Haha, it does have a very HALO look to it! I do agree with you for right now. The gun is pretty far as it sits from anything defense related let alone a actual battle rifle. I think that will change though! The MDR is about as ambitious of a project as they come. Especially from a company as small as DTA was at the time. Any new platform will have its issues, but I believe they will be solved. Desert Tech is a good company at its core, and anyone better believe they want this to work more than any end user does. I think It's just taking them a little longer because of their size. They apparently just changed the extractor itself which I believe will go a lot further than just changing a gas port... Just spit balling, but I really hope it all gets straightened out.
- Thread starter Tritanium
- Start date
Haha, it does have a very HALO look to it! I do agree with you for right now. The gun is pretty far as it sits from anything defense related let alone a actual battle rifle. I think that will change though! The MDR is about as ambitious of a project as they come. Especially from a company as small as DTA was at the time. Any new platform will have its issues, but I believe they will be solved. Desert Tech is a good company at its core, and anyone better believe they want this to work more than any end user does. I think It's just taking them a little longer because of their size. They apparently just changed the extractor itself which I believe will go a lot further than just changing a gas port... Just spit balling, but I really hope it all gets straightened out.
Meh...the MDR is no where near the quality of its asking price...sorry...if you look at it...with an engineering/mechanical mind...the materials used are crap. There is maaaaaybe $500-700 worth of material there...at best this gun should only cost $1500...sure the engineering and such adds up...but not to $2500...at this point...I would recommend getting a KelTec RFB if you need a 308 bully right now, or wait for IWI to release the T7 or hold off another year or so before investing into the MDR @$2500...its a great design ergonomically...but everything else is subpar...
Even with the recent announcement on "upgraded" parts...it still does not cure the uber tight chamber, failure point gas piston design and questionable longevity of the rifle.
Even with the recent announcement on "upgraded" parts...it still does not cure the uber tight chamber, failure point gas piston design and questionable longevity of the rifle.
Inrangetv update
This is just my $.02. I had (Note Had) one.
I waited a long time for this rifle to hit the market and really wanted to love it. When I first picked it up, there were some issues with cycling it and reseting the trigger when dry fired. If you held the trigger back, you couldn't cycle the action and cock the hammer. It had to go back for repair. The rep said I could have just shot it and "broke it in", but in my opinion if a part doesn't fit, you shouldn't force it. When it returned it worked very well, so this suggests to me there were some out of spec parts and I can't believe a firearm manufacturer would suggest firing an inoperable weapon to try to "fix" a problem.
With regard to accuracy, unfortunately the best I could get it to group after testing 6 different types of match ammo was 1.5" - 2". (I get that out of my 16" DSA FAL with a RMR, and I get 3/4" out of my SCAR-H.) I had issues with reliability FTF (short stroke), and FTE issues if I recall correctly, and damaging brass on extraction. I would up selling it (losing $500) and am glad to see it gone.
I waited a long time for this rifle to hit the market and really wanted to love it. When I first picked it up, there were some issues with cycling it and reseting the trigger when dry fired. If you held the trigger back, you couldn't cycle the action and cock the hammer. It had to go back for repair. The rep said I could have just shot it and "broke it in", but in my opinion if a part doesn't fit, you shouldn't force it. When it returned it worked very well, so this suggests to me there were some out of spec parts and I can't believe a firearm manufacturer would suggest firing an inoperable weapon to try to "fix" a problem.
With regard to accuracy, unfortunately the best I could get it to group after testing 6 different types of match ammo was 1.5" - 2". (I get that out of my 16" DSA FAL with a RMR, and I get 3/4" out of my SCAR-H.) I had issues with reliability FTF (short stroke), and FTE issues if I recall correctly, and damaging brass on extraction. I would up selling it (losing $500) and am glad to see it gone.
I apricate your honest opinion as one of the only people on here who seemed to actually own one. Unfortunately that seems to be the general consensus. I was as excited as possible when they announced it. I actually even requested that they make a semi auto .308 before they ever announced it lol. The only reason I don't own one already is because I've been down that road before. I bough the ACR as soon as they came out and had 2 years worth of problems with it. I kept dealing with them because I loved the design of the gun. Unfortunately by the time they actually got everything straightened out I had such a bad taste in my mouth I couldn't enjoy the gun anymore.
I'm not buying a MDR until I'm certain that wont be the case. I just keep checking in because I want it to be right so badly. The gun just feels so amazing in your hands, and there are a lot of advantages to the design if they ever get it working right. I think the widened out ejection shoot will go a long way, but I'm definitely going to be waiting to find out.
I currently have one and love it. It has had hiccups sure, but the new 2019 gas valve seems to be the answer. I am shipping mine back to warranty to get the other optional upgrades. I will keep my progress on the process with it updated here. Their warranty department has been awesome to deal with thus far with the couple issues I have had.
