Help me buy a lower

[Franko]

With all the current goings on I have decided to buy an AR15 lower. I want it for the following reasons:

1. I want to buy it before the election. That way I have something just in case the Dems win big and we get a US wide ban on "assault rifles"
2. I live in California and intend to buy a Kali Key to turn it into a straight pull single shot (probably 9mm and 5.56) so I can use it as a range toy
3. In the event things go completely off the rails I can take off the key and have a fully featured rifle

I expect to only own one and I have enough money to do it right. I am currently looking for lowers made by:

1. LMT (MARS-L)
2. Knights Armament

What other manufacturers make something you would trust your life with? Also for bonus points, what magazines should I be looking at?

Thanks again.

 

[aslrookie]

Lower is a lower as long as everything is properly alligned. Even knights rep says that.

 

[hink001]

Yes... I used to be a Daniel Defense fanboy and had a couple other 'mid-tier' rifles... I sold them and purchased a couple psa lowers and a DD Upper... there is no rattle whatsoever... and w/ the money I saved I installed a mbt-2s larue trigger, some fancy stocks and still have money left over... If you're staying in Cali you're going to need money for lube... for yourself. internally. Otherwise you're buying for looks.

 

[Jigstick]

Seekins. Radian. BAD. SanTan. LMT. Radians are the cats ass

 

[charnicus]

With all the current goings on I have decided to buy an AR15 lower. I want it for the following reasons:

1. I want to buy it before the election. That way I have something just in case the Dems win big and we get a US wide ban on "assault rifles"
2. I live in California and intend to buy a Kali Key to turn it into a straight pull single shot (probably 9mm and 5.56) so I can use it as a range toy
3. In the event things go completely off the rails I can take off the key and have a fully featured rifle

I expect to only own one and I have enough money to do it right. I am currently looking for lowers made by:

1. LMT (MARS-L)
2. Knights Armament

What other manufacturers make something you would trust your life with? Also for bonus points, what magazines should I be looking at?

Thanks again.

So the only Knights lower you can get in California is an SR30. SR25 and 15 are on the no can has list. Google banned roll marks California and add CalGuns you should be able to find the list.

If you’re only going to buy one buy two or three. We are lucky enough to own them here now or for now. There’s enough shit on the market to make your lower(s) just as ambi. Depending on the FFL buying a factory ambi may cause issues. I’d have the discussion with the FFL before buying if you won’t consider anything else. I would use the guy who runs a business from home. Like Accurate Arms in Livermore. (Don’t know what part you’re from.)

If you’re looking to buy now your options on much of anything is going to be slim.

You would do very right with a Noveske Gen1 lower (forged). Aeros don’t suck nor do the Rainier arms forged offerings. Rebranded Mega.

Magazines Okay Ind or Pmags

 

[acudaowner]

get a bunch of lowers now even those 80 %'s is not a bad deal as long as its legal in your area. cheaper less hassle no permissions needed .
then you can decide what parts you want to use .

 

[soap11x]

I have owned several Aero lowers and am very happy with them. They are cheap and good. Period. I don't see any huge advantages other lowers give you (with very few exceptions). If you want to spend more money because you want some extra bells and whistles, try to get your hands on an ambi LWRC. Whatever you do though, try to get one that is machined and not forged. Although they are only marginally different, the general consensus is that forged lowers are inferior.

 

[alamo5000]

I have three various rifles all made with Cross Machine Tool uppers and lowers. The ambi feature is honestly very useful, especially once you train on it.

On a function level there are a ton of options (however now buying is nuts). It really depends on 'how nice' you want it to be and which features you really desire.

 

[alamo5000]

I have owned several Aero lowers and am very happy with them. They are cheap and good. Period. I don't see any huge advantages other lowers give you (with very few exceptions). If you want to spend more money because you want some extra bells and whistles, try to get your hands on an ambi LWRC. Whatever you do though, try to get one that is machined and not forged. Although they are only marginally different, the general consensus is that forged lowers are inferior.

If I were going to build a very functional rifle that looks great but might not be 'as flash' as some of the other pimped out options (and is substantially less expensive)... I would go with Aero all day long. I've long been considering building an Aero truck gun. Absolutely.

 

[soap11x]

If I were going to build a very functional rifle that looks great but might not be 'as flash' as some of the other pimped out options (and is substantially less expensive)... I would go with Aero all day long. I've long been considering building an Aero truck gun. Absolutely.

