Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

Doug308

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I have heard all different methods of doing break in process, but never heard of cleaning with Windex to remove all traces of oil, to have a squeaky clean barrel before shots.

What's the opinion on this?


Howa Break-In Procedures and Ballistics Charts

BREAK-IN PROCEDURE FOR GUN BARRELS USING JACKETED BULLETS

For the first ten shots we recommend using jacketed bullets with a nitro powder load (Most Factory Ammo). Clean the oil out of the barrel before each shot using a simple window cleaner (like Windex®) which will soak the oil out of the pores. After firing each cartridge, use a good copper cleaner (one with ammonia) to remove the copper fouling from the barrel. We do not recommend anything with an abrasive in it since you are trying to seal the barrel, not keep it agitated.

After cleaning with bore cleaner, clean again with window cleaner after each shot. Use window cleaner because many bore cleaners use a petroleum base which you want to remove before firing the next shot. This will keep the carbon from building up in the barrel (oil left in the pores, when burned, turns to carbon).

To keep the temperature cool in the barrel, wait at least 5 minutes between break-in shots. The barrel must remain cool during the break-in procedure. If the barrel is allowed to heat up during the break-in, it will destroy the steel’s ability to develop a home registration point, or memory. It will have a tendency to make the barrel “walk” when it heats up in the future. We have all seen barrels that, as they heat up, start to shoot high and then “walk” to the right. This was caused by improperly breaking in the barrel (generally by sitting at a bench rest and shooting 20 rounds in 5 minutes or so). If you take a little time in the beginning and do it right, you will be much more pleased with the barrel in the future.

Look into the end of the barrel after firing a shot, and you will see a light copper-colored wash in the barrel. Remove this before firing the next shot. Somewhere during the procedure, around shot 6 or 7, it will be obvious that the copper color is no longer appearing in the barrel. Continue the window cleaner and bore cleaner applications through shot 10.

Following the initial ten shots, you then may shoot 2 rounds, cleaning between each pair of shots, for the next 10 shots. This is simply insuring that the burnishing process has been completed. In theory, you are closing the pores of the barrel metal that have been opened and exposed through the cutting and hand lapping procedures.

http://www.legacysports.com/products/howa/howa_breakin.html
 

Rafael

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

I don't believe there is any benefit to break-in procedures, no matter how simple or complex they make them.
 

3PER

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

Break-in? I bet they suggest you clean it after shooting also!
 

TrooperBrian

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

I agree with Rafael, its crap. The entire purpose of a break-in has NOTHING to do with the bore. Its just trying to smooth out the THROAT where they chamber the barrel.

The whole thing came about when people wondered hmmm..I wonder if I clean it..it must shoot better! And people took it to the next level, spending all day, several days "breaking in" their barrels.

But when those paranoids are shooting off a bench and get 1/2MOA or less, wouldn't you wonder if all that effort made sense? Its called effort justification in psychology.
 

Kapac

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

You may think its "crap" but I bet if you were to buy a full custom rifle and you spent $4k-$5k for the rifle. I gaurantee you will be looking up their barrel break-in proceedure and following it to a T!!

Doug, if you think it would benifit you and/or your gun then do it. Personally I break-in all my rifles in a manor that I have used for many years and it works for me! So I do it. Now when they start telling you what and whos ammo to use that is plain BS!

Kapac
 

Rafael

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced



<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kapac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You may think its "crap" but I bet if you were to buy a full custom rifle and you spent $4k-$5k for the rifle. I gaurantee you will be looking up their barrel break-in proceedure and following it to a T!

Kapac </div></div>
You would be wrong there. My positions do not vary with cost.

You would be better served by conveying your position and letting others convey theirs.
 

jimi

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

when i bought my new 223 varminter, i laughed out loud when i read about the windex, then i thought, what the hell, the rifle cost less than filling my 4x4 9 times!!!

im not saying it did anything, or didnt, or trying to sway you one way or the other, but i did said break in with windex..... for shits and giggles....

ive posted this pic before, but this is my first round of load development after 'recommended barrel break in'

IMG_0197.jpg


there is a .230 group, a .260 and a .287 group, all on the same piece of paper on the same day one after another at 100 yrds(although all 3 shot groups)pay no attention to the numbers above the targets, they are just powder charges and shot sequence for my own reference.

like the greek said, 'Put windex on!' hahahahahahahaha

it sure as hell didnt do any harm on this barrel...

will i be windexing all my new rifles, hahaha probably not... but then again.....

cheers guys,

jimi
 

TrooperBrian

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Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kapac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You may think its "crap" but I bet if you were to buy a full custom rifle and you spent $4k-$5k for the rifle. I gaurantee you will be looking up their barrel break-in proceedure and following it to a T!!

Doug, if you think it would benifit you and/or your gun then do it. Personally I break-in all my rifles in a manor that I have used for many years and it works for me! So I do it. Now when they start telling you what and whos ammo to use that is plain BS!

Kapac</div></div>

I have about $4500 into my LRTR, I broke it in by going to the range, getting trigger happy, and cleaning it at the end of the day. Throat gets polished by itself. Just make sure the cleaning is a good one.