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Guy at my range has one with a .308 and a new 6.5 creedmoor barrel. With the 6.5 and handloads he was able to get sub MOA at 100 yards with an 8X scope. I had a chance to shoot it with the 308 barrel and I was kinda MEH... but he is having a great time with it. He was getting ready to open a box of Berger branded ammunition with the 140 grain pills in it... I had to go to work so I bugged out before he started shooting.
Please do keep us posted on the upgrades. It seemed like this last round of fixes might be legit which would be awesome because like I said, I've wanted one for a while. I just need it to be a functional weapon before I'm dropping that kind of cash.
Thanks for the info man, sub MOA is more then enough for a battle rifle as far as I'm concerned. I'd be happy if it could stay under 1.5 MOA with .308 GMM. Out of curiousty what do you mean when you say it was just Meh?
It just wasn’t my cup of tea. I was very excited about the DT platform and its modularity. When I was able to hold one at SHOT it was a lot to consider. After shooting it, I was not that impressed. The trigger could have been better, and I have shot ar platforms for so many years I have too many habits.
I owned and sold a Tavor cause it didn’t get shot enough to keep it in the safe. Got to handle a Tavor 7 and realized that the bull pup just wasn’t for me. YRMV
Yeah I guess I could see that angle. I did get to play with one quite a bit at a gun show and the trigger is certainly a LOT heavier than I was expecting from them. Honestly I can get used to that sort of thing after a little bit of practice though. I went from a TRP 1911 to a HK P30 as my "main" sidearm and at first I was looking everywhere on how to get some trigger work done on the HK. After about 2000rds though I was just as good with the HK and its heavy gritty trigger as I was with the 1911.
The bullpup platform is definitely a change of pace but for me it just feels right in the hand. I'm definitely a AR/M4 man, but I know with training I will eventually be much better with a bullpup. My first rifle was a AR-15 and after being in the military the AR platform just sort of feels like an extension of my body lol. However again I feel like with training the bullpup will be superior in a lot of ways... Plus I'm a much bigger fan of 7.62/.308 over 5.56/.223. The round is just better in a lot of ways and with the platform being as small and light as these newer .308 bullpups are I just don't see any reason not to.
I've had one for some time. It went back to DT when I had problems with cases sticking in the chamber. The word was that I was using bad ammo and or that I hadn't broken it in yet. When I got it back it did cycle better but still had problems with banging case shoulders into the barrel extension and popping holes in them. Fortunately they wouldn't feed and fire so no problems with blowing crap every where. There were issues with ejection and scraping cases up so that reloading was tough. I never got the new gasblock because I refused to sign up on their website. They didn't want to send them to owners who wouldn't do that. Seems pretty sad to me. I almost always shoot suppressed....can't see any reason to do otherwise.
I did come up with a solution and trashed the crappy and not so accurate 308 barrel to retrieve the gasblock and barrel extension. I built a 6.5X47 barrel that is a little heavier and made my own gas port. In addition I smoothed out the sharp edges in the barrel extension and polished the edges of the ejection port parts. The result is a very nice shooting 6.5 X 47 that will actually shoot much better than the 308 piece of crap I bought. I also did a barrel in 338 BR to shoot subsonics primarily. It works very well too with a gasblock I made for the cal using a larger dia gasblock and piston to allow the lower pressure subs to cycle. They work well. With a hole in the gasport for supersonics I can also run 180gr bullets at 2200 fps or so.
All in all its a neat toy but I think they screwed the pooch on some of the design. The idea that you need to remove the handguard to adjust the gasport is stupid. That you need to remove the handguard to remove and replace the barrel is also. The feel of the rifle is ok with good balance but the promised match grade trigger is only match grade compared to military rifles from the late 1800's. Its heavy, creepy and no way to adjust it. The ejection issues are probably here to stay as long as you use the forward ejection plate. If you take off the cover and let it kick them out the side its much less annoying but then you've got to chase your brass to points unknown. At a buck a piece for the 6.5X47 and 6mm BR cases from Lapua I hate to lose them. On the other hand the new barrels have showed that the rifle is capable of good accuracy though at a cost higher than the factory barrel. For the cost of the rifle you'd be better off buying one of the IWI 308 Tavors when they finally come to market. The price is much lower and they have a reputation for at least making rifles reliable and ready for market. The Keltech is another 308 bullpup that might be a better choice as its less than half the price and doesn't seem to chew up stuff as fast. The price point of the MDR puts it in a catagory where you should get better than what they deliver. If it was a $1400 rifle it would probably be ok but not at $2500......
Just my opinion base on my rifle and those belonging to friends and customers.
I did come up with a solution and trashed the crappy and not so accurate 308 barrel to retrieve the gasblock and barrel extension. I built a 6.5X47 barrel that is a little heavier and made my own gas port. In addition I smoothed out the sharp edges in the barrel extension and polished the edges of the ejection port parts. The result is a very nice shooting 6.5 X 47 that will actually shoot much better than the 308 piece of crap I bought. I also did a barrel in 338 BR to shoot subsonics primarily. It works very well too with a gasblock I made for the cal using a larger dia gasblock and piston to allow the lower pressure subs to cycle. They work well. With a hole in the gasport for supersonics I can also run 180gr bullets at 2200 fps or so.
