I posted yesterday, asking about steel quality issues with 1903s and 1917s. Now that I have gotten that answer, my next is, is there any major difference making one better than the other? I can remember my grand father saying that he had preferred the 1917, because it cocked on the close, making follow up shots faster. Is one of the guns better than the other, or is it just personal preference?
- Thread starter BigPappaG
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Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
Depends on what you want to do with it. The big advantage of the 03s is windage adjustable. Personally, I dont like cock on close, but some do. I have both, have shot both competitively and if given the choice, its an 03a3 for me, then the 03, then the 17.
Depends on what you want to do with it. The big advantage of the 03s is windage adjustable. Personally, I dont like cock on close, but some do. I have both, have shot both competitively and if given the choice, its an 03a3 for me, then the 03, then the 17.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
The 1917 is a stronger action. The sights are easier to see than the 03, but about the same as the 03A3, for young eyes. It was only the very early 03's that had metalergy problems because of heat treat. Albert York is supposed to have used the 1917 when he earned his MOA. Though the movie shows the 1903. A 1917 action is fast as you are not slowed by cocking the bolt on opening the action. It's not that hard to close if you are young. As we get older and the eyes get bad, we tend to like the 1917 more the the 03 and even the 03a3 as the front sight is easier to see.
The 1917 is a stronger action. The sights are easier to see than the 03, but about the same as the 03A3, for young eyes. It was only the very early 03's that had metalergy problems because of heat treat. Albert York is supposed to have used the 1917 when he earned his MOA. Though the movie shows the 1903. A 1917 action is fast as you are not slowed by cocking the bolt on opening the action. It's not that hard to close if you are young. As we get older and the eyes get bad, we tend to like the 1917 more the the 03 and even the 03a3 as the front sight is easier to see.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
If you look at the results from the CMP National matches and Eastern and Western games, for the vintage class, the 1917 seems to be the favorite U.S. rifle to use.
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=5690&eventID=14&awardID=1
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=6478&eventID=3&awardID=1
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=7812&eventID=3&awardID=1
If you look at the results from the CMP National matches and Eastern and Western games, for the vintage class, the 1917 seems to be the favorite U.S. rifle to use.
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=5690&eventID=14&awardID=1
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=6478&eventID=3&awardID=1
http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/report_eventAward.cgi?matchID=7812&eventID=3&awardID=1
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
It was Alvin York not Albert. He made a comment once about using an English rifle. His unit was issued 1917 when they got to Europe but no hard evidence that he didn't procure a 1903. The controversy continues. The 1903 ruled the range in her day and can still be shot competitively if you know how to use the sight. The 1917 was judged to have the best BATTLE sights, not target sights. It was said that the "1903 was the best target rifle that ever went to war ". If you have eye issues go to the 1903A3.
It was Alvin York not Albert. He made a comment once about using an English rifle. His unit was issued 1917 when they got to Europe but no hard evidence that he didn't procure a 1903. The controversy continues. The 1903 ruled the range in her day and can still be shot competitively if you know how to use the sight. The 1917 was judged to have the best BATTLE sights, not target sights. It was said that the "1903 was the best target rifle that ever went to war ". If you have eye issues go to the 1903A3.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is there a major difference in accuracy, or reliability?</div></div>
Yes and no. Both are extremely reliabile. I have both, when it comes to shooting, I can shoot the 1903a3 much better, its faster and smoother in the rapid fire stages of the GSM matches.
Fact is I've never found a smoother working bolt action rifle then my SC 'a3.
Now I agree that in reality its the shooter. In slow fire my Eddystone M1917 is about as accurate as my 'a3, but over all, the a3 is more accurate.
Both are shot in CMP GSM matches. GSM stands for Grand, Springfield and Military (other vintage military rifles). Notice the Springfield has its own catagory. The M1917 is put into a class with "all other" vintaged military rifles.
Go to the scores posted in the above links, you'll notice the Springfield scores are higher then the others, including the Garand.
Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with my M11917, wouldn't trade it for anything, but its not as smooth as my M1903a3. From the bench there isn't much difference, but for over all shooting, as in CMP-GSM games, the M1903a3 has the edge when you're talking about slow fire, offhand (standing) and rapid fire. A huge advantage is the windage adjustments on the 1903a3s.
Best senario would be to get both.
Many people don't understand the sights on the M1917. When the sight leaf is folded down, its sighted in for a battle sight zero of 400 yards. To shoot other yardage, such as 100, 200 etc, you use the leaf sight in the up right position.
