Suppressors Clarified; Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
- Thread starter 308sako
- Start date
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
I had a zero which was shifting slightly between outings on me last year. I thought I was going nucking futs or something until I was lying at 900 yds at an F class match waiting for my target to be marked and I watched my reticle jump about .75MOA on me. Turned out the erector was sticking.
I had a zero which was shifting slightly between outings on me last year. I thought I was going nucking futs or something until I was lying at 900 yds at an F class match waiting for my target to be marked and I watched my reticle jump about .75MOA on me. Turned out the erector was sticking.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
my group shifted just an inch to the right on my 308 bolt gun BUT on my AI with suppressor it went about 5 inches low. I think it really depends on the shooter and the platform your running
my group shifted just an inch to the right on my 308 bolt gun BUT on my AI with suppressor it went about 5 inches low. I think it really depends on the shooter and the platform your running
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
How thick is the barrel?
Was it properly stress relieved?
How heavy is the can?
How thick is the barrel?
Was it properly stress relieved?
How heavy is the can?
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
So I understand this..
He set up and with a cold barrel?
His first 4 or 5 shots and off?
And then when things warm up, they hit on target and stay on target?
Is the suppressor a reflective design?
So I understand this..
He set up and with a cold barrel?
His first 4 or 5 shots and off?
And then when things warm up, they hit on target and stay on target?
Is the suppressor a reflective design?
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Well, I would have to say then a couple of items to look at and consider:
1. depending on the can design, you have heard of first round pop, well that noise is not all that is an ill effect, volume, temp and suppression can create some weird momentary issues, not consistent either! Have seen this over the many years and testing.
2. are we shooting reloads or factory? you know where I am going with this, quality of reloads basically could be questionable.
3. no matter if its an AI or X-brand, if the suppressor is maintained on the weapon constantly, never off you could still find a POI shift. when determining and checking for POI shift, I have found, taking the rifle out and performing the following will and has directly assisted me in many years:
1. rifle zero'd @ 100yds, I use the same ammo/lot for the entire run
2. cold bore with x2 follow ups
3. wait 10 minutes, with x3 rounds, suppressor attached, fire x3 rd group, determine initial POI shift.
4. now single load x1 rd (safety first here!) unsuppressed, fire, next attach suppressor load x1 rd fire, repeat this for a total of x6 rds, x3 suppressed and x3 unsuppressed, but the can on and off after each rounds. this will determine if the mounting device and suppressor are reliable and repeatable. this completes the 100yd testing and determines what you have in POI shift and repeatability. if all looks good here, you have your correction data, plot and lets go to next step.
5. 200yds, here I will perform the x3 rds unsuppressed, x3 rds suppressed for a quick verification, no corrections made, simple checking the repeatable/predictability of setup.
6. 300yds, here we make corrections, determined from 100yds and 200yds groups. fire x3 unsuppressed, make POI correction, x3 suppressed, and repeat this sequence x4 times each, making a group total grouping of x24rds. This will consist of x4 3rd groups unsuppressed and x4 3rd groups suppressed.
With all this being done, what you have completed is a true break in of the suppressor and muzzle attachment, reliability, repeatability checks and most of all SELF ASSURED confidence in the setup you call YOURS! One note, most always ask me, is what do you find to be the outcome. If I can do the 300yd grouping at the end, cover the group with the palm of my hand, you have something to work with. On some suppressors, I have found even with the POI corrections, the end results here could and have demonstrated as much as a 4MOA end result. Single flyers, from can off to on and so on will create this. No matter what, the proof is there, you have to work it, determine it and deal with it at this point.
End note, I don't understand why someone would leave a suppressor on all the time, especially a precision rifle. This tends to be more problematic than less corrections and issues in the end.
Well, I would have to say then a couple of items to look at and consider:
1. depending on the can design, you have heard of first round pop, well that noise is not all that is an ill effect, volume, temp and suppression can create some weird momentary issues, not consistent either! Have seen this over the many years and testing.
2. are we shooting reloads or factory? you know where I am going with this, quality of reloads basically could be questionable.
