Bushmaster

[mtbadger]

Am I the only one that likes Bushmaster??? I have a Predator that is a fantastic range gun but to heavy for humping through the countryside.

I am going to build a light weight carry gun and was thinking of a Bushmaster Carbine style.

I have a Plum Crazy lower to build a truck gun....

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Bushmaster

Bushmasters aren't bad. I'm not necessarily a fan, but for a work rifle they're pretty decent. They mostly get a bad name from the guys who want everything "milspec". I could care less if my barrel is parkerized under the FSP, and my <span style="text-decoration: line-through">barrel</span> receiver extension nut hasn't come loose over the last four years despite not being staked.

I've been around Bushmasters, and a lot of them, for the past few years. There's been issues from over the years, but the failure rate is still under 1%. The two primary malfunctions that weren't a result of someone tampering with something they're not supposed to are gas keys coming loose and extractor springs wearing out. Easy fix and normal wear and tear, especially for weapons that see a lot of use. This is over 6+ years of service and a sampling of over 1000 rifles.

My issue with the Bushmasters are the barrels aren't very accurate for my taste, but I'm picky too where 3-4moa with ball ammo is satisfactory but not ideal. MK262 Mod 1 gets close to 1moa but not quite. If they were to improve their barrels, there isn't much I would complain about at all.

 

[dtask]

Re: Bushmaster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mtbadger</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I the only one that likes Bushmaster??? I have a Predator that is a fantastic range gun but to heavy for humping through the countryside.

I am going to build a light weight carry gun and was thinking of a Bushmaster Carbine style.

I have a Plum Crazy lower to build a truck gun.... </div></div>

Funny thing is that the PFC (as Plum Crazy is now known) is from Lake Havasu, AZ - same lower marking as the Bushmaster Carbon series of rifles. They are identical, so is it former employees doing some more of the same or did the factory get sold off?

Bushmaster, prior to the Cerberus acquisition, was always quick to address issues and, in my experience, produced excellent quality products or made it right and/or more than right when you had an issue. I don't know that the case is the same now post acquisition, so I cannot give an opinion.

The ARC/Massada debacle soured a lot of people (me included) on Bushmaster products - for example, where the hell are the bbls of differing lengths and calibers for the ACR?! Still no delivery years after the fact and when they do get here, they'll be priced wrong & backordered. And the price of the plastic rifle is rucking fidiculous. Bushmaster fell off with a lot of people when they screwed with our emotions on Magpul's rifle.

 

[Evolution 9]

Re: Bushmaster

Redmanss,

"my barrel extension nut hasn't come loose over the last four years despite not being staked."

It's the receiver end plate/ castle nut on the <span style="font-weight: bold">receiver</span> extension that needs to be staked, not the barrel extension, and I have seen MANY stocks rotate 90 degrees on the shooter's shoulder because the extension wasn't staked.

"gas keys coming loose"..."normal wear and tear"

NOPE, gas keys coming lose are a fight stopper and are NOT "normal wear and tear". All it takes to prevent this is to properly stake the key (Bushmaster already stakes them so it would cost them exactly $0.00 to just stake them properly).

To the OP, if it's just a fun "truck gun" a Bushmaster will work great, but for the same cost or cheaper, you could get a BCM upper that will have less problems (gas key won't come lose, extractor spring will last longer, etc.).

 

[Redmanss]

Re: Bushmaster

Yes, I meant the receiver extension. You got me and my proof reading and multitasking sucks, along with me researching upper receiver parts for my next build so I was stuck on stupid too. That's what I get for typing and having a conversation at the same time, but you knew what I meant. Other than two that I could see obvious signs or admission of user tampering, none have come loose. These are rifles carried all day, every day.

Gas keys. Four failures out of about 1200 rifles over my four years with this batch. Yes, that is a hard failure, but I used to see an equal number of Colt failures on M16A2s while working the ranges at Parris Island and those rifles see far fewer rounds downrange per year than ours do. I was told by our armorer that Bushmaster had a bad batch and these likely were due to that, but I can't qualify that information as to how credible it is. You can see where the staking hit the screw head but didn't compress far enough into it.

Any weapon that gets used takes normal wear and tear, and you're always going to have failures once the years start stacking up. In my experience with a large group of rifles in use, I would not say that Bushmaster is inferior to Colt with similar service usage when reliability is concerned. Actually, I got fed up with worn out FCG on the Colts constantly causing double fires, but have yet to see one on our Bushmasters.

