Alliant Power Pro 2000 in 308 AR Piston - Free Lunch?

[Guyotrd]

I was thinking of using my POF P308 for the next ELK hunt - but consider the velocity marginal at best for the long 250 - 350 yd shots that might be required.

I am getting 2578 with the 20 in barrel with factory Hornady ELD-X 178 which surprised me as it is only 22fps slower than the factory specs in a barrel that is 24 inches (it should be about 100fps slower)

I ran across the load data on the Federal Website for the new Edge TLR 175 that lists Max velocity at 2803 - if that is accurate I would be getting in range of a 300 WSM. Problem solved.

I have searched here and seen all sorts of conflicting opinions on the temperature stability - Alliant says it is stable and other posts have it at .5ps per degree. The temperature swings a lot here in Colorado so the indoor range I shoot at for load development is about 70 F, while the shot in second season could be anywhere from 10 - 50 F. Also other powders like the factory Hornady which is unknown might have similar variations - (I imagine besides the Alliant the Hornady Factory recipe will be hard to beat) - Also POF advises against Hornady SST ammo in the piston gun for some reason related to the location of the gas port and I am not sure whether this is a factor here.

I cannot solve this mystery now as there is not powder and am starting to think we may never see powder and ammo abundant again.

Is there a downside I am not seeing or is this a case of a free lunch on the extra velocity?

 

[FLIGHT762]

Hornady advises against using "Superformance" ammo in gas guns, not "SST", which is one of their bullet designs.

 

[Guyotrd]

Hornady advises against using "Superformance" ammo in gas guns, not "SST", which is one of their bullet designs.

Yes of course - I am nearing 60 and while not slobbering yet the memory/mental acuity is not what is used to be - although ask me anything about the 70's - I do not particularly care for their sst bullets.

 

[Guyotrd]

I just bought some on Gunbroker for 100 / lb -Way too much but I want to try it, comments from those that have used it, would be appreciated.

 

[FLIGHT762]

I've shot a bit of 2000 MR in two 308 bolt guns using 175 OTM. One is a 24" Hart and the other, a 27" 40XBKS. Velocities were in the 2770 FPS range with 46.5 Grs. in a Federal case.

I don't think you're going to get near your goal velocity in a 20" gas gun. I shoot two DI 308 AR's, a GAP 10 and a SR-25. I have to drop a grain or two from my bolt gun loads or I will beat my brass to death.

I did try a couple of 2000 MR loads in the GAP 10. With 45.0gr. & a Hornady 178, in Federal GMM brass, I got 2611 FPS avg. W/ a Magneto Speed. I went up to 45.8 gr. with a 175 Nosler CC and "1968 WCC" 7.62 NATO brass. Didn't chrono it, but got 2" groups @ 300 yards with no over pressure signs. GAP 10 has a 22" Bartlien barrel.

You're going to have to work up your load and be aware of the temp sensitivity if you shoot the load in hotter weather.

 

[jzerfoss]

I used 2000mr in my 18.5" AR308 and I was getting 2570ish with 46.8grs and 178gr bthp. Decent velocity for the barrel length. Single digit s.d. and good accuracy for the platform (.5-.75)

 

[Guyotrd]

I just spoke with Alliant and they said that the 2000 MR is not one of their temperature stable powders like RL 16, 23 and 26 and I can expect 1 - 2 FPS Variance at temperature extremes.

I will report back my experiment once I load with the TLR Edge

 

[Mr Tibbs]

Guyotrd: I’ve got a Speer Datafile for the 168 gr BTHP Match bullet , Power Pro 2000-MR is not one of the 13 powders suitable for gas operated semi-auto rifles .

 

[Jumper]

Guyotrd: I’ve got a Speer Datafile for the 168 gr BTHP Match bullet , Power Pro 2000-MR is not one of the 13 powders suitable for gas operated semi-auto rifles .

Is this for Rifles like the M14 or the Garand that are prone to bent Op rods?
PP200MR is my main powder for my AR. Its DI gas system in 7mm-08 with +1" gas tube and adjustable gas. I've had good results with 44.4gr PP200MR behind a 150gr SMK. Even when shot suppressed. Velocity a hair less than 2800fps.

 

[Doom]

2000MR is awfully slow. Having used it in a 20” bolt with 178 AMax I would not recommend it in a Semi even if I were not pushing the velocity. The velocity was slightly under 2700 fps with ~48grs. An adjustable gas block would be needed on a DI. My Rem 700 spit fire in broad daylight and recoil was excessive. No one around me liked it, and that was before I put a break on the rifle!

It is definitly not a Garand or M14 powder, it would destroy the Op Rod.

 

[Mr Tibbs]

Is this for Rifles like the M14 or the Garand that are prone to bent Op rods?
PP200MR is my main powder for my AR. Its DI gas system in 7mm-08 with +1" gas tube and adjustable gas. I've had good results with 44.4gr PP200MR behind a 150gr SMK. Even when shot suppressed. Velocity a hair less than 2800fps.

The datafile shows a + next to each powder that can be used in a Gas Operated Semi-auto rifles . There is no + next to Alliant Power Pro 2000-MR .

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjHk83Q65XvAhWph-AKHf_2DGAQFjAJegQICBAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Freloading-data.speer-ammo.com%2Fdownloads%2Fspeer%2Freloading-pdfs%2FRifle%2F30_caliber_308_dia%2F308_Winchester_168.pdf&usg=AOvVaw0qnL877P9S-MFxYEfsjGx0

 

[Doom]

The datafile shows a + next to each powder that can be used in a Gas Operated Semi-auto rifles . There is no + next to Alliant Power Pro 2000-MR .

The powders marked are M1A/M14 suitable powders and loads so they apply directly to those rifles. The AR’s are more forgiving but still have to consider Gas pressure at the gas port.

 

[Guyotrd]

I am going to call Alliant Monday to make sure it is safe in my Piston 308.