Rifle Scopes Help with Optic Selection

[ABader]

I am fairly new to the long range shooting scene. I have shot out to 300 with the Army during our quals, but never really sat down and done precision shooting. With that said, I do shoot some out to 300 with my bolt action 308 from Savage. A friend of mine is letting me use a Leupold hunting scope of his right now that I like, but it is time for me to purchase my own. I am trying to keep my price point under $1,300 but still have an optic that allows me to grow into it, but not be a bargin bin special that I'll regret buying later. The three that I have narrowed my selection down to are:

Leupold 6.5-20x50 Mark 4LR/T with MilDot reticle
Bushnell 6-24x50 Elite Tactical 3 with G2DMR reticle
Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 FFP with EBR-1 reticle

Any thoughts on which would be the best for a beginner to the precision world? Any others that I may of missed and should consider? I appreciate all the help up front.

 

[kmose73]

I'd avoid the mark 4 because that one is second focal plane. Moving to first focal will put you out of your budget. The other two should work ok. You might also consider some of the stuff from SWFA, or a bushnell elite 3.5-21 hdmr.

 

[ABader]

You said to avoid the mark 4 because it is in the second focal plane. I know that it means where the reticle is placed within the optic itself, but what is the significance of first over second focal plane? I am looking up the other two you mentioned right now. Thank you again.

 

[bodywerks]

FFP means the reticle size changes as the zoom changes, keeping it subtended 1:1 with the target at all times. This means no math to do when considering windage corrections or hold overs. Its nice, but not absolutely a no go, especially if its something you have to sacrifice to be able to have better glass.
I have a Leupold mk4 m5. Not sure of the specs of the one you're considering, but mine is a ffp scope. I also went with the tmr reticle. Its mil-based, but far superior to the mil-dot, IMO. The m5 turrets are also in mils so your adjustments match the reticle.
The mk4 glass is the best of the three you mentioned.
If you go vortex, go with the 6-24 version of the pst. I had a 4-16. The glass was terrible. Some say theirs is great, but several others also agree that the 4-16 glass is hit or miss.

 

[ABader]

Thanks bodywerks, I was considering the 6.5-20x50 Mark 4LR/T which from what kmose said and I have found is in the SFP. Based off of kmose suggestion I found a SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 that I like as well, but is definitely at the top of what I want to pay. What is the difference between the MilDot, G2DMR, and TMR reticles? Is there one that is easier to learn to use over others?

 

[Bulletmoto]

I too would recommend the SWFA 5-20, very nice scope and will keep you happy for a long time.

 

[sawman556]

SWFA SS 5-20x50mm
Bushnell 3.5-21x50mm G2
Vortex PST 6-24x50mm FFP

If my SWFA 1-6x is any indication on how good the 5-20x is, it would be my first choice.

 

[kmose73]

Thanks bodywerks, I was considering the 6.5-20x50 Mark 4LR/T which from what kmose said and I have found is in the SFP. Based off of kmose suggestion I found a SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 that I like as well, but is definitely at the top of what I want to pay. What is the difference between the MilDot, G2DMR, and TMR reticles? Is there one that is easier to learn to use over others?

Those are all different versions of a mil-scale reticle. Basically the TMR is a mil reticle but with hashmarks instead of dots. It also has 1/2 mil marks, so ranging and correction is a little easier because it takes out some guesswork when mil values must be divided up into decimals. The G2 is the same thing but on the bottom half it has mil based windage marks for guys who like to hold off for wind and elevation. It looks like a Christmas tree on the bottom. Can be a real time saver for quick shots.

I would definitely recommend that if you have a mil reticle you get mil turrets also.

Also if you look on the hide in optics for sale, you get get some screaming deals on used stuff if you are patient. I will always buy mil/mil,first focal, used on this sight when possible from here on out. Plus it helps guys move stuff so they can upgrade.

 

[ABader]

Thanks kmose and everyone else. I am currently in Afghanistan, so I have the next 4 months to sit and wait to look around. I just want to have something waiting for me at home so that I can hit the range as soon as I get back to put to practice everything Ive been learning on here.

 

[sawman556]

Thanks kmose and everyone else. I am currently in Afghanistan, so I have the next 4 months to sit and wait to look around. I just want to have something waiting for me at home so that I can hit the range as soon as I get back to put to practice everything Ive been learning on here.

You should be hitting some strange not the range my friend.

 

[Crosshair]

If the SS 5-20x is going to max your budget too hard, the SS 3-15x42 ($699)and SS 3-9x42 ($599) both are among the best at their price points too, and are both more than enough magnification for shooting out to 1k or further.

