Can't find CCI41 primers, what is a good alternative? My loads were developed with the CCI41 and it's all AR's.
- Thread starter corsair_001
- Start date
The CCI #41 milspec primer is ballistically equivalent to the CCI 450 standard small rifle magnum primer, without the 'sensitivity protection' that is found in their milspec CCI #34 and CCI #41 primers.
For slam fire purposes, the milspec primers are called for, but for bolt guns, you can go with their CCI 250/CCI 450 primers, which are their magnum primers.
Chris
I load tested CCI BR and CCI#41 primers, AR-15 everything the exact same but the primers obviously. Both Chrono'd at 2740, no changes whatsoever. Definitely don't buy Fiocchi though, pierced primer city. CCI BR will work fine.
The main difference between CCI #34 and CCI #41 primers and standard primers is the height of the anvil is shorter requiring more force to set off the primer. For the AR15 rifle any primer with a cup thickness of .025 will work fine, with thinner cups the risk of slam fires increases. The greatest risk of slam fire is if a single round is loaded WITHOUT the magazine in place and the bolt is allowed to slam shut. With the magazine in place bolt velocity is reduced as it feeds from the magazine slowing the speed of the bolt and it free floating firing pin.
Now some food for thought............
Remington ran the Lake City Army Ammunition Plant from 1941 to 2002 and used its 7 1/2 primers in 5.56 ammunition. Remington didn't use CCI primers at Lake City and Winchester who ran the plant after 2002 didn't use CCI primers. And the Sierra manual for .223/5.56 service rifle AR15 loads uses Remington 7 1/2 primers.
Now look at the flash photos of the primer tests at the link below and see which primer looks like a mini flame thrower.
Primers - Small Rifle Primer Study
A Match Primer Study in the 6BR Cartridge
By Germán A. Salazar
The Rifleman's Journal: Primers - Small Rifle Primer Study
Now some food for thought............
Remington ran the Lake City Army Ammunition Plant from 1941 to 2002 and used its 7 1/2 primers in 5.56 ammunition. Remington didn't use CCI primers at Lake City and Winchester who ran the plant after 2002 didn't use CCI primers. And the Sierra manual for .223/5.56 service rifle AR15 loads uses Remington 7 1/2 primers.
Now look at the flash photos of the primer tests at the link below and see which primer looks like a mini flame thrower.
Primers - Small Rifle Primer Study
A Match Primer Study in the 6BR Cartridge
By Germán A. Salazar
The Rifleman's Journal: Primers - Small Rifle Primer Study
Thanks for the link bigedp! Always enjoy furthering the education.
Think about it, Remington ran Lake City Army Ammunition plant and had to use recycled Winchester ball powders and they used Remington primers in this military ammunition.
It's likely a personal preference,but I would have worried little about the recycled Win. powder. I still shoot some WW2 surplus powder with fair success. The Remmy primers,don't have much experience with them. Your link certainly showed them in a good light though.
I have to repost this info as I was looking for info on Wolf primers.
PRIMER CHART & REFERENCE GUIDE
Small Handgun Standard .017" cup thickness
CCI 500
Federal 100 - Has a soft cup - good to use if hammer strike is light.
Federal 100M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SP
Magtech PR-SPC - Lead-free "Clean Range" primer for indoor ranges etc.
Remington 1 ½
RWS 4031
Winchester WSP
Wolf Small Pistol SP - brass cup
Small Handgun Magnum .017" cup thickness
CCI 550 See Note 1 at the bottom of page
Federal 200
Federal 200M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SPM
Remington 5 ½
RWS 4047
Winchester WSPM
Wolf Small Pistol Magnum SPM - brass cup
Large Handgun Standard .020" cup thickness
CCI 300
Federal 150 - Has a thinner cup
Magtech PR-LP
Remington 2 ½
RWS 5337
Winchester WLP
Wolf Large Pistol LP - brass cup
Large Handgun Magnum .020" cup thickness
CCI 350
Federal 155
Wolf Large Pistol Magnum LPM - brass cup
Small Rifle Standard
CCI 400 -thin .020" cup, not recommended for AR15 use by CCI/Speer. Good for .22 Hornet, .30 Carbine. See Note 1 at the bottom of the page
CCI BR4 - match primer with a thicker .025" cup.
Federal 205 - Mil-Spec cup thickness according to Federal - okay for 5.56mm. .0225" cup thickness.
Federal 205M - same as the 205 but the match version.
