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Accuracy International Customer Service

J

JimGnitecki

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Oct 24, 2011
561
12
Austin, TX
I wrote to Accuracy International on December 29, when I was in the marrket for a bolt action precision rifle, and had not yet ruled out the AI rifles. I asked for a pdf (not physical) copy of the owner's manual, figuring a pdf costs them nothing, and surely they would want a prospective buyer to be able to see the manual in advance so he knows what he would be buying.

Surprise.

1. I did not get a reply until today, January 13, just over 2 weeks later. I guess selling costly rifles does not motivate people to answer prospective buyers' questions.

2. Here is the reply I got, verbatim:

"
Unless you purchased the firearm we do not distribute the manuals. however if you contact one of our distributors they would be more then happy to assist you with any questions you have.

Thank You,
Accuracy International
"

Now most manufacturers provide copies of owners manuals quicly and free, if for no other reason than to limit liability.

Glad I bought a Sako instead.

Jim G
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

The manuals are a very big book, and are detailed, Generally you only get a manual if you attend the Armorers Course because it is a 3" Binder. I have not seen it in PDF.

There is a ton of information out there on an AI, and really what do you think a PDF would tell you that you couldn't' glean from a site like this where people use the hell out of the AI ?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

To be fair to AI, most of what they provide is available on line. On the other hand, the simple owner's manual you get with the rifle is not that good: It does not have information on adjusting the trigger or torque specs. All you are going to get is how to take the bolt apart, which is easy if you know how to twist your wrist.

That said, I fear there might be customer service trouble at AINA now that Stacey is gone:

I have been trying to get my AX chassis system out of them since May of last year (using prize certificates from the Sniper's Hide Cup).

I talked to Patrick once about it three or four months ago. Since then I have e-mailed Scott four times, called him twice and left two messages. And nothing.

No sweat, though, I've got Tom Irwin's phone, e-mail, and an open PM with him (about something else). I just hate to be the one to complain about such petty stuff.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

I didn’t know that Stacy had left. He was awesome and really knew his stuff. I'm Sorry to hear that people are having such trouble with AI customer service. I have always held AI in pretty high regard.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

I have had great customer service with AINA,you would be better off calling and talking to someone there. Patric law and Scott Seigmund have answered all my question in a timely manner.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Stacey is a guy... LOL

HE really knows his stuff.
smile.gif


Really AI Proper is not the place to kick tires on the rifle, their website is set up to give you some fine details as to each element of the system. And their dealers and distributors are much more in tune with individual sales. AI Proper is much government sales.

RG, I will tell Scott at SHOT You are looking for your chassis ? Was it an AI Certificate or Mile High ? As I will see them both.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

LL could you ask at SS if there soon to be up web store will allow us to buy AW barrels?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jmilera</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LL could you ask at SS if there soon to be up web store will allow us to buy AW barrels?</div></div>

yes but why wouldn't you just call Mile High or Euro Optics ?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

As per mile high and Tac pro and Alex Roy at euro it is now AI policy that they cannot sell barrels.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">RG, I will tell Scott at SHOT You are looking for your chassis ? Was it an AI Certificate or Mile High ? As I will see them both. </div></div>Thanks. It was a bunch of AI certificates that Stacey arranged for the prize table(s). I got on the 'list' for an Ax chassis with Patrick last spring. They were going to invoice me the hundred-and-something bucks and send me a chassis. Then nothing. No replies.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Your not the only one that has been waiting on an AX chassis for a while.

KT
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Frank, any news from Scott or AINA about honoring those SH Cup prize certificates?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

LL any news on where we can buy barrels for our AW?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

I have just seen this thread otherwise I would have commented sooner.

1. During the past month it was probably the worst time to get responses from us. The company always closes for the Christmas holiday and reopens after New Year. This year was different for a couple of us as we were working on the PSR proposal until January 6, the deadline. After that it was preparing for the Shot Show just over one week later so if customer service was not as good as it should be then those were some reasons.
2. Regarding operators manuals, as LL said we provide plenty of technical information on our website and through our distributors, 4 of them. We do not supply PDF manuals but we do supply PDF brochures on our website.
3. I would question a decision to purchase a rifle based on whether a company will provide a PDF of a manual in advance. Do you look at a user manual of a car before you buy it?
4. It is in the second half of 2011 that AICS AX has been in production to the level we are regularly shipping to customers. Those include our distributors, government agencies and the US Navy. In any business where a large investment has been made it is normal for paying customers with orders to get supplied first. If you have not sent us a formal letter with the certificates you will not be on the list. I do not know if you have but if you have not I would advise you to do that.
5. Stacey was very knowledgeable about our products but there are others who know just as much. Surprising as it might be, there are even others who know more and they still work for AI. If anyone wants to know anything related to AI products they can call AINA in Fredericksburg or any of our distributors in the USA. That is for US customers. Anyone else can call our distributors and agents around the world or send an e-mail to our website. I assure you the question will be answered.
6. You can but barrels directly from AINA.

