325-500gr subs from ar-15 platform shit on your .338’s.
- Thread starter Longshot85
- Start date
325-500gr subs from ar-15 platform shit on your .338’s.
I did this rather quickly in JBM Ballistics
70deg, 1000 ft, 1080 fps muzzle velocity for both...
I'd say, no, it really doesn't matter...
Anyone seen this round? It's the 2 in the middle. I invented it over 2 years ago. The rounds pictured are the subsonics. It also comes in supersonic and the ballistics are pretty good. I can share more information if anyone is interested. Kinda' competes with the 8.6CM. Mods feel free to move it if I'm stepping on this thread too much.
One thing you guys aren't comparing is the supersonic capability which should be a big step up from the 300 Blackout. If dedicated subs are all you are doing it might not be worth it. I am interested to see what kind of cool bullets we get out of it. The extra 35% bullet weight can't hurt especially in a subsonic bullet and eventually we might see some even heavier options.
If I remember right there are two 338 Whispers. One is based on the fireball and the other on the 6BR or 7BR. On the small case you are really pushing it and don't end up with much of a shoulder if I remember right. The 338 Spectre seems to be a much better solution from what I can tell reading what I can.
Discreet Ballistics appears to have been making quite a bit of subsonic expanding 8.6 for the Q guys in their preproduction testing/demo hunts - https://www.instagram.com/discreet.ballistics/
But I believe Hornady were the ones that delivered a bunch of new factory brass to Q - https://www.instagram.com/p/CS4aRLhr0uR/
Kevin has talked about it several times on the podcast. He said it's going to be open source just like 300 Blackout. That's the best way to ensure its success.
I just hope the 230 eld-x can be loaded to a decent velocity. Should make for a sweet large frame package.
sounds like the 1/3 twist will pull non bonded bullets apart. Hopefully some barrel manufacturers go with a 1/5 or some other twist
sounds like the 1/3 twist will pull non bonded bullets apart. Hopefully some barrel manufacturers go with a 1/5 or some other twist
Why, I hear people "posting" negatively about this guy. Wondering what he did to you personally? This guy must be a bad ass to to piss all these people off and nobody has driven to his shop and whipped his ass. I think I will buy two of everything he is selling.
- Nov 3, 2010
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Here, Let Me Google That For You
Passive-aggressively teach your friends how to Google. For all those people who find it more convenient to ask you rather than search it themselves. Not associated with Google.
googlethatforyou.com Sorry I now see it. My name is Benny House, I live at 46 Jim Day Lane, Tularosa, NM. My number is 575-551-1946. I have never owned a Q platform, I have never met Kevin B, nor have I ever received anything from his company. I was going to order one of his shirts to get into the pool for an opertuniyy for his current givaways but I never got around to it. So there it is,, my affiliation with Kevin B and Q. There are some people still around that don't like keyboard warriors, if I could put a wager on this, bet Kevin B has never even heard of you. I come to these sights to learn, not hear someone bash someone. If you have info on subject matter, I want to hear it, if you don't, then stfu. I don't know how many post you have made, apparently more then one, I hope you have contributed something positive with them because apparently you have so much to offer!
I asked what he personally did
I only asked what he did personally to Ormendj. You took it upon yourself to put your 2 cents in. I get it if he has done something to you personally, what I don't get is jumping on a bandwagon because someone thinks it will boost some status and make them like a self proclaimed expert. My thoughts are like this, if I'm purchasing a firearm, I want the best I can afford with my money. If I Ned a doctor, I don't go find one based on personality, I don't give a damn if he/she has bedside manners. They can be the biggest ass in the world, they are not my friend, they are my Dr. If I want a quality firearm, I don't care who makes it, as long as the quality is there. I have yet to have a firearm manufacture ask me over for beers! From everything I see, Kevin B is as knowledgeable as anyone and possibly more cutting edge. You are right, I am not contributing any firearm knoldge to this group. But maybe someone will take a look at themselves in the mirror and become a better person. I heard this once. Be carefull pointing a finger at someone because there will be three more pointing back at you. I'm done arguing, I will watch for the post on the 8.6, I hope someone has good feedback on it other then I'm not buying one because Kevin B hurt my sisters feelings at the 8th grade prom in 1986.
