Do our Troops have an American version of the enemies RPG ? What is it ? I know that some thing called the AT-4 replaced the LAW . Is that it ? Its a one shot weapon isn't like the LAW ?
- Thread starter Iron Worker
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Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
SMAW-D, Javelin and the Carl Gustav (for the cool guys).
We still have the AT-4's.
Most troops will never get the systems to use.
Another effective weapon is the 40mm grenade launcher which is something that troops will have.
Don't forget our 60mm mortars for the Light Infantry CO's which can be fired in direct lay.
SMAW-D, Javelin and the Carl Gustav (for the cool guys).
We still have the AT-4's.
Most troops will never get the systems to use.
Another effective weapon is the 40mm grenade launcher which is something that troops will have.
Don't forget our 60mm mortars for the Light Infantry CO's which can be fired in direct lay.
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
AT-4s are lame. When we needed more than small arms, call in the air support. Or if the LAVs could maneuver to our location, a 25mm chain gun will end that fight very quickly.
AT-4s are lame. When we needed more than small arms, call in the air support. Or if the LAVs could maneuver to our location, a 25mm chain gun will end that fight very quickly.
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
Having been on the receiving end of RPGs in Sunny Southeast Asia in 69, I always wondered why we didn't have something comparable.
I felt that a gook with a RPG launcher and a few B-40 rockets was like he had a 105 on his back and could bring serious smoke on me and others.
Given the fact that the US has lots of plants that can manufacture good plastic products, I find it hard to believe that we have not produced some kind of RPG for, US, the grunt in the field.
A new and improved version with various kinds of rockets for different applications, kind of like what is a B-40 anti personel round and a RPG-7 for hard targets.
It was a lot better than the LAWs we had and they didn't have to try and destroy the launch tubes from the LAWs like we did. {As if you had time and could do that so the local VC didn't use the expended LAWs for containers for various booby traps.}
I think our revered and loved Lifer leaders looked at the RPG launcher and it's rockets as a Communist design and we, The USofA would not even consider using something like that.
As they sat behind their desks and considered all things, their EGOS and KNOWLEDGE prevented the development of a better system, kind of like the Air Force not having forward bolt assist on their rifles, as the Air Force personel would keep their rifles clean. {I'll bet their rifles were clean when they had to put a bird down in the bush on a forced landing.}
I find it ironic that the USA provided the USSR with thousands of Bazookas to fend off the Nazis in WW-2 with lend-lease as the Russians didn't have much as to knocking out tanks, yet we didn't develope better systems, as they did, and add it to our arsenal.
They turned the Bazooka around and muzzle loaded it with a fast turnaround as to reloading done by one person. Meanwhile, where are we in the US?
Jacking it with our leaders and still getting our asses kicked by the RPG. The Devil's Finger. So simple and yet so effetive. Regards, FM
Having been on the receiving end of RPGs in Sunny Southeast Asia in 69, I always wondered why we didn't have something comparable.
I felt that a gook with a RPG launcher and a few B-40 rockets was like he had a 105 on his back and could bring serious smoke on me and others.
Given the fact that the US has lots of plants that can manufacture good plastic products, I find it hard to believe that we have not produced some kind of RPG for, US, the grunt in the field.
A new and improved version with various kinds of rockets for different applications, kind of like what is a B-40 anti personel round and a RPG-7 for hard targets.
It was a lot better than the LAWs we had and they didn't have to try and destroy the launch tubes from the LAWs like we did. {As if you had time and could do that so the local VC didn't use the expended LAWs for containers for various booby traps.}
I think our revered and loved Lifer leaders looked at the RPG launcher and it's rockets as a Communist design and we, The USofA would not even consider using something like that.
As they sat behind their desks and considered all things, their EGOS and KNOWLEDGE prevented the development of a better system, kind of like the Air Force not having forward bolt assist on their rifles, as the Air Force personel would keep their rifles clean. {I'll bet their rifles were clean when they had to put a bird down in the bush on a forced landing.}
I find it ironic that the USA provided the USSR with thousands of Bazookas to fend off the Nazis in WW-2 with lend-lease as the Russians didn't have much as to knocking out tanks, yet we didn't develope better systems, as they did, and add it to our arsenal.
They turned the Bazooka around and muzzle loaded it with a fast turnaround as to reloading done by one person. Meanwhile, where are we in the US?
