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How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Intrepid4576

Intrepid4576

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Minuteman
Jul 12, 2011
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Honesdale, PA, USA
#1
I know this probably seems like something absurd to most of you to ask here this but I was never taught or shown how or even seen it done.

Im asking here because i have read in more than one place that more barrels are ruined due to improper cleaning than from not cleaning and just shooting.

I have already bought and received my lucas bore guide and i have a Dewey cleaning set already also

I have a AI AW .338 if that matters in regards to cleaning it.

I dont know what type of liquid im soposed to use to clean with and i also dont actually know the step by step of how to clean...i could assume but i just spent all my money (i have 40 dollars left) on this rifle setup - its my very first firearm ...figured do it right once.

so yeah i dont want to listen to some fool out there who thinks they know the best way to clean a rifle and then mess up my gun...which i intend to keep forever
smile.gif


so thats why im asking here for the proper way to clean a rifle...all parts of it

keep in mind when describing to me that i am new please

thanks
 
#2
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

You should consider signing up for the Hide's online training. Its extremely reasonable and an absolute treasure trove for new and experienced shooters alike.
 
#4
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

This video was done by Robert Gradous, one of the best gunsmiths in the country. Watch it, and then if you have any further questions, post them up.

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#6
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Wow, First Rifle is a .338. I guess I messed up with a .22 back in the day. HAHA.
Anyway. Are you cleaning during or after break in of the barrel?There's going to be a variance of cleaning after every shot to cleaning after several hundred shots. But, the process will be the same.
I'm not far from your area. Maybe 30 min or so. PM if you need help. I'd hate to see you ruin an AW.
 
#7
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

I recomend TM Solution for the solvent, Boretech Eliminator is also good. You have the proper equipment with the Dewey and Lucas, remember to keep them clean I wipe my rod each time it goes down the bore or after brushing 4-5 strokes in and out. Now remember to use quality patches (in the proper size!)Butches are the best I have found. You need quality brushes and use them sparingly, let the solvent do the work that means let it sit for 10-15 min and then brush 4-5 times with a very wet brush that is straight (check it each time). I also clean my brushes each brushing cycle with break clean. Then patch out. Remember this should take no more than 30 min with the dwell time. I find 1 no more than 2 cycles of this the bore is clean. You will want to dry the bore good and follow up with a very light coat quality oil designed for barrles I like Butches Gun Oil, and patch out before shooting. Also clean the chamber and lug seats. One more thing I see people do that is a huge mistake is dipping the brush into solvent as opposed to dripping the solvent on the brush, or patch, keep the solvent clean. I hope this helps. If you have any further questions shoot me a PM and Ill give you my phone # and we can talk about it.
 
#8
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Thanks for the post so far everyone.

I plan on only cleaning once in awhile / not doing any special barrel break in

what do i do to clean the area behind where the bore guide sits? chamber / bolt and stuff like that? does that stuff only get wiped down with an oiled cloth once in awhile or?

Thanks for that video that helped.
 
#9
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Where are you located Commav80r? Do you know of any ranges in our area that reach out a bit? Only thing i know of is Archbald range that only goes to 200

i have a nice dot drill target i printed off here that should be plenty challenging for now just figured id ask
smile.gif
 
#12
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Does anyone here use Sweets 7.62 solvent? I have had good luck with it. I understand it is very important to make sure you don't leave it in the barrel.
 
#14
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: skep_tic1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Does anyone here use Sweets 7.62 solvent? I have had good luck with it. I understand it is very important to make sure you don't leave it in the barrel. </div></div>

I've used it for years and yes, it's not supposed to left in the bore for extended periods of time due to the ammonia content. It is very aggressive on copper fouling compared to a product like Hoppes #9. It also has a pretty strong odor. If your nose is plugged up, it won't be after you use this stuff. The newer foaming bore cleaners are probably just as good if not better without the possible damage to the bore. However, since I don't have a bore scope and have never tried to intentionally damage a bore with these products, I can't really say how long it takes any of these products to start damaging the bore.
 
#15
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

KG2 (grey pumice-like stuff) and a nylon brush does a great job followed with some KG12 on patches. These are non-ammonia based cleaners that really clean quickly with minimal effort.

Eabco.com has the full details. Used for several years now and have had great results.
 
#16
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

I'm quite sure that leaving sweets in the barrel long enough to get it good and clean is fine. I always obsessively dry patch and I always runs a couple oil patches threw before I'm done. I've never seen anything remove copper like sweets.
 