Magtech PR-SR - .025" cup thickness (not much feedback yet on this new primer as to AR15 suitability but with the same cup thickness as the Rem 7 1/2 it looks good so far)
Remington 6 ½ - thin .020" cup, intended for older, lower pressure rounds Remington says do not use for the .223 Rem or other similar pressure rounds. Good for .22 Hornet, .30 Carbine.
Remington 7 ½ BR - A match or "bench rest" primer. Lyman & Nosler classify this primer as a Standard. Remington says the compound is the same as the 6 1/2 but with a thicker .025" cup.
RWS 4033
Winchester WSR - some piercing issues noted when changed from silver to brass cup. Cup thickness is a bit thinner at .021". Most say they are good to go for the AR15 despite that, probably because of the hardness of the cup. Some feel they are less resistant to higher pressures.
Wolf Small Rifle SR - soft, sensitive copper cup, not recommended for AR15/military rifle use or high pressure rounds.
Small Rifle Magnum
CCI 450 - same thicker .025" cup as the BR4 and #41.
CCI #41 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo. With this primer there is more 'distance' between the tip of the anvil and the bottom of the cup than with other CCI SR primers. .025" thick cup. Same primer mix as CCI 450.
Remington 7 ½ BR - A match or "bench rest" primer. Hornady, Handloads.com, and Chuck Hawks classify this primer as a Magnum, differing from other sources that classify it as a Standard. .025" cup thickness.
Wolf Small Rifle Magnum SRM - hard, less sensitive brass cup intended for AR15/military rifle and high pressure rounds.
Wolf Small Rifle 223 SR223 - "This is the newest primer available in the Wolf line. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite."
Large Rifle Standard
CCI 200 - mild in brisance. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
CCI BR2 - same as the 200 but the match version. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Federal 210 - medium brisance between CCI/Remington & Winchester. Do not use in semi-automatics.
Federal 210M - match version of the above primer. Do not use in semi-automatics.
Magtech PR-LR
Remington 9 ½ - mild in brisance.
RWS 5341
Winchester WLR - the hottest standard primer. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Wolf Large Rifle LR - all brass - Used by noted match shooter David Tubbs who says: "Be sure they are seated into the case - if not they can be hard to ignite. Russian primers use a different sinoxide compound (closer to the European type), which, in my testing, consistently delivers better extreme spreads over Federal..." Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Large Rifle Magnum
CCI 250
CCI #34 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo.
Federal 215 - original magnum primer
Remington 9 ½ M - mildest magnum primer.
RWS 5333
Winchester WLRM
Wolf Large Rifle Magnum LRM - all brass
50 BMG
CCI #35 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo.
Winchester 8312
Primers recommended for use in .223 Rem/5.56 semiautomatic rifle loads:
CCI #41, 450, BR4 (#41 & 450 good with ball powder)
Federal 205, 205M
Remington 7 1/2 BR (good with ball powder)
Winchester WSR (good with ball powder)
Wolf SRM (good with ball powder)
Wolf SR223 (hotter than SRM - great with ball powder)
Primers recommended for use in .308 Win/7.62x51/7.62x39 semiautomatic rifle loads:
CCI #34, 200, BR2, CCI 250
Winchester WLR, WLRM (good with ball powder)
Wolf LR
################################################## ################################
NOTE 1: According to Speer/CCI Technical Services - Both the CCI 550 Small Pistol Magnum and CCI 400 Small Rifle primers are identical in size. Both primers use the same cup metal and share the same cup thickness. Both primers use the same primer compound formula and same amount of primer compound. They can be used interchangeably.
Linkpimp
PRIMER CHART & REFERENCE GUIDE
Small Handgun Standard .017" cup thickness
CCI 500
Federal 100 - Has a soft cup - good to use if hammer strike is light.
Federal 100M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SP
Magtech PR-SPC - Lead-free "Clean Range" primer for indoor ranges etc.
Remington 1 ½
RWS 4031
Winchester WSP
Wolf Small Pistol SP - brass cup
Small Handgun Magnum .017" cup thickness
CCI 550 See Note 1 at the bottom of page
Federal 200
Federal 200M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SPM
Remington 5 ½
RWS 4047
Winchester WSPM
Wolf Small Pistol Magnum SPM - brass cup
Large Handgun Standard .020" cup thickness
CCI 300
Federal 150 - Has a thinner cup
Magtech PR-LP
Remington 2 ½
RWS 5337
Winchester WLP
Wolf Large Pistol LP - brass cup
Large Handgun Magnum .020" cup thickness
CCI 350
Federal 155
Wolf Large Pistol Magnum LPM - brass cup
Small Rifle Standard
CCI 400 -thin .020" cup, not recommended for AR15 use by CCI/Speer. Good for .22 Hornet, .30 Carbine. See Note 1 at the bottom of the page
CCI BR4 - match primer with a thicker .025" cup.