All in all its a neat toy but I think they screwed the pooch on some of the design. The idea that you need to remove the handguard to adjust the gasport is stupid. That you need to remove the handguard to remove and replace the barrel is also. The feel of the rifle is ok with good balance but the promised match grade trigger is only match grade compared to military rifles from the late 1800's. Its heavy, creepy and no way to adjust it. The ejection issues are probably here to stay as long as you use the forward ejection plate. If you take off the cover and let it kick them out the side its much less annoying but then you've got to chase your brass to points unknown. At a buck a piece for the 6.5X47 and 6mm BR cases from Lapua I hate to lose them. On the other hand the new barrels have showed that the rifle is capable of good accuracy though at a cost higher than the factory barrel. For the cost of the rifle you'd be better off buying one of the IWI 308 Tavors when they finally come to market. The price is much lower and they have a reputation for at least making rifles reliable and ready for market. The Keltech is another 308 bullpup that might be a better choice as its less than half the price and doesn't seem to chew up stuff as fast. The price point of the MDR puts it in a catagory where you should get better than what they deliver. If it was a $1400 rifle it would probably be ok but not at $2500......
Just my opinion base on my rifle and those belonging to friends and customers.
Will do I. I am excited to get it back but it could be a few weeks. In the mean time I'll just have to break in the SCAR16
I just found this thread. I want to update everyone on the MDR's status. We did have some initial issues out of the gate and we worked as quick as we could to address the problems. The major improvements are:
1. We re-designed our NEW 2019 gas valve to allow a very large variety of ammunition
2. We developed a NEW wider extractor that has 40% more rim engagement to prevent rims from ripping on hot ammunition
3. We have a viewing port in the hand-guard now allowing gas port settings to be easily verified without removal of the hand-guard.
The 2019 MDR's are functioning flawlessly and they run all kinds of ammo through them with no issues. All MDR rifles are shipping with the 2019 upgrades. For anyone who already owns and MDR then the 2019 upgrades are available free of charge just send your rifle into our warranty department for them.
We have also improved our warranty policy. All DT manufactured rifles and conversion kits come with a life-time warranty that is transferable to any owner so it doesn't matter if you are the first second third or 10th owner the warranty still applies and will be honored.
For those waiting to see if the 2019 upgrades are legit In-Range is the first to post the results in their videos of the 308 and 5.56 caliber MDR's. We have also installed the 2019 upgrades in the rifles with; Garand Thumb, Military Arms Channel, Sootch, Iraqiveteran, and other reviewers who will be publishing updated reviews over the next 4-6 weeks.
As far as why I do not post in the bullpup forum anymore; its because of the extreme toxicity that resides there, we provided an extreme amount of transparency and updates to keep their members up to date the best that we could but it seemed to just make things worse. I understand that we took longer than we anticipated to release the MDR and we also had some teething pains to overcome with initial production MDR's. Between both of those it has generated a constant DT hate storm on the BPforum which is unfortunate.
1. We re-designed our NEW 2019 gas valve to allow a very large variety of ammunition
2. We developed a NEW wider extractor that has 40% more rim engagement to prevent rims from ripping on hot ammunition
3. We have a viewing port in the hand-guard now allowing gas port settings to be easily verified without removal of the hand-guard.
The 2019 MDR's are functioning flawlessly and they run all kinds of ammo through them with no issues. All MDR rifles are shipping with the 2019 upgrades. For anyone who already owns and MDR then the 2019 upgrades are available free of charge just send your rifle into our warranty department for them.
We have also improved our warranty policy. All DT manufactured rifles and conversion kits come with a life-time warranty that is transferable to any owner so it doesn't matter if you are the first second third or 10th owner the warranty still applies and will be honored.
For those waiting to see if the 2019 upgrades are legit In-Range is the first to post the results in their videos of the 308 and 5.56 caliber MDR's. We have also installed the 2019 upgrades in the rifles with; Garand Thumb, Military Arms Channel, Sootch, Iraqiveteran, and other reviewers who will be publishing updated reviews over the next 4-6 weeks.
As far as why I do not post in the bullpup forum anymore; its because of the extreme toxicity that resides there, we provided an extreme amount of transparency and updates to keep their members up to date the best that we could but it seemed to just make things worse. I understand that we took longer than we anticipated to release the MDR and we also had some teething pains to overcome with initial production MDR's. Between both of those it has generated a constant DT hate storm on the BPforum which is unfortunate.
Awesome! I just got mine back for all the upgrades last week and will be taking it out this coming weekend to test it. I will update everyone, but they did awesome at DT warranty. Even tightened up the charging handles for me like I asked!!
FWIW I own one of the original MDRs. I got the first upgraded gas valve (Which I paid for, then they announced they were free after). Then got the next upgraded one for free. I have the old style extractor and hand guard. I asked if they could send me the parts to install myself and they said no I need to send it in which is a little annoying but I understand they want to be in control of any warranty work as they don't know if I'm a complete idiot or not.