#17
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Sweets is good at removing copper, but that should not be an issue with most calibers and quality barrels. However Sweets is old technology IMO Bore Tech Eliminator does as good if not better and easier on barrels and dosent stink! As I said before TM Solution is the best I have tried, and I have tried and compaired many. If you havent used any you should!
 
#18
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

yeah i definitely dont want to use anything that is to rough or even has a chance of hurting the barrel - from what ive read especially lowlights comparison between two rifles one cleaned and one not im planning to only clean once in awhile if groups are not that great and when i do to not use overly abrasive compounds

so could anyone tell me about cleaning behind where the boreguide sits? just wipe down the bolt with an oiled cloth and the same for the chamber or?

thanks
 
#19
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

As far as cleaning the chamber and the action and bolt here is how I do it. Your Lucas bore guide will fit into the chamber sealed by the o-ring and stops just before the shoulder so while cleaning solvent will be in the shoulder and neck of the chamber. This is good b/c this is where the carbon will build up while shooting, if your brass is in good shape and load not too light the body of the chamber should stay fairly clean. I will run a few saturated patches down my bore (using a jag and removing them at the muzzle as not to pull the dirty patch back through the bore) to let that sit while I clean my chamber. One more thing I just thought of, when your jag exits the muzzle make sure you dont let it drag on the crown when pulling it back through or when removing a patch (this is also why it is important to have a straight rod and a straight brush). Some people remove the brush at the muzzle so to only push it through the bore, I dont have any problem running a brush both ways but this is why I clean my brushes so much. OK back to cleaning the chamber. I use a chamber rod (short cleaning rod) and a loop, Ill put 2 patches through the loop about 1/4 through (so just a corner of the patches are through) and then fold the big side of the patches back over the corner I pulled through -hope that is clear as mud- so the end of the loop is completely covered by a thick layer of patches. I then soak it with solvent and run into the chamber twisting slowly and making sure it gets into the throat. I may repeat this if the chamber is very dirty. I then use a chamber mop to dry out the chamber. I finish cleaning the barrel and then wipe the chamber out 1 more time after cleaning the bore to remove any left over solvent. I have a special tool to clean my lug seats that can also be used to clean the raceways in the action. I just wipe the bolt body and lugs down with solvent and then a dry lent free cloth. I use solvent and an AP brush on bolt face making sure to remove any brass shavings.

Rember to take your time and pay attention to what you are doing and you will not damage your rifle.

Here is a link to the tools I use so you understand what I am talking about:
http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=35492/Product/Sinclair_Action_Cleaning_Tool_Kit
 
#20
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

I watched that you-tube vid...
I've always used Wipe-Out... he used Patch-Out...
Other than one's a foam, and one's liquid, is there a diff?
The foaming cleaner just seems easier to use...

Now for a stupid question that's always bugged me..
Different patch sizes for different calibers????
Jag sizes increase with bore dia, so that the thickness of a cotton patch gives the proper snug fit in the bore.
So all a "bigger" patch does is extend further down the bore on the jag, right? So why is that more important on a larger bore?
I use .22 patches on our .30 cal rifles, and don't see an issue...what am I missing??
 
#22
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

I dint want to start a flame war here, but My opinion is don't be overly obsessed with your cleaning.... You can follow instructions posted by others here and it will do just fine. Do remember that you cleaning something that withstands thousands of EXPLOSIONS rated at 50,000+ psi and then has a metal object fly thru it, touching it, while going 2500+ feet per second. So other than obvious gross negkegance, I wouldn't be too worried about small subtleties....

Again this is my opinion, but I haven't heard anybody refute it with actual facts, how a plastic jag/soft brush/relatively soft materialed rod hitting HARD steel,that withstands everything mentioned, will do anything. No matter how hard I try I just can't seem to scratch my glass table with my nail, my nail will scratch/break before the glass will.....same concept
 
#24
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dint want to start a flame war here, but My opinion is don't be overly obsessed with your cleaning.... You can follow instructions posted by others here and it will do just fine. Do remember that you cleaning something that withstands thousands of EXPLOSIONS rated at 50,000+ psi and then has a metal object fly thru it, touching it, while going 2500+ feet per second. So other than obvious gross negkegance, I wouldn't be too worried about small subtleties....

