Stupid question. First duracoat job tomorrow. Guns (870 and 1911) are broken down and ready to be cleaned and sprayed. So here is the question. When people say they use brake cleaner to strip oil prior to duracoat are we talking automotive brake cleaner or Break-Free citrus based gun cleaner? Don't want to screw this up before I even start spraying paint...
Gunsmithing Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
- Thread starter springerjb
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Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I usually use automotive brake cleaner. Are you talking about the Break Free Powder Blast stuff? I've used it a few times for other things, and think it leaves too much of a residue to work well with DuraCoat.
I usually use automotive brake cleaner. Are you talking about the Break Free Powder Blast stuff? I've used it a few times for other things, and think it leaves too much of a residue to work well with DuraCoat.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I think you are referring to the degreasing before aluminum oxide blasting (or whatever Duracoat recommends). I degrease my parts with carb cleaner, then blast, then spray with acetone before I put a finish on. My experience is with Gunkote. The only Break-Free I know of is a cleaner/lubricant for gut parts, and would not be good for degreasing.
I think you are referring to the degreasing before aluminum oxide blasting (or whatever Duracoat recommends). I degrease my parts with carb cleaner, then blast, then spray with acetone before I put a finish on. My experience is with Gunkote. The only Break-Free I know of is a cleaner/lubricant for gut parts, and would not be good for degreasing.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I'd use acetone, brake cleaners leave a residue. I welded some steel I'd degreased with brake clean and it lets you know its still there. Couldn't say it would effect Duracoat but acetone is meant for paint prep work.
I'd use acetone, brake cleaners leave a residue. I welded some steel I'd degreased with brake clean and it lets you know its still there. Couldn't say it would effect Duracoat but acetone is meant for paint prep work.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
Don't get brake cleaner and carb cleaner mixed up, they look like the same stuff, but they are not.
Carb cleaner leaves residue (bad).
Brake cleaner does not (good).
Mineral Spirits leaves residue (bad).
Brake cleaner and/or Acetone are what you want, I use both as needed.
Don't get brake cleaner and carb cleaner mixed up, they look like the same stuff, but they are not.
Carb cleaner leaves residue (bad).
Brake cleaner does not (good).
Mineral Spirits leaves residue (bad).
Brake cleaner and/or Acetone are what you want, I use both as needed.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
In the commercial chemical lab where I worked during my college days as dishwasher (to clean laboratory flasks and such before chemical testing) we used acetone and alcohol...denatured anhydrous alcohol such as Solox...to clean if we wanted a really pure surface. One is a polar solvent and the other a non-polar solvent. Half and half mix. Don't use that on carbon steel and let it sit around very long. Atmospheric moisture will start rust in a short time. JMHO
In the commercial chemical lab where I worked during my college days as dishwasher (to clean laboratory flasks and such before chemical testing) we used acetone and alcohol...denatured anhydrous alcohol such as Solox...to clean if we wanted a really pure surface. One is a polar solvent and the other a non-polar solvent. Half and half mix. Don't use that on carbon steel and let it sit around very long. Atmospheric moisture will start rust in a short time. JMHO
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I suggest acetone. </div></div>
+1
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I suggest acetone. </div></div>
+1
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I would use Brake-Kleen as a degreaser prior to blasting. I would recommend heating metal parts prior to coating to bring out any oil that may be in recesses, holes and joints. Based on the amount present, you may want to put back into Brake-Kleen or just clean area with Acetone. Good luck.
I would use Brake-Kleen as a degreaser prior to blasting. I would recommend heating metal parts prior to coating to bring out any oil that may be in recesses, holes and joints. Based on the amount present, you may want to put back into Brake-Kleen or just clean area with Acetone. Good luck.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
To degrease simply spraying it with something is not going to cut it. Save the brake cleaner for your brakes. Submerge in Acetone for 20 minutes. From this point on you may only touch your parts with powder free latex gloves. Acetone goes right through nitrile. Then for best adhesion you need to rough up the surface with 100-120 grit aluminum oxide blasting. Blow the residue off with compressed air so you don't get any hidden media residue surprizes. Then if possible warm your parts up to 250 degrees for 20-30 minutes to push out any hidden oils. If no oil is exposed then once your parts are back to room temp proceed with spraying you coating.