You take forever to say nothing.
I didn't jump on any bandwagon. I saw a shill post and called it out as one and I will do so every time I see one in the future. The threads subject matter was irrelevant. Your continued posts do not dissuade me from thinking you are a shill. Although it is entirely possible you feel the need to defend your future heirloom purchases from this knowledgeable, cutting edge, badass, and that is why you decided to join and make your posts. If the latter, please accept my humblest apologies.
Sounds like Faxon is committed to it and is talking about selling barrels this year. Hornady, Discreet Ballistics and Gorilla are "close" to putting out ammo. I'm looking forward to a 12" from Faxon
faxonfirearms.com
8.6 Blackout
Faxon Firearms making barrels for 8.6 Blackout (8.6 BLK), the new round from Q.
faxonfirearms.com 
As excited as I was about this years ago when the concept was still just that, this has been vaporware long enough that I no longer care much to get into cartridge. I believed in it's promise of being able to do everything, but I've since come to the oft repeated conclusion, "if something does everything, it likely doesn't do anything well."
I'm leaning more like this....was pumped....but this has taken so long....I've wrote it off until there's a good bit of product out there...ammo, reloading goods, barrels etc AND it performs as described
If it has good supersonic performance, I'm in. They were bragging about 1k hits with it but I'd bet that's on a 2'x2' square or something like that... Still, if it has decent trajectory and good energy on target to 600-800 yds then I'm in. Unless they've found differently, I'm excited about the 230 ELDX in this case. If it can be pushed 2200 fps at sea level, it will be supersonic to 1k, have 1000ft/lbs of energy at 650 yds and expand out to 500 yds.
It has always seemed closer to a 6.5G big brother with subsonic capability.
I'm just as frustrated with the lack of communication and long lead time on this too but that doesn't change if the product is a good one or not
It has always seemed closer to a 6.5G big brother with subsonic capability.
I'm just as frustrated with the lack of communication and long lead time on this too but that doesn't change if the product is a good one or not
All I’ll say about it is you can’t cheat the physics of ballistics. When people try to pitch something that seems too good to be true it usually is. That said, the fast twist rate is fairly unique which would help aid in expansion at the detriment to
Penetration. The downside is you’d likely have higher chamber pressures for supers than a slower twist barrel and you will likely be limited in bullet selection to all copper or very tough built bullets so they don’t blow up.
If your goal is subs, the 458 socom is going to give you more energy at the ranges subs are most useful (100y and in) with a lighter rifle/package. If your goal is supers there is such little difference to a 308 with all its great bullet selection that it probably wouldn’t be worth buying another caliber. There are also less recoiling, higher velocity, better ballistic cartridges out there (6/6.5cm etc) that will kill the common North American game most hunt just fine.
Where I think the 8.6 shines is a “do all” caliber. You can use it for heavy hitting subs under 100 yards for night hunting hogs and then put on a day scope zerod for supers for a handy brush gun that can take just about anything in North America.
To summarize I think there are better calibers for a dedicated subsonic calibers and better options for dedicated supersonic calibers. This does both fairly well but not the “best” at either. I see gorilla is making ammo but unless it gets some serious push from ammo makers and ammo prices themselves start to come down I think it may take some time to catch on if it ever does.
Penetration. The downside is you’d likely have higher chamber pressures for supers than a slower twist barrel and you will likely be limited in bullet selection to all copper or very tough built bullets so they don’t blow up.
If your goal is subs, the 458 socom is going to give you more energy at the ranges subs are most useful (100y and in) with a lighter rifle/package. If your goal is supers there is such little difference to a 308 with all its great bullet selection that it probably wouldn’t be worth buying another caliber. There are also less recoiling, higher velocity, better ballistic cartridges out there (6/6.5cm etc) that will kill the common North American game most hunt just fine.
Where I think the 8.6 shines is a “do all” caliber. You can use it for heavy hitting subs under 100 yards for night hunting hogs and then put on a day scope zerod for supers for a handy brush gun that can take just about anything in North America.
