Has anyone used these? Is there a better product out there? What size would you recommend (pack size/grams)? I would like to put together a first aid/Trauma kit for my vehicle.
Thanks guys,
Kc
Thanks guys,
Kc
Hunting & Fishing Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
- Thread starter ugsly
- Start date
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Use combat gauze. It is pretty much the standard for controlling bleeding.
http://www.z-medica.com/healthcare/Products/QuikClot-Combat-Gauze.aspx
Use combat gauze. It is pretty much the standard for controlling bleeding.
http://www.z-medica.com/healthcare/Products/QuikClot-Combat-Gauze.aspx
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
alternative materials to know how to use/keep around could be discussed here...
afrin nasal spray works quick to squelch a bleed...it dialates capillaries and can be used on some pretty nasty flesh bleeds - don't bother on a vein cut, but if you have a flesh cut that is getting to the point of "direct pressure doesnt' seem to be enough", washing it down with afrin can help. Just make sure your patient has someething to chew on, is restrained, or out cold LOL...they jump like a fish when it hits the wound.
Superglue...i've used it to quickly and temporairly suture a smaller wound when nothing else was available. stick the skin to skin, and don't pack the wound, direct pressure afterwards and get to the H
theres alot of stuff that CAN be used in a pinch, alot of which i hesitate to publish because someone might use them and cause more harm that good in some cases. A good trauma doctor kicks back on this board, and at worst, you could check with any ER friends you may have - they usually have some pretty good advice for alternative methods/materials
I second keeping some quickclot bandages in your kit though. i keep a couple with me when bow hunting. an arrow wound is nasty.
alternative materials to know how to use/keep around could be discussed here...
afrin nasal spray works quick to squelch a bleed...it dialates capillaries and can be used on some pretty nasty flesh bleeds - don't bother on a vein cut, but if you have a flesh cut that is getting to the point of "direct pressure doesnt' seem to be enough", washing it down with afrin can help. Just make sure your patient has someething to chew on, is restrained, or out cold LOL...they jump like a fish when it hits the wound.
Superglue...i've used it to quickly and temporairly suture a smaller wound when nothing else was available. stick the skin to skin, and don't pack the wound, direct pressure afterwards and get to the H
theres alot of stuff that CAN be used in a pinch, alot of which i hesitate to publish because someone might use them and cause more harm that good in some cases. A good trauma doctor kicks back on this board, and at worst, you could check with any ER friends you may have - they usually have some pretty good advice for alternative methods/materials
I second keeping some quickclot bandages in your kit though. i keep a couple with me when bow hunting. an arrow wound is nasty.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
You can use QuikClot or go with the standard Israeli Combat Gauze. Both items have their champions & detractors. Bottom line, get one & learn how to CORRECTLY use it.
I can hook you up with a great setup for your vehicle, etc., if you're interested...
http://deltaoutdoorsman.com/scart/index.php?act=viewCat&catId=17
Thanks & best of luck to you.
Ceylon
deltaoutdoorsman.com
You can use QuikClot or go with the standard Israeli Combat Gauze. Both items have their champions & detractors. Bottom line, get one & learn how to CORRECTLY use it.
I can hook you up with a great setup for your vehicle, etc., if you're interested...
http://deltaoutdoorsman.com/scart/index.php?act=viewCat&catId=17
Thanks & best of luck to you.
Ceylon
deltaoutdoorsman.com
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Ive read that fragrant free tampons are a great thing to have in a trauma kit.
Designed to swell and absorb and works well for packing larger wounds or bullet holes.
Im not a doctor but a medic on here originally posted it so I take no credit and am just regurgitating the information. Im sure a search will reveal many similar threads here.
Ive read that fragrant free tampons are a great thing to have in a trauma kit.
Designed to swell and absorb and works well for packing larger wounds or bullet holes.
Im not a doctor but a medic on here originally posted it so I take no credit and am just regurgitating the information. Im sure a search will reveal many similar threads here.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
A bit of a advert but interesting none the less.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9xvIbKBJn4
You need to research the dangers of this product. It can burn, blind and cause other injury.It does have a place for someone who knows when and where to apply.