Jacking it with our leaders and still getting our asses kicked by the RPG. The Devil's Finger. So simple and yet so effetive. Regards, FM
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
I think that any kid that launched bottle rockets out of a copper tube, piece of pipe, or hollow tent pole realizes the potential of the system.
Yeah, It is Rocket science, just theirs and ours.
I saw a Cub Scout build a launcher with a piece of PVC pipe that was directional, point it where you want it to go.
He used small Estes rocket motors and could tell me where they were going and when the parachute would deploy.
He told me,"I want to get my model rocket back and shoot it again, they cost too much to build to loose them." Cub Scouts understand, why can't others? Regards, FM
I think that any kid that launched bottle rockets out of a copper tube, piece of pipe, or hollow tent pole realizes the potential of the system.
Yeah, It is Rocket science, just theirs and ours.
I saw a Cub Scout build a launcher with a piece of PVC pipe that was directional, point it where you want it to go.
He used small Estes rocket motors and could tell me where they were going and when the parachute would deploy.
He told me,"I want to get my model rocket back and shoot it again, they cost too much to build to loose them." Cub Scouts understand, why can't others? Regards, FM
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
Kids I will be honest I always felt pretty damn tickled with the LAW. More so with the M202. Nothing like crispy critters..
Kids I will be honest I always felt pretty damn tickled with the LAW. More so with the M202. Nothing like crispy critters..
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
I thought the LAW was the loudest weapon I ever fired.
I remember the cadre explaining that there was no recoil
and it was going to be nothing shooting one.
The first round I launched <KABOOM> I thought I was going to be deaf forever and I was wearing damn earplugs. Can't imagine shooting one w/o hearing protection.
I am content these days with my shoulder-fired potato-gun bazooka.
Seems like we could field something similar if we wanted to.
I guess the 40mm grenade launcher is it. MGL-140?
I thought the LAW was the loudest weapon I ever fired.
I remember the cadre explaining that there was no recoil
and it was going to be nothing shooting one.
The first round I launched <KABOOM> I thought I was going to be deaf forever and I was wearing damn earplugs. Can't imagine shooting one w/o hearing protection.
I am content these days with my shoulder-fired potato-gun bazooka.
Seems like we could field something similar if we wanted to.
I guess the 40mm grenade launcher is it. MGL-140?
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
I will not argue that the LAW is not a great weapon, it is, try to reload it for the second shot, damn, no can do, grab another one. [By the way, Division wants all tubes destroyed so they can't be used for booby traps against us.] Meanwhile, Chuck has already sent another B-40 down on US and has reloaded another, ready to go as we scramble around getting the next LAW up for a go at them.
I don't know what the M-202 is but it sounds neat. Is it as light and easy to carry as the RPG launcher and 6 rounds for it?
Our Chunker, Blooper gun, M-79 Grenade launcher was a good thing too but limited as to effect. Had to get close to target.
I feel that a light weight man carried rocket launcher with various warheads is some thing our troops should have and don't.
As I posted before, I believe that we have the manufacturing technology and good plastics to build something really great to help the troops.
Don't put a little pop on them with a 40mm, give them something to think about with a RPG made in the USA with all of our knowledge and technolegy that sends them up to the 40 Virgins and let them know there is another on the way if the first one wasn't enough.
Also, as I posted before, I think we have Leadership problems that prevent that coming to be. Officer types that have never had a hot round come by their heads and never have been out where it really counts. While in VN our closest thing to a RPG was a 90mm recoiless rifle. Have you ever humped one of those heavy MFers? Not good. Hump the gun and hope someone else that has the rounds is close when you need it. Knocks the shit out of bunkers, but heavy, as is it's ammo.
They have it over us as far as RPGs go and have had it over us for many years. Time to change something. Regards, FM
I will not argue that the LAW is not a great weapon, it is, try to reload it for the second shot, damn, no can do, grab another one. [By the way, Division wants all tubes destroyed so they can't be used for booby traps against us.] Meanwhile, Chuck has already sent another B-40 down on US and has reloaded another, ready to go as we scramble around getting the next LAW up for a go at them.
I don't know what the M-202 is but it sounds neat. Is it as light and easy to carry as the RPG launcher and 6 rounds for it?
Our Chunker, Blooper gun, M-79 Grenade launcher was a good thing too but limited as to effect. Had to get close to target.
I feel that a light weight man carried rocket launcher with various warheads is some thing our troops should have and don't.
As I posted before, I believe that we have the manufacturing technology and good plastics to build something really great to help the troops.