While they are not "flashy", they are better than 90% of the receivers on which most ar's are built. I've seen hundreds of $1200+ dollar guns move over the counter with shitty and messy receivers where the manufacturer did not even properly sand away the casting line on the mag well. Aero is often looked over because it is cheap but it should not be... they make excellent receivers!

 

[Franko]

Thank you all for the input, I really appreciate the help. I will contact my local FFL and work with him to buy a lower that doesn't get me into trouble.

 

[houndog]

Just bought a blemished lower from Aeroprecision for $71. Should arrive at my FFL in the next couple of days. I've built up a number of lowers using blemished Aeroprecision/Spikes Tactical receivers. No problems with functionality, and in most cases you wouldn't know it was blemished if I didn't tell you. Can't speak to whether they're legal in Cali.

 

[TheOE800]

There’s only five forges, bro.

 

[Jsp556]

There’s only five forges, bro.

But there’s machining after forging... Yes, it does make a difference.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

Do yourself a favor and buy a good quality matched upper/ lower set. Save yourself headaches later.

Cheers, Sirhr

 

[Franko]

Do yourself a favor and buy a good quality matched upper/ lower set. Save yourself headaches later.

Cheers, Sirhr

So is my best bet to get a well matched upper and lower to buy from the same manufacturer? For example, go with a LMT lower and an LMT upper as well, and if I go with an Aero lower then go with a Aero upper as well?

Thanks for the help.

 

[houndog]

Curious what others have experienced. However, I have a Aeroprecision stripped lower on a LaRue upper and a PWS upper. No issues with either. Also have a Spike's Tactical stripped lower on LaRue and BCM uppers. Again zero issues.

 

[TheOE800]

But there’s machining after forging... Yes, it does make a difference.

Yeah it was a troll post. I have mentioned final machining in my posts here before as well.

 

[alamo5000]

Curious what others have experienced. However, I have a Aeroprecision stripped lower on a LaRue upper and a PWS upper. No issues with either. Also have a Spike's Tactical stripped lower on LaRue and BCM uppers. Again zero issues.

It's going to dependon a number of things. In a best case scenario you can have lines that don't mate up or match up very well. In times past an AR was cosmetically pretty much the same, but now with CNC machines the sky is the limit for what can be done.

In some cases, probably most, it will be annoying yet ultimately cosmetic if you mix brands of uppers with other lowers etc. Probably won't have a lot of function issues but it can look like crap in many instances.

In a worst case scenario the company can't hold to mil spec so if you try to mate up a spec upper with an out of spec lower you can run into issues. I've personally seen where the owner of a gun all the sudden couldn't swap uppers without using a small hammer and a punch.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

An aero matched set is fine.. also look at juggernaut tactical. They're in So Cal. I have a few. I typically buy matched sets to guarantee fit and function.

 

[sirhrmechanic]

So is my best bet to get a well matched upper and lower to buy from the same manufacturer? For example, go with a LMT lower and an LMT upper as well, and if I go with an Aero lower then go with a Aero upper as well?

Thanks for the help.

If you are only getting one good AR to build for yourself... spend on a good matches set (bought together) from a quality company like Aero, LMT or LWRC. You can buy sets easily.

The off the shelf stuff generally fits, well, adequately. As long as pin sizes are right and things line up. It does in 99 percent of cases.

But if you are building that “one great at and are going in stages, stash the best upper lower set you can get. It will never be worth less. And assembly is a breeze.

Sirhr

 

[CrabsandFootball]

An aero matched set is fine.. also look at juggernaut tactical. They're in So Cal. I have a few. I typically buy matched sets to guarantee fit and function.

Aero has been putting out hot garbage for years. You can't trust anything they will put out will be correct.

KAC Ambi
KAC Regular
LMT MARS
LMT Regular
SAN Tan Ambi
BCM
COLT
Sabre Defense (way back in day)
Old MEGA sets (ZEV is trash)

Just because a lower can hold all the parts it needs to, doesn't mean it is machined correctly and will perform correctly in perpetuity.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

Aero has been putting out hot garbage for years. You can't trust anything they will put out will be correct.

