installed? A2 butt stock please also!
- Thread starter razor100
- Start date
STOP!!
Do NOT use KNS pins with any Geissele trigger. (I feel like a broken @#$%ing record as this is at least the 3x time I've posted this in the last month).
First and foremost...the KNS pins are the WRONG size for Geissele triggers (although the smaller KNS pins...0.154"...will fit the Geissele triggers, but can lead to a spongy/soft second stage because they are undersized).
Second, the KNS pins are notoriously SOFT compared to the higher quality Geissele pins provided with the triggers/hammers. As a result, the KNS pins are prone to developing burrs which get pulled up and jam/damage the Geissele triggers. The Geissele pins are chrome-moly steel that is rough turned, rough ground, heat treated and then centerless finish ground...more importantly...THEY FIT the Geissele triggers which are purpose built/designed around Geissele's 0.1550" diameter pins (+/- 0.0001).
Now, you'll find all manner of people running Geissele triggers with KNS 0.154" pins, but it is ill-advised and could ultimately cause you more problems than they'll ever solve..
Do NOT use KNS pins with any Geissele trigger. (I feel like a broken @#$%ing record as this is at least the 3x time I've posted this in the last month).
First and foremost...the KNS pins are the WRONG size for Geissele triggers (although the smaller KNS pins...0.154"...will fit the Geissele triggers, but can lead to a spongy/soft second stage because they are undersized).
Second, the KNS pins are notoriously SOFT compared to the higher quality Geissele pins provided with the triggers/hammers. As a result, the KNS pins are prone to developing burrs which get pulled up and jam/damage the Geissele triggers. The Geissele pins are chrome-moly steel that is rough turned, rough ground, heat treated and then centerless finish ground...more importantly...THEY FIT the Geissele triggers which are purpose built/designed around Geissele's 0.1550" diameter pins (+/- 0.0001).
Now, you'll find all manner of people running Geissele triggers with KNS 0.154" pins, but it is ill-advised and could ultimately cause you more problems than they'll ever solve..
I would think trigger pin holes in the receiver would have more of an effect on the trigger. The K&N pins are held together by the pin retainers which keep them in alignment, they also stop the pins from rotating & causing wear of the receiver pin holes or walking out. They also add nice look & finish to a gun.
When Geissele says very clearly not to use KNS pins with their triggers (which he does), folks should listen. Having just installed a Geissele DMR in an LMT lower (that I removed KNS pins and a factory trigger from to install the DMR), I can definitely say that the Geissele pin fit to trigger and receiver holes is definitely tighter than the KNS.
I will take Mr. Geissele's word for the harder steel and machining tolerances for their pins.
I will take Mr. Geissele's word for the harder steel and machining tolerances for their pins.
which is a myth. In spec pins and holes dont walk. The way the pins are designed they are held in and "shouldnt" walk. There is a spring in the hammer that holds the pin into the hammer. The hammer spring legs hold the trigger pin in place(or should). And "wallowing" out of the pin holes is a myth(or at least WAY overblown internet "truth) too IMO. There are M16's that are 30+ years old with millions of rounds through the lowers that dont have wallowed out holes. I wont say you wont find a lower with wallowed out holes, but if everything is in spec, it is very very rare to have that happen.
Geissele pins fit so tight in the receiver that I cannot imagine them rotating for that matter. Furthermore, most people will never shoot enough rounds to make it happen even if they did. I use geissele and ALG triggers and I use the pins they come with and I have never had one walk on me. They cannot if installed correctly.
Once more the inverse barometer of all things firearms related chimes in with his drunken late night stupidity. Practice pointer...when considering firearms advice, you are best served by doing the exact opposite of what tipper suggests.
Take about five seconds and do and google "kns pins geiselle" and you will find many authoritative statements that confirm that ORD is correct and tipper suffers from a severe case of rectal cranial inversion.
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ok thanks for the heads up about mixing the two- still would like to purchase a complete lower without having to scrap the internals- maybe I should just install a new buttstock and trigger on my MP15?
Could it be that one of these are out of spec's, the two most common pins used are .154 & .171. one thousands or ten thousands even are nothing if your are building a house.
If you want a "new" lower, why not just buy a stripped one, an LPK minus the FCG (plenty of options out there for this), then assemble it yourself using the components you want/need, including stock/grip/etc.?
If you have the knowledge/wherewithal to DIY a buttstock swap and FCG swap on your existing M&P lower, you can certainly assemble a stripped lower with relative ease.
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