Again this is my opinion, but I haven't heard anybody refute it with actual facts, how a plastic jag/soft brush/relatively soft materialed rod hitting HARD steel,that withstands everything mentioned, will do anything. No matter how hard I try I just can't seem to scratch my glass table with my nail, my nail will scratch/break before the glass will.....same concept </div></div>

Gotta agree with ya. We shot thousands of rounds of soft lead .22's through our Win. 52-D's and Anschutz Super Matches and cleaned them maybe once every 3 months.

Like you, would like to see some empirical evidence.
 
#26
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

There is thread here about solvents and their effectiveness removing copper from bullets. I have since started using KG 12 and really like it. As for procedure, watch the rifle cleaning video in the online training section.
 
#27
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

In one capacity or another I've worked with firearms since I was 19 years old.

By no means an expert, but I've learned some things.

One:

Everytime you run a cleaning rod down a barrel you run the risk of damaging it. In addition to being my opinion, it's been validated by three marquee barrel manufacturers that I know personally.

The answer?

Do not clean your bore until you see a change in performance. The (assuming the barrel is already broken in)

Practical examples:

At Camp Perry the NRA highpower course is 80 record shots. Assuming no alibis you'll fire a total of 88 rounds for the day. (sighters)

The last 20 are at the 600 where every scrap of accuracy is vital. In 20+ years of doing this I've yet to see anyone run a patch down the bore prior to the 600.

International Palma:

800, 900, and 1000 yard shooting. 45 rounds completes the course of fire. It's common to see a shooter smoke 10-15 rounds through a fresh bore prior to ever firing a record shot.

60+ years ago mercury was a common component to priming compounds. Through the process of combustion it created a corrosive element that would chew up a barrel if left unclean.
As a result barrel maintenance was a must to ensure longevity. In today's world its no longer the case. Especially with a SS barrel.

"Change in performance" can mean a couple things:

Shot groups open up.
Signs of pressure.

Pressure is what I'll address now:

A barrel, however smooth will at some point begin to load up with copper. This happens a couple ways. Copper is mechanically stripped off the cartridge as it passes through the freebore/throat region of the chamber. Chamber pressures/temps often reach 50,000+CUP/6,000+F* at the throat region. Copper is vaporized into a plasma gas state in this environment.

As we travel down the barrel the pressure/temp lowers and it'll condense in a barrel much the way water condenses on a cold glass.

At some point this will build up. It increases friction and if your cartridges are at elevated loads it will likely begin to show itself as flattened primers and/or cratered primer strikes.

When this happens and you haven't changed anything, it can likely be a bore that's in need of attention. (assuming your following the "don't clean till it changes" philosophy.)

Solvents:

Two types primarily: Powder and copper.

Powder is basically a petroleum distillant ant that cuts the carbon funk left over from combusted powder.

Copper solvent is more than likely ammonia. It reacts with it chemically and strips it from the bore. If potent enough it can mess with the barrel steel so ensure you get it all out when done. Patches turn a smurf blue color when using ammonia based solvents that react with copper.

Tools:

I personally like UNCOATED one piece SS cleaning rods from Dewey. Uncoated rods don't pick up grit/dust that can embed in the plastic coating of some other rods. One piece means there's not fittment issues that can nick a bore/crown.

Bore guides: Always use one. It's just cheap insurance against damaging a throat/bore.

Brushes: I like the plastic ones as they tend to hold more solvent than brass.

Jags: Any good one works fine.

Procedure:

You can change direction with a brush but it must pass completely through the barrel first. NEVER change direction with a brush when still inside the bore.

Jags can go both ways at any point.

Notes: With a jag I am very, very careful when pulling it back through the bore/crown. The brass is softer than the steel but if careless there is the risk of dinging the crown with the edge of the jag. Just be careful/particular.

Hope this helps and good luck

C.
 
#28
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Chad (or who ever else wants to chime in),

What are your thoughts on cleaning a chromoly barrel if it is only shot 1 time per week or per 2-3 weeks? I would be ok w/ not cleaning a SS barrel at this shooting interval but worry about the chromoly especially shooting suppressed (which in my mind has more potential for condensation to develop in the bore).

Thanks for your time.
 
#29
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Wowsers thanks everyone for sharing so much info on this.

Jbell thanks alot also i actually have a chamber rod already (when i ordered the dewey cleaning stuff i just called and told them to send me everything i would need :p ) So ill try to follow your directions the best i can
smile.gif


so much info offered its great
smile.gif


I do plan on joining the training area but i honestly dont have the money for it atm...i ordered a suppressor for my rifle and only have 40 dollars left for the next week and a half so hehe
 
#30
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: C. Dixon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Jags can go both ways at any point.
</div></div>This is something I've always wondered about. I know not to reverse a brush in the bore, but I've found with the jags if I run it back and forth a few times in the barrel without fully exciting, that it often picks up more carbon fowling, where as it had looked clean when I just pushed the patches through one way. I guess it's more to scrub the bore with the patches. To me I sometimes do this and other times don't, and I've never had a problem, but I didn't know if it was a good idea or not.
 