This is proper surface prep. Anything less may appear to work but will lead to premature failure of the coating over time.
Good luck and post some pictures.
To degrease simply spraying it with something is not going to cut it. Save the brake cleaner for your brakes. Submerge in Acetone for 20 minutes. From this point on you may only touch your parts with powder free latex gloves. Acetone goes right through nitrile. Then for best adhesion you need to rough up the surface with 100-120 grit aluminum oxide blasting. Blow the residue off with compressed air so you don't get any hidden media residue surprizes. Then if possible warm your parts up to 250 degrees for 20-30 minutes to push out any hidden oils. If no oil is exposed then once your parts are back to room temp proceed with spraying you coating.
This is proper surface prep. Anything less may appear to work but will lead to premature failure of the coating over time.
Good luck and post some pictures.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
We use MEK, and we used to use isopropyl alcohol (high concentrate commercial, not the OTC bottled stuff for medical use). Both evaporate rapidly and leave no residue. But to ensure a good bond to the metal surface I would strongly recommend media blasting after you degrease, then a bath in either MEK/Acetone/Laquer thinner, and then coat it.
The quality of the end result is a direct reflection of the effort put into proper surface prep.
We use MEK, and we used to use isopropyl alcohol (high concentrate commercial, not the OTC bottled stuff for medical use). Both evaporate rapidly and leave no residue. But to ensure a good bond to the metal surface I would strongly recommend media blasting after you degrease, then a bath in either MEK/Acetone/Laquer thinner, and then coat it.
The quality of the end result is a direct reflection of the effort put into proper surface prep.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
MEK is a terrific solvent...but I really hate the odor.
MEK is a terrific solvent...but I really hate the odor.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hired Gun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To degrease simply spraying it with something is not going to cut it. Save the brake cleaner for your brakes. Submerge in Acetone for 20 minutes. From this point on you may only touch your parts with powder free latex gloves. Acetone goes right through nitrile. Then for best adhesion you need to rough up the surface with 100-120 grit aluminum oxide blasting. Blow the residue off with compressed air so you don't get any hidden media residue surprizes. Then if possible warm your parts up to 250 degrees for 20-30 minutes to push out any hidden oils. If no oil is exposed then once your parts are back to room temp proceed with spraying you coating.
This is proper surface prep. Anything less may appear to work but will lead to premature failure of the coating over time.
Good luck and post some pictures. </div></div>
Brake-Kleen does come in gallon and 5 gallon quantity and can be purchased at a auto parts store.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hired Gun</div><div class="ubbcode-body">To degrease simply spraying it with something is not going to cut it. Save the brake cleaner for your brakes. Submerge in Acetone for 20 minutes. From this point on you may only touch your parts with powder free latex gloves. Acetone goes right through nitrile. Then for best adhesion you need to rough up the surface with 100-120 grit aluminum oxide blasting. Blow the residue off with compressed air so you don't get any hidden media residue surprizes. Then if possible warm your parts up to 250 degrees for 20-30 minutes to push out any hidden oils. If no oil is exposed then once your parts are back to room temp proceed with spraying you coating.
This is proper surface prep. Anything less may appear to work but will lead to premature failure of the coating over time.