KAC Ambi
KAC Regular
LMT MARS
LMT Regular
SAN Tan Ambi
BCM
COLT
Sabre Defense (way back in day)
Old MEGA sets (ZEV is trash)

Just because a lower can hold all the parts it needs to, doesn't mean it is machined correctly and will perform correctly in perpetuity.

To each his own. I never had a problem with one and a lot of guys can say the same. Of course I'm not putting it through extreme torture conditions either so there's that.

 

[Franko]

Aero has been putting out hot garbage for years. You can't trust anything they will put out will be correct.

KAC Ambi
KAC Regular
LMT MARS
LMT Regular
SAN Tan Ambi
BCM
COLT
Sabre Defense (way back in day)
Old MEGA sets (ZEV is trash)

Just because a lower can hold all the parts it needs to, doesn't mean it is machined correctly and will perform correctly in perpetuity.

How do you feel about Radian lowers? Also, should I be looking for a SanTan "lite" lower (STT-15L) or their standard one (STT-15)?

Thanks again.

 

[ormandj]

Don't count out ADM lowers, every bit as nice as Radian, and I like the ambidextrous system better if you're ok with a few proprietary parts. Just don't buy up all the supply, please.

 

[XLR308]

Another vote for an AERO set.
The fit and finish on them is very good for the price, the lower is set up with a tension screw if a little wiggle between them gives you heartburn but the fit has very little play as is.
The only exception atleast for me is if you plan on hanging a long heavy barrel on the upper I would suggest something like a VLTOR MUR1A or similar that are beefed up in key areas.

 

[Rlandry]

I've built four ARs, two of them using $42 Anderson stripped lowers and zero issues. They don't have flared magwells and cutesy engraving on the side, but all of the parts kits I used fit and the guns work.
There are only four or five manufacturers who make lowers for all of the builders. If you want to fork out good coin for bling, that's your choice but you don't have to in order to get a good product.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Except when its not. I have seen my fair share of dicked from the factory Aero receivers as well as some of the builders who run in the same circles.

They not what they used to be and were never that great to begin with.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

I've built four ARs, two of them using $42 Anderson stripped lowers and zero issues. They don't have flared magwells and cutesy engraving on the side, but all of the parts kits I used fit and the guns work.
There are only four or five manufacturers who make lowers for all of the builders. If you want to fork out good coin for bling, that's your choice but you don't have to in order to get a good product.

Bullshit.

Zero issues is not a qualifier. I could build 10 PSA and Del ton Parts guns, never shoot them and say I have no issues. The market disagrees.

There are WAY more than four or five manufactures. There are over 5 in my state alone who machine their own receivers. You may be confused with Forgings, which you would be correct but that has nothing to do with now a receiver is machined. Machining and QA/QC is what seperates the top reciever manufactures (and many farm this out to machine shops) from anyone who can get a loan for a Tormach or Haas

Some of you people need to post way less and read way more.

 

[XLR308]

Except when its not. I have seen my fair share of dicked from the factory Aero receivers as well as some of the builders who run in the same circles.

They not what they used to be and were never that great to begin with.

Everyone has QC issues from time to time, wether it be machining tolerances, heat treating and metallurgical deficiencies you name it.
I try personally not to paint companies with a broad stroke.
I have seen $600 billet receiver set marketed as match sets that had more play in them than abused and used military issue AR's, does that really matter to some it does to some it doesnt.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Everyone has QC issues from time to time, wether it be machining tolerances, heat treating and metallurgical deficiencies you name it.
I try personally not to paint companies with a broad stroke.
I have seen $600 billet receiver set marketed as match sets that had more play in them than abused and used military issue AR's, does that really matter to some it does to some it doesnt.

Again, Bullshit.

Don't whitewash lack of QA/QC. If being done properly, stuff will not get out. Heat treatment and bad batches of material I will give you, not much you can do about that, even with top notch outfits. Do you think KAC or BCM have the same percentage of shit gear getting out on the street as PSA and Aero? ROFL

Cost is irreverent to this issue. Good machining and QA/QC costs money, but just because your paying top dollar doesn't mean its happening.

There are known quanities in this indutry and its foolish to deviate from them.

 

[XLR308]

Again, Bullshit.

Don't whitewash lack of QA/QC. If being done properly, stuff will not get out. Heat treatment and bad batches of material I will give you, not much you can do about that, even with top notch outfits. Do you think KAC or BCM have the same percentage of shit gear getting out on the street as PSA and Aero? ROFL

Cost is irreverent to this issue. Good machining and QA/QC costs money, but just because your paying top dollar doesn't mean its happening.

