6.5CM New Rifle - Load Development

[roscoe53]

Just purchased new Ruger Long Range Target in 6.5CM and plan to begin the process of finding what she likes best. Going to start with H4350 pushing Hornady 140gr ELD-M. Been researching posts from all over just to get an idea of what others are finding. It seems like there is a lot of good stuff happening around 41.5 - 41.9gr with that bullet. Upon reviewing Hodgdon's data site they are saying 40.0gr is compressed. I always respect max loads, but am quite amazed that loads are going over almost 2.0gr! Am I missing something? I've been handloading for a long while and usually have not had to go over max to get to the nodes I'm looking for. Thanks for any help that you can provide. If anyone has a Ruger LRT in 6.5CM I would be interested in how you are liking it to.

 

[DownhillFromHere]

Why do Hornady and pretty much everyone else set such low max charges for the 6.5CM? First and foremost, LIABILITY.

No, 40.0 grains of H4350 is not compressed - nowhere near. - with the 140 ELD.

Like you, I started reloading many years (decades) ago. I too stayed between the min/max charge lines. I quit reloading bottleneck cartridges long ago. When I discovered a deep interest in modern long-range rifle and tactical competition, I swore I would just use factory rounds.As a retired engineer, I guess it was inevitable that I would relent and start handloading the 6.5CM. I am fortunate to have two close buddies with years of experience loading the 6.5CM, and they both told me to start at 40.0 grains H4350 with the 147-grain ELD-M. Even with the heavier bullet, I didn't start seeing pressure signs until 41.8-42.0 grains, and even then the sign was a very faint ejector mark. No issues with bolt lift.

So it does indeed seem that 41.2-41.4gr H4350 is the "chocolate ice cream cone" for the 140-147grain ELD bullets in bolt guns - pretty much everybody likes chocolate ice cream and pretty much all 6.5CM rifles (at least bolt guns; I can't speak for gas guns) like that H4350 charge with those bullets. I also found a node at 40.2 grains. I'm still deliberating whether the extra 100fps velocity at the higher charge is the standard I want to use for this rifle.

It took me awhile to accept that safe charges in current-production rifles can usually exceed the manuals' stated maximums - not always, but usually (there's my liability cover-my-butt statement). As another example, look at the .223 Remington. I grew up with that cartridge shooting a 50ish-grain bullet. Then came the 5.56mm NATO loading, and all the warnings that the 5.56 rounds should not be considered safe in a .223. Then I bought a .223 bolt gun... and started seeing 75-90 grain bullets approaching those 1960s-vintage velocities with bullets 2/3s lighter! Bottom line is, I found that I can shoot Mk262-spec 77-grain 5.56 rounds in my bolt-action rifle with zero pressure signs and great accuracy.

In no way am I suggesting that manuals' data should be ignored - especially by people new to reloading.

 

[crowsniper1]

I did some testing a couple weeks ago with my new Remington 700 6.5 26”
Magnetospeed sporter used for test
H4350 powder,new hornady brass and 140 gr hornady bthp 2.815 OAL
Powder charge on left ,velocity on right side
41.————2670 fps
41.3———2675
41.5———2710
41.7———2718 good SD and ES here
42.0———2740 warm load
42.3———2756
42.5———2744 lower velocity so I stopped here

 

[roscoe53]

Why do Hornady and pretty much everyone else set such low max charges for the 6.5CM? First and foremost, LIABILITY.

No, 40.0 grains of H4350 is not compressed - nowhere near. - with the 140 ELD.

Like you, I started reloading many years (decades) ago. I too stayed between the min/max charge lines. I quit reloading bottleneck cartridges long ago. When I discovered a deep interest in modern long-range rifle and tactical competition, I swore I would just use factory rounds.As a retired engineer, I guess it was inevitable that I would relent and start handloading the 6.5CM. I am fortunate to have two close buddies with years of experience loading the 6.5CM, and they both told me to start at 40.0 grains H4350 with the 147-grain ELD-M. Even with the heavier bullet, I didn't start seeing pressure signs until 41.8-42.0 grains, and even then the sign was a very faint ejector mark. No issues with bolt lift.

So it does indeed seem that 41.2-41.4gr H4350 is the "chocolate ice cream cone" for the 140-147grain ELD bullets in bolt guns - pretty much everybody likes chocolate ice cream and pretty much all 6.5CM rifles (at least bolt guns; I can't speak for gas guns) like that H4350 charge with those bullets. I also found a node at 40.2 grains. I'm still deliberating whether the extra 100fps velocity at the higher charge is the standard I want to use for this rifle.

It took me awhile to accept that safe charges in current-production rifles can usually exceed the manuals' stated maximums - not always, but usually (there's my liability cover-my-butt statement). As another example, look at the .223 Remington. I grew up with that cartridge shooting a 50ish-grain bullet. Then came the 5.56mm NATO loading, and all the warnings that the 5.56 rounds should not be considered safe in a .223. Then I bought a .223 bolt gun... and started seeing 75-90 grain bullets approaching those 1960s-vintage velocities with bullets 2/3s lighter! Bottom line is, I found that I can shoot Mk262-spec 77-grain 5.56 rounds in my bolt-action rifle with zero pressure signs and great accuracy.

In no way am I suggesting that manuals' data should be ignored - especially by people new to reloading.

Thanks for getting back so quickly and after reading your response I feel much better about pushing this load beyond book loads to get what I’m after. Of course I will monitor pressure signs along the way as always. Ive been reloading Pistol and shotshell for 30 or so years, but rifle for only a couple. My first was with .308 and through a lot of trial and error I learned a bunch. I really enjoy squeezing out every detail to produce the most accurate load the rifle can shoot and then make it repeatable. Really can’t wait to work on 6.5CM as I think it’s potential can be superior to .308.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[roscoe53]

I did some testing a couple weeks ago with my new Remington 700 6.5 26”
Magnetospeed sporter used for test
H4350 powder,new hornady brass and 140 gr hornady bthp 2.815 OAL
Powder charge on left ,velocity on right side
41.————2670 fps
41.3———2675
41.5———2710
41.7———2718 good SD and ES here
42.0———2740 warm load
42.3———2756
42.5———2744 lower velocity so I stopped here

Thanks for your help. From what information I’ve gathered so far looks like I’m headed down a similar road. I use a Magnetospeed as well and it’s perfect for this sort of work up.

 

[clemmo]

hi, first time commenting on forum, my pet load for the 140 gr hornady eldm is 41.7 gr ar 2209 { h4350 }seated 23 thou off lands, shoots 0.5 moa at 200 yds,travelling at 2740 fps, next is a copperhead 135 gr vld,{ australian made} 42.7 gr of ar 2209, seated 25 thou off, travelling at 2825,shoots much the same moa, my 600 yrd fly load is 123 gr lapua scenar 39.4 ar 2208 { varget} skips along at 2985 fps and very accurate, seated 10 thou into lands 2.5 thou tension on bullet. using lapua brass small rifle primers.

 

[JOE62]

If you’ve loaded accurate ammo for the 308 , you’ll be amazed with the Creedmoor. Very easy to load for and most will shoot just about anything you put in them. I found a good load for mine with 41.9 grns H4350, Berger Hybrid Target 140’s in Lapua brass and CCI 450’s. Seating them.050 off the lands. Averaging 2769 fps. I loaded up to 42.3 but the accuracy wasn’t there. I started at 39.5 and found the first node around 40.5 but I didn’t chrono it. Good luck with the Creedmoor. Feed it what it likes and it will perform for you.