Yea a lot has changed, but nightforce glass being better than Schmidt now is not one of them.
- Thread starter STXLeroy
- Start date
Careful, you are going to have a lot of people mad at you for saying the truth, and saying what over 80% of the community has said for 10 years.
Why don’t you ask some instructors instead of talking out your ass
lol the owner of this site (who hates talking about glass) has even mentioned that Schmidt nudges nightforce glass out slightly. So I will take his opinion over your so called “instructors”
And like I said, this topic has been the most widely discussed scope topic for the last ten years on this site with world class shooters and competition shooters chiming in, and like I said 80% of the time (probably more) Schmidt has always won, so what exactly would these “instructors” be able to do to change the outcome of what has been discussed already for ten years
I was referencing the failure rate
But if more failures , brown glass and a high rate of grease on lenses is what you look for in a scope, keep buying them.
he used to be less politically correct and would call a spade a spade. But now he plays all sides.
and maybe Bender glass is better than NXS but it’s not better than ATACR. You seem to be stuck in the 90s. Smh boomers strike again
But if more failures , brown glass and a high rate of grease on lenses is what you look for in a scope, keep buying them.
he used to be less politically correct and would call a spade a spade. But now he plays all sides.
and maybe Bender glass is better than NXS but it’s not better than ATACR. You seem to be stuck in the 90s. Smh boomers strike again
Can we have your original screen name so we know how deep of boots we all should be wearing ?You are completely delusional
Tell me you couldn’t afford the extra 1k for a Schmidt without telling me you couldn’t afford the extra 1k
Perceptive & Deersniper you guys are funny. I am a Vortex snob, owning several Razors, owned an AMG (sold it and ATACR 5-25 to help pay for the current S&B and another Razor) but this talk is so opinionated.
I'm going to say this:
-ATACR 5-25 was barely better than my Razor GII. The Razor GII was quite a bit cheaper so it is my pick for "best bang for the buck".
-ATACR 7-35 has the edge for ELR because of it's 35X max zoom.
-With both S&B PMII & ATACR 7-35 both set to 25X zoom the S&B was slightly clearer or more diamond-like in visual appeal. The ATACR eyebox at 25X was very very flexible while the S&B was very picky. The ATACR loved being around the 25X zoom while the S&B kicked ass at around 18X.
Overall I'm happy with my S&B, just wished the reticle was more advance as I've started to become a better shooter. Carry on boys.
I'm going to say this:
-ATACR 5-25 was barely better than my Razor GII. The Razor GII was quite a bit cheaper so it is my pick for "best bang for the buck".
-ATACR 7-35 has the edge for ELR because of it's 35X max zoom.
-With both S&B PMII & ATACR 7-35 both set to 25X zoom the S&B was slightly clearer or more diamond-like in visual appeal. The ATACR eyebox at 25X was very very flexible while the S&B was very picky. The ATACR loved being around the 25X zoom while the S&B kicked ass at around 18X.
Overall I'm happy with my S&B, just wished the reticle was more advance as I've started to become a better shooter. Carry on boys.
Lol the glass sucks. 2 other people looked at my 5-45 and agreed it was terrible compared to my Atacrs.Tell me you couldn’t afford the extra 1k for a Schmidt without telling me you couldn’t afford the extra 1k
you’re right though. I’m a poor. Couldn’t afford benders had to sell them
Pretty sure a like 4 mile record was just set with a TT5-25
“The glass sucks”
dude you are a complete tool if anybody looking at these posts agrees with this clown after he just said this you are a complete clown 80-90% of snipershide and shooting community including military and world class shooters
-“Schmidt glass is slightly better than nightforce”
deer sniper
-“TwO Of My FwEnDs SaId My NnNnNiGhTfOrCe wAs BbBeTtEr”
TT is pretty well acknowledged to have among the best glass in the high end scope range.
Dude shut the fuck up and go sit in the corner. You are getting fucking roasted and hit with facts and all you got is “My FwENd SiAd NiGhTfAwWRcE iS bEtTeR”
fuck out of here and take the LIm done with you clown, the fact that you just said Schmidt glass sucks just proves you are another nightforce fairy as I mentioned who couldn’t afford the Schmidt’s and tried to go to bed at night by trying to convince yourself nightforce glass was just as good as Schmidt.
So your narcissistic ass can sit here and argue with yourself trying to convince yourself you won after embarrassing yourself and getting roasted, just like you spend all your time trying to convince yourself nightforce glass is better than a scope you couldn’t afford before going to sleep at night with your nightforce scope box with a gloryhole cut in it.
How old are you? LegitimatelyDude shut the fuck up and go sit in the corner. You are getting fucking roasted and hit with facts and all you got is “My FwENd SiAd NiGhTfAwWRcE iS bEtTeR”
Im done with you clown, the fact that you just said Schmidt glass sucks just proves you are another nightforce fairy as I mentioned who couldn’t afford the Schmidt’s and tried to go to bed at night by trying to convince yourself nightforce glass was just as good as Schmidt.