Don't put a little pop on them with a 40mm, give them something to think about with a RPG made in the USA with all of our knowledge and technolegy that sends them up to the 40 Virgins and let them know there is another on the way if the first one wasn't enough.
Also, as I posted before, I think we have Leadership problems that prevent that coming to be. Officer types that have never had a hot round come by their heads and never have been out where it really counts. While in VN our closest thing to a RPG was a 90mm recoiless rifle. Have you ever humped one of those heavy MFers? Not good. Hump the gun and hope someone else that has the rounds is close when you need it. Knocks the shit out of bunkers, but heavy, as is it's ammo.
They have it over us as far as RPGs go and have had it over us for many years. Time to change something. Regards, FM
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
Well we have FOs/JTACs/TACPs/FACs that can deliver a multitude of things ie. 60s/81s/120s/155(Ecal)/HIMARS/AH-1s/F-18/AC-130s
Well we have FOs/JTACs/TACPs/FACs that can deliver a multitude of things ie. 60s/81s/120s/155(Ecal)/HIMARS/AH-1s/F-18/AC-130s
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
The real question is how many of you guys over in A-stan have captured RPG's and re-used them.
That legal?
The real question is how many of you guys over in A-stan have captured RPG's and re-used them.
That legal?
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
You dont want to capture/re-use the RPGs. They have been know to boobytrap the launchers so it vents hot gas towards your head by drilling a hole in the launch tube right by where your head sits.
And I wouldnt say the PG-7s are the most reliable. We have seen them launched at our trucks, sail over the hood and skip across the dirt. Also not saying the PG-7s arent deadly but you are talking about roughly 13oz of RDX in the warhead. It is designed to penetrate armor not demolish a truck. DOnt get me wrong I am not saying I pray for one to hit my truck but it wont descimate it in the event of.
You dont want to capture/re-use the RPGs. They have been know to boobytrap the launchers so it vents hot gas towards your head by drilling a hole in the launch tube right by where your head sits.
And I wouldnt say the PG-7s are the most reliable. We have seen them launched at our trucks, sail over the hood and skip across the dirt. Also not saying the PG-7s arent deadly but you are talking about roughly 13oz of RDX in the warhead. It is designed to penetrate armor not demolish a truck. DOnt get me wrong I am not saying I pray for one to hit my truck but it wont descimate it in the event of.
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
superior tactics superior soldiers.......
superior tactics superior soldiers.......
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Foul Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will not argue that the LAW is not a great weapon, it is, try to reload it for the second shot, damn, no can do, grab another one. [By the way, Division wants all tubes destroyed so they can't be used for booby traps against us.] Meanwhile, Chuck has already sent another B-40 down on US and has reloaded another, ready to go as we scramble around getting the next LAW up for a go at them.
I don't know what the M-202 is but it sounds neat. Is it as light and easy to carry as the RPG launcher and 6 rounds for it?
Our Chunker, Blooper gun, M-79 Grenade launcher was a good thing too but limited as to effect. Had to get close to target.
I feel that a light weight man carried rocket launcher with various warheads is some thing our troops should have and don't.
As I posted before, I believe that we have the manufacturing technology and good plastics to build something really great to help the troops.
Don't put a little pop on them with a 40mm, give them something to think about with a RPG made in the USA with all of our knowledge and technolegy that sends them up to the 40 Virgins and let them know there is another on the way if the first one wasn't enough.
Also, as I posted before, I think we have Leadership problems that prevent that coming to be. Officer types that have never had a hot round come by their heads and never have been out where it really counts. While in VN our closest thing to a RPG was a 90mm recoiless rifle. Have you ever humped one of those heavy MFers? Not good. Hump the gun and hope someone else that has the rounds is close when you need it. Knocks the shit out of bunkers, but heavy, as is it's ammo.
They have it over us as far as RPGs go and have had it over us for many years. Time to change something. Regards, FM
</div></div>
Sir no offense intended , but your post leads me to believe you are a young un. The M202 FLASH was the most fun one man could have with a shoulder fired weapon. It was the one thing I honestly never got enough of!! Just an FYI it was a 4 shot rocket launcher that fired incendiary rockets. It was supposed to be used against hard targets such as bunkers, pill boxes, and fortifications, and what not. It will shit fire in a grand manner and it was reloadable IIRC. As you may or may not have guessed it was designed to replace the flame thrower. It was somewhat dangerous to use, but believe me when I tell you it was heap of fun setting shit on fire and I mean really hot fire that did not burn out any time soon. I love Willie Pete
It warms the heart in a comforting manner.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Foul Mike</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I will not argue that the LAW is not a great weapon, it is, try to reload it for the second shot, damn, no can do, grab another one. [By the way, Division wants all tubes destroyed so they can't be used for booby traps against us.] Meanwhile, Chuck has already sent another B-40 down on US and has reloaded another, ready to go as we scramble around getting the next LAW up for a go at them.
