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Any Swiss K-31 fans?

Muskox

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jul 10, 2011
333
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Sucky Kentucky
I have a wonderful un-issued one I can't get to get back to Merica and start shooting again.

I have seen some interestingly customized ones, and would like to put a fiberglass stock on mine as well as a 1913 railed mount if anyone has any good idea photos.
 
Very accurate and nicely made guns. To bad they are not in left handed as well even though I do have two of them. Attached is a link. Larry Racine makes target type stocks for them. He also makes match rifle sight bases. One of my K31's has Swiss Match Rifle sights installed on it. Bought them all the way from Switzerland.

gunsmithing.htm

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels
 
If you have an un-issued one don't mess with it. They are great shooters with the Swiss match ammo. The value on these is starting to jump and you don't see as many for sale. If you want to trick one out find a beech
Stock beater to play with. One gunsmith was converting them
To 308 but it cost around 1k for the work and barrel
 
Top item on the page, 875 CHF (Swiss francs) for the stock alone: Richner Waffen GmbH - Mägenwil - Sportwaffen

Full conversion model (2650 CHF) in winter camo:

N7isnLq.jpg
 
Did you bother to do a search for K31 before you posted? There are several posts about the K31.

Why on earth would one need to scope such an accurate rifle?

 
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Yes I bothered, just didn't find the Swiss thumbhole stock.

I'll do what I want with it, thanks for padding your post count.

Mine is beach by the way not walnut.

Not sure I am going to restock it, just looking at options. I have nice rifles with expensive companants that I am willing to spend money on. A WW2 rifle is proably not one of them. I wouldn't spend $1000 to restock a Mauser 98 or Krag either.

As for putting a scope on it, I will do that. Probably with one of the EAW clamp on mounts.

I own no rifles without scopes, and I can't see the point of this not having a scope either. This is 2013, not 1776. Rifle scopes are made to kill things at distance. Why would I choose to make my life harder by not using one.
 
'I'll do what I want with it, thanks for padding your post count.' WTF is that?

My comment wasn't a challenge it was a comment about the genetic accuracy of these rifle. Obviously there will not any intelligent conversation about about shooting and care of the K31 here. The title of this page is VINTAGE rifles.

Your need to learn to shoot and have basic skills.

Yes you do what you want who cares it's your rifle and throw that kill word around a bit more. Real grown up.

Cheers
..MJ..

 
The K31 is my favorite milsurp rifle. I own 2 standard rifles 1 K31/42 sniper an 2 K31/55 AKA K31ZFK. All are very accurate but the K31/55 is by far the most accurate.
 
'I'll do what I want with it, thanks for padding your post count.' WTF is that?

Look at where the poster is from. I think he took exception to the fact that you were shooting a koala up the butt. :D
 
Love the SRs. I used to own a 96/11, and a sweeter shooter would be hard to find. My K31 harvested my daughter's first deer, a nice 7-pointer. A straight shot from the front, right through the heart @ 73 yd.
 
So let me get this straight.....you should never scope a rifle because it is an accurate one? Personally, I've never found a reason to scope a rifle that's NOT accurate.

Okie
 
So let me get this straight.....you should never scope a rifle because it is an accurate one? Personally, I've never found a reason to scope a rifle that's NOT accurate.

Okie

Someone should have told snipers over the last 70 years or so....


Tapatalk2
 
If you really want to scope a K31 go talk to Rock solid industries. But the will have to install it.
 

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Don't have a K31 in the collection, yet.
Do have an M1911, shoots like a dream with the GP-11 ammo, shoots accurate with the GP-11 ammo all with iron sights.
As the eyes get olders, the idea of scoping it appealing, unless I gift it to the next generation.
So they can appreciate the craftsmanship and learn proper shooting skills on a vintage rifle.

Some times scoping a vintage rifle is like suggesting a Sophia Loren needed a boob job.
 