I hope that might clarify a few issues for everyone.

Tom Irwin
Director
Accuracy International
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Thanks, Tom. I appreciate having one of the principals of the company take the time to directly address a Thread like this one.

Anyone who sees my posts knows that for both personal and practical reasons I am big fan and supporter of AI and its products, and I understand the business decision to fill more important (meaning more lucrative) contracts first.

I sent in the certificates in April, and in June I was told that I am on the list. My problem is not with having to wait, because that I understand. The frustrating part is with my order once getting lost with the transition, twice falling into a black hole and then being unable to get a reply for months - either by phone or by e-mail.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

You gotta give AI this, for a euro made rifle you have the principals posting here answering your questions. If u ever had a REAL issue I bet AI would handle it as best they could. All the more reason I bought an AI AW!
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wlwaldock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You gotta give AI this, for a euro made rifle you have the principals posting here answering your questions. If u ever had a REAL issue I bet AI would handle it as best they could. All the more reason I bought an AI AW! </div></div>

Disagree. My experience is that how a company handles the small issues is a good predictor of who they handle the BIG issues. A company that has trouble with "small" issues is showing The World that its processes or staffing need more work.

And your comment "as best they could", rather than "I'm sure they would handle it quickly and well", says volumes to me.

As to not being willing to provide a pdf of a user manual:

Almost every company I know provides pdf copies of their product manuals via SELF-SERVICE downloads. They do so for at least 4 reasons:

- It answers many customer or potential customer questions without even requiring a company customer service rep to take a phone call

- It limits a company's product liability exposure (talk to a corporate attorney if you don't understand how and why)

- It enables a customer or potential customer to keep a copy handy without having to carry a paper copy.

- Having made the decision to NOT provide a pdf capability, and then making the further separate decision to NOT make the manual available to anyone except people who have already spent the money and bought the rifle suggests that the company is not open to a buyer evaluating its products based on detailed written information, but rather on a sales pitch from a distributor. That annoys some buyers who prefer a more analytical approach to buying, that includes evaluating what that product will be like to actually use and maintain, as evidenced by its owner's manual.

The atitude I detected in my research turned me off. I eliminated AI from my comparison efforts and focused on TRG.

Jim G

 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

You just had a Director level employee answer your question personally. How is that messing up the LITTLE things? The man said they don't have a PDF version of their owner's manual and so did LL and a member who owns an AI rifle. You received your response in a timely fashion considering the events and circumstances within the industry, and at AI in particular, over the last month or so. The internet is full of information on their rifles and the product's reputation speaks for itself. In my opinion you were looking for an excuse not to buy an AI because the TRG is a cheaper alternative. I doubt very highly the lack of making one sale of a rifle to you is going to have a deep financial impact on AI and you seem like a sensitive baby by your comments.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Just to point out the (hopefully) obvious, you <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">do</span></span> realize that the PDF manuals are available via third parties if you search for them on Google....right?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Jim,
I am not sure where the comment "as best they could" came from but I read my post and could not find it there.
I am not sure what experience you have of companies who do not handle small issues but we handle all issues regardless of who the customer is, big or small and we have both as you must know. What we cannot do is satisfy a customer who does not agree with our finding or decision. Probably the most common is a customer who does not clean their barrel properly and then wonders why his AI is not shooting well.
As I said before we do have PDF's of all our brochures on our website but not owners manuals. The term itself suggests you have to own one.
Graham,
I will look into your AX chassis and be in contact.
swage,
Thanks for your comments. I am also an owner of the company and an American/British dual citizen. I have lived in America for 30 years.

Tom Irwin
Accuracy International
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Congrats on posting probably the second most pointless AI thread imaginable.....after "Did AI copy Victor Co...."