So your narcissistic ass can sit here and argue with yourself trying to convince yourself you won after embarrassing yourself and getting roasted, just like you spend all your time trying to convince yourself nightforce glass is better than a scope you couldn’t afford before going to sleep at night with your nightforce scope box with a gloryhole cut in it.
Agree, I have 4 TT along with a Z ZComp and Hendsold and I dont think there is anything better than the Theta
If possible. You could buy both on the PX and sell the one you don't like without losing much if anything.
"Bender worth the $1200 more than the ATACR? since I'm used to second focal plane should I just strap another old school NXS for half the price? Opinions. I've got an open mind so tell me what the professionals think"
No,
but where are 5-25 PMIIs $1200 more then ATACR 5-25? Used ( which is how I always roll) they are about the exact same price scope for scope. Id pick the reticle you like get the one your find that is cheaper or toss a coin if they are the same price. Or just buy the first that pops up here and try it and if you dont like it sell it here and buy the other.
No,
but where are 5-25 PMIIs $1200 more then ATACR 5-25? Used ( which is how I always roll) they are about the exact same price scope for scope. Id pick the reticle you like get the one your find that is cheaper or toss a coin if they are the same price. Or just buy the first that pops up here and try it and if you dont like it sell it here and buy the other.
I need a few more posts and full members stats before I can start swapping. But I've purchased several items from here with good success. This razor was purchased on the forums. I just wish I knew how it would be in field conditions with my eyes. Good advice
I posted the below in another users PX listing for a ATACR.
I just bought the 7-35x ATACR to complement my Schmidt Bender PMII. It is my first Nightforce. I have no clue if it is the same as the 5-25x.
I was super hesitant to buy Nightforce because it "wasn't German glass", was "Made in Japan", and seemed like the luxury brand of Vortex. I only gave it a try because of the Military contract to replace SB. I know I'm not the only brand whore snob like that on the Hide
I spent HOURS doing a side-by-side comparison in all different lighting conditions, at all different distances, and at all types of objects from my back porch where mirage kills.
My conclusion about the Nightforce ATACR F1:
Nightforce = Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
My overly critical, OCD a** will take that to my grave with me. I tried so very hard to induce CA in both and couldn't. Turret feel and usability go to NF. Ability to resolve through mirage was equal. Edge clarity actually went to NF.
SB had warmth and vividness --> it looked clearer.
NF had sharpness and the colors looked more...realistic?
For example, from my balcony I could look at homes on a hillside from 600 yard out to 1K. What I saw through the NF was what I "imagined" the homes would look like give all I could see is just a dot on a hillside. Meaning, the colors of that home I see 800 yards away are magnified and are exactly what I see in my NF whereas the color of the home in the SB were probably closer to what the home would look like if I walked all the way up too it.
Parallax knobs were a toss up. FWIW, Kahles suffered mightily regarding CA. I have no way of testing robustness or click accuracy, but the confidence I have in dialing on a NF is measurably higher than dialing on SB.
Anyone on the fence about NF can buy with confidence if my $0.02 matters at all. I have two horses in this race and don't care which is the winner. I do know I would like an ATACR with the T3 reticle if I could find one.
Nightforce = Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
I just bought the 7-35x ATACR to complement my Schmidt Bender PMII. It is my first Nightforce. I have no clue if it is the same as the 5-25x.
I was super hesitant to buy Nightforce because it "wasn't German glass", was "Made in Japan", and seemed like the luxury brand of Vortex. I only gave it a try because of the Military contract to replace SB. I know I'm not the only brand whore snob like that on the Hide
I spent HOURS doing a side-by-side comparison in all different lighting conditions, at all different distances, and at all types of objects from my back porch where mirage kills.
My conclusion about the Nightforce ATACR F1:
Nightforce = Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
My overly critical, OCD a** will take that to my grave with me. I tried so very hard to induce CA in both and couldn't. Turret feel and usability go to NF. Ability to resolve through mirage was equal. Edge clarity actually went to NF.
SB had warmth and vividness --> it looked clearer.
NF had sharpness and the colors looked more...realistic?
For example, from my balcony I could look at homes on a hillside from 600 yard out to 1K. What I saw through the NF was what I "imagined" the homes would look like give all I could see is just a dot on a hillside. Meaning, the colors of that home I see 800 yards away are magnified and are exactly what I see in my NF whereas the color of the home in the SB were probably closer to what the home would look like if I walked all the way up too it.
Parallax knobs were a toss up. FWIW, Kahles suffered mightily regarding CA. I have no way of testing robustness or click accuracy, but the confidence I have in dialing on a NF is measurably higher than dialing on SB.