I don't know what the M-202 is but it sounds neat. Is it as light and easy to carry as the RPG launcher and 6 rounds for it?
Our Chunker, Blooper gun, M-79 Grenade launcher was a good thing too but limited as to effect. Had to get close to target.
I feel that a light weight man carried rocket launcher with various warheads is some thing our troops should have and don't.
As I posted before, I believe that we have the manufacturing technology and good plastics to build something really great to help the troops.
Don't put a little pop on them with a 40mm, give them something to think about with a RPG made in the USA with all of our knowledge and technolegy that sends them up to the 40 Virgins and let them know there is another on the way if the first one wasn't enough.
Also, as I posted before, I think we have Leadership problems that prevent that coming to be. Officer types that have never had a hot round come by their heads and never have been out where it really counts. While in VN our closest thing to a RPG was a 90mm recoiless rifle. Have you ever humped one of those heavy MFers? Not good. Hump the gun and hope someone else that has the rounds is close when you need it. Knocks the shit out of bunkers, but heavy, as is it's ammo.
They have it over us as far as RPGs go and have had it over us for many years. Time to change something. Regards, FM
</div></div>
Sir no offense intended , but your post leads me to believe you are a young un. The M202 FLASH was the most fun one man could have with a shoulder fired weapon. It was the one thing I honestly never got enough of!! Just an FYI it was a 4 shot rocket launcher that fired incendiary rockets. It was supposed to be used against hard targets such as bunkers, pill boxes, and fortifications, and what not. It will shit fire in a grand manner and it was reloadable IIRC. As you may or may not have guessed it was designed to replace the flame thrower. It was somewhat dangerous to use, but believe me when I tell you it was heap of fun setting shit on fire and I mean really hot fire that did not burn out any time soon. I love Willie Pete
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I thought the LAW was the loudest weapon I ever fired.
I remember the cadre explaining that there was no recoil
and it was going to be nothing shooting one.
The first round I launched <KABOOM> I thought I was going to be deaf forever and I was wearing damn earplugs. Can't imagine shooting one w/o hearing protection.
I am content these days with my shoulder-fired potato-gun bazooka.
Seems like we could field something similar if we wanted to.
I guess the 40mm grenade launcher is it. MGL-140?
</div></div>
We have something equivalnet or at least the cool guys do.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EmergencyNrse</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I thought the LAW was the loudest weapon I ever fired.
I remember the cadre explaining that there was no recoil
and it was going to be nothing shooting one.
The first round I launched <KABOOM> I thought I was going to be deaf forever and I was wearing damn earplugs. Can't imagine shooting one w/o hearing protection.
I am content these days with my shoulder-fired potato-gun bazooka.
Seems like we could field something similar if we wanted to.
I guess the 40mm grenade launcher is it. MGL-140?
</div></div>
We have something equivalnet or at least the cool guys do.
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
Sharpshooter, What do you mean with Sir, no offense intended but you believe me to be a Young un?
Let's start with Sir.
My parents were married for several years before I showed up in 1948. Therefore I am not a bastard.
I am not a homosexual.
I do not think of myself as better than anyone else.
I try to treat everyone as an equal and not superior to anyone else unless they show me different.
I was drafted and did my time.
When you think back at what drill SGTs said about "Don't call me Sir, I work for a living," That is me.
Therefore I do take offense at being called Sir.
I don't know what you think someone is as far as a "Young un".
I was one of the first 25 on this site, and proud of it. I think I was 23 or 24, therefore not a Young un on this site.
I am 62 yrs. old, does that qualify me as a Young un?
Do you refer to my time in RVN in 69 as I am a Youn un and you were there before me?
I have a feeling that I have been around since before you were a twinkle in your father's eye and a trickle down your mother's leg.
That aside, our troops deserve a readily available RPG with whatever warheads that we can make to make them more effective and better able to defend themselves.
I believe the Sirs of this country have not provided what is sorely needed.