That said, I've never had a FTF with my MDR. I only have around 200-250 rounds through it and the only mod I've ever made was lightly filing the part in the ejector chute that retains the brass. The way it came it was too sharp and required too much force to insert brass. After filing it a bit it become more reliable to hand eject rounds. You still need to manipulate the bolt with some authority to not get a hang up. While actually firing, this is a non issue as the gun operates with a lot of energy.
Accuracy I have only even shot this rifle with thermal scopes including the HALO LR. I can shoot about 1-1.5" groups with 168 amax handloads with a thermal scope at a handwarmer which I'm pretty happy with. A lighter trigger and a better scope I could put this rifle to the test even more. It's acceptable in regards to accuracy for what I bought it for (hog rifle).
The ergonomics on it are the best I can possibly imagine for what I bought it for (again hog hunting in and out of a buggie). The rear weight makes it awesome to shoulder and you can hold it with one hand. Try that with a suppressed AR10...
The mag release is very stiff. Been that way since I got it. Not a huge deal as I usually use the one in the rear and rarely change mags hunting.
The recoil is very stout for a 308. Like surprisingly so. It feels like a mild loaded 30-06 rifle. The impulse is rather sharp. It's still manageable, but you definitely notice it compared to say an AR10 which seems to have a longer smoother recoil impulse. I've run mine with a SiCo Omega since day 1.
All in all I'm very happy with the rifle for my intended use. I kind of laugh about guys expecting AK reliability out of a brand new design. In time with some tweaks I'm sure the MDR will prove to be a reliable rifle. If you shoot one type of ammo through it and tune it then it will be very reliable. I'm not one to run steel cased ammo through anything except an AK or cheap range blasting AR. I think folks just have some unrealistic expectations. I was also on the waitlist for this rifle and yes was pretty sick of being led on, but unfortunately that just seems to be the industry we are in. Instead of complaining about it and crying on public forums about it, just grab another rifle out of your safe in the meantime. After all, wouldn't you rather have a better product later on than a piece of shit sooner?
I would not hesitate to recommend the MDR to a friend even over a SCAR and custom AR10, if their intended use is just range shooting or hunting.
That said, I've never had a FTF with my MDR. I only have around 200-250 rounds through it and the only mod I've ever made was lightly filing the part in the ejector chute that retains the brass. The way it came it was too sharp and required too much force to insert brass. After filing it a bit it become more reliable to hand eject rounds. You still need to manipulate the bolt with some authority to not get a hang up. While actually firing, this is a non issue as the gun operates with a lot of energy.
Accuracy I have only even shot this rifle with thermal scopes including the HALO LR. I can shoot about 1-1.5" groups with 168 amax handloads with a thermal scope at a handwarmer which I'm pretty happy with. A lighter trigger and a better scope I could put this rifle to the test even more. It's acceptable in regards to accuracy for what I bought it for (hog rifle).
The ergonomics on it are the best I can possibly imagine for what I bought it for (again hog hunting in and out of a buggie). The rear weight makes it awesome to shoulder and you can hold it with one hand. Try that with a suppressed AR10...
The mag release is very stiff. Been that way since I got it. Not a huge deal as I usually use the one in the rear and rarely change mags hunting.
The recoil is very stout for a 308. Like surprisingly so. It feels like a mild loaded 30-06 rifle. The impulse is rather sharp. It's still manageable, but you definitely notice it compared to say an AR10 which seems to have a longer smoother recoil impulse. I've run mine with a SiCo Omega since day 1.
All in all I'm very happy with the rifle for my intended use. I kind of laugh about guys expecting AK reliability out of a brand new design. In time with some tweaks I'm sure the MDR will prove to be a reliable rifle. If you shoot one type of ammo through it and tune it then it will be very reliable. I'm not one to run steel cased ammo through anything except an AK or cheap range blasting AR. I think folks just have some unrealistic expectations. I was also on the waitlist for this rifle and yes was pretty sick of being led on, but unfortunately that just seems to be the industry we are in. Instead of complaining about it and crying on public forums about it, just grab another rifle out of your safe in the meantime. After all, wouldn't you rather have a better product later on than a piece of shit sooner?
I would not hesitate to recommend the MDR to a friend even over a SCAR and custom AR10, if their intended use is just range shooting or hunting.
Thanks for the support guys. Also for some insight the wider extractor requires the new case support piece inside of the barrel extension so its more than just changing the extractor the barrel extension must be removed and the new piece installed.
That is the problem with you guys. There was almost no transparency. I witnessed your replies first hand for almost three years. I can't remember a single time in those three years where you were transparent and took responsibility. I never saw you guys admit that you were facing real challenges with the rifle. Instead you guys pointed fingers at your suppliers, floods, or whatever else external event could conjure as an excuse.
Also, false promises, over and over again. Bringing peoples emotion up, only to give some worthless announcement.
Furthermore, I saw too many of your customers left high and dry by you guys, when they were having problems with their rifles.
Then Nick came on the site, and it only fueled the fire that much more. He's attitude was arrogant, and dismissive.
