flatter. I'll take improved wind drift, I can get pretty good ranges with LRFs. Wind conditions between me and 1K are a bit harder to get a good reading on.

Berger 185 is inside of 155 SMK at every distance.
Berger 185 (1831.6 fps @ 600 yds) has more velocity than the SMK 155 (1832.1 fps @ 600 yds) past 600 yards.
Berger 185 @ 1K yards has 1342 fps, SMK 155 @ 1K has 1231 fps.
Past 1200, not really a practical range for 308, the Berger 185 has less drop and drift than 155 SMK.
185 Berger is 1250 fps at just under 1100 yards, 155 SMK is 1250 fps just under 1000 yards.

If majority of the OPs shooting is 600 or less, I can see a possible advantage to 155s.

OP, short answer is the 185 Juggernaut is the knee of curve bullet you are looking for to improve performance of your 308, IMHO.

What chamber is in rifle?
What is OAL of Berger 185 to touch lands? Berger 185 doesn't mind jump either but more as a data point to know how much case capacity you'll have to work with.
What magazine system are you running, max OAL mag system will feed?
What is maximum length of loaded round that will pass through the magazine cutout in receiver?
Twist rate of barrel?
Barrel length?

Ballistic calculators are great but in real world where one has to deal with conditions, bigger bullets with higher BCs tend to win at distance. YMMV

 

[Timo Turl]

Perhaps consider the 175gr TMK ?

 

[Jin308to408]

I'm using 185 otm with 41.5 H4895 from 27inch barrel, with 11.25. get exactly 2700. shoot 1000 yards no problem.

 

[jbailey]

Berger 185gr Hybrid. 308 Lapua Palma brass. 2000MR. 31" barrel from a long action. Absolute hammer at 2850fps. Now I run the 198gr Warner Flatline in this setup and that load steps all over the Berger 185gr load. The Flatlines are 'special' but for normal swaged bullets, I really the the Hybrids.

 

[JoeBUtah]

Berger 185 Juggernauts on top of something like 42 gr of 4064 has been my go to for the past couple of years. Makes me look like genious behind it: ragged holes at 100 and hits to 1000...

 

[Rob01]

178 ELD-M and also 178 BTHPs also work great to 1000+. I have been using the 178 BTHP a lot in handloads and the Superformance load and they do great. The Superformance load gets them at 2805fps from my 20"which is crazy but my handloads with Varget are in the 2700fps area. Both hit 1000 easily.