A bit of a advert but interesting none the less.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9xvIbKBJn4
You need to research the dangers of this product. It can burn, blind and cause other injury.It does have a place for someone who knows when and where to apply.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Quickclot will burn the ever lovin shit out of you if used hastily or not used properly. Trust me, I used it numerous times before we were issued Combat Gauze. The Quick Clot reacts with blood, not necessarily the wound. So if you have spatter on a non-injured body part, and the Quick Clot comes in contact with that blood, it will immediately react and burn like a mofo! Combat Gauze, however; is extremely absorbent and stops the bleeding very quick (with proper pressure) and it does this without burning your digits.
Most bleeding, aside from artillery can be stopped by applying enough pressure to the right spot. I carry 3 tourniquets in my pack when I go camping/hunting just in case something happens and I have to saw my own leg off with my Swiss Army Knife. At least I won't bleed to death...
Quickclot will burn the ever lovin shit out of you if used hastily or not used properly. Trust me, I used it numerous times before we were issued Combat Gauze. The Quick Clot reacts with blood, not necessarily the wound. So if you have spatter on a non-injured body part, and the Quick Clot comes in contact with that blood, it will immediately react and burn like a mofo! Combat Gauze, however; is extremely absorbent and stops the bleeding very quick (with proper pressure) and it does this without burning your digits.
Most bleeding, aside from artillery can be stopped by applying enough pressure to the right spot. I carry 3 tourniquets in my pack when I go camping/hunting just in case something happens and I have to saw my own leg off with my Swiss Army Knife. At least I won't bleed to death...
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ugsly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has anyone used these? Is there a better product out there? What size would you recommend (pack size/grams)? I would like to put together a first aid/Trauma kit for my vehicle.
Thanks guys,
Kc </div></div>
Use the Gauze version of Celox, nothing to blow into your eyes that way. Just remember it has to be a really bad bleed to use this stuff.
Celox doesn't use heat like the original formulation of Quick Clot. I believe quick clot resolved the hellacious burn issue with a reformulation.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ugsly</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has anyone used these? Is there a better product out there? What size would you recommend (pack size/grams)? I would like to put together a first aid/Trauma kit for my vehicle.
Thanks guys,
Kc </div></div>
Use the Gauze version of Celox, nothing to blow into your eyes that way. Just remember it has to be a really bad bleed to use this stuff.
Celox doesn't use heat like the original formulation of Quick Clot. I believe quick clot resolved the hellacious burn issue with a reformulation.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
afrin does not cause vasodilation. You have it backwards. Afrin contains phenylephrine, which causes vasoconstriction of blood vessels, both arteries and veins. Thats why you spray it up your nose when your nose is runny. It squeezes everything down so fluid cant get in. Same principle applies to nose bleeds. A blast up there should constrict the blood vessels and stop the bleeding. But be careful, too much can cause systemic hypertension....which could be bad for patients with certain cardiac and neuro conditions.
afrin does not cause vasodilation. You have it backwards. Afrin contains phenylephrine, which causes vasoconstriction of blood vessels, both arteries and veins. Thats why you spray it up your nose when your nose is runny. It squeezes everything down so fluid cant get in. Same principle applies to nose bleeds. A blast up there should constrict the blood vessels and stop the bleeding. But be careful, too much can cause systemic hypertension....which could be bad for patients with certain cardiac and neuro conditions.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ScrtSqrl02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Quickclot will burn the ever lovin shit out of you if used hastily or not used properly. Trust me, I used it numerous times before we were issued Combat Gauze. The Quick Clot reacts with blood, not necessarily the wound. So if you have spatter on a non-injured body part, and the Quick Clot comes in contact with that blood, it will immediately react and burn like a mofo! Combat Gauze, however; is extremely absorbent and stops the bleeding very quick (with proper pressure) and it does this without burning your digits.
Most bleeding, aside from artillery can be stopped by applying enough pressure to the right spot. I carry 3 tourniquets in my pack when I go camping/hunting just in case
something happens and I have to saw my own leg off with my Swiss Army Knife. At least I won't bleed to death... </div></div>
The thermogenic QuikClot granules are no longer available; their "newer" generation products use kaolin which is basically like a clay substrate for clotting. If bleeding of this nature is of concern, take First Aid & the time to learn anatomy, including arterial pulse points BEFORE you may "really" need to know where they are.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ScrtSqrl02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Quickclot will burn the ever lovin shit out of you if used hastily or not used properly. Trust me, I used it numerous times before we were issued Combat Gauze. The Quick Clot reacts with blood, not necessarily the wound. So if you have spatter on a non-injured body part, and the Quick Clot comes in contact with that blood, it will immediately react and burn like a mofo! Combat Gauze, however; is extremely absorbent and stops the bleeding very quick (with proper pressure) and it does this without burning your digits.