There are known quanities in this indutry and its foolish to deviate from them.

That's some whitewash double talk bullshit right there.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Mega machine shop.

 

[S197]

With all the current goings on I have decided to buy an AR15 lower. I want it for the following reasons:

1. I want to buy it before the election. That way I have something just in case the Dems win big and we get a US wide ban on "assault rifles"
2. I live in California and intend to buy a Kali Key to turn it into a straight pull single shot (probably 9mm and 5.56) so I can use it as a range toy
3. In the event things go completely off the rails I can take off the key and have a fully featured rifle

I expect to only own one and I have enough money to do it right. I am currently looking for lowers made by:

1. LMT (MARS-L)
2. Knights Armament

What other manufacturers make something you would trust your life with? Also for bonus points, what magazines should I be looking at?

Thanks again.

I have not seen many kac lowers lately but primary arms seems to get lmt mars lowers often.

 

[S197]

Mega machine shop.

mega used to be a great shop, near the end and before they sold out their quality dropped.

 

[Powder_Burns]

That’s a bummer. I have some of their early ‘gator’ lowers and they are great.

 

[Jsp556]

The non-Ambi KAC lowers were discontinued. Even KAC fucks up. Imagine a KAC lower that will not accept a KAC trigger guard. Lol, I have one of the first run that was released and I didn’t send it back when they offered to exchange all of them.

 

[XLR308]

The non-Ambi KAC lowers were discontinued. Even KAC fucks up. Imagine a KAC lower that will not accept a KAC trigger guard. Lol, I have one of the first run that was released and I didn’t send it back when they offered to exchange all of them.

Heracy how dare you question the written word

 

[CrabsandFootball]

The non-Ambi KAC lowers were discontinued. Even KAC fucks up. Imagine a KAC lower that will not accept a KAC trigger guard. Lol, I have one of the first run that was released and I didn’t send it back when they offered to exchange all of them.

And to be honest, other than the rollmark they aren't special. The roll pin they provided with the KAC trigger guard was way oversized. The upper was so dry it was almost white. Had to dunk it in Eds Red just to give her some life.

I built a KAC today with all Colt Parts along with a LMT MARS H lower. The LMT was so much easier with the take down captive spring and detents being way easier to install. Still love the KAC Ambi but they are pricey compared to a complete LMT MARS L even with a G trigger in them.

 

[Jsp556]

Heracy how dare you question the written word

I agree that top tier mfgs have better QA/QC than bargain brands and you have to pay for it. I agree that KAC, LMT, etc are the best in the business. It’s fact that bargain brands put out things that better mfgs usually don’t let out the door. I also acknowledge that even the best fuck up. It’s what they do about the fuck up that tells you about the company’s ethics. KAC let bad shit out the door, they owned it, and made it right with their customers. Magpul, BCM, and standard milspec trigger guards worked on the lowers. It didn’t matter to me so I kept mine.

 

[Jsp556]

And to be honest, other than the rollmark they aren't special. The roll pin they provided with the KAC trigger guard was way oversized. The upper was so dry it was almost white. Had to dunk it in Eds Red just to give her some life.

I built a KAC today with all Colt Parts along with a LMT MARS H lower. The LMT was so much easier with the take down captive spring and detents being way easier to install. Still love the KAC Ambi but they are pricey compared to a complete LMT MARS L even with a G trigger in them.

Yep, standard lowers, nothing special other than the fact that they were KAC. Mine was chalky looking out of the box as well.
The MARs lowers finish nicely. Like the KAC’s, they’re just forged parts used to build hard use, duty grade guns that get dumped into bins at the factories. The prices on factory assembled MARs lowers have gotten into the KAC price range as of late.

I hope no one took my post as a “Just as good” post because it definitely wasn’t intended to be.

 

[Franko]

So far I have found lowers from San Tan (STT-15), LMT (MARS-L), and Radian (AX556)and they are all in about the same price range (450-550). If I am going to pay about the same price, is one markedly better than the other or should I just go with what looks better to me?

Thanks again all.