 

[ABader]

Sawman, the strange can be hit that night, have to hit the range early in the morning in the lovely El Paso desert or else its just too damn hot and takes the fun out of it.

 

[sawman556]

Sawman, the strange can be hit that night, have to hit the range early in the morning in the lovely El Paso desert or else its just too damn hot and takes the fun out of it.

Well I would hit it again and again in the morning. You must keep your main projectile dispenser operational. Just sayin'.

 

[ABader]

Crosshair, Im ok with being right at my max range and would be willing to possibly go a bit over if it were an optic worth the expenditure of the SWFA SSHD 5-20x50, which is where I am leaning towards thanks to everyone's input.

 

[Crosshair]

Crosshair, Im ok with being right at my max range and would be willing to possibly go a bit over if it were an optic worth the expenditure of the SWFA SSHD 5-20x50, which is where I am leaning towards thanks to everyone's input.

Great, I think the 5-20x is one of the best values out there. It was designed to compete well against the $1800 range of Nightforce and Razor scopes, and I think it does amazing at it; from almost all accounts of owners with time behind them. Value wise, the Bushy HDMR is close, but my personal preference goes to the SS in the $1100 range, though the G2 reticle is pretty useful.

 

[kmose73]

I love the milquad reticle on my 10x hd. The G2 is only an avantage if you hold for elevation IMO.

 

[ABader]

Thank you again everyone for the input. I will keep looking around, but for the money spent, it looks like the SWFA 5-20 is going to be the route I go. Maybe Ill get lucky and find a used one in the next few months before I get state side I can pick up and save on my budget some for other items, or towards a rifle more geared to this type of shooting.

 

[roggom]

If you want a Mk 4 then get a Mk4, they can be had in FFP and SFP, the LR/T only has the 3.5-10x40 in FFP, but the ER/T can be had in the mag range you want in FFP. You can scour the Snipers Hide Optics sale thread and wait, if you are patient Leupys pop up all the time, as do other scopes. As you know the Leupold warranty is lifetime and transferable, so a used scope will do just fine.

Now not sure what type of shooting you will be doing, but do you really need that high of magnification? If you will be shooting at static targets it will be fine, as you do not need that much field of view, but in that crazy El Paso Heat is gonna show nothin but mirage. You will be dialing back a lot.

SWFA scopes are nice, but it sucks to be out in the field and thinking that a couple more paydays and you could have had the scope you really wanted. Just my .02

 

[ABader]

If you want a Mk 4 then get a Mk4, they can be had in FFP and SFP, the LR/T only has the 3.5-10x40 in FFP, but the ER/T can be had in the mag range you want in FFP. You can scour the Snipers Hide Optics sale thread and wait, if you are patient Leupys pop up all the time, as do other scopes. As you know the Leupold warranty is lifetime and transferable, so a used scope will do just fine.

Now not sure what type of shooting you will be doing, but do you really need that high of magnification? If you will be shooting at static targets it will be fine, as you do not need that much field of view, but in that crazy El Paso Heat is gonna show nothin but mirage. You will be dialing back a lot.

SWFA scopes are nice, but it sucks to be out in the field and thinking that a couple more paydays and you could have had the scope you really wanted. Just my .02

I have other rifles, 17hmr, 22lr, and 308. I have always done less than 300 meters and that was about it. Before I deployed I went to our 1000 meter range on post, being Im active duty, and attended a competition shoot as a spectator. I got to talking to some of the guys because this has always peeked my interest and have decided I will get into this specialty of marksmen ship. End goal, I would love to be able to sit down and hit a target at 1,500 meters, but as with all things you must crawl before you walk and run. What I am going for is a good optic that I dont mind shelling some cash out for to start with to learn on. In the coming years move up to maybe 338LM or 408 Cheytac to really reach out and test my skills. For the moment, I need to start small and learn the ropes from the start to accomplish my end goal. I picked the Mark 4 as an optic I was considering because I know Leupold makes a good product, the others, I really don't know as I am new to this discipline. As I have seen on here over the weeks before I joined, the optic world changes almost overnight every time a new release comes out. I appreciate all the input I have gotten thus far and welcome any more that anyone has to offer.

 

[kmose73]

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/optics-sale/198105-ss-5-20x50.html

Hey, check it out!!

 

[ABader]

http://www.snipershide.com/shooting/optics-sale/198105-ss-5-20x50.html

Hey, check it out!!

Saw it this afternoon when I got up. Already on it. Thanks kmose.