#31
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Intrepid4576</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I do plan on joining the training area but i honestly dont have the money for it atm...i ordered a suppressor for my rifle and only have 40 dollars left for the next week and a half so hehe
</div></div>

Good to see your priorities are in the correct order ... firearms and accessorys then chow, gas, you know the other bull shit.

Glad I could help, keep in mind these are just some suggestions and what works for me.
 
#32
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Honestly don't know. I don't hang many chrome barrels nor do I own any on personal guns.

If you live in a muggy climate what id likely do is toss a couple silica packs in your case with the gun.

Pull the bolt when storing so some air can circulate.

Good luck.

C.
 
#33
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Clean the bore first with a foaming bore cleaner to remove copper then wait 15 minutes - run a patch through. If it's clean you can then wipe barrel with a dry patch followed by Hoppes #9 solvent...repeat cleaning process until barrel swabs show no powder fouling then wipe again with dry swabs. Finally, take a lightly oiled patch with FP-10 or basic gun oil (slip 2000 or something) and lightly swab the barrel.

The super fast way to clean a barrel is to blast it with gun scrub and then oil the barrel...or use a bore snake with a little bit of hoppes on it and then oil the barrel lightly. Remember that gun scrub removes all solvents and oil so you will need to make sure you oil the gun well to prevent rust and ensure proper action.

Easy.
 
#35
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SteelShot11</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh, and wear rubber disposable gloves and your hands wont smell for hours...</div></div> I just started doing that last couple weeks, great not to smell like serious chemicals for hours haha. But sometimes it still gets on me if I accidentally rip the gloves!
 
#36
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

My current break-in method is not about changing anything, but about monitoring fouling rates. I clean every few rounds at first to get some sort of a handle about how much/what kind of fouling is going on, and how that changes as the barrel becomes more shot-in.

I clean after each outing to get feedback on fouling, and to reset the bore's fouling status as a baseline for further monitoring. Most often, I find that as the round count becomes respectable, fouling becomes less and less of an issue.

My cleaning method is simple enough that it seldom becomes a chore. I use Outer's Gunslick bore cleaning foam. The regimen is the same, three one-two hour soaks, each followed by dry patches until they come out dry. No matter what went on before the cleaning, the process is as close as possible to identical each time.

This is not about getting a squeaky clean bore, it's about reading the condition of the used patches. The used patches are arranged in a line according to their sequence of use.

Each will usually show a different/diminishing degree of black and/or blue fouling/cleaning products. The information they yield is only useful as a comparison against how the rifle was performing when shooting ceased.

This correlation allows the shooter to discover trends and relate them to assessments about how far along the barrel is getting in its productive lifespan.

When this is done, I liberally oil the bore, then dry patch it out to leave only a light protective coating. Then I follow up by degreasing the chamber with patches dampened in alcohol and then dry patches. The goal is a clean, dry, oil-free chamber.

Finally, a very small dab of grease to the back face of the bolt lugs, which is worked in by opening/closing the bolt about a half-dozen times, then the bolt lugs get wiped dry. The goal is to end up with a small film of lubricant on the lug mating faces of the bolt recesses. The moving parts are keep cleaner to reduce grit accumulation.

Greg
 
#37
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Greg,

I could not have said it better as to how and why I clean. I may have a different cleaning method as you the end result is the same ... keeping a mental record of the bores condition based on fouling and then putting the bore back to the same state as the last cold bore shot. I would guess that, like me your cold bore data is very consistant and proably not very far off (if any at all) from your zero at short range, 300 yds or less.
 
#38
Re: How to clean a gun. Yes im that new ; /

Since the total of my C/F shooting involves a lengthy COF and sighters are the norm, my cold bore shot position is not even really significant.

I leave my previous hot-bore dope on the scope, and employ the first few shots to condition and heat up the barrel. Most typically, it is shooting right back to the previous zero within three or four shots. Everything in my shooting regimen, from load develpment to dope development, is geared around a warm barrel and the COF's shooting cadence.

All of this runs counter to tactical doctrine, but what can I say, I don't pursue tactical venues.

Greg
 
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