But on the upside...this has to be a great contender for the dumbest reason ever to buy a TRG award!



 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arbiter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just to point out the (hopefully) obvious, you <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="font-style: italic">do</span></span> realize that the PDF manuals are available via third parties if you search for them on Google....right? </div></div>

No, I did not. And AI did not say so either when they replied indicating they do not provide them.

Jim G
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tomirwin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jim,
I am not sure where the comment "as best they could" came from but I read my post and could not find it there.
Tom Irwin
Accuracy International

</div></div>

It was not you who said I quoted the person who said it on this thread in my posting. I assumed he is one of AI's customers.

Jim G
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BasraBoy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Congrats on posting probably the second most pointless AI thread imaginable.....after "Did AI copy Victor Co...."

But on the upside...this has to be a great contender for the dumbest reason ever to buy a TRG award!



</div></div>

This was obviosuly NOT the "only" reason for not buying an AI. I never said it was, but it did leave me with a bad feeling about what I could expect from AI if I ever needed help or information.

But it was one factor in a listing of pluses and minuses. The plus list was very good too, but the other supplier's overall offering worked better for ME (not necessarily you or others).

I'm glad to hear that others' experience with , and perception of, of AI might be better. They clearly meet the needs of at least some prospective buyers since they have been around for a while and have a good reputation.

But I felt the Sako TRG offering fit my needs better.

As for wanting a "cheaper" solution, if you look at my purchases since getting my TRG, there is clear evidence that I am not opposed to spending what is needed to get a good package set up the way I like. I just don't see the point in spending MORE than is appropriate, and I sure prefer to spend my money with a seller who is eager to tell me about his or her offering, and why it merits my consideration.

I had, and have, no desire to "trash" AI or anyone else. I just wanted prospective other buyers to know what they are likely to encounter when trying to engage AI. I'll move on off this thread now, and let the AI buyers enjoy their investments in peace.

Jim G
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JimGnitecki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

But I felt the Sako TRG offering fit my needs better.

I had, and have, no desire to "trash" AI or anyone else.

I'll move on off this thread now, and let the AI buyers enjoy their investments in peace.

Jim G </div></div>

There it is.....

Common sense prevails.

There are myriad positive reasons for buying both platforms - each to their own.

Enjoy your TRG, Jim.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

In my experience it's hard to have all your employees say and do the right thing all the time. The management team however has a much longer view in terms of Customer service and reputation management. Very rarely have I not seen eye to eye with an owner of a company as long as you can access them. What toms posts conveyed to me is that you basically tried to reach him during one of the busiest times with the psr contract deadline and shot and that combined with some miscommunication led to your Inquiry dropping through the cracks. Then Tom got into it personally and tried to resolve it. That tells me that the guy who isn't going anywhere anytime soon and has all the real authority cares and will work with customers IMHO.

Please excuse an grammar or formatting typed from my iPhone

And happy shooting to Jim not attacking u at all just sharing my
Opinion too
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JimGnitecki</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wlwaldock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You gotta give AI this, for a euro made rifle you have the principals posting here answering your questions. If u ever had a REAL issue I bet AI would handle it as best they could. All the more reason I bought an AI AW! </div></div>

Disagree. My experience is that how a company handles the small issues is a good predictor of who they handle the BIG issues. A company that has trouble with "small" issues is showing The World that its processes or staffing need more work.

And your comment "as best they could", rather than "I'm sure they would handle it quickly and well", says volumes to me.

As to not being willing to provide a pdf of a user manual:

Almost every company I know provides pdf copies of their product manuals via SELF-SERVICE downloads. They do so for at least 4 reasons:

- It answers many customer or potential customer questions without even requiring a company customer service rep to take a phone call

- It limits a company's product liability exposure (talk to a corporate attorney if you don't understand how and why)

- It enables a customer or potential customer to keep a copy handy without having to carry a paper copy.

- Having made the decision to NOT provide a pdf capability, and then making the further separate decision to NOT make the manual available to anyone except people who have already spent the money and bought the rifle suggests that the company is not open to a buyer evaluating its products based on detailed written information, but rather on a sales pitch from a distributor. That annoys some buyers who prefer a more analytical approach to buying, that includes evaluating what that product will be like to actually use and maintain, as evidenced by its owner's manual.

The atitude I detected in my research turned me off. I eliminated AI from my comparison efforts and focused on TRG.

