want get a new upper for the AR. Which one would you guys rec ommend and do you just resize the grendale fot the 6mmAR ?
6mm or 6.5 grendale
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Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
I would go with the grendel, but it all comes down to what your wanting to do with it. Im not sure about the 6mmAR.
I would go with the grendel, but it all comes down to what your wanting to do with it. Im not sure about the 6mmAR.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
Exactly what do you want to do with the rifle. 6.5 Grendle is a decent precision round for the AR platform or you could get to 6.8 for greater stopping power.
Exactly what do you want to do with the rifle. 6.5 Grendle is a decent precision round for the AR platform or you could get to 6.8 for greater stopping power.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
Largely depends on if you reload or not. Factory 123 Hornady AMax is a very good, all around choice and is generally very accurate and starting to show up on better shelves. 6.8mm is probably more readily available and a good round, but the difference between it and Grendel inside of 400 yds is moot. Past there, the Grendel will surpass the 6.8 on ballistic coefficient alone, given near same velocity. No experience with 6mm AR of any form, but some of the guys here and over on Accurate Shooter site are pretty impressed with various iterations of 6mm. Factory loads at Wally World-not ever likely.
Largely depends on if you reload or not. Factory 123 Hornady AMax is a very good, all around choice and is generally very accurate and starting to show up on better shelves. 6.8mm is probably more readily available and a good round, but the difference between it and Grendel inside of 400 yds is moot. Past there, the Grendel will surpass the 6.8 on ballistic coefficient alone, given near same velocity. No experience with 6mm AR of any form, but some of the guys here and over on Accurate Shooter site are pretty impressed with various iterations of 6mm. Factory loads at Wally World-not ever likely.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
I have a 6.5 Grendel and think it's quite the round. I've tested on two of my own 24" platforms and a 16" and 18" platform. That covers carbine, medium rifle and full length gas paths. Which is really the key to getting maximum velocity out of the case in an AR platform.
Inside of 1k, it's a wash as to which one is better, some like the slightly faster velocity of the 6mm's and some like the harder hitting power of the 6.5's. The 6.5 Lapua has the best ballistics of all of them. But the 6mm can keep up with that in velocity. From what I've seen the 123 Lapua has the best ballistics and wind bucking capability. But, you pretty much have to load those yourself. But, you'd do that with the 6mm anyhow.
As far as a decision between the 6.8 and th 6.5 (or any 6.5G case variant), you will find what robert neuser said and that is within a relatively short range, i.e. 400 yds/m you won't find hardly a hill of beans difference. That holds true to all ranges with non-high BC bullets. The difference is you can load high BC bullets in the 6.5 and you can't in the 6.8 SPC. Really, the perfect balance of weight, velocity, and BC is either 6.5 or 6mm.
You can also consider th BR cases, which now finally have a magazine that reliably feed those cases http://www.bratrifles.com/. A sizeable reduction numerically in cases, though.
With the Olympic Arms you can get a WSSM chambered upper. These are the only folks building these anymore from a commercial/non-custom standpoint. The most power you can get out of an AR-15 platform. Again, serious reduction in magazine capacity.
I have a 6.5 Grendel and think it's quite the round. I've tested on two of my own 24" platforms and a 16" and 18" platform. That covers carbine, medium rifle and full length gas paths. Which is really the key to getting maximum velocity out of the case in an AR platform.
Inside of 1k, it's a wash as to which one is better, some like the slightly faster velocity of the 6mm's and some like the harder hitting power of the 6.5's. The 6.5 Lapua has the best ballistics of all of them. But the 6mm can keep up with that in velocity. From what I've seen the 123 Lapua has the best ballistics and wind bucking capability. But, you pretty much have to load those yourself. But, you'd do that with the 6mm anyhow.
As far as a decision between the 6.8 and th 6.5 (or any 6.5G case variant), you will find what robert neuser said and that is within a relatively short range, i.e. 400 yds/m you won't find hardly a hill of beans difference. That holds true to all ranges with non-high BC bullets. The difference is you can load high BC bullets in the 6.5 and you can't in the 6.8 SPC. Really, the perfect balance of weight, velocity, and BC is either 6.5 or 6mm.
You can also consider th BR cases, which now finally have a magazine that reliably feed those cases http://www.bratrifles.com/. A sizeable reduction numerically in cases, though.
With the Olympic Arms you can get a WSSM chambered upper. These are the only folks building these anymore from a commercial/non-custom standpoint. The most power you can get out of an AR-15 platform. Again, serious reduction in magazine capacity.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: para1505</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will use it for tactical longrange events and coyote hunting </div></div>
Long Range and the Grendel or 6MM RAT win.
The benefit of the 6.8 is a fairly decent range with a heavier bullet which is less sensitive to barrel length (shorties), than the Grendel or other 6mm options.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: para1505</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will use it for tactical longrange events and coyote hunting </div></div>
Long Range and the Grendel or 6MM RAT win.
The benefit of the 6.8 is a fairly decent range with a heavier bullet which is less sensitive to barrel length (shorties), than the Grendel or other 6mm options.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
Sandwarrior,
I'm wanting to build a grendal also if I can find a barrel. What would you recommend for barrel length 18" or 20"? To be used on a carbine lower for coyotes, hogs and long range shooting. I'm thinking a medium contour short enough to swing around on coyotes but stiff enough for long range shots on steel.