Some of us no longer have the eyesight we had when we we 20 years old and require scopes on a rifle. That being said I would never bubba my K31's. That's why I shoot the K31/55 or the K31/42 which are scoped Swiss snipers. But if I did not have an alternative I might consider scoping a military rifle. But not any of my Swiss ones. For example there are mounts that replace the rear sight on MN's that do not permanently alter the rifle. Same with some Mauser rifles. But you have to use a long eye relief scope like those used on scout rifles.
 
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The K31 is my favorite milsurp rifle. I own 2 standard rifles 1 K31/42 sniper an 2 K31/55 AKA K31ZFK. All are very accurate but the K31/55 is by far the most accurate.

Whats different about the K31/55?

Also, the 7.5x55 has near .284 capacity, yet MV is comparatively low, like below .308 factory loads. The cartridge is quite a modern looking design, why are the velocities so low? Is this just to stay safe in 100 year old actions or? Surely it could be loaded up to ~.30-06 levels?

Also, for those who have shot multiple examples of both: what is/was more accurate and/or easier to shoot between the M1896/M38/M41 Swedish Mauser vs the K31 Swiss and its variants? Im about ready to start getting some vintage service/sniper rifles and definitely plan on either a 1903A4 or 1942 USMC Springfield Sniper for sure, likely from James River. And then after that Im debating between K31 and Swede Mauser.

And also for anyone who knows, sandwarrior perhaps? Would you say that the M96 Swede and its variants are the most accurate Mausers on average and/or the easiest to get to shoot? And out of all the 7x57mm 1898 models, which would rank first?
 
Some of us no longer have the eyesight we had when we we 20 years old and require scopes on a rifle. That being said I would never bubba my K31's. That's why I shoot the K31/55 or the K31/42 which are scoped Swiss snipers. But if I did not have an alternative I might consider scoping a military rifle. But not any of my Swiss ones. For example thee are mounts that replace the rear sight on MN's that do not permanently alter the rifle. Same with some Mauser rifles. But you have to use a long eye relief scope like those used on scout rifles.

Brownell's sells a clamp-on mount that is pretty secure. No alteration to the rifle required, but the scope is offset to the right making for an interesting cheek weld. And yes old eyes do benefit greatly from scopes.

OFG
 
Whats different about the K31/55?

Also, the 7.5x55 has near .284 capacity, yet MV is comparatively low, like below .308 factory loads. The cartridge is quite a modern looking design, why are the velocities so low? Is this just to stay safe in 100 year old actions or? Surely it could be loaded up to ~.30-06 levels?

Also, for those who have shot multiple examples of both: what is/was more accurate and/or easier to shoot between the M1896/M38/M41 Swedish Mauser vs the K31 Swiss and its variants? Im about ready to start getting some vintage service/sniper rifles and definitely plan on either a 1903A4 or 1942 USMC Springfield Sniper for sure, likely from James River. And then after that Im debating between K31 and Swede Mauser.

And also for anyone who knows, sandwarrior perhaps? Would you say that the M96 Swede and its variants are the most accurate Mausers on average and/or the easiest to get to shoot? And out of all the 7x57mm 1898 models, which would rank first?

Get you're self one of each and find out. 7.5 doesn't need to run at 3006 full house to out shoot most rifles and the .30 '06.

 
"Whats different about the K31/55?"

The K31 /55 aka K31/55 is the last iteration of the K31 line. It has a Kern 4X over the receiver like most other rifles rather than the side mounted folding periscope of the K31/42 and the K31/43 sniper which has scope around 2X As you can see from the photo it looks like someone sporterized the rifles but the come with an entirely different heavy stock and a very effective muzzle brake very similar to the FG42's and a bipod similar to the PE 57 and SIG AMT.

Below are 2 photos of my K31/55 aka K31/ZFK.




I found the standard K31 sights easier to use than the Swedish sights on the M1896 or the M38's. That was when I could shoot iron sights. Now with increasing age I rarely shoot iron sights. When I shoot a Swede it's my 41B sniper.
 
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Whats different about the K31/55?