Ta da.
 

rdsii64

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

    I never broke in either of my Howa's. I have put about 2500 rounds down the pipe of my .308 and thats a conservative estimate and it still groups like the first day I shot it.
     

    Dan983

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

    Take the time to break-in the barrel. Maybe not so important for the top quality hand lapped barrels, but why take the chance? Some barrels become so coppered up the cannot be cleaned.
     

    CaptainH

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

    I received this information from a friend at Broughton Barrels. Summarizing - shoot 1 clean with copper cleaner, then swab with patch with some synthetic motor oil (e.g., Mobile One) then a dry patch and repeat the shoot and clean for the first 10 shots. Then shoot 5 and repeat the cleaning etc. There was a point around 20 - 25 rounds where the cleaning became markedly easier and there was much less resistance to the patch in the barrel.
     

    sobrbiker883

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kapac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You may think its "crap" but I bet if you were to buy a full custom rifle and you spent $4k-$5k for the rifle. I gaurantee you will be looking up their barrel break-in proceedure and following it to a T!!

    </div></div>

    Guarantee? I guarantee you can't guarantee what I will do with a rifle.

    Howa's mumbo-jumbo about barrel memory is crap. I also like the windex recommendations....
     

    devildog62

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    I only break in barrels because of the voodoo black magic double secret ninja code......haven't you heard?!?!?!
     

    Niles Coyote

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    Crap, not only did forget to break in my new custom (sorry, about a thousand under the 4500 tag) but I just realized I have about 800 rounds down the bore and it has not yet seen a cleaning patch…

    With 100y groups in the .2-.3 range I don’t think I will touch it either.
     

    355sigfan

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    I followed the break in procedure on the GAP-10 I owned, I did not break in the barrel on my Larue Stealth and the Stealth out shot the gap. There is nothing to this barrel break in process in my opinion. I bet if I reversed the process and broke in the stealth and not the Gap the results would be the same.
    Pat
     

    nzgrip

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    I don't think it's as cut and dry as you do or you don't need to break in a barrel. Not all barrels are created equally, and even the good ones can be let down by a poor reaming in the chamber. My new Krieger now has 100 rnds through it and is only just starting to settle, major copper fouling. The section of the chamber that i can see is pretty rough so i can only assume the throat is jjust as rough causing excessive copper fouling.
     

    cooper_257

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    Alaskapopo You dident have a GAP-10, you had a gap built AR theirs a big difference. how do i know this, because you have been s***ing all over the gap 10 thread with your Larue BS. you should go over to BARF.com .

    I have one of the new GAP-10s and I did not do a break in and this gun is very accurate.
     

    PKRobbins

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have $5+ custom rifles that have never been broke in, not even close in fact. </div></div>

    case closed
    wink.gif


    I'm too lazy to follow those goofy procedures. I'd worry more about damaging the bore and barrel trying to clean it at the range with a makeshift setup.
     

    DMann

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SonarSpencer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Doesn't every barrel "walk" once it gets hot enough? </div></div>

    Not necessarily. If there is stress in the barrel, once it begins to warm, it will flex. A sporter weight factory barrel will do this more often due to the stresses introduced into the lighter-contoured, mass-produced barrel during manufacturing. A custom barrel of the same weight and profile may not have the same amount of stress. I am of the OPINION (i.e., no science to really back it up) that cut-rifled barrels have less manufacturing stress than a button-rifled barrel and will not tend to "walk" (as much) as it warms up. I have been wrong before. Particularly about redheads.
     

    cvedrick

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Proced

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CaptainH</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I received this information from a friend at Broughton Barrels. Summarizing - shoot 1 clean with copper cleaner, then swab with patch with some synthetic motor oil (e.g., Mobile One) then a dry patch and repeat the shoot and clean for the first 10 shots. Then shoot 5 and repeat the cleaning etc. There was a point around 20 - 25 rounds where the cleaning became markedly easier and there was much less resistance to the patch in the barrel. </div></div>

    Happens I know the guy who wrote the original procedure that Broughton is more or less handing out.

    As far as windex goes, it is soap, ammonia and abrasive. I imagine HOWA figured non shooters are more likely to have it around than CR10, Shooters Choice, Montana Extreme etc.

    If you want to read the originals, with comments and explanations here it is:

    http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=252192&highlight=break+in
     

    scap99

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Niles Coyote</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Crap, not only did forget to break in my new custom (sorry, about a thousand under the 4500 tag) but I just realized I have about 800 rounds down the bore and it has not yet seen a cleaning patch…

    With 100y groups in the .2-.3 range I don’t think I will touch it either. </div></div>

    Have to say I agree...
    Here's a 300 yd target from Sunday morning.
    Using my "vintage" UGSW Infidel (752 down the tube), my brand new SS HD 5-20, and an almost perfectly seasoned TBAC 30P-1 (got just about 190 rounds through the can)

    I'll clean it when it stops shooting better than I can.


    tgtgfx.jpg

    By scap99 at 2011-08-03
     

    J-ROD

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    I searched and searched concerning this when I first got my dpms LR308. I am a complete newbie compared to almost everyone on this board...but my personal conclusion is do what you want, just be really careful how and what you use to clean the barrel as I think the chances of you hurting the barrel via a three piece cheapo cleaning rod and/or no bore guide are astronomically higher than hurting it by not breaking it in.
    With that said (and I'm a poor shot really) here is a 3 shot group of the 3rd, 4th and 5th round out of my DPMS at 100yds. The high right shot was the 2nd shot used to get it sighted in. I cleaned the barrel squeaky clean before heading out and did no break-in.