Good luck and post some pictures. </div></div>
Brake-Kleen does come in gallon and 5 gallon quantity and can be purchased at a auto parts store.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gvanhyning</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Brake-Kleen does come in gallon and 5 gallon quantity and can be purchased at a auto parts store. </div></div>
I bet you can buy it by the tanker truck full if you wanted too, but it still doesn't make it suitable surface prep for coatings unless it's on the DuraCoat list as approved. I avoid DuraCoat so I wouldn't know if it's approved or not. I do know that acetone is the only readily available solvent that leaves no trace. This is why it's used to clean high end optics. I know if you spray Brake Clean on a window it leaves a mess. The proof to me is to smear/spray/swab/splash your favorite surface cleaner on the objective lens of your best scope and let it evaporate. Then tell me which one you want to paint over.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gvanhyning</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Brake-Kleen does come in gallon and 5 gallon quantity and can be purchased at a auto parts store. </div></div>
I bet you can buy it by the tanker truck full if you wanted too, but it still doesn't make it suitable surface prep for coatings unless it's on the DuraCoat list as approved. I avoid DuraCoat so I wouldn't know if it's approved or not. I do know that acetone is the only readily available solvent that leaves no trace. This is why it's used to clean high end optics. I know if you spray Brake Clean on a window it leaves a mess. The proof to me is to smear/spray/swab/splash your favorite surface cleaner on the objective lens of your best scope and let it evaporate. Then tell me which one you want to paint over.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
Brake Cleaner
Something with lots of warnings and free high if used in closed of spaces
Brake Cleaner
Something with lots of warnings and free high if used in closed of spaces
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I use El Cheapo Walmart Brake Cleaner (a buck or so a can). I buy it by the case, it's not cheaper that way but it's easier to have a dozen cans around then to run out mid project and have one of those "oh fuck" moments.
I've done dozen's of painting jobs on firearms and never, and i mean never had one flake off.
I use El Cheapo Walmart Brake Cleaner (a buck or so a can). I buy it by the case, it's not cheaper that way but it's easier to have a dozen cans around then to run out mid project and have one of those "oh fuck" moments.
I've done dozen's of painting jobs on firearms and never, and i mean never had one flake off.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kenda</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The quality of the end result is a direct reflection of the effort put into proper surface prep. </div></div>
<span style="font-weight: bold">I could NOT agree with this statement MORE!</span>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kenda</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
The quality of the end result is a direct reflection of the effort put into proper surface prep. </div></div>
<span style="font-weight: bold">I could NOT agree with this statement MORE!</span>
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I use a process similiar to HIRED GUN. I do use brake cleaner however. I really spray it down, especially in the crevices where oil lurks. Then I blow it off, blast it, and blow it off again. I either pop it in the oven or hang it above the burners( if it won't fit) for about 20 minutes and wipe(lint free) any oil off then, spray, blast(that specific spot), blow off again. then paint and bake. So far(about 100 complete guns and who knows how many parts) I have had zero issues with the coating's adhesion.
I use a process similiar to HIRED GUN. I do use brake cleaner however. I really spray it down, especially in the crevices where oil lurks. Then I blow it off, blast it, and blow it off again. I either pop it in the oven or hang it above the burners( if it won't fit) for about 20 minutes and wipe(lint free) any oil off then, spray, blast(that specific spot), blow off again. then paint and bake. So far(about 100 complete guns and who knows how many parts) I have had zero issues with the coating's adhesion.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I use whatever the cheapest brake cleaner I can find at the time is. I go through a shitload of that stuff and it has all worked so far.
I use whatever the cheapest brake cleaner I can find at the time is. I go through a shitload of that stuff and it has all worked so far.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
If you are going to paint a gun and do all this work do it right the first time use "Hired guns" post on propper prep. This is how the pros do it. Sorry to all you other guys but why go cheap on somthing so important.
If you are going to paint a gun and do all this work do it right the first time use "Hired guns" post on propper prep. This is how the pros do it. Sorry to all you other guys but why go cheap on somthing so important.
Re: Break-free or brake cleaner before duracoat???
I have used brake cleaner and carb cleaner. Then clean all the surfaces with 90% isopropal aclcohol. Works good. But i got to try the acatone next time. The Jet action on the Carb cleaner works great at gettin gunk off. Though.
I have used brake cleaner and carb cleaner. Then clean all the surfaces with 90% isopropal aclcohol. Works good. But i got to try the acatone next time. The Jet action on the Carb cleaner works great at gettin gunk off. Though.