Most bleeding, aside from artillery can be stopped by applying enough pressure to the right spot. I carry 3 tourniquets in my pack when I go camping/hunting just in case
something happens and I have to saw my own leg off with my Swiss Army Knife. At least I won't bleed to death... </div></div>
The thermogenic QuikClot granules are no longer available; their "newer" generation products use kaolin which is basically like a clay substrate for clotting. If bleeding of this nature is of concern, take First Aid & the time to learn anatomy, including arterial pulse points BEFORE you may "really" need to know where they are.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
I've been told by a combat medic and an ER doctor that the #1 course of treatment to a badly bleeding wound is pressure. A pack of quick clot in your kit may make you feel better prepared, but if the wound is so bad that pressure won't take care of it, you've likely got worse things to worry about. As ukdslayer said, knowing pulse points is critical to really being prepared for an injury of that nature.
I personally keep a tube of superglue in my hiking and hunting packs. As mentioned, it works very well for keeping a laceration closed after you get the bleeding under control. I've also used black pepper to stop the bleeding when I snipped the tip of my finger off with a pair or razor-sharp pruning shears. Does it hurt... sure as shit it does, but it did the trick nicely. You can also pack a wound with spiderwebs if your in the woods and are having trouble stopping the flow on a minor cut.
I've been told by a combat medic and an ER doctor that the #1 course of treatment to a badly bleeding wound is pressure. A pack of quick clot in your kit may make you feel better prepared, but if the wound is so bad that pressure won't take care of it, you've likely got worse things to worry about. As ukdslayer said, knowing pulse points is critical to really being prepared for an injury of that nature.
I personally keep a tube of superglue in my hiking and hunting packs. As mentioned, it works very well for keeping a laceration closed after you get the bleeding under control. I've also used black pepper to stop the bleeding when I snipped the tip of my finger off with a pair or razor-sharp pruning shears. Does it hurt... sure as shit it does, but it did the trick nicely. You can also pack a wound with spiderwebs if your in the woods and are having trouble stopping the flow on a minor cut.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Boudin, if you look up combat gauze there is plenty of training on the internet what it is capable of.
Boudin, if you look up combat gauze there is plenty of training on the internet what it is capable of.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
I didn't mean to imply that it's not a useful product; sorry if it came across that way. I was primarily reiterating what was told to me by the two professionals who I spoke with.
I think the position they are speaking from is this... if you have a severed femoral or subclavian artery, you've only got 15-30 seconds before you loose consciousness. With a severed brachial, approximately 45-60 seconds. If you're unfortunate enough to sustain an injury of this degree while alone, chances are you're not gonna to be able to access your quick clot and address the injury before you're out, especially when you consider that wigging out at the sight of rapid blood loss from your own body is not that uncommon of a response. I've had to treat a laceration on a friend who was an experienced paramedic and had worked on injuries as extreme as a self-inflicted GSW to the face, simply because he froze up at the sight of that much of his own blood. What is a fairly common response (in my experience) is to grab the injury site.
With the same degree of research needed to find a video of military medics testing the efficacy of Quick Clot on a severed pig femoral, one could also find information regarding where to apply pressure in response to various injury locations. Equipped with that knowledge, the instinctual "grab" response can be more effectively applied, in a much quicker time frame than immediately trying to access your QC, buying you some time to fish it out of your pack and apply it to the wound.
On top of that I'll go further to assume that, given the severity of injuries that both of these guys are accustomed to dealing with, the reason they say you probably have worse problems to worry about is: injuries to one of these major blood vessels are often compounded by some other number of injuries that can ultimately pose just as great of a threat to your survival as the blood loss.
I will clarify though, that it's undoubtedly an amazing product and the pig study demonstrates how effective it can be in comparison to SOPs prior to it's availability. I DO think it is a good thing to have in your hiking/hunting pack or car, but I think you're more likely to use it on someone else when it's absolutely necessary than to be able to use it on yourself under the same circumstances. I just don't think having a pack of QC in your kit makes you prepared to deal with an injury of this nature and am merely trying to point out the importance in taking your pursuit of preparedness one step further.
For what it's worth, I also keep a CAT tourniquet and an Israeli combat dressing that the medic gave me in my hiking pack... not just superglue, black pepper, and spiderwebs.