3. no matter if its an AI or X-brand, if the suppressor is maintained on the weapon constantly, never off you could still find a POI shift. when determining and checking for POI shift, I have found, taking the rifle out and performing the following will and has directly assisted me in many years:
1. rifle zero'd @ 100yds, I use the same ammo/lot for the entire run
2. cold bore with x2 follow ups
3. wait 10 minutes, with x3 rounds, suppressor attached, fire x3 rd group, determine initial POI shift.
4. now single load x1 rd (safety first here!) unsuppressed, fire, next attach suppressor load x1 rd fire, repeat this for a total of x6 rds, x3 suppressed and x3 unsuppressed, but the can on and off after each rounds. this will determine if the mounting device and suppressor are reliable and repeatable. this completes the 100yd testing and determines what you have in POI shift and repeatability. if all looks good here, you have your correction data, plot and lets go to next step.
5. 200yds, here I will perform the x3 rds unsuppressed, x3 rds suppressed for a quick verification, no corrections made, simple checking the repeatable/predictability of setup.
6. 300yds, here we make corrections, determined from 100yds and 200yds groups. fire x3 unsuppressed, make POI correction, x3 suppressed, and repeat this sequence x4 times each, making a group total grouping of x24rds. This will consist of x4 3rd groups unsuppressed and x4 3rd groups suppressed.
With all this being done, what you have completed is a true break in of the suppressor and muzzle attachment, reliability, repeatability checks and most of all SELF ASSURED confidence in the setup you call YOURS! One note, most always ask me, is what do you find to be the outcome. If I can do the 300yd grouping at the end, cover the group with the palm of my hand, you have something to work with. On some suppressors, I have found even with the POI corrections, the end results here could and have demonstrated as much as a 4MOA end result. Single flyers, from can off to on and so on will create this. No matter what, the proof is there, you have to work it, determine it and deal with it at this point.
End note, I don't understand why someone would leave a suppressor on all the time, especially a precision rifle. This tends to be more problematic than less corrections and issues in the end.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Its possible that the heat mirage off the can at that number of shots can affect your sight picture. We have had this happen. Rifle cools off, heat mirage goes away.
Other less possibility, is that the threads are not quite right and as they heat, they allow a small amount of movement. This "not quite right" may not be measureable.
Had this happen with a Surefire adaptor. First round was nut on and everybody else went 1" down. Cool off and next round is 1" up, nut on cold zero, then back down 1".
A lot of loc-tite and some devcon, adaptor is now TIGHT, and zero shift described above is gone forever.
Its possible that the heat mirage off the can at that number of shots can affect your sight picture. We have had this happen. Rifle cools off, heat mirage goes away.
Other less possibility, is that the threads are not quite right and as they heat, they allow a small amount of movement. This "not quite right" may not be measureable.
Had this happen with a Surefire adaptor. First round was nut on and everybody else went 1" down. Cool off and next round is 1" up, nut on cold zero, then back down 1".
A lot of loc-tite and some devcon, adaptor is now TIGHT, and zero shift described above is gone forever.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
I have a noticeable poi shift as the can gets hotter on my ruger Mark III.
let it cool between shots or learn to compensate.
I have a noticeable poi shift as the can gets hotter on my ruger Mark III.
let it cool between shots or learn to compensate.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
This is the type of test I want to perform with several different types of suppressors this year.
There is a lot of talk about various suppressors and their alleged affect on the POI and no one has really tested several cans to see which ones have the greatest affect on the POI.
This is the type of test I want to perform with several different types of suppressors this year.
There is a lot of talk about various suppressors and their alleged affect on the POI and no one has really tested several cans to see which ones have the greatest affect on the POI.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
There was a big test of suppressors with .338L that was just completed at 1,500 yards at the Whittington Center, specifically for POI for the upcoming SOCOM solicitation. Results released in about a month. POI remains a driving influence in all things suppressed.
There was a big test of suppressors with .338L that was just completed at 1,500 yards at the Whittington Center, specifically for POI for the upcoming SOCOM solicitation. Results released in about a month. POI remains a driving influence in all things suppressed.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Atomic Lab Rat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This is the type of test I want to perform with several different types of suppressors this year.
