Is there a particularly high quality product that is designed, engineered, produced and then sold from China?

want2learn

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I can well recall growing up, if one were presented with an item denoted as made in Japan, that would generally connote a product of substandard quality….aside from perhaps cameras?

Certainly conceptions have evolved quite differently now. I would imagine that most consider products from Switzerland (watches, chocolate for example) or Germany to be of desirable quality.

While many products designed and engineered in other countries have proven well manufactured in China (Apple products for example), I’m remiss in naming a particular product that satisfied the same qualitative criteria of not only design but engineering, development, manufacture and sale.



Any suggestions?
 

plong

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Edit to add: and arguably on point 4 ( can you say marketing...? ... Apple...?) as well!
 

Sean the Nailer

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I can well recall growing up, if one were presented with an item denoted as made in Japan, that would generally connote a product of substandard quality….aside from perhaps cameras?

Certainly conceptions have evolved quite differently now. I would imagine that most consider products from Switzerland (watches, chocolate for example) or Germany to be of desirable quality.

While many products designed and engineered in other countries have proven well manufactured in China (Apple products for example), I’m remiss in naming a particular product that satisfied the same qualitative criteria of not only design but engineering, development, manufacture and sale.



Any suggestions?
Sweet and Sour chicken balls
beef and Broccoli
Almond Gai Ding
Chicken Chow Meow
Sweet and Sour Spare-ribs
Fortune Cookies
Flied Lice
Moo Goo Gai Pan

That's all I got.
 

sonichanxiao

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Anything on the government banned list or anything you see elsewhere but not in the US.
 

357Max

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I can think of one thing!

My favorite holiday is 4th of July & it wouldn't be complete without Chinese Fireworks. I've been working in PA lately and stopped in a fireworks store to get loaded up for the 4th. Every single thing in there from sparklers to the biggest mortars are all made in china.

 

FishinGuns

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I can think of one thing!

My favorite holiday is 4th of July & it wouldn't be complete without Chinese Fireworks. I've been working in PA lately and stopped in a fireworks store to get loaded up for the 4th. Every single thing in there from sparklers to the biggest mortars are all made in china.

Summon-a-bitch. Ain’t that a kick in the nuts?
 

357Max

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I'm not very up to speed with the AK47, never owned one. I suspect the story is similar to SKS's & I do know some history on them.

I've got one of the earliest Norinco SKS Sino Soviet letter guns imported pre-ban by KSI, 1959. It is unfired.

Those early SKS & I suspect it would apply to AK 47's were built on Soviet machinery, tooling, & under direct Soviet supervision in china. Even have Soviet QC proof marks on them. They were high quality having screwed in barrels, milled trigger groups and bolt carriers with lightening reliefs cut into them & heavy barrel nuts. As the years rolled on, machinery and tooling were replaced, and Chinese tweaked the design. They always got worse, never an improvement. The later years were cheaper rifles having pinned barrels, stamped trigger groups and slab-sided bolt carrier
 

reubenski

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Certain types of processors. We either can't produce them, or don't produce them(because we can't make them for enough of a profit). Two places in the world they're made: China and Taiwan. Explains why we're so supportive of Taiwan being independent, right? If you want a Magneto Speed for $350, kestrel 5700 for under $1000, most Vortex scopes, or a Labrador for less than $1000 you're preventing the US's independence of this crucial technology. You want us to continue to go to war to stabilize the Middle East, keep supporting big oil companies and enjoying gas at $2 a gallon.

It's always amazed me that the WalMart shoppers are the loudest opponents of "the fer'iners".
 