With quick shots with the Model 1917, be careful to use the front sight, and not one of the ears, that will get you sooner or later. Teaches you to pay attention.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is there a major difference in accuracy, or reliability?</div></div>
Yes and no. Both are extremely reliabile. I have both, when it comes to shooting, I can shoot the 1903a3 much better, its faster and smoother in the rapid fire stages of the GSM matches.
Fact is I've never found a smoother working bolt action rifle then my SC 'a3.
Now I agree that in reality its the shooter. In slow fire my Eddystone M1917 is about as accurate as my 'a3, but over all, the a3 is more accurate.
Both are shot in CMP GSM matches. GSM stands for Grand, Springfield and Military (other vintage military rifles). Notice the Springfield has its own catagory. The M1917 is put into a class with "all other" vintaged military rifles.
Go to the scores posted in the above links, you'll notice the Springfield scores are higher then the others, including the Garand.
Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with my M11917, wouldn't trade it for anything, but its not as smooth as my M1903a3. From the bench there isn't much difference, but for over all shooting, as in CMP-GSM games, the M1903a3 has the edge when you're talking about slow fire, offhand (standing) and rapid fire. A huge advantage is the windage adjustments on the 1903a3s.
Best senario would be to get both.
Many people don't understand the sights on the M1917. When the sight leaf is folded down, its sighted in for a battle sight zero of 400 yards. To shoot other yardage, such as 100, 200 etc, you use the leaf sight in the up right position.
With quick shots with the Model 1917, be careful to use the front sight, and not one of the ears, that will get you sooner or later. Teaches you to pay attention.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
I have a M1917, a M1903A4 forgery, two M1903A3's, and five M1903's, the 1917 is a nice shooter but my Remington M1903 with a "C" stock is my target rifle, I added USMC sights and could not be happier. If I have to take a Bolt gun to war its the one I would take. But their all great rifles.
I have a M1917, a M1903A4 forgery, two M1903A3's, and five M1903's, the 1917 is a nice shooter but my Remington M1903 with a "C" stock is my target rifle, I added USMC sights and could not be happier. If I have to take a Bolt gun to war its the one I would take. But their all great rifles.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
If you are looking at this from a perspective of which to shoot in CMP match, if its legal, use the 03a3. Thats the hands down answer. I know just a tad about the subject.
John
If you are looking at this from a perspective of which to shoot in CMP match, if its legal, use the 03a3. Thats the hands down answer. I know just a tad about the subject.
John
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you are looking at this from a perspective of which to shoot in CMP match, if its legal, use the 03a3. Thats the hands down answer</div></div>
Doen't matter, in CMP Games they don't compete in the same catagory. The Springfield is fired in the "S" Springfield Match, the M1917 is fired in the "M" or Military (other miliary rifles) match.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you are looking at this from a perspective of which to shoot in CMP match, if its legal, use the 03a3. Thats the hands down answer</div></div>
Doen't matter, in CMP Games they don't compete in the same catagory. The Springfield is fired in the "S" Springfield Match, the M1917 is fired in the "M" or Military (other miliary rifles) match.
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
Kraig, well aware of that, if we are talking the nationals (like I said, I have a small clue about such things
) but for your local yocal matches, most seem to run GSMs so anything goes. If that is the case, I know I aint grabbin the M1917. In the Vintage match, its tough to beat the M96 or the SR as the 1917 just isnt set up well for "match" shooting.
John
Kraig, well aware of that, if we are talking the nationals (like I said, I have a small clue about such things
) but for your local yocal matches, most seem to run GSMs so anything goes. If that is the case, I know I aint grabbin the M1917. In the Vintage match, its tough to beat the M96 or the SR as the 1917 just isnt set up well for "match" shooting.John
Re: 1903 Springfield vs 1917 Enfield.iu
The Military actually shot the M1917 in the 1919 National Matches at Camp Perry as they were considering going with that rifle over the 1903. However what saved the 1903 was the Camp Perry winds and the lack of a windage adjustment on the 1917. If the 1917 had a windage adjustment the 1903 would probably be a footnote in US military history.
The Military actually shot the M1917 in the 1919 National Matches at Camp Perry as they were considering going with that rifle over the 1903. However what saved the 1903 was the Camp Perry winds and the lack of a windage adjustment on the 1917. If the 1917 had a windage adjustment the 1903 would probably be a footnote in US military history.
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