There is a lot of talk about various suppressors and their alleged affect on the POI and no one has really tested several cans to see which ones have the greatest affect on the POI. </div></div>
If you had 20 of the SAME manufacturers' cans, same make and model, it can have the same issues, the kind of test you want to do has been done by a defense contractor under "non disclosure agreement" on more than one manufacturer's can.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Atomic Lab Rat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This is the type of test I want to perform with several different types of suppressors this year.
There is a lot of talk about various suppressors and their alleged affect on the POI and no one has really tested several cans to see which ones have the greatest affect on the POI. </div></div>
If you had 20 of the SAME manufacturers' cans, same make and model, it can have the same issues, the kind of test you want to do has been done by a defense contractor under "non disclosure agreement" on more than one manufacturer's can.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
I'm the person 308sako was referring to. Here is a bit more detail.. Rifle is an ai ae mkI, can is an AAC cyclone with a sas3 cover. I don't leave the can attached for storage due to the pictures I've seen of what escaping water vapor from the suppressor can do to the bore. I do notice a shift each remounting of the can that is not always repeatable, usually around .2mil vertical and horizontal. I rezero prior to a match with the can attached to minimize this. However, this is not the shift were talking about.
During a match I fired a 6 round string at 200m that matched the dope (dialed .5 mil) and zero perfectly (within .1mil). Next stage I fired two shots at 300m (dialed upto 1.3) and the first went high by .3 mil. Second shot I dialed down to 1mil and hit. The next stage was 8 rounds at 300m again-- I left the current 1 mil dialed and the first shot hit. The next 7 all went .3mil low again. I continued shooting for the 20 rounds at ranges between 200-500m and it matched my dope perfectly again and no further changes in poi happened.
One thing if note is the high round count prior to cleaning the rifle had when this happened. Aside from cleaning the lugs, raceways, muzzle threads, and crown the rifle had not seen a patch in 1055 rounds.
I've never had it do this before and my obvious first step was to clean the thing which took alot less effort then I expected for such a high round count. This also makes me want to second guess this as the culprit.
I'm the person 308sako was referring to. Here is a bit more detail.. Rifle is an ai ae mkI, can is an AAC cyclone with a sas3 cover. I don't leave the can attached for storage due to the pictures I've seen of what escaping water vapor from the suppressor can do to the bore. I do notice a shift each remounting of the can that is not always repeatable, usually around .2mil vertical and horizontal. I rezero prior to a match with the can attached to minimize this. However, this is not the shift were talking about.
During a match I fired a 6 round string at 200m that matched the dope (dialed .5 mil) and zero perfectly (within .1mil). Next stage I fired two shots at 300m (dialed upto 1.3) and the first went high by .3 mil. Second shot I dialed down to 1mil and hit. The next stage was 8 rounds at 300m again-- I left the current 1 mil dialed and the first shot hit. The next 7 all went .3mil low again. I continued shooting for the 20 rounds at ranges between 200-500m and it matched my dope perfectly again and no further changes in poi happened.
One thing if note is the high round count prior to cleaning the rifle had when this happened. Aside from cleaning the lugs, raceways, muzzle threads, and crown the rifle had not seen a patch in 1055 rounds.
I've never had it do this before and my obvious first step was to clean the thing which took alot less effort then I expected for such a high round count. This also makes me want to second guess this as the culprit.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
There actually has been several over many years in the past, suppressor test which were conducted by private labs and firms which were documented and provided to such outfits which were required. In these different "Independent" test, many factors and results were reported to assist in the decision making process prior to final procurement of such items. None of which have been released or would expect to be published for general public usage either. There are several different "website suppressor testing/rating" outfits obviously out there which have published some good information, some bad, and some slightly bias as one may expect. But the good thing is one should review all, digest for education and make an "informed" decision, not based on what is hot today or who thinks who is the best since that is what so and so runs or the one and only one they own. There are many different suppressors out there, actually not one company makes the best of all for all applications. Some specialize in pistols, some in rifles and some in subguns, but most have something that is really good in one or two areas but maybe not so much in the others. Something to look at and think about when buying.