I didn't mean to imply that it's not a useful product; sorry if it came across that way. I was primarily reiterating what was told to me by the two professionals who I spoke with.
I think the position they are speaking from is this... if you have a severed femoral or subclavian artery, you've only got 15-30 seconds before you loose consciousness. With a severed brachial, approximately 45-60 seconds. If you're unfortunate enough to sustain an injury of this degree while alone, chances are you're not gonna to be able to access your quick clot and address the injury before you're out, especially when you consider that wigging out at the sight of rapid blood loss from your own body is not that uncommon of a response. I've had to treat a laceration on a friend who was an experienced paramedic and had worked on injuries as extreme as a self-inflicted GSW to the face, simply because he froze up at the sight of that much of his own blood. What is a fairly common response (in my experience) is to grab the injury site.
With the same degree of research needed to find a video of military medics testing the efficacy of Quick Clot on a severed pig femoral, one could also find information regarding where to apply pressure in response to various injury locations. Equipped with that knowledge, the instinctual "grab" response can be more effectively applied, in a much quicker time frame than immediately trying to access your QC, buying you some time to fish it out of your pack and apply it to the wound.
On top of that I'll go further to assume that, given the severity of injuries that both of these guys are accustomed to dealing with, the reason they say you probably have worse problems to worry about is: injuries to one of these major blood vessels are often compounded by some other number of injuries that can ultimately pose just as great of a threat to your survival as the blood loss.
I will clarify though, that it's undoubtedly an amazing product and the pig study demonstrates how effective it can be in comparison to SOPs prior to it's availability. I DO think it is a good thing to have in your hiking/hunting pack or car, but I think you're more likely to use it on someone else when it's absolutely necessary than to be able to use it on yourself under the same circumstances. I just don't think having a pack of QC in your kit makes you prepared to deal with an injury of this nature and am merely trying to point out the importance in taking your pursuit of preparedness one step further.
For what it's worth, I also keep a CAT tourniquet and an Israeli combat dressing that the medic gave me in my hiking pack... not just superglue, black pepper, and spiderwebs.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Boudin,
I kind of got a laugh out of your post. I am a medic and because of that I don't think I have ever thought that way and you are correct. I don't know if I would be able to apply combat gauze or anything of that sort to myself in a situation like that. I would hope I could.
Boudin,
I kind of got a laugh out of your post. I am a medic and because of that I don't think I have ever thought that way and you are correct. I don't know if I would be able to apply combat gauze or anything of that sort to myself in a situation like that. I would hope I could.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
perfect instance for the "battle buddy" argument. Ive done it all my life and still do it. I wont go somewhere potentially dangerous alone.
And to caveat on that I wont go somewhere potentially dangerous with someone I dont trust. Your battle buddy is only as good as his knowledge and capabilities are.
Im not a medic, but i have had some medical training and I understand and hold great respect for any medical knowledge that I can glean from my peers.
perfect instance for the "battle buddy" argument. Ive done it all my life and still do it. I wont go somewhere potentially dangerous alone.
And to caveat on that I wont go somewhere potentially dangerous with someone I dont trust. Your battle buddy is only as good as his knowledge and capabilities are.
Im not a medic, but i have had some medical training and I understand and hold great respect for any medical knowledge that I can glean from my peers.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
oh also +1 on arterial pressure points. Is say 90% of the guys I have worked with in the past knew how to correctly apply a pressure dressing or a tourniquet but none of them knew jack about First applying the arterial pressure point while then subsequently/simultaneously manipulating the tourniquet.
and as always many hands make light work... 2 guys applying the fundamentals on one patient is a game changer
oh also +1 on arterial pressure points. Is say 90% of the guys I have worked with in the past knew how to correctly apply a pressure dressing or a tourniquet but none of them knew jack about First applying the arterial pressure point while then subsequently/simultaneously manipulating the tourniquet.
and as always many hands make light work... 2 guys applying the fundamentals on one patient is a game changer
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
on a side note, who makes those tourniquets that look like straps? You can buy them in sets, and wear them around your upper / lower arm, upper / lower leg, and you can pull them tight with your arm or teeth if your arms are injured? Anybody know what im talking about?
on a side note, who makes those tourniquets that look like straps? You can buy them in sets, and wear them around your upper / lower arm, upper / lower leg, and you can pull them tight with your arm or teeth if your arms are injured? Anybody know what im talking about?