Don't call me Sir again!!
Call me asshole or stupid or anything else, but do NOT call me Sir. Regards, FM
Sharpshooter, What do you mean with Sir, no offense intended but you believe me to be a Young un?
Let's start with Sir.
My parents were married for several years before I showed up in 1948. Therefore I am not a bastard.
I am not a homosexual.
I do not think of myself as better than anyone else.
I try to treat everyone as an equal and not superior to anyone else unless they show me different.
I was drafted and did my time.
When you think back at what drill SGTs said about "Don't call me Sir, I work for a living," That is me.
Therefore I do take offense at being called Sir.
I don't know what you think someone is as far as a "Young un".
I was one of the first 25 on this site, and proud of it. I think I was 23 or 24, therefore not a Young un on this site.
I am 62 yrs. old, does that qualify me as a Young un?
Do you refer to my time in RVN in 69 as I am a Youn un and you were there before me?
I have a feeling that I have been around since before you were a twinkle in your father's eye and a trickle down your mother's leg.
That aside, our troops deserve a readily available RPG with whatever warheads that we can make to make them more effective and better able to defend themselves.
I believe the Sirs of this country have not provided what is sorely needed.
Don't call me Sir again!!
Call me asshole or stupid or anything else, but do NOT call me Sir. Regards, FM
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
How is that for a vent as to not being an officer? I think I went overboard.Regards FM
How is that for a vent as to not being an officer? I think I went overboard.Regards FM
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
Wow, talk about off subject.
To answer the original question is No we do not have anything comparable to the RPG in our inventory.
We have a few things somewhat like it but nothing with that range, power, portability that is so easily reloadable.
40mm is great but not nearly the power. AT4 is nice but not reloadable.
Why we don't more or less copy that weapon for our own purposes I have no clue. Any rifleman can carry six rockets fairly handily while someone else has the launcher across his back. boom boom bitches.
Wow, talk about off subject.
To answer the original question is No we do not have anything comparable to the RPG in our inventory.
We have a few things somewhat like it but nothing with that range, power, portability that is so easily reloadable.
40mm is great but not nearly the power. AT4 is nice but not reloadable.
Why we don't more or less copy that weapon for our own purposes I have no clue. Any rifleman can carry six rockets fairly handily while someone else has the launcher across his back. boom boom bitches.
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
LAW, RPGs etc. are surely very effective (i think javelin has direct attack mode if so selected however it's very expensive...) atleast here in our little conflict ('91 against JNA) rpgs (Armbrust - German, no backjet and safe to fire in confined spaces) proved very useful and dangerous (urban conflict) to armor...
I think those warheads are not very dangerous to personnel as their blast radius is small and directed however as your forces are mostly inside vehicles and in guerrilla warfare (ambushes) those sure provide some degree of "mobile artillery" for "primitive" forces.
PS: I was present when shooting M80 and M79 (JNA weapons clones of LAW) the latter should be also encountered in Iraq (a lot of them were sold to Iraq army in the eighties) and as previously said nothing comes even close to the loudness of it, some kind of annoying high pitched sound really hurts ears...
LAW, RPGs etc. are surely very effective (i think javelin has direct attack mode if so selected however it's very expensive...) atleast here in our little conflict ('91 against JNA) rpgs (Armbrust - German, no backjet and safe to fire in confined spaces) proved very useful and dangerous (urban conflict) to armor...
I think those warheads are not very dangerous to personnel as their blast radius is small and directed however as your forces are mostly inside vehicles and in guerrilla warfare (ambushes) those sure provide some degree of "mobile artillery" for "primitive" forces.
PS: I was present when shooting M80 and M79 (JNA weapons clones of LAW) the latter should be also encountered in Iraq (a lot of them were sold to Iraq army in the eighties) and as previously said nothing comes even close to the loudness of it, some kind of annoying high pitched sound really hurts ears...
Re: Enemy has RPGs what comparable weapon do we ?
When I trained in the mid-'60's, we were still provided with rifle grenades. There was an adapter that allowed standard grenades to be rifle-launched. I suspect that if a GREM-style muzzle interface and bullet trap were employed, it could be incorporated into a similar adapter.
Greg
When I trained in the mid-'60's, we were still provided with rifle grenades. There was an adapter that allowed standard grenades to be rifle-launched. I suspect that if a GREM-style muzzle interface and bullet trap were employed, it could be incorporated into a similar adapter.
Greg
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