I know it isn't the cool thing to defend Bushmaster, but I'm here to tell you they work. Again, I just wish they had better barrels but they still hit minute of man just fine.

Do I own one, yes. Will I buy another one, no and that is because I can afford more now than I could when I bought that second hand Bushmaster a decade ago. It hasn't failed either and it's my milsurp spitting hammer pair beater while I'm home. One beater is enough for me and I save the good stuff for my MK12.

As for the ACR, yeah, I'm in the group of sorely disappointed on that whole story. At least they can build an AR.

 

[Evolution 9]

Re: Bushmaster

4/1200... I wish our numbers were that good

 

[dighawaii]

Re: Bushmaster

I have a Bushmaster V-Match carbine and for what it's worth, it is a lightweight carbine that runs extremely well. I have not had any malfunctions to date. The V-Match barrel is fluted and will hold 1-2 MOA with 55 gr. ball ammo.

I understand that saying that in itself is meaningless because all rifles are individual and should be evaluated as such, but I have had such good performance from this AR style rifle, I thought I would make this post.

This rifle was meant for 3-gun type events so ball ammo is all I have shot through it, but I am sure that handloading will yield excellent results.

Good Luck on your carbine build.

Tom O.

 

[PSL1078]

Re: Bushmaster

I have seen Colts that weren't parkerized under the front sights. Bushmaster does/did offer a 4150 chrome lined barrel, which most companies don't. Nothing available to the civilian market is 100% mil spec.

 

[Evolution 9]

Re: Bushmaster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PSL1078</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nothing available to the civilian market is 100% mil spec. </div></div>

Actually, it is.

A couple companies offer fully mil spec rifles with the exception of the fire control group/ auto sear hole/milling, and even that is available to civilians who can afford class 3 stuff.

 

[viperjody]

Re: Bushmaster

i like the bushy... the plum lowers seam nice... I am going to get one..

 

[rsilvers]

Re: Bushmaster

The ACR price has come down:

http://www.midwesthuntersoutlet.com/item.aspx?PID=342501&w=PQ+JDyOLrQE=

 

[PSL1078]

Re: Bushmaster

I will agree with you on the class 3 stuff, but if you have to add an exception due to the FCG, then the rifle(s) in question would not be 100% mil spec. Does it really matter if a FSB doesn't have parkerized finish under it? No. All my Bushy gas keys have been staked........

 

[WRM]

Re: Bushmaster

My "Primary" AR wears a Bushmaster upper, has several thousand rounds through it, and has performed flawlessly - I'm a fan....

25M "Quick and Dirty" Army Qual Test (Offhand/Sitting/Prone/Prone):

Cheers,

Bill

 

[PSL1078]

Re: Bushmaster

I do like a Bushy, BTW.........

 

[Evolution 9]

Re: Bushmaster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PSL1078</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will agree with you on the class 3 stuff, but if you have to add an exception due to the FCG, then the rifle(s) in question would not be 100% mil spec. Does it really matter if a FSB doesn't have parkerized finish under it? No. All my Bushy gas keys have been staked........ </div></div>

We aren't in too much disagreement. Every Bushmaster I have seen had a staked gas key, but none of them were staked properly (there is a right way and several wrong ways). I have re-staked hundreds of them for discerning owners.

 

[hewlett260]

Re: Bushmaster

From the sounds of it I got lucky with mine. An O.R.C. to which I added an Adams Arms kit and an Omega rail. Before the piston, it was at about 900 rounds with zero malfunctions and averaged 2 1/2 MOA. After the piston and the Omega rail I'm getting right around 1-2 MOA with anything I have run through it(55-69 grains), and zero malfunctions. Its got about 4700 rounds through it now give or take 100.

 

[Hook Creek]

Re: Bushmaster

Besides the high price my Bushmaster has not had any problems. But next time I will go with something cheaper, and spend more on accessories.

 

[deadly0311]

Re: Bushmaster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Evolution 9</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PSL1078</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nothing available to the civilian market is 100% mil spec. </div></div>

Actually, it is.

A couple companies offer fully mil spec rifles with the exception of the fire control group/ auto sear hole/milling, and even that is available to civilians who can afford class 3 stuff.