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
My Fire Department uses this style. It's very similar to the combat ones.
http://www.boundtreeuniversity.com/Trauma/articles/1001716-Tourniquets-From-combat-to-commonplace
These I believe are what they use now.
http://www.combattourniquet.com/
Either one of these or that style will work well if you truly need one.
As for the gauze. Many of our medics are PJ's and they have been deployed many times. They have used the combat gauze and say it works well. In fact so well for serious bleeds Arterial in nature that our department now carries them.
http://www.z-medica.com/healthcare/Products/QuikClot-Combat-Gauze.aspx
You can find them online for $35 or so... Watch some training videos and learn how to use it.
and as for some saying they cause more damage. That may be true but the ER docs can take care of that. Its better than the alternative of exsanguination in the field before you get to the trauma center.
My Fire Department uses this style. It's very similar to the combat ones.
http://www.boundtreeuniversity.com/Trauma/articles/1001716-Tourniquets-From-combat-to-commonplace
These I believe are what they use now.
http://www.combattourniquet.com/
Either one of these or that style will work well if you truly need one.
As for the gauze. Many of our medics are PJ's and they have been deployed many times. They have used the combat gauze and say it works well. In fact so well for serious bleeds Arterial in nature that our department now carries them.
http://www.z-medica.com/healthcare/Products/QuikClot-Combat-Gauze.aspx
You can find them online for $35 or so... Watch some training videos and learn how to use it.
and as for some saying they cause more damage. That may be true but the ER docs can take care of that. Its better than the alternative of exsanguination in the field before you get to the trauma center.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
we use the c.a.t style tourniquets in our dept. they work great and can be performed with one hand if needed. on the original note. i think that knowledge is by far king to anything else. you can have everthing know to man, but knowing how to use it is what makes the difference. QC works good, but most of the time there is always a alteritive.
on a side note, you can get military tourn. at your local surplus. they run right about $30+ from suppliers, and $3-5 at the surplus.
we use the c.a.t style tourniquets in our dept. they work great and can be performed with one hand if needed. on the original note. i think that knowledge is by far king to anything else. you can have everthing know to man, but knowing how to use it is what makes the difference. QC works good, but most of the time there is always a alteritive.
on a side note, you can get military tourn. at your local surplus. they run right about $30+ from suppliers, and $3-5 at the surplus.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jfd0913</div><div class="ubbcode-body">on a side note, you can get military tourn. at your local surplus. they run right about $30+ from suppliers, and $3-5 at the surplus. </div></div>
If they aren't new at the surplus store I wouldn't buy CAT tourniquets. They can break, also make sure they aren't some ripoff model. Is saving $25 for a something that could be lifesaving worth it?
http://www.coalitiontacticalmedicine.org/2010/05/02/tourniquet-safety-alert/
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jfd0913</div><div class="ubbcode-body">on a side note, you can get military tourn. at your local surplus. they run right about $30+ from suppliers, and $3-5 at the surplus. </div></div>
If they aren't new at the surplus store I wouldn't buy CAT tourniquets. They can break, also make sure they aren't some ripoff model. Is saving $25 for a something that could be lifesaving worth it?
http://www.coalitiontacticalmedicine.org/2010/05/02/tourniquet-safety-alert/
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Pressure done right should be the first line of defense. Now when you have massive trauma, you might not be able to get enough pressure over a broad enough area (large hole).
I have held pressure on 1000+ femoral arteries from working as an RN in the cath lab for years in the past. About 10 minutes applied correctly on someone without blood thinners or clotting abnormalities will just about stop it.
All this fancy stuff sells product, and some are decent, but in the end, hold pressure and don't check it for 10 minutes.
Pressure done right should be the first line of defense. Now when you have massive trauma, you might not be able to get enough pressure over a broad enough area (large hole).
I have held pressure on 1000+ femoral arteries from working as an RN in the cath lab for years in the past. About 10 minutes applied correctly on someone without blood thinners or clotting abnormalities will just about stop it.
All this fancy stuff sells product, and some are decent, but in the end, hold pressure and don't check it for 10 minutes.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Bayou Boy,
This fancy stuff was designed for a combat environment and not a cath lab. Is it appropriate for a civilian setting, it can be. Combat gauze and the products like that are designed solely to be used on groin, neck, and armpit bleeders where a tourniquet won't work. One of the main reasons they are used is sometimes in a combat environment you don't have 10 minutes and you also might not have a clean cut through an artery. Imagine what happens to an artery after it has been sliced by a bunch of tiny fragments of shrapnel. An artery doesn't have the structure left to stop the bleeding.