    2011-06-18_13-05-48_565.jpg
     

    sailorspencer

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DMann</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SonarSpencer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Doesn't every barrel "walk" once it gets hot enough? </div></div>

    Not necessarily. If there is stress in the barrel, once it begins to warm, it will flex. A sporter weight factory barrel will do this more often due to the stresses introduced into the lighter-contoured, mass-produced barrel during manufacturing. A custom barrel of the same weight and profile may not have the same amount of stress. I am of the OPINION (i.e., no science to really back it up) that cut-rifled barrels have less manufacturing stress than a button-rifled barrel and will not tend to "walk" (as much) as it warms up. I have been wrong before. Particularly about redheads.

    </div></div>


    Thanks for the knowledge. I just bought a How 1500 .308 myself. I just want to see if Japanese steel is forged better even if its a 'button-barrel'. I was figuring conditioning was smokes and mirrors, however its not expensive to do... just time consuming. Might take the 10/22 just to plink during cool-down time.
     

    Jhnmdahl

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kapac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You may think its "crap" but I bet if you were to buy a full custom rifle and you spent $4k-$5k for the rifle. I gaurantee you will be looking up their barrel break-in proceedure and following it to a T!!
    </div></div>

    Nope, don't do it.

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Kapac</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Personally I break-in all my rifles in a manor that I have used for many years and it works for me!</div></div>

    I'd at least go outdoors...
     

    Boomholzer

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If the barrel is allowed to heat up during the break-in, it will destroy the steel’s ability to develop a home registration point, or memory. </div></div>

    This suggests that the heat from a ~20rnd string will harden, separate, permantly distort, or change the metallurgy. This is outside other common directions of benefit in mechanical conditioning of bore. (separate topic; abrasive lapping bullets, what's your jump... what is the part of a bore to kill accuracy?)
    I have my non-breakin practice no one cares about, much like the religion of this topic. I think the post quote is total BS outside of reason.










     

    sailorspencer

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    So many people are against this "break in" procedure.... Other than loss of time and a few annoyances, how can windex or any other ammonia based cleaner and 20 rounds (one at a time) hurt the barrel?
     

    lowlight

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    It doesn't hurt a thing, it is just a waste of time in many cases. The barrel should dictate the level of cleaning necessary. As well the results down range. Setting out to "break in" as in 1 shot - clean, 2 shots - clean, etc is just not always necessary, particularly in a 308. In other calibers you may see a necessity depending the speed, caliber, bullet, but not always.

    Any smith worth his salt will tell you, they have seen more barrels ruined from improper or over cleaning versus shooting. Shooting doesn't hurt near as much as the constant scrubbing and harsh solvents many use.

    It has been posted here often, but look at the date this was written and by who...

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gale McMillan
    Senior Member posted September 25, 1999 10:10 AM
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The break in fad was started by a fellow I helped get started in the barrel business . He started putting a set of break in instructions in ever barrel he shipped. One came into the shop to be installed and I read it and the next time I saw him I asked him What was with this break in crap?. His answer was Mac, My share of the market is about 700 barrels a year. I cater to the target crowd and they shoot a barrel about 3000 rounds before they change it. If each one uses up 100 rounds of each barrel breaking it in you can figure out how many more barrels I will get to make each year. If you will stop and think that the barrel doesn't know whether you are cleaning it every shot or every 5 shots and if you are removing all foreign material that has been deposited in it since the last time you cleaned it what more can you do? When I ship a barrel I send a recommendation with it that you clean it ever chance you get with a brass brush pushed through it at least 12 times with a good solvent and followed by two and only 2 soft patches. This means if you are a bench rest shooter you clean ever 7 or 8 rounds . If you are a high power shooter you clean it when you come off the line after 20 rounds. If you follow the fad of cleaning every shot for X amount and every 2 shots for X amount and so on the only thing you are accomplishing is shortening the life of the barrel by the amount of rounds you shot during this process. I always say Monkey see Monkey do, now I will wait on the flames but before you write them, Please include what you think is happening inside your barrel during break in that is worth the expense and time you are spending during break in. </div></div>

    In most cases you can shoot, then clean after. If accuracy is an issue, clean it, if not, don't... but most importantly rule number one should be, <span style="font-style: italic">"whatever makes you feel good"... </span>

    Complete conversation... http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/Barrel_BreakIn.asp
     

    sailorspencer

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    Re: Howa's Recommended Barrel Break in Procedure

    That makes alot of sense, and I appreciate it. Now that the air is cleared, I think I'l go to the range this weekend and have fun, rather than taking the underside of my kitchen sink with me!