Jim G

</div></div>
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

How is it bad customer service? your not a customer until you've bought something!

Did Sako send you a manual?
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JimGnitecki</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I asked for a pdf (not physical) copy of the owner's manual, figuring a pdf costs them nothing, and surely they would want a prospective buyer to be able to see the manual in advance so he knows what he would be buying.

Glad I bought a Sako instead.</div></div>
IIRC you purchased the Sako because you had a chance to shoot it. I don't recall any of your threads at the time (on this site and others) discussing manuals.

I've shot AIAW, AIAX, Sako, GAP, Surgeon, and customized Remmies. IMO manuals give you basic rifle specs, not how it's going to shoot. Ergonomics must be felt, not described.

There's no way I would make the choice between a Jeep, Toyota, Ford, Chevy, Nissan, or Benz 4WD vehicle based solely on their owners manual. The printed material is nice to assist in the decision process, but driving the different vehicles becomes the bottom line.

Enjoy your Sako. It's a great gun. But I see no reason why you deemed it necessary to justify your choice by your comments in this thread.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Ok guys hold the presses....we have a new way to measure weapon companies...if they send you a PDF of there man. They are good to go.....are you serious? Really...

No offense but I would rather them build great rifles, and deal with CURRENT customers than waste time dealing with insignificant requests epically when they have went through the effort to put all the data up on the site already.

Every time I have had a question they have gotten back to me right away.

And by the way no company is perfect...father in law got a sako brand new- fired one round had to send it back in. Did not see it for 6 months and still has issues. bad company...no they are trying to make it right.

I think you need to expand your judging criteria just a bit...just my observation.

And how the hell can you judge a rifle with a pile of paper that gets read once when you are in the reading room, and gets put away forever after that. Very strange and sad that someone has to shit all over a company for something so petty.

Good luck to you.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

Hi Basra,
Sorry the thread does not meet your expectations but if there is something regarding AI products or service then I will comment. Is that not one of the reasons to have this forum?
Tom Irwin
Accuracy International
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tomirwin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hi Basra,
Sorry the thread does not meet your expectations but if there is something regarding AI products or service then I will comment. Is that not one of the reasons to have this forum?
Tom Irwin
Accuracy International </div></div>

Tom, I think you misunderstood my post.

No concerns from me...

I'm a long-time AW owner and have <span style="text-decoration: underline">NEVER</span> had any issues with AI in the UK or any of the distributors and dealers on either the products or CS.

A great British company doing a great job!

My AW is, for me, the best money I've ever spent on a rifle.

Was commenting on what appeared to be the OP's reason for not buying an AI!

Given your input and concern in this thread Tom, it is clear CS at AI is a priority.

Thanks!
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

What a waste of space thread-the op wants to be nasty because he didnt get a pdf ?The company gave you service and told you what ttheir policy is -you dont like it and try to slag them off and buy a different rifle ??? I suspect like most people that show bitterness in a alternate buy situation you were never going to buy the AI otherwise you wouldnt have let such a small thing put you off .Grow up and stop shitting your nappies for all to smell
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

"But on the upside...this has to be a great contender for the dumbest reason ever to buy a TRG award!"

I'm with you BasraBoy, what a joke this thread is!

Thank you Tom for sorting things out.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

It's interesting to see how people's expectations have changed in recent years, (usually for the more demanding).

I've been into H&K pistols for a long time and for just about all but the last couple years, H&K wouldn't even talk to an individual for the most part. That never stopped me or the rest of the collectors from buying them. Even today I am happy if H&K at least has their website updated with the models they are actually selling!

When I bought my first AI rifles from TacPro over a decade ago, I don't recall any option for getting information directly from AI but that didn't stop me from asking around and researching it, going and seeing one in person and then being very happy with the purchase.

I'm not saying that it's not nice to have lots of information and details before you buy, but being upset about not getting a full Armourer's manual from a top tier military supplier before you purchase a rifle is a bit on the demanding side.

Sako rifles are nice and I'm sure you'll be happy with your TRG, I've had both and in my opinion, the AI rifles are significantly better.
 
Re: Accuracy International Customer Service

AI is a company I can happily stand behind. It is not too often a representative actually participates in forums; it speaks volumes about the company.
 
Mr Irwin, can Aina convert my AIAW fixed stock to a folder? I just added a suppresor and it is a bit long now.
Thanks
JM
 
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