To summarize I think there are better calibers for a dedicated subsonic calibers and better options for dedicated supersonic calibers. This does both fairly well but not the “best” at either. I see gorilla is making ammo but unless it gets some serious push from ammo makers and ammo prices themselves start to come down I think it may take some time to catch on if it ever does.
Who made the barrel for you?
so what are specs of the bullet?
It's a 338-223 https://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/338-223-straight-338-thumper.3981622/
There nothing new under the sun. There a limit on how may ways to push a bullet in different cases
Any velocity with 210-230gr bullets?
this round has me intrigued for a very light weight deer rifle. ballistically able to do everything including distance..
im curious as to how light one could get the rifle.
im curious as to how light one could get the rifle.
I think of it as a shortened 338 federal for longer bullets couples with a fast barrel. If you only want to shoot supers a 338 federal with a fast twist barrel will accomplish the same thing and possibly even get a bit more velocity. But it’s not ideal for subs as the bullets will be seated very deep in the case.
I owned a “very light” 338 federal. It was NOT fun to shoot. The recoil is as bad as a 300 win mag. The 8.6 with supers will be very similar to a 338 federal in terms of recoil when loaded to similar levels. Be careful fil how light you go with the rifle. Mine was like 6.5 lbs with stock. Kimber 84
i own a 338 edge currently which isn't bad at all for recoil. i mean the rifle does weight 12-14lbs.
had a 300 wsm that was 8-9 lbs and the recoil on that wasnt terrible either. i mean its usually only 1 shot and the animal is done.
Mine did not have a brake however. That makes a big difference. Sure one shot but you also don’t want to develop a flinch. For the lightweight rifles under 6-7lbs I now stick with 6.5 creed or 308 as the biggest round. My 458 socom AR has some pretty good kick to it as well and that’s with a brake/can.
Try it with stab rated soft armor and see how it goes.
I used some beat up pieces of Hornady 6.5 Creedmoor brass and button sized them up to .338
The round on the left, the bullet is set with a COAL of 2.700”
The round on the right, the bullet is set with a COAL off 2.800” (the base of the bullet is set at the neck/shoulder junction
These are Barnes .338 160 TTSX’s
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I did the same, was messing around in the reloading room and decided to neck up a piece of 6.5 creedmoor brass to .338.
I seated a 300 grain Berger bullet in it. Problem is where I have it seated at it won’t fit in an aics magazine. Definitely looks kinda neat though.
I seated a 300 grain Berger bullet in it. Problem is where I have it seated at it won’t fit in an aics magazine. Definitely looks kinda neat though.
Just over 2800 is what Hodgdon reports for the larger volume 338 federal with 160 gr bullets (24” test barrel). I would not expect more from the smaller 8.6 creedmoor case...
If I understood the propaganda coming (cuming?) out of SHOT is that even with a 12" barrel and supers you are getting 2000+fps? Also having a can on a shortish barrel would make it nice for the woods.
They tested 12.5” set up and are claiming Barnes 210gr at 2450fps.
www.loaddevelopment.com
8.6 Creedmoor or 8.6 BLK or 8.6 Blackout? - LoadDevelopment.com
The 8.6 BLK cartridge pioneered by Kevin Brittingham of Q, changing the game when it comes to hunting rounds.
www.loaddevelopment.com I’ll stick with 2950 on quick loads
Joe Bob Outfitters has a wait-list for 8.6 BLK barrels on their site. All three flavors of faxon in this chamber. The time may be nigh.
I'm excited about the possibility of this cartridge. Are there options with better terminal performance with supers, absolutely. Are there current subsonic options with heavier pills, yup. Is there one cartridge that can do both, and do both well, out of an LR-308/SR-25...I don't know of one.
Also, I think that this cartridge could push .338 bullet design to be a little more eccentric (similar to what 300 BLK did).
Best,
I'm excited about the possibility of this cartridge. Are there options with better terminal performance with supers, absolutely. Are there current subsonic options with heavier pills, yup. Is there one cartridge that can do both, and do both well, out of an LR-308/SR-25...I don't know of one.
Also, I think that this cartridge could push .338 bullet design to be a little more eccentric (similar to what 300 BLK did).
Best,