Personally, I believe there is a fundamental problem with the way DT runs the company, and it starts from the top.
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Seconded, Tonsofguns is spot on. About 100 documented lies on BPF and ARFCOM directly from Nick. Not to mention mass documentation of huge issues with the rifles themselves.
Still waiting on some real (Garandthumb style) testing to be done in the wild by users on all these "fixes" too. Remember several months ago this same CEO was claiming that everything was fine, there were no problems, the gun was utterly reliable, and anyone who was experiencing issues was an idiot for using "shitty" ammo (that somehow works in every other firearm). So I'll believe these "fixes" work when we see proper testing and not before.
Still waiting on some real (Garandthumb style) testing to be done in the wild by users on all these "fixes" too. Remember several months ago this same CEO was claiming that everything was fine, there were no problems, the gun was utterly reliable, and anyone who was experiencing issues was an idiot for using "shitty" ammo (that somehow works in every other firearm). So I'll believe these "fixes" work when we see proper testing and not before.
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I own 3 DT coverts:/Srs and love them. I put my money down on the MDT in 556 the day the gun was announced and years later, I still wait.,.,.
Not trying to be an ass, but I'm calling bullshit on that. I ordered my gun through Desert Tech since making this thread and had it within a week.
I waited until the 308 MDRs were available online before I purchased. Figured I let the bugs get worked out first. Have had mine for several months and even before the new gas plugs mine has been completely reliable. My only complaint is the trigger. It could be improved upon. MDR is slightly more accurate than my SCAR 20s.
I haven't even seen this thread since Desert Tech themselves chimmed it which is a nice surprise. I just wanted to put in a little update myself.
I think Desert Tech gets far to much hate or the internet for this rifle, and I do understand its only been compounded by some of their reactions. With that said they have gone far and above to try and fix all the issues and I think most of the hate comes from unexperienced shooters just hoping into the cool looking new rifle and taking issues with it. To be clear I'm not saying for a second the MDR hasn't had a really rough start. I'm just saying I think a lot of people online spew a lot of hate for the product, most of which probably never even touched one. Desert Tech was a very small (comparatively) company when they took on the MDR. They designed and manufactured a weapon unlike any other in a lot of ways and yes it had a lot of complications. I would think any real shooter would know and understand that such complications come with a radically new design from a small company. I know I sure did which is why I waited even when I asked Desert Tech to make semi auto .308 before it was ever even announced.
It seems everyone likes to trash this brand new rifle because its doesn't run as good as their AR-10 or AR-15. Well it also hasn't been around for almost 70 years getting it quirks smoothed out. I got my rifle a few weeks back and its been nothing but wonderful with everything from Malaysian surplus ammo to FGMM. They also had great communication, and were very helpful with all of my questions.
My first correspondences with DTA at the time, was early 2015 and they have always answered my question promptly and honestly. One of the reason its taken me so long to order a MDR was because every time I contacted them in the last two years about buying one, they told me straight up the guns were ready to order or good to ship, but they were working on some things they were getting complaints about.
So in my experience with my original SRS and now my MDR the company is a stand up company, and they make some truly incredible products. Albeit with a rough start on the MDR. I'm not saying a lot of you aren't right to be angry with how your guns may have started or how long it took them to sort things out. I'm just saying if your writing them off because of that you're missing out on some great weapons from a great company.
I think Desert Tech gets far to much hate or the internet for this rifle, and I do understand its only been compounded by some of their reactions. With that said they have gone far and above to try and fix all the issues and I think most of the hate comes from unexperienced shooters just hoping into the cool looking new rifle and taking issues with it. To be clear I'm not saying for a second the MDR hasn't had a really rough start. I'm just saying I think a lot of people online spew a lot of hate for the product, most of which probably never even touched one. Desert Tech was a very small (comparatively) company when they took on the MDR. They designed and manufactured a weapon unlike any other in a lot of ways and yes it had a lot of complications. I would think any real shooter would know and understand that such complications come with a radically new design from a small company. I know I sure did which is why I waited even when I asked Desert Tech to make semi auto .308 before it was ever even announced.
It seems everyone likes to trash this brand new rifle because its doesn't run as good as their AR-10 or AR-15. Well it also hasn't been around for almost 70 years getting it quirks smoothed out. I got my rifle a few weeks back and its been nothing but wonderful with everything from Malaysian surplus ammo to FGMM. They also had great communication, and were very helpful with all of my questions.
My first correspondences with DTA at the time, was early 2015 and they have always answered my question promptly and honestly. One of the reason its taken me so long to order a MDR was because every time I contacted them in the last two years about buying one, they told me straight up the guns were ready to order or good to ship, but they were working on some things they were getting complaints about.
So in my experience with my original SRS and now my MDR the company is a stand up company, and they make some truly incredible products. Albeit with a rough start on the MDR. I'm not saying a lot of you aren't right to be angry with how your guns may have started or how long it took them to sort things out. I'm just saying if your writing them off because of that you're missing out on some great weapons from a great company.