Also, the 7.5x55 has near .284 capacity, yet MV is comparatively low, like below .308 factory loads. The cartridge is quite a modern looking design, why are the velocities so low? Is this just to stay safe in 100 year old actions or? Surely it could be loaded up to ~.30-06 levels?

Also, for those who have shot multiple examples of both: what is/was more accurate and/or easier to shoot between the M1896/M38/M41 Swedish Mauser vs the K31 Swiss and its variants? Im about ready to start getting some vintage service/sniper rifles and definitely plan on either a 1903A4 or 1942 USMC Springfield Sniper for sure, likely from James River. And then after that Im debating between K31 and Swede Mauser.

And also for anyone who knows, sandwarrior perhaps? Would you say that the M96 Swede and its variants are the most accurate Mausers on average and/or the easiest to get to shoot? And out of all the 7x57mm 1898 models, which would rank first?

Good questions!

First about the K-31 velocity. Understand that the current GP(19)11 ammunition isn't all that far behind what was the then loaded M2 ball of the U.S. Army. And, it's shooting a 174 gr. bullet instead of a 150 gr. bullet. The sights are attuned to that bullet at that speed. The bullet does have a very high BC for a .30 and therefore will outshoot any .308 or .30-06 on the market even today. I have compared GP11 against SMK175's and GP11 handily wins. By 100 yds. if you want to know the actuality. FWIW, the bullet is a two diameter bullet. If you get some you will notice it is a lot longer and sleeker sticking out of the top of the case. So, that is why the velocity is what it is. Everything was predicated on it being one speed back then. It worked, so no changes. As to the cartridge looking modern? It was designed in 1889. Tell you something?

That said, I think of it and the variations of the 1911, my Swiss rifles shoot a hair tighter than the Swedish rifles do. You will see Swedish rifles on a lot more titles as they competed worldwide with theirs. The Swiss, generally did not. The one major exception being the Olympics. When rifle competitions were still held in them.

Also, as much as I love my Mausers of all different sizes and calibers, the K-31 will beat any of them for accuracy. At least in their original military forms. I used to have a CG-63 that was as accurate as any milsurp rifle I've owned.

As to which Mauser is most accurate in originally chambered 7x57? The Mexican 1910 manufactured between the years 1930-1935. As noted by the 1910 those rifles were manufactured in Mexico (as were the later ones) starting in 1910. The genral problem with Mexican Mausers is there were so many uprisings it's hard to tell which days you had good or not so good quality, depending on what revolution was going on at the time. During the period above there were no revolutions disrupting production. You might also be surprised to find that in breaking down Mausers to rebuild them it was found Mexican Mausers had the highest quality. As good as, if not better than the Swedes. The time was when labor was cheap but, Mexicans always being attentive to detail, had the time to make as perfect of steel, form the product and finish it out to make the best Mauser on the market of the day. This didn't happen by accident. From the 1860's onward, due to the multiple invasions of Mexico by foreign armies, Mexico sent her brightest young hopefuls to Europe to learn manufacturing. Especially the manufacture of arms/armaments. Without going too in depth with the history, suffice it to say, when they built good rifles, Mexico built the best. If you get a 1930 you will need to check the crest to make sure you have a Mexican and not an FN Import. Which is still a nice rifle. A true Mexican will say "Fabrica Nacional De Armas" over the crest and "Mexico-D.F." and date stamped under the crest. The crest is an eagle clutching a rattlesnake on a cactus. An imported rifle will say "Republica Mexicana" over the crest and date of Mfr. Another great one is the 1936 Short rifle. Not as long of barrel as the previous ones. But, very high quality and accurate.

Along the same lines as Mexico, some countries ended up on the benefit side of post-war years. Czechoslovakia fell into this category. Prior to WWI they were contracted by Germany to build many weapons. So they had the weapons manufacture capability on hand. They too have a 'quality over quantity' mindset. So, that being said, two of the most accurate 7x57 M98's (standard production) I've shot were a 98/22 and a 98/29. Note the 98/29's were not all Persian. All Persians were 7.92x57, though. VZ-24's were also made in 7x57 and if you got one of these you probably would not be disappointed in the accuracy.