You can take 1-5 cans from each and test them on "ONE" gun, does that make it a conclusive test, no not really. Try that test with multiple guns, calibers, muzzle brake devices, thread pitches, suppressors and over a period of time not just one day or week. Then you have a base of data which you can draw honest and non-bias data from to honestly understand the products pro's and con's.
LVMIKE: after reading the above post, I would recommend a good thorough cleaning as well, then go out and test the can for the POI shift again. I believe you have figured out a possible result of the issue and at least one that could be removed to positively influence your results. Good luck and lmk if you need any assistance.
There actually has been several over many years in the past, suppressor test which were conducted by private labs and firms which were documented and provided to such outfits which were required. In these different "Independent" test, many factors and results were reported to assist in the decision making process prior to final procurement of such items. None of which have been released or would expect to be published for general public usage either. There are several different "website suppressor testing/rating" outfits obviously out there which have published some good information, some bad, and some slightly bias as one may expect. But the good thing is one should review all, digest for education and make an "informed" decision, not based on what is hot today or who thinks who is the best since that is what so and so runs or the one and only one they own. There are many different suppressors out there, actually not one company makes the best of all for all applications. Some specialize in pistols, some in rifles and some in subguns, but most have something that is really good in one or two areas but maybe not so much in the others. Something to look at and think about when buying.
You can take 1-5 cans from each and test them on "ONE" gun, does that make it a conclusive test, no not really. Try that test with multiple guns, calibers, muzzle brake devices, thread pitches, suppressors and over a period of time not just one day or week. Then you have a base of data which you can draw honest and non-bias data from to honestly understand the products pro's and con's.
LVMIKE: after reading the above post, I would recommend a good thorough cleaning as well, then go out and test the can for the POI shift again. I believe you have figured out a possible result of the issue and at least one that could be removed to positively influence your results. Good luck and lmk if you need any assistance.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
This thread has a LOT of WIN in it.
Stacey is SPOT ON.
Most of the testing inquired about is proprietary, done by outside agencies or not even done. Up until recently, maybe half of the suppressor companies were concerned with POI shift. And half is a generous figure.
This thread has a LOT of WIN in it.
Stacey is SPOT ON.
Most of the testing inquired about is proprietary, done by outside agencies or not even done. Up until recently, maybe half of the suppressor companies were concerned with POI shift. And half is a generous figure.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Here is an example of what I was referring to earlier. This picture is a basic and very true representation of our new QD TI .338 Suppressor and QD muzzle brake is producing. This picture is of a steel plate @ 300yds, L to R wind this day of 12-15 full value, 3 rounds unsuppressed, 3 rounds suppressed, but here is the kicker, NO CORRECTION input for POI shift this is what the system naturally produced and this was with a cold bore, followed by suppressed follow up, followed by unsuppressed and so forth. So this demonstrates the reliable repeatability I mentioned which is I believe to be the top requirement with such a system. This group was fired as well with LC Ball with the following picture showing the rifle with a few spent cases from days and days of testing. The last picture is another example of a different mounting solution and suppressor, again with ball ammo, but demonstrates what I look for with the repeatability.
Here is an example of what I was referring to earlier. This picture is a basic and very true representation of our new QD TI .338 Suppressor and QD muzzle brake is producing. This picture is of a steel plate @ 300yds, L to R wind this day of 12-15 full value, 3 rounds unsuppressed, 3 rounds suppressed, but here is the kicker, NO CORRECTION input for POI shift this is what the system naturally produced and this was with a cold bore, followed by suppressed follow up, followed by unsuppressed and so forth. So this demonstrates the reliable repeatability I mentioned which is I believe to be the top requirement with such a system. This group was fired as well with LC Ball with the following picture showing the rifle with a few spent cases from days and days of testing. The last picture is another example of a different mounting solution and suppressor, again with ball ammo, but demonstrates what I look for with the repeatability.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
The "suppressor" is Suppressed Armament Systems, the new proprietary AINA/SAS QD TI suppressor line we introduced at Shot Show this year, varying models for .30cal, .338cal and Covert models currently. I will be listing available models and pricing very soon our the "accuracyinternational.us" website.
You are very welcome, had a few minutes last night to simply relax and review some current post here to pass along some information which some may find helpful and interesting to work with. Thank you and best wishes.