Yeah I will say the trigger is a little "strange" I think would be my way of putting it. I love the shape and feel of the literal trigger itself. I also personally think the trigger weight is perfect for this type of rifle(it feels to be about 5lbs or so). It's just really weird in that it has basically zero noticeable pre-travel. You feel nothing and then just bang. I kind of just figure like a lot of things with a bullpup it just needs some getting used to.
You can say anything you want but it’s the truth and if I wanted to prove it I could. Would you like to put money where your mouth is? What caliber is your gun?
The reality is of course the reverse of what Tritanium is spewing. We have over four years of documented lies over on BPF.
Likewise, the MDR deserves every bit of criticism it gets, it isn't reliable, durable, or a particularly pleasant rifle in comparison to others. Case in point, here is one TUNED by DT failing at a recent match:
Yeah we wall want a nice new rifle. This one just isn't it, at least in its current form and especially with the current company producing it.
Likewise, the MDR deserves every bit of criticism it gets, it isn't reliable, durable, or a particularly pleasant rifle in comparison to others. Case in point, here is one TUNED by DT failing at a recent match:
Yeah we wall want a nice new rifle. This one just isn't it, at least in its current form and especially with the current company producing it.
I have a trail of emails, not just from DT but another source who makes DT barrels, etc. and tried to help me because of knowing them. DT has always been “nice” but keeps breaking promises. After 2 years plus, I wanted my money back to buy my 2nd Covert. After being told I would promptly receive a refund I went ahead and bought my 2nd Covert (just released) through europtic. When my money never came, I called and was told I was on a list for refund but they had a group of MDR’s coming in the following week in 556 like I wanted and they would pull one and send it to me if I wanted. Knowing they are struggling and need their cash I agreed. That has to be 6 months ago and still nothing.... I’ll start trying again but it’s getting past ridiculous. The DAY the MDR was announced by an email to me I called and put my money down on a 556...I can’t even remember how long that was....my heart goes out to them but this is too much
One other little detail is that these rifles shouldn't be sold until they're ready. This is a problem for those who want new and cool right now but the main cause of this is a company announcing something that isn't and won't be ready. Don't let marketing sell til you've got something that works. DT failed miserably in this regard and has no leg to stand on for arguments about it. They caved to the public desire for new cool and it is entirely their fault and responsibility.
The biggest deal with this whole issue though isn't whether guys should be pissed or not over something that doesn't have 70 years of development. The issue is why did they let a top dollar rifle hit the market when it wasn't ready? If KelTech did that it wouldn't be such a big deal.....1100 dollar rifle is no biggie. But when the rifle costs twice as much and doesn't work as well its a problem. DT was not upfront about it and I was told I shouldn't be using the crappy ammo I was shooting in my rifle when I sent it in for repair. Funny thing is that same crappy ammo runs great in every other semi auto 308 I've run it in and every machinegun too. Its good ammo and the rifle has the problem. Yanking rims off, popping holes in the shoulder of the case, sticking cases, poor feed and function are serious problems and not ammo related. There are other issues with the rifle I don't understand but they're more related to taste or individual preference.
Now they're telling us that we need to send the rifles in again to get the upgrades but I don't want them messing with my rifle. Previously they said they'd get us all the new gasport plug but only if we signed up on their website. Before that they were charging us for the gasport plug. The issue is the fact that we paid top dollar for something that was supposed to be top notch. We got kelTech at a DT price and they still won't fix it right. All we get is guys who post stuff here to look good......promises that aren't kept.
Frank
The biggest deal with this whole issue though isn't whether guys should be pissed or not over something that doesn't have 70 years of development. The issue is why did they let a top dollar rifle hit the market when it wasn't ready? If KelTech did that it wouldn't be such a big deal.....1100 dollar rifle is no biggie. But when the rifle costs twice as much and doesn't work as well its a problem. DT was not upfront about it and I was told I shouldn't be using the crappy ammo I was shooting in my rifle when I sent it in for repair. Funny thing is that same crappy ammo runs great in every other semi auto 308 I've run it in and every machinegun too. Its good ammo and the rifle has the problem. Yanking rims off, popping holes in the shoulder of the case, sticking cases, poor feed and function are serious problems and not ammo related. There are other issues with the rifle I don't understand but they're more related to taste or individual preference.
Now they're telling us that we need to send the rifles in again to get the upgrades but I don't want them messing with my rifle. Previously they said they'd get us all the new gasport plug but only if we signed up on their website. Before that they were charging us for the gasport plug. The issue is the fact that we paid top dollar for something that was supposed to be top notch. We got kelTech at a DT price and they still won't fix it right. All we get is guys who post stuff here to look good......promises that aren't kept.
Frank
Pretty much.
Mine is back at dt for the 4th time to get the upgrades and figure out what is out of spec since the bolt, and extension started getting burs after they replaced the frame rails last time.
Almost 2 years in and I've never really had a rifle I would call reliable or could trust with any ammo.