Sandwarrior,
I'm wanting to build a grendal also if I can find a barrel. What would you recommend for barrel length 18" or 20"? To be used on a carbine lower for coyotes, hogs and long range shooting. I'm thinking a medium contour short enough to swing around on coyotes but stiff enough for long range shots on steel.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outlaw45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sandwarrior,
I'm wanting to build a grendal also if I can find a barrel. What would you recommend for barrel length 18" or 20"? To be used on a carbine lower for coyotes, hogs and long range shooting. I'm thinking a medium contour short enough to swing around on coyotes but stiff enough for long range shots on steel.</div></div>
Between the two there isn't a whole lot of difference as long as you use a full length gas tube. There is a pretty sizeable drop going from a 20" full length to an 18" medium or especially, carbine length gas tube. Significant as far as the Grendel goes because from what I've found you need every fps you can get. Sure the high BC bullets work at lower speeds, but dropoff at extended range increases dramatically.
So, as you describe what you'd like to use it for and how, I'd get the 18" with long gas path. The collapsible carbine lower is good as well. I use one with my 24" and have found that just as handy as running a short barrel. I don't know what kind of coyote radar you might strap on there, but I just used a YHM free floated fore-end. A rail type fore-end might be easier to put stuff on you want or may not want on a different hunt. Once I got the fore-end aligned I drilled a hole for a sling-stud and that's what I stick a Harris bi-pod on. the rail type is just a matter of matching up the angle of where you like the rails then using the lockring to keep it at that setting. Make sure to Loctite the lock ring or it all comes apart. Loose stuff never helps accuracy.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outlaw45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Sandwarrior,
I'm wanting to build a grendal also if I can find a barrel. What would you recommend for barrel length 18" or 20"? To be used on a carbine lower for coyotes, hogs and long range shooting. I'm thinking a medium contour short enough to swing around on coyotes but stiff enough for long range shots on steel.</div></div>
Between the two there isn't a whole lot of difference as long as you use a full length gas tube. There is a pretty sizeable drop going from a 20" full length to an 18" medium or especially, carbine length gas tube. Significant as far as the Grendel goes because from what I've found you need every fps you can get. Sure the high BC bullets work at lower speeds, but dropoff at extended range increases dramatically.
So, as you describe what you'd like to use it for and how, I'd get the 18" with long gas path. The collapsible carbine lower is good as well. I use one with my 24" and have found that just as handy as running a short barrel. I don't know what kind of coyote radar you might strap on there, but I just used a YHM free floated fore-end. A rail type fore-end might be easier to put stuff on you want or may not want on a different hunt. Once I got the fore-end aligned I drilled a hole for a sling-stud and that's what I stick a Harris bi-pod on. the rail type is just a matter of matching up the angle of where you like the rails then using the lockring to keep it at that setting. Make sure to Loctite the lock ring or it all comes apart. Loose stuff never helps accuracy.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
You're talking about a drop off in velocity from 20" to 18" right? How much are we talking about?
So you're saying if I get a 18" barrel with a rifle length gas tube velocity if pretty much the same as a 20"? Most of the 18" barrels I've seen listed are medium length gas systems.
You're talking about a drop off in velocity from 20" to 18" right? How much are we talking about?
So you're saying if I get a 18" barrel with a rifle length gas tube velocity if pretty much the same as a 20"? Most of the 18" barrels I've seen listed are medium length gas systems.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outlaw45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You're talking about a drop off in velocity from 20" to 18" right? How much are we talking about?
So you're saying if I get a 18" barrel with a rifle length gas tube velocity if pretty much the same as a 20"? Most of the 18" barrels I've seen listed are medium length gas systems.</div></div>
That's the problem. The big thing is it really limits you to faster powders which don't give the best 'push' for the bullet. Light bullets not so bad actually. But, light bullets are literally 'hit and miss' the farther you go out compared to the high BC 123's you can get for this.
My load of IMR 8208 XBR behind 123's in a medium length was just over 2500. So about a 200 fps drop. These are still doable. You just have to figure drops better and call wind better. Also, 8208 is way less temp sensitive than AA2520. So if you can work with the slightly lower velocities it's not a worry.
That said, my next suggestion is, get the 20" with full length rifle gas path. Do it with a collapsible stock and you won't even notice the 2" out on the end of the barrel. Except for velocity is better.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Outlaw45</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You're talking about a drop off in velocity from 20" to 18" right? How much are we talking about?
So you're saying if I get a 18" barrel with a rifle length gas tube velocity if pretty much the same as a 20"? Most of the 18" barrels I've seen listed are medium length gas systems.</div></div>
That's the problem. The big thing is it really limits you to faster powders which don't give the best 'push' for the bullet. Light bullets not so bad actually. But, light bullets are literally 'hit and miss' the farther you go out compared to the high BC 123's you can get for this.
My load of IMR 8208 XBR behind 123's in a medium length was just over 2500. So about a 200 fps drop. These are still doable. You just have to figure drops better and call wind better. Also, 8208 is way less temp sensitive than AA2520. So if you can work with the slightly lower velocities it's not a worry.
That said, my next suggestion is, get the 20" with full length rifle gas path. Do it with a collapsible stock and you won't even notice the 2" out on the end of the barrel. Except for velocity is better.
Re: 6mm or 6.5 grendale
Copy that. I think 20" is the way to go. I see most of the barrel companies have threaded barrels for flash hiders and comps. Why don't I see more plain target crowns? I can't imagine there's a lot of recoil that you would need a comp or muzzle brake.
Copy that. I think 20" is the way to go. I see most of the barrel companies have threaded barrels for flash hiders and comps. Why don't I see more plain target crowns? I can't imagine there's a lot of recoil that you would need a comp or muzzle brake.
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