As a general rule I find the pre WWI's to be pretty accurate. Depending on how much they got used/abused. Most all of the South American countries (not Argentina) used the 7x57 at one time or another. The 1908 mfr'd by DWM is accurate (when not shot out) as well as the Steyr 1912 Mexican/Chilean.

-hope that helps
 
Went to Manatee this past weekend, and my younger son took his K-31 along...it's fitted with the Swiss Products d and t side mount (damn those receivers are hard!) I installed with a Bushy 10X tactical. Made him up some H4350 handloads with 175 smk's and he banged away at the torso sized steel at 565 with rarely a miss...great rifles, need to get one for myself!
 
There is also a Hammerli made K31 that has has match sight but they are quite rare. I have 1 in my collection and it is a tack driver. I do not shoot it much any longer my eyesight is just not good enough for iron sights.
 
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I have a couple K-31's. one was bubba'd by someone else before could get the sniper version. Both of mine like the 175 smk. I almost had a set of the match sights years ago but the guy descided that he wanted to keep them. Last set I saw was over 300 and that is more than I paid for both rifles. Would love to find a set. The one with a scope holds under a min all day long. As does the original one. When my eyes are up to it. Would love to find a set of sights for it.
Going to have to work up some h4350 loads now as I have been using n160.
 
I have a couple K-31's. one was bubba'd by someone else before could get the sniper version. Both of mine like the 175 smk. I almost had a set of the match sights years ago but the guy descided that he wanted to keep them. Last set I saw was over 300 and that is more than I paid for both rifles. Would love to find a set. The one with a scope holds under a min all day long. As does the original one. When my eyes are up to it. Would love to find a set of sights for it.
Going to have to work up some h4350 loads now as I have been using n160.

I've already shot hand loads thru my gun with 175mk's. Believe the powder I used was H4350. I'll look in my load data tonight when I get home. If I recall correctly I paid around $200 for the sights (yea more than I paid for the rifle). I bought the sights from a dealer in Switzerland and had them shipped all the way over here. That was around 12 years ago. They we're brand new in the packaging. The only thing I had to add to them was the adjustable rear aperture which is a Gehman.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels
 
I've already shot hand loads thru my gun with 175mk's. Believe the powder I used was H4350. I'll look in my load data tonight when I get home. If I recall correctly I paid around $200 for the sights (yea more than I paid for the rifle). I bought the sights from a dealer in Switzerland and had them shipped all the way over here. That was around 12 years ago. They we're brand new in the packaging. The only thing I had to add to them was the adjustable rear aperture which is a Gehman.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

thanks a lot Frank.
 
There is also a Hammerli made K31 that has has match sight but they are quite . I have 1 in my collection and it is a tack driver. I do not shoot it much any longer my eyesight is just not good enough for iron sights.

I didn't know any of the hammerli's made it to the states. I friend of mine got to shoot one when shot military competitions while he was in the swiss army. said was one of the most accurate rifles he had ever shot, and tried to buy it when got out but they wouldn't sell it to him. did it come with the match sights on it?
 
Yes it did I will post some photos shortly.
I got his 35 years ago together with 3 1911 carbines with Pioneer bayonets, a 1911 rifle and bayonet, a 96/11 rifle and bayonet, A Walnut stocked K31 and bayonet and a K31/42 sniper.All are matching and range from 90-98% finish with excellent wood.
A few photos




 
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I thought it was H4350 but wasn't. Sorry!

I loaded 47.0gr. of N150 and the 175mk's. Nice looking hits on the primers. Not flat, no pressure signs and bolt worked like a million bucks.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

Frank,

That's pretty much right in line with what I did. I used 46 gr. of VV N160 behind a 175 for about 2640 fps. My first load with them was 46. gr. with 168 SMK's then 167 gr. lapua's.

I've found anything right in that area, loaded to reasonable velocities is gonna show accuracy. Load 'em hot and maybe not so much accuracy, eh? But, good solid loads always showed accuracy with these.

SAMNEV. Beautiful rifle!
 