I recirved notice today with tracking number so my MDR is coming and I will get to own one. I am glad they did finally come through and not pull a bankruptcy on us which would have been an easy way out. I forgot about SCAR having those broken stock issues when it came out and DT is smaller then FN...let’s hope....
FWIW, I got a 2019 MDR that already had the updated gas valve/block, and, upon working with the RMA department at DT, was able to confirm that my barrel extension would accommodate the larger extractor (though the larger extractor was not fitted when I took delivery of the rifle). I was able to send in just my bolt, which was returned with the larger extractor installed. To be fair, the turnaround time was longer than originally quoted, but given the fact that I broke my leg right before I sent my bolt in, the extra delay didn't cost me any lost range time (since I wasn't going to the range anyhow on a busted leg).
Looking at some of the cases that ran through the gun on my initial range trip with the smaller extractor installed, I can see that the new extractor is indeed considerably larger than the old one. I haven't had a chance to get to the range with the new extractor installed.
I have my own thread on my MDR experiences, but the long and short of it is that through the 52(?) rounds I have so far fired through the gun, I have had a few FTF and FTE malfunctions, but nothing that required tools to clear. Further, using my hand loads, I was seeing some three shot groups right around 1 MOA. Yeah, yeah, three shot groups... I was working up to five shot groups when I got tired of the muzzle brake that I fitted to the MDR tearing holes in my sand bags, so I wrapped up early. The new plan is to get a blast shield to fit over the (SiCo ASR) brake so I can shoot without destroying anything on the bench.
Looking at some of the cases that ran through the gun on my initial range trip with the smaller extractor installed, I can see that the new extractor is indeed considerably larger than the old one. I haven't had a chance to get to the range with the new extractor installed.
I have my own thread on my MDR experiences, but the long and short of it is that through the 52(?) rounds I have so far fired through the gun, I have had a few FTF and FTE malfunctions, but nothing that required tools to clear. Further, using my hand loads, I was seeing some three shot groups right around 1 MOA. Yeah, yeah, three shot groups... I was working up to five shot groups when I got tired of the muzzle brake that I fitted to the MDR tearing holes in my sand bags, so I wrapped up early. The new plan is to get a blast shield to fit over the (SiCo ASR) brake so I can shoot without destroying anything on the bench.
I'm at a long range shoot this week and we ran one of the guys MDR rifles in 6.5X47 Lapua yesterday and today with a non factory barrel. He had a first round cold bore hit yesterday at 1000 yds and I believe today he managed to get the thing out to 1500 yds. I'll have to check with him tomorrow on that. The barrel is an 18" made from a Douglass blank with a heavier profile behind the gas block to help stiffen it up. He is running it suppressed with a brake mount suppressor and its pretty quiet. I think he got one of the newer gasport plugs but it has the earlier narrow extractor. We were running factory Lapua 139gr Scenar ammo which seems to perform very well. Other than the poor trigger for a target rifle it was well received.
Frank
Frank
I checked with my buddy on the MDR in 6.5X47 and it turns out he only ran it out to 1000. He had multiple hits though and a few others and I managed it too. He did run his Desert Tactical SRS out to 1800 in 6.5X47 though. The high grass and small bullet made it tough to see the hits past that. Still impressive.....
Frank
Frank
You can squeeze good accuracy out of any platform that is free floated with quality barrels. But as a bullpup that isn't really what it is meant to be doing, and will always be at a big disadvantage from the bench vs. other platforms. Still nice for your friend, but reliability needs to come first.
I'm glad some other people are having good experiences with their MDR as well! I've personally loved mine so far. I genuinely do understand the bad experiences and aforementioned bad taste some people have because of the early versions though. I just don't think everyone should be writing it off and telling nobody to ever try one because of those experiences.
I personally got into the SCAR as well as the ACR very early on and both of them had their fair share of problems. The ACR wouldn't run for a 100rds without jamming and I had to send it back to Remington 4 times over the course of a year before it worked properly. That was comparatively a very simple design from a much larger company. It was certainly aggravating, but I understood that I was paying the price of getting into early technology.
DTA/Desert Tech came out of the gates with an amazing rifle with the SRS. It rocked the industry with its accuracy, interchangeable calibers, and compact size for the price. The MDR was extremely ambitious, especially for such a small company. Perhaps a little to ambitious for the timeline they set. At the end of the day though I have no doubt it'll be an amazing. I've owned a RDB, Tavor, and a FS2000. All I can say is the MDRs fit and finish is better than all of them to me. When you hold it, it just feels right in your hands. More so then the rest by a good bit.
I personally got into the SCAR as well as the ACR very early on and both of them had their fair share of problems. The ACR wouldn't run for a 100rds without jamming and I had to send it back to Remington 4 times over the course of a year before it worked properly. That was comparatively a very simple design from a much larger company. It was certainly aggravating, but I understood that I was paying the price of getting into early technology.
DTA/Desert Tech came out of the gates with an amazing rifle with the SRS. It rocked the industry with its accuracy, interchangeable calibers, and compact size for the price. The MDR was extremely ambitious, especially for such a small company. Perhaps a little to ambitious for the timeline they set. At the end of the day though I have no doubt it'll be an amazing. I've owned a RDB, Tavor, and a FS2000. All I can say is the MDRs fit and finish is better than all of them to me. When you hold it, it just feels right in your hands. More so then the rest by a good bit.