Anyone on the fence about NF can buy with confidence if my $0.02 matters at all. I have two horses in this race and don't care which is the winner. I do know I would like an ATACR with the T3 reticle if I could find one.
Nightforce = Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
Last edited:
I posted the below in another users PX listing for a ATACR.
I just bought the 7-35x ATACR to complement my Schmidt Bender PMII. It is my first Nightforce. I have no clue if it is the same as the 5-25x.
I was super hesitant to buy Nightforce because it "wasn't German glass", was "Made in Japan", and seemed like the luxury brand of Vortex. I only gave it a try because of the Military contract to replace SB. know I'm not the only brand whore snob like that on the Hide
I spent HOURS doing a side-by-side comparison in all different lighting conditions, at all different distances, and all types of object from my back porch where mirage kills.
My conclusion about the Nightforce ATACR F1:
Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
My overly critical, OCD a** I will take that to my grave with me. I tried so very hard to induce CA in both and couldn't. Turret feel and usability go to NF. Ability to resolve through mirage was equal. Edge clarity actually went to NF.
SB had warmth and vividness --> it looked clearer. Whereas NF had sharpness and the colors looked more...realistic? For example, from my balcony I could look at homes on a hillside from 600 yard out to 1K. What I saw through the NF was what I "imagined" the homes would look like give all I could see is just a dot on a hillside. Meaning, the colors of that home I see 800 yards away are magnified and are exactly what I see in my NF whereas the color of the home in the SB were probably closer to what the home would look like if I walked all the way up too it.
Parallax knobs were a toss up. FWIW, Kahles suffered mightily regarding CA. I have no way of testing robustness or click accuracy, but the confidence I have in dialing on a NF is measurably higher than dialing on SB.
Anyone on the fence about NF can buy with confidence if my $0.02 matters at all.
Nightforce = Schmidt-Bender quality and performance without the Schmidt-Bender price.
@Huskydriver I was looking for a used PMII and came upon this dumpster fire of a thread.
@Huskydriver I was looking for a used PMII and came upon this dumpster fire of a thread.
Lol It wasn't my fault!
Have you played with a 320 or 520 ultra short yet?
Yes and I'm on the fence. I like the ultra bright but.....kinda just bought a Swaro STR 80 spotter so.....I'm back to being poor for 2 months.
You are going to love that spotter....be poor for a bit and save up.... Those new dtii+ turrets are legit. Prolly my fav turret I have ever used.
I think if ever given the choice between a 525 Schmidt and a 320 us I would always take the 320 now no questions asked. No tunneling on the low end and 20x on the top is plenty for me as I'm rarely above 16 in most dynamic shooting situations... Usually at 10-12. Mag ring is better on the 320 imo.
Fov on the 320 is impressive check @Glassaholic battle of the ultra shorts thread if you haven't.
Grid comes in the 320 also
Schmidt Bender PM II 3-20x50 Ultra Short DT II+ MTC LT / ST II ZC LT GRID .1 mrad Riflescope 667-911-422-M2-I5
FREE SHIPPING on Schmidt Bender PM II 3-20x50 Ultra Short DT II+ GRID .1 mrad Riflescope 667-911-422-M2-I5
Life is too short to compromiseYou are going to love that spotter....be poor for a bit and save up.... Those new dtii+ turrets are legit. Prolly my fav turret I have ever used.
I think if ever given the choice between a 525 Schmidt and a 320 us I would always take the 320 now no questions asked. No tunneling on the low end and 20x on the top is plenty for me as I'm rarely above 16 in most dynamic shooting situations... Usually at 10-12. Mag ring is better on the 320 imo.
Fov on the 320 is impressive check @Glassaholic battle of the ultra shorts thread if you haven't.
Grid comes in the 320 also
Schmidt Bender PM II 3-20x50 Ultra Short DT II+ MTC LT / ST II ZC LT GRID .1 mrad Riflescope 667-911-422-M2-I5
FREE SHIPPING on Schmidt Bender PM II 3-20x50 Ultra Short DT II+ GRID .1 mrad Riflescope 667-911-422-M2-I5www.eurooptic.com
#circlife
#mpct3
FYI Gr2id came in handy for a no dial, hold under stage. Dude after me had an MPCT3 and ran out of mils and couldn't touch his scope.
#opencirclesrgayierthanaides
Mpct2 is probably best tree reticle imo. Love it in my 527. But I run msr2 in everything else
#putagr2idinitandillplay
Lol that is not the price you will pay if you know what you are doing.... Just saying
How many mil did you have to hold. ? The bottom of the uterus gives you an extra mil for 3FYI Gr2id came in handy for a no dial, hold under stage. Dude after me had an MPCT3 and ran out of mils and couldn't touch his scope.
2.5, but apparently floating in between doesn’t work out too well on a 6” circle at 600 yards
2.5, but apparently floating in between doesn’t work out too well on a 6” circle at 600 yards
Modern problems require modern solutions...