Samnev some awesome rifles.
I've been loading 44.0 gr of N160 with the 175 SMK. And show about 2" @ 200 but have note to up powder. When upped to 46.0 opened groups to 3" but had a lot more wind that day. 10 mph with gusts. But that is what I have been shooting but have not shot groups with it since.
Did use 180gr nosler BT to take a deer and did wonderful.
When get some empties I'll try some H4350 loads and see what I get.
 
sandwarrior,
thanks for the compliment. I just wish my eye sight would allow me to shoot iron sights now.
Deej.
When my eyesight allowed me to shoot iron sights 38 grains of IMR 4895 behind 168 grains worked well for me. Any where up to 41.5 grains worked almost as well. It a mild load but shoot very well at 100 yards.
 
love the k31 action and the looks it gets at the range.
im on a flat wallet so i when it comes to my toys i stay cheap and then tune them up with DIY projects. i couldnt afford to send mine out to get drilled at rock-solid so instead i made a bull pup stock allowing me to use a 30$ scout mount and a normal scope. its a fun gun to shoot weather is un altered or modded.bullpup k31 A.jpg
 
love the k31 action and the looks it gets at the range.
im on a flat wallet so i when it comes to my toys i stay cheap and then tune them up with DIY projects. i couldnt afford to send mine out to get drilled at rock-solid so instead i made a bull pup stock allowing me to use a 30$ scout mount and a normal scope. its a fun gun to shoot weather is un altered or modded.View attachment 17471

Erbacon,

Interesting concept. How is it to cycle the action with it moved to the rear? Easier or harder, or just 'different'?
 
it is awkward to use. the stock is very very blocky and heavy like a bench rifle on steroids because it isn't as easy to maneuver I figure it wouldn't make a difference if it is slow to operate the blot. only need on shot when I hunt any ways. I usually only carry two rounds.
I thought about adding a push rod and strapping it to the knobs on the bolt and running an hooked screw into the stock for a guide. that way you could use it just like a normal bolt, but I never made it that far.
I mainly just wanted to see what it would do with a center mounted scope and im too cheap to spend more then 100$ on the idea. I might have 75 tied p in it total.
im happy with the results tho. it did its job
 
One of my most accurate military rifles as well. Folks tend to look at these as manufactured by SIG or Hammerli and that is not the case. SIG and Hammerli manufactured all the parts for the rifles and provided them to the Swiss National Armory ... Eidgenössiche Waffenbrick in Bern, Switzerland... they built all the rifles. It's common to find a mix of SIG and Hammerli parts on an original rifle. I've been told that many of the serious shooters in the Swiss rifle clubs preferred the Hammerli barrels and effected swaps when they could. My most accurate K31 is all SIG ... except for a Hammerli barrel, likely just such a swap.

There's a guy on the Swiss Rifles forum that was a Swiss army armorer who's a wealth of information...
 
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ok finally got some H4350 loads worked up

image.jpgimage (2).jpgimage (3).jpgimage (4).jpg the first picture is my son doing the Vana White. second is the bubba'd up sniper wannabe. I did a ladder from 44 gr to 49gr in .2 gr increments and these were the two nodes I got. sot at 300 yards and the wind was about as bad as could get with swirling and up to 20mph gusts. I loaded them as long as I could and still fit in mag. I think I still get a bit of jump but didn't measure. the lower node was just over 2 min and high just under. some was wind and he called 2 shots each as wind and gun set up was messing with him a bit. there were no signs of pressure in any of the loads. primers had no signs and extraction was same through out the ladder. might try some vv powders next. n160 was showing about same and didn't do a ladder with it yet. hopefully got some info out of it and we got to play around a bit.
 
Ok going to try vv550 next with 168 and 175gr. As soon as get a descent day will let ya know how it worked.
 
Some Hammerli's did make it here...here is mine with an "Elite" rear sight. I love the K-31. I built this K-31 Scheutzen rifle and they are easy to scope with a Unertl type scope. Also, shown is my "feldschiessen" K-31 with Elite target sights.