I appreciate everyones feedback both positive and negative. We have upgraded all MDR's that we had backlogged in warranty so if you are waiting on yours it is en route back to you. Anyone wanting to upgrade their MDR then our current turnaround is 1 week or less.
is there any way to upgrade the trigger to be about 2lbs?
I'm a long range shooter and I love a super light trigger, if it's more than 3-4lbs I dont know if I can live with that.
I'm having a custom 6mm creed barrel spun up and will be using the best components and tangent theta scope and bipod and such so I'm expecting easily 1/2 moa. my bolt gun makes 5 shot groups in the .0s because I know how to load good ammo.
the only thing that I'm concerned with affecting the mdr accuracy potential that I'm not sure I can fix is the trigger. LOVE the SRS trigger btw.
even if it voids warranty or whatever can I work on the springs or order new springs or pay you guys or anything?
ETA I've not purchased or shot one yet, planning on ordering a 223 mdr and buying a 308 kit and having a custom 6 creed bartlein left hand progressive twist barrel spun up with my reamer.
I couldn't care less about reliability with shit ammo, I doubt this thing will eat anything but lapua brass and berger bullets.
hell of a deer rifle!
No you can’t adjust the trigger.
nvm I just found a company (JARDINC) who sells Sear packs for a 2.5 lb trigger pull weight
FWIW, I was able to get back out to the range awhile back with my MDR with the new extractor installed (it already has the 2019 gas valve). This time out, I was shooting 5 round groups, and while most of them were ~1.5 MOA, my last two groups of the day were shot with a different technique that gave me a slightly sub-MOA group and a best of .630 MOA. While I admit to these being handloads, it's just a load that I pulled out of my ass (read: ZERO effort has been made to this point in regard to matching the load to the gun; these loads were assembled prior to even firing the gun at all).
I had a few FTE issues early on, but the last outing it ran 100%. While I absolutely agree that the trigger could be better (and am excited to see that Jard has a solution), I can say that I'm gaining confidence in the weapon, and look forward to spending more time with it.
I had a few FTE issues early on, but the last outing it ran 100%. While I absolutely agree that the trigger could be better (and am excited to see that Jard has a solution), I can say that I'm gaining confidence in the weapon, and look forward to spending more time with it.
I didnt want to deal with the beta testing a new gun so I purposely waited a while. glad to see the new updates seems to have fixed everything. now, if they would only make that MDR-c handguard!
or of I could get someone to custom make me one lol
You don't want to be a beta tester but you want to have a barrel made for an untested round(for the mdr)?
I'm curious to hear how the 6.5 barrels actually run given how much hell the 308s have had. Ar's are going to much longer than typical gas lengths for a given barrel length with the 6.5s at least. The mdr is kinda stuck with about a midlength piston system and a fairly light reciprocating assembly that requires a lot of velocity to work right. I'll admit I'm not well versed in the nuances of short stroke piston systems vs DI.
I was concerned about a new platform and was unconfident in the short stroke piston design they would come up with.
seems it runs fine with crap ammo, I'm thinking I can squeeze 1/2 moa out of it with my tailored 6 creed loads. I've already got the reamer and blanks and just seems to me to be the perfect small hunting package with a 18-20 inch bartlein and a muffler.
They seem to have the kinks worked out with 223 and 308. Both of those have their own specific gas valves and porting even though the pressure curves are somewhat similar to each other. 6 Creed is quite a bit different.
Yeah, because the odds are good they have the MDR figured out before Desert Tech does....
I built a 6.5X47 for a friend and he has been shooting it quite a bit. Accuracy is excellent but my barrel is 2" longer than factory and heavier. I also put in a much smaller gas port. There are still some issues with overboosting due to the location of the gasport which is too close to the breech. I've built a couple barrels in other cals where I built the gasblock as well and was able to change other things to fix the reliability issues.
As for the 6mm Creedmoor you're going to need to work out some important details to make it work properly. You need to figure out how to stiffen the barrel as well if you intend to get better accuracy. Just swapping out the chambering won't quite cut it. You probably already knew that though.....
Frank
As for the 6mm Creedmoor you're going to need to work out some important details to make it work properly. You need to figure out how to stiffen the barrel as well if you intend to get better accuracy. Just swapping out the chambering won't quite cut it. You probably already knew that though.....
Frank
There is a guy who took a bsf ar10 barrel with a rifle length gas system and fit it to his mdr. Apparently the extension threads are the same. I know he made his own gas block but I'm not sure if he made a longer gas piston, op rod or both to make up the gap for the operating mechanism.
Maybe he does but if you're going for 6 Creed I have a feeling you're still very much in beta test territory. The port is too close for 6.5, even more so for 6cm.
For my tastes it's too short for 223 and 308 even but it should give the flexibility to make sbr configurations work.