</div></div>

Milspec is the minimum acceptable standard by which the Military will allow certain parts to be used......saying a rifle is Mil-Spec is akin to saying "well the is the absolute shittiest stuff the military can use, so it must be good"

I much prefer something that isn't touted as a "milspec" rifle because I know what Mil Spec means. Again though, due diligence allows one to make an informed decision. I had a Bushmaster and ran it to hell and back and never ever had a problem. YMMV

And the word "milspec" is up there with Tactical, Operator, custom rifle, and 1/2 MOA.......yeah yeah yeah...everyone is a Operator and gets all their "tactical" gear and kit, and has a 1/2 MOA custom rifle.

 

[WildGeese]

Re: Bushmaster

Hopefully this won't turn into an epic AR vs AK debate and I know everyone has their opinions. With that said, I am not a fan of Bushmaster Firearms and I would consider them to be "consumer" grade weapons at best that I would never trust my life to. I can fill pages with negative stories about BM but I will share two. Long before 2005, I was not a fan of BM. However, in 2005 I was on the "two way" range and one of my guys had a BM. The weapon functioned for the first few rounds but it quickly became a "bolt gun" during his first mag, and required him to cycle the bolt after every shot. A real show stopper considering the situation. That evening I broke it down and because the carrier key was improperly staked, it had literally become loose so the gas was escaping. Fast forward to 2007 when I was present when some folks took receipt of 100 factory new BM carbines. Not one of the 100 had a properly staked carrier key-what a surprise.

I have dozens of these stories so I certainly fall into the category of not liking BM and would never trust anything that they produce.

YMMV and as I said, I certainly know folks (recreational shooters) that love them and never have had an issue. One of the big things that really got to me was their CS and the attitude that they had a perfect weapon and if they were failing in the field, it was due to the operator. Yeah, okay.

 

[RyeDaddy]

Re: Bushmaster

I was satisfied with my Bushmaster M4 when I had it. I put 1200 or so rounds through it with zero malfunctions, and it was accurate enough. Traded the upper and buffer/stock parts out with someone and made it into a 20" A2 rifle, and it went another 400 rounds without issue before I sold it. So in my experience they build a decent AR, and I'm not a hater.

I, like everybody, was displeased with the ACR and the pricing thereof, they (I feel) perverted Magpul's concept, and tried to make a killing off it. For the money, I like FN's SCAR alot better, and for less money I really like Robinson's XCR.

You can count me now as someone who does not do business with Freedom Group. This includes Remington. This is a topic for another thread, so I won't hijack, but I simply cannot forgive Cerberus for it's handling of Marlin.

 

[Ishallbie O'Cullkillin]

Re: Bushmaster

I have a heavy barreled Bushy carbine that is moa all the time. I want another barrel like that one, but they are backordered til the sun burns out. I gotta settle for a different brand, but I want chrome lined, 4150 chromoly, and accuracy like my bushmaster barrel. Suggestions?

 

[TonyAngel]

Re: Bushmaster

My biggest gripe about Bushmaster is the price. Other than that, the major problems that I've seen with Bushmasters hasn't been due to the quality of the parts, but more due to the shoddy assembly job.

I have a parts carbine that I've been running for a while. I kind of lost interest in ARs, but threw this one together just to have an AR carbine. It has a Bushmaster barrel on it and it shoots well enough, but if I had to buy another 14.5 or 16" barrel, I don't think it's going to be a Bushmaster; only because they don't offer a 14.5 or 16" with a mid length gas system.

Right now, I'd probably jump on one of the Select barrels from Ranier Arms. At under $200 they are hard to beat and come with a satisfaction guarantee.

 

[BOLTRIPPER]

Re: Bushmaster

i did'nt know ar15dotcom was off line......

 

[edwin907]

Re: Bushmaster

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TonyAngel</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My biggest gripe about Bushmaster is the price. Other than that, the major problems that I've seen with Bushmasters hasn't been due to the quality of the parts, but more due to the shoddy assembly job. </div></div>
Perfect analysis. I rebuild any "complete" firearm I get anyway, surprising what you find (or don't).

Late 90's, the Bushmaster barrels quite good, if you specified a 1/7.
The 11.5" 1/7 HBAR barrel assembly I got just a couple years ago for suppressor use is excellent, POI consistent.
Like the lowers, replaced everything with Colt/LMT small parts for my Recon, those Bushy parts went in another lower that's probably clocking 40K rounds now, without a failure!