Rifle Scopes Explain FFP to the Dumb

JC Steel

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OK, what is up with all the talk with First Focal Plane? I have saved up some money and am now ready to buy a scope but dont know what to get. Why is everyone getting FFP? I want to use my rangefinder for most of my shooting so does this play into it? Thanks for the advice. -Jake
 

Ratbert

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

With a first focal plane scope the size of the stadia lines (eg MilDots) relative to the size of the target stays constant. As you change magnification to make the target appear larger, the reticle also changes size to appear larger. Because of this you may use the ranging and hold-over features of your reticle at any magnficiation.

In a second focal plane scope the stadia lines in the reticle are fixed at a single size. As you change the size of the target by zooming in/out the reticle does not change size. Consequently the ranging and hold-over features of the reticle are only accurate at 1 magnification setting. At all other magnification settings (in practical terms) the only useful part of the reticle is the center crosshairs.

People like FFP scopes because (as only 1 example) you can use the stadia lines to accurately adjust your shot left or right for windage without having to constantly adjust the windage turret. With an SFP scope you could only do this at the "correct" magnification setting.

 

Graham

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

FFP: When the reticle changes, everything stays the same.
SFP: When the reticle stays the same, everything changes.
 

JC Steel

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

Either case the point of impact never changes with magnification up or down right???
 

Rafael

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

The only time it would change is if you are using holdovers or lead-holds. If you always hold center and dial....yeah it's broken.
laugh.gif
 

LibertyOptics

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jcvibby</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to use my rangefinder for most of my shooting so does this play into it? </div></div>

I think this does play into it. IMHO, you do NOT need an FFP scope unless you just really want one. The utility of the FFP is accurate reticle ranging capabilities at all magnifications. Use of an LRF tells me such is not necessary for your appilcation. You will be just fine with an SFP scope.

Scott
 

Switchblade

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LibertyOptics</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jcvibby</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to use my rangefinder for most of my shooting so does this play into it? </div></div>

I think this does play into it. IMHO, you do NOT need an FFP scope unless you just really want one.
Scott </div></div>

I have to disagree on need/ffp. For working with and excercising your shooting skills at range the ffp is the way to go as the magnification setting is not an issue with the ranging. It is a lot more versatile on a multi range lane so you are not fixed to 10x on a variable scope that magnifies to say 17x. It's nice to magnify from x - higher x and not have the reticle lose it's applicability
 

Smokin

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

Its not just ranging, its useful for holds as well. If you are shooting accross a wide area at varying distances under time pressure with wind, you can dial back your magnification to more quickly acquire your targets and still have your reticle accurate for hold over shooting.
 

LibertyOptics

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

Guys,

No argument from me. The OP stated he intends to use a LRF for "most" of his shooting, this obviates the need for FFP. You are correct for the FFP for holding over, windage, and training. My assumption is that on lower powers he will be within MPBR and if beyond that he will be cranking up to max or synchro mag power anyway.

FFP has it's benefits, but as a dealer I get guys who hop on board the bandwagon and then can't stand the changing reticle, or it's use on low power. My gut feeling was I made the right call on the advice.
 

JC Steel

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

I think I will be two LRF and a SFP scope instead of a FFP scope. I am think about nightforce or USO in the 22 high power range. Any suggestions before I hit the search function??? Thanks for the info on FFP. I now understand and can see my applications require only a SFP scope.
 

coulthard_west

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

Usoptics are a better bang for your buck in my opinion. 100% made in America. Night force uses Japanese parts. I've heard they can't take the abuse a USO can.
 

Arch

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">FFP: When the reticle changes, everything stays the same.
SFP: When the reticle stays the same, everything changes. </div></div>

Except the appearance....
 

palma

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

A misconception noted in several posts above...you absolutely can range using a SFP scope at any magnification. You have to change the values, but it can be done, easily if you do the math on paper before you hit the field. Ranging at 11x with a 5.5-22NF scope is an easy example.
 

dmg308

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: s.i.t.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Now what happens when lrf conks out. Hell need the ffp then </div></div>

Not if he cant use it
grin.gif
 

dmg308

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: palma</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A misconception noted in several posts above...you absolutely can range using a SFP scope at any magnification. You have to change the values, but it can be done, easily if you do the math on paper before you hit the field. Ranging at 11x with a 5.5-22NF scope is an easy example. </div></div>

This has proven to be very difficult in multiple target,leads and holdover situations.Plus you have to find out and mark the scope at the true values because it's rarely matching the factory marks.As you said it is possible it just interjects alot more variables and problems to the equation.Where I feel its not that important is on a lower mag scope like the 3.-10 Leupolds.For things inside on the low setting it probably does'nt matter for anything else the scope will probably be on 10x anyway.
 

MAX100

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Re: Explain FFP to the Dumb

It can be hard to see the reticle with a FFP scope on low power because it gets very small and sometimes lost on a darker target.

This is an example of what a FFP Falcon scope reticle looks like on low 4x power. It is small and hard to see.

4menace-ret1.jpg



This what it looks like on 14x. It would be very large on a 25x scope and could be a problem with very accurate hits.

4menace-ret2.jpg



I prefer SFP scopes for my use.

GC





 

lowlight

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    Here are some SH Videos on the subject

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    Wyfox

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    Great example of "We all start somewhere" and with lots and lots of practice and dedication you can make it to the top like Jake has!