Federal 205 - Mil-Spec cup thickness according to Federal - okay for 5.56mm. .0225" cup thickness.
Federal 205M - same as the 205 but the match version.
Magtech PR-SR - .025" cup thickness (not much feedback yet on this new primer as to AR15 suitability but with the same cup thickness as the Rem 7 1/2 it looks good so far)
Remington 6 ½ - thin .020" cup, intended for older, lower pressure rounds Remington says do not use for the .223 Rem or other similar pressure rounds. Good for .22 Hornet, .30 Carbine.
Remington 7 ½ BR - A match or "bench rest" primer. Lyman & Nosler classify this primer as a Standard. Remington says the compound is the same as the 6 1/2 but with a thicker .025" cup.
RWS 4033
Winchester WSR - some piercing issues noted when changed from silver to brass cup. Cup thickness is a bit thinner at .021". Most say they are good to go for the AR15 despite that, probably because of the hardness of the cup. Some feel they are less resistant to higher pressures.
Wolf Small Rifle SR - soft, sensitive copper cup, not recommended for AR15/military rifle use or high pressure rounds.
Small Rifle Magnum
CCI 450 - same thicker .025" cup as the BR4 and #41.
CCI #41 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo. With this primer there is more 'distance' between the tip of the anvil and the bottom of the cup than with other CCI SR primers. .025" thick cup. Same primer mix as CCI 450.
Remington 7 ½ BR - A match or "bench rest" primer. Hornady, Handloads.com, and Chuck Hawks classify this primer as a Magnum, differing from other sources that classify it as a Standard. .025" cup thickness.
Wolf Small Rifle Magnum SRM - hard, less sensitive brass cup intended for AR15/military rifle and high pressure rounds.
Wolf Small Rifle 223 SR223 - "This is the newest primer available in the Wolf line. It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite."
Large Rifle Standard
CCI 200 - mild in brisance. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
CCI BR2 - same as the 200 but the match version. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Federal 210 - medium brisance between CCI/Remington & Winchester. Do not use in semi-automatics.
Federal 210M - match version of the above primer. Do not use in semi-automatics.
Magtech PR-LR
Remington 9 ½ - mild in brisance.
RWS 5341
Winchester WLR - the hottest standard primer. Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Wolf Large Rifle LR - all brass - Used by noted match shooter David Tubbs who says: "Be sure they are seated into the case - if not they can be hard to ignite. Russian primers use a different sinoxide compound (closer to the European type), which, in my testing, consistently delivers better extreme spreads over Federal..." Hard enough for use in semi-automatics.
Large Rifle Magnum
CCI 250
CCI #34 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo.
Federal 215 - original magnum primer
Remington 9 ½ M - mildest magnum primer.
RWS 5333
Winchester WLRM
Wolf Large Rifle Magnum LRM - all brass
50 BMG
CCI #35 - commercial version of the fully-qualified DOD primer for use in U.S. military ammo.
Winchester 8312
Primers recommended for use in .223 Rem/5.56 semiautomatic rifle loads:
CCI #41, 450, BR4 (#41 & 450 good with ball powder)
Federal 205, 205M
Remington 7 1/2 BR (good with ball powder)
Winchester WSR (good with ball powder)
Wolf SRM (good with ball powder)
Wolf SR223 (hotter than SRM - great with ball powder)
Primers recommended for use in .308 Win/7.62x51/7.62x39 semiautomatic rifle loads:
CCI #34, 200, BR2, CCI 250
Winchester WLR, WLRM (good with ball powder)
Wolf LR
################################################## ################################
NOTE 1: According to Speer/CCI Technical Services - Both the CCI 550 Small Pistol Magnum and CCI 400 Small Rifle primers are identical in size. Both primers use the same cup metal and share the same cup thickness. Both primers use the same primer compound formula and same amount of primer compound. They can be used interchangeably.
Linkpimp
Wow, great information. This serves to remind me why I constantly read through the site. Great folks with great information. Thank you
BTW, placed order with MidSouth
BTW, placed order with MidSouth
Last edited:
You're all wrong. They are not in stock at any of those places.
D
Deleted member 113831
Guest
They were 7 years ago when this thread was current.
WHAT is with the influx of posting on threads from 4-10 years ago guys???? please stop lol
LOOK AT THE DATE POSTED ON EVERY THREAD
It's all new guys posting to get their post count up. Pulls up a 7 Y / O thread to tell everyone their wrong.
We have cci 41‘s locally