 

[...]

ive never understood paying $100-300 for a lower.

spend $40 and get yourself an Anderson Lower....it literally does everything exactly the same as a Spikes/ Noveske/ Daniel Defense/ KAC/ ect.


honestly its hard to fuck up an AR.....even the cheapest AR-Stoner franken rifles shoot just fine.

 

[Powder_Burns]

Roll marks don’t enhance accuracy or reliability. What matters to me when picking a lower receiver is whether or not mags will drop free, buffer threads are clean, hammer and trigger pin holes are clean and in spec, bolt catch slot and trigger guard ears are the right size. Taking a mag, bolt catch, and a trigger pin or some calipers with you to check out lowers with may be overkill but you won’t have any issues with fit and function if you are diligent. Buying online is a roll of the dice with some of the bargain bin lowers, even with better quality makes at this stage we are probably scraping the barrel as far as selection and avaliability goes.

 

[XLR308]

And to be honest, other than the rollmark they aren't special. The roll pin they provided with the KAC trigger guard was way oversized. The upper was so dry it was almost white. Had to dunk it in Eds Red just to give her some life.

I built a KAC today with all Colt Parts along with a LMT MARS H lower. The LMT was so much easier with the take down captive spring and detents being way easier to install. Still love the KAC Ambi but they are pricey compared to a complete LMT MARS L even with a G trigger in them.

Wholly shit Batman we just had another unwholly act of heresy.

 

[1911addict42]

I just bought a Radian Mod 1 complete rifle.
They have a reputation for having one of the best lowers on the market. Also have a lifetime warranty, which is important to me.
Guys here have vastly more experience than I do, but I find that in almost all areas of life, you get what you pay for.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

ive never understood paying $100-300 for a lower.

spend $40 and get yourself an Anderson Lower....it literally does everything exactly the same as a Spikes/ Noveske/ Daniel Defense/ KAC/ ect.


honestly its hard to fuck up an AR.....even the cheapest AR-Stoner franken rifles shoot just fine.

Ignorance is bliss. This is how you know someone has almost no experience with the AR platform.


I don't understand why anyone buys an AI, just buy a savage its just as good.

I don't understand why anyone buys a ZCO/TT/NF, just buy a vortex crossfire its just as good.

ect ect ect.

 

[CrabsandFootball]

Roll marks don’t enhance accuracy or reliability. What matters to me when picking a lower receiver is whether or not mags will drop free, buffer threads are clean, hammer and trigger pin holes are clean and in spec, bolt catch slot and trigger guard ears are the right size. Taking a mag, bolt catch, and a trigger pin or some calipers with you to check out lowers with may be overkill but you won’t have any issues with fit and function if you are diligent. Buying online is a roll of the dice with some of the bargain bin lowers, even with better quality makes at this stage we are probably scraping the barrel as far as selection and avaliability goes.

Your first sentence does not match the rest of your statement.

Roll marks are an indicator of a quality product. The best indicator of future performance, its past performance. We know whats almost guaranteed to be quality and we know what is a roll of the dice at best.

Therefore, rollmarks do enhance accuracy and reliability.

 

[...]

Ignorance is bliss. This is how you know someone has almost no experience with the AR platform.


I don't understand why anyone buys an AI, just buy a savage its just as good.

I don't understand why anyone buys a ZCO/TT/NF, just buy a vortex crossfire its just as good.

ect ect ect.

....you must be new around here eh?....

pal, im a professional firearms instructor, NRA master shooter, and shot NCAA rifle.....i really dont need my experience questioned by someone who thinks spending $300 on the least critical part of an AR15 is necessary for proper function.


tell me, since you have all the answers, and i apparently know nothing.....exactly what a Noveske lower does than an Anderson lower doesnt do?....how exactly does it have any bearing on performance?

if you take a DD barreled upper, and put it on an anderson lower, is it going to shoot any differently?

 

[1911addict42]

....you must be new around here eh?....

pal, im a professional firearms instructor, NRA master shooter, and shot NCAA rifle.....i really dont need my experience questioned by someone who thinks spending $300 on the least critical part of an AR15 is necessary for proper function.


tell me, since you have all the answers, and i apparently know nothing.....exactly what a Noveske lower does than an Anderson lower doesnt do?....how exactly does it have any bearing on performance?

if you take a DD barreled upper, and put it on an anderson lower, is it going to shoot any differently?

Some lowers offer Ambi controls and Billet. Right?