Chiller, no love no tag no soup, he he.
The "suppressor" is Suppressed Armament Systems, the new proprietary AINA/SAS QD TI suppressor line we introduced at Shot Show this year, varying models for .30cal, .338cal and Covert models currently. I will be listing available models and pricing very soon our the "accuracyinternational.us" website.
You are very welcome, had a few minutes last night to simply relax and review some current post here to pass along some information which some may find helpful and interesting to work with. Thank you and best wishes.
Chiller, no love no tag no soup, he he.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Oh yeah, he drooled, fondled, talked and touched everything with LOTS of emotion, very touching it was, ha ha.
Oh yeah, he drooled, fondled, talked and touched everything with LOTS of emotion, very touching it was, ha ha.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Where is the love.....
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Of great interest....
Where is the love.....
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Of great interest....
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
I would have too chiller your not alone!
Geez Mike I'm sorry to hear you are still having some problems. I take it you've ruled out the scope as the culprit?
I would've almost swore it was just time to clean, mine did the same thing till I cleaned it. At about 700rds some flyers started popping up, after I cleaned it settled into it's normal self again.
Does the can do this on both your AI's?
I would have too chiller your not alone!
Geez Mike I'm sorry to hear you are still having some problems. I take it you've ruled out the scope as the culprit?
I would've almost swore it was just time to clean, mine did the same thing till I cleaned it. At about 700rds some flyers started popping up, after I cleaned it settled into it's normal self again.
Does the can do this on both your AI's?
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Looks I'll see ya monday in the am Mike. We'll talk then.
Looks I'll see ya monday in the am Mike. We'll talk then.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Well, went out to the range late today, finally descent enough to go shoot and do some more testing. So here is a quick download of what I got out of x2 of the new QD TI .338 suppressors (BLACK ONES in all the pictures) that we at Shot Show and yes Chiller along with thousands of others finger #&%^#D, he he. All rounds fired today were LC98 Ball ammo:
1. Bugger eating moron just standing there, looked like a threat, engage!
2. He has a black spot on him, most be a diseased one Yuck! (Cold Bore w/suppressor installed, since thats the purpose here)
3. Well no more black spot, POI 6 o'clock well within the pasty.
4. Huh, took that can off, installed can #2, same build just the twin to #1, fired 2nd round.
Performed the 300yd and 500yd testing today as well, I believe the pictures above will state the obvious to what occurred. However, at the end of the day, just for fun, I fired another 10rds @ 500yds 8" head plate, barrel is a little warm, just took the 2nd 17oz suppressor off, and eat it alive. So yes, this platform is working very well, just to tease Chiller some more, and looking forward to better weather to post more data soon, thanks again and enjoy.
Well, went out to the range late today, finally descent enough to go shoot and do some more testing. So here is a quick download of what I got out of x2 of the new QD TI .338 suppressors (BLACK ONES in all the pictures) that we at Shot Show and yes Chiller along with thousands of others finger #&%^#D, he he. All rounds fired today were LC98 Ball ammo:
1. Bugger eating moron just standing there, looked like a threat, engage!
2. He has a black spot on him, most be a diseased one Yuck! (Cold Bore w/suppressor installed, since thats the purpose here)
3. Well no more black spot, POI 6 o'clock well within the pasty.
4. Huh, took that can off, installed can #2, same build just the twin to #1, fired 2nd round.
Performed the 300yd and 500yd testing today as well, I believe the pictures above will state the obvious to what occurred. However, at the end of the day, just for fun, I fired another 10rds @ 500yds 8" head plate, barrel is a little warm, just took the 2nd 17oz suppressor off, and eat it alive. So yes, this platform is working very well, just to tease Chiller some more, and looking forward to better weather to post more data soon, thanks again and enjoy.
Re: Clarified; Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HumungoSpheres</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Title says it all, a friend shooting recently has had a couple of mysterious zero shifts which then return to known POI's. This has happened and after as little as 4 or 5 shots, the rifle returns to normal.
Please note this refers to when the rifle has been zero'd with the silencer attached and is being fired with the silencer attached. The silenser has not been removed from the barrel either, so not repositioned. Hope that is clear.
Best quality equipment being used... ??? It's a head scratcher </div></div>
Aside from the outstanding advice given by others, the only bit I can add relates to the attachment mechanism of the suppressor, QD or threaded. Any change in the union between the can and the barrel will affect harmonics, thus point of impact. Second, changes in the baffle configuration between shot, ie, are the baffles loose. Last, of course, obvious, and you've probably checked for it, I feel sheepish bringing it up, are baffle strikes.
A suppressor or muzzle brake can look tight, but even 1/8 turn of looseness will toss shots. I learned this the hard way a few years back when my previously tack driving .270 suddlenly wouldn't hit the proverbial broadside of the barn. I check the scope, scope mount, took the action out of the stock, remounted it, cursed, scratched my head, then picked up the rifle by the muzzle and felt the brake twist. I tightened it back up (it was just loose enough to be turned by hand), and voila, the rifle was once again it's usual self, and I passed another class in the School of Hard Knocks. Good Luck.
-Wes
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HumungoSpheres</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Title says it all, a friend shooting recently has had a couple of mysterious zero shifts which then return to known POI's. This has happened and after as little as 4 or 5 shots, the rifle returns to normal.
Please note this refers to when the rifle has been zero'd with the silencer attached and is being fired with the silencer attached. The silenser has not been removed from the barrel either, so not repositioned. Hope that is clear.
Best quality equipment being used... ??? It's a head scratcher </div></div>
Aside from the outstanding advice given by others, the only bit I can add relates to the attachment mechanism of the suppressor, QD or threaded. Any change in the union between the can and the barrel will affect harmonics, thus point of impact. Second, changes in the baffle configuration between shot, ie, are the baffles loose. Last, of course, obvious, and you've probably checked for it, I feel sheepish bringing it up, are baffle strikes.
A suppressor or muzzle brake can look tight, but even 1/8 turn of looseness will toss shots. I learned this the hard way a few years back when my previously tack driving .270 suddlenly wouldn't hit the proverbial broadside of the barn. I check the scope, scope mount, took the action out of the stock, remounted it, cursed, scratched my head, then picked up the rifle by the muzzle and felt the brake twist. I tightened it back up (it was just loose enough to be turned by hand), and voila, the rifle was once again it's usual self, and I passed another class in the School of Hard Knocks. Good Luck.
-Wes
Re: Clarified; Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Still beautiful, HS, albeit covered with about 20 inches of snow right now.
Still beautiful, HS, albeit covered with about 20 inches of snow right now.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Stacey, I gotta ask, what punched the holes in the plate? 50?
Stacey, I gotta ask, what punched the holes in the plate? 50?
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Yeap, .50BMG and these plates are seriously worn down to but those where some OOPS! rounds mixed in I believe.
Yeap, .50BMG and these plates are seriously worn down to but those where some OOPS! rounds mixed in I believe.
Re: Once zero'd can a CAN cause POI shifts?
Yeap, but back to Mike's ?, this is just to demonstrate what I was talking about in regards to barrel threading, "properly" and dedicated to suppressor usage. There is no question that any gunsmith can thread a barrel, but rather the point to how and to what quality "WILL" he do this request. The one thing I recommend time and time again to the customer which is going to have his barrel threaded for a suppressor, is inform the gunsmith, have the device available for indication and checks, and understand you are changing the harmonics and launch tube (barrel) effectively as soon as that say 8" extension is installed no matter what! There has to be a tolerance maintained or you will see the results at the other end, ill or not they will present themselves clearly.
Yeap, but back to Mike's ?, this is just to demonstrate what I was talking about in regards to barrel threading, "properly" and dedicated to suppressor usage. There is no question that any gunsmith can thread a barrel, but rather the point to how and to what quality "WILL" he do this request. The one thing I recommend time and time again to the customer which is going to have his barrel threaded for a suppressor, is inform the gunsmith, have the device available for indication and checks, and understand you are changing the harmonics and launch tube (barrel) effectively as soon as that say 8" extension is installed no matter what! There has to be a tolerance maintained or you will see the results at the other end, ill or not they will present themselves clearly.