Bayou Boy,
This fancy stuff was designed for a combat environment and not a cath lab. Is it appropriate for a civilian setting, it can be. Combat gauze and the products like that are designed solely to be used on groin, neck, and armpit bleeders where a tourniquet won't work. One of the main reasons they are used is sometimes in a combat environment you don't have 10 minutes and you also might not have a clean cut through an artery. Imagine what happens to an artery after it has been sliced by a bunch of tiny fragments of shrapnel. An artery doesn't have the structure left to stop the bleeding.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bayou Boy,
This fancy stuff was designed for a combat environment and not a cath lab. Is it appropriate for a civilian setting, it can be. Combat gauze and the products like that are designed solely to be used on groin, neck, and armpit bleeders where a tourniquet won't work. One of the main reasons they are used is sometimes in a combat environment you don't have 10 minutes and you also might not have a clean cut through an artery. Imagine what happens to an artery after it has been sliced by a bunch of tiny fragments of shrapnel. An artery doesn't have the structure left to stop the bleeding. </div></div>
I understand what you are saying. I'm also not saying that other things don't work. And I am quite aware of the difference between trauma wounds and arterial punctures (which is why I put the disclaimer in my statement early on). I've been a flight nurse, worked in ERs, etc.
I've just seen ALOT of alternative clotting methods. All kinds of talk about removing nitric oxide from the blood causing vasoconstriction yada, yada. Some certainly work, some are junk. I just know if you hold enough pressure for a long enough period, it usually works.
But I do definitely recognize that there are things out there that do work and work well. So I hear what you are saying. I did not intend to come across as the product you listed didn't work.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jong</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Bayou Boy,
This fancy stuff was designed for a combat environment and not a cath lab. Is it appropriate for a civilian setting, it can be. Combat gauze and the products like that are designed solely to be used on groin, neck, and armpit bleeders where a tourniquet won't work. One of the main reasons they are used is sometimes in a combat environment you don't have 10 minutes and you also might not have a clean cut through an artery. Imagine what happens to an artery after it has been sliced by a bunch of tiny fragments of shrapnel. An artery doesn't have the structure left to stop the bleeding. </div></div>
I understand what you are saying. I'm also not saying that other things don't work. And I am quite aware of the difference between trauma wounds and arterial punctures (which is why I put the disclaimer in my statement early on). I've been a flight nurse, worked in ERs, etc.
I've just seen ALOT of alternative clotting methods. All kinds of talk about removing nitric oxide from the blood causing vasoconstriction yada, yada. Some certainly work, some are junk. I just know if you hold enough pressure for a long enough period, it usually works.
But I do definitely recognize that there are things out there that do work and work well. So I hear what you are saying. I did not intend to come across as the product you listed didn't work.
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Go to this website and download the PPT files and take the course.
http://www.naemt.org/education/PHTLS/TCCC.aspx
Great videos on Celox, combat gauze and CAT. Everyone that plays with guns should know this stuff. You never know what can happen at the range. These PPT files require the newest powerpoint. If you don't have it just grab open office and use it its free.
WHen I was in school 20 years ago tourniquet was a last resort. That has changed. In TCCC there is a saying "when in doubt tourniquet". With arterial bleeds from GSW you have seconds. If you don't know anatomy then learn the pressure points now. You should know the difference between arterial bleeds and veneous. Download and play this course on your computer. If you haven't been thought this stuff before I guarantee you will learn something from this powerpoint
Go to this website and download the PPT files and take the course.
http://www.naemt.org/education/PHTLS/TCCC.aspx
Great videos on Celox, combat gauze and CAT. Everyone that plays with guns should know this stuff. You never know what can happen at the range. These PPT files require the newest powerpoint. If you don't have it just grab open office and use it its free.
WHen I was in school 20 years ago tourniquet was a last resort. That has changed. In TCCC there is a saying "when in doubt tourniquet". With arterial bleeds from GSW you have seconds. If you don't know anatomy then learn the pressure points now. You should know the difference between arterial bleeds and veneous. Download and play this course on your computer. If you haven't been thought this stuff before I guarantee you will learn something from this powerpoint
Re: Celox (Trauma Blood Clotting Agent)
Yes, combat gaze, not grams.
Excellent product
Yes, combat gaze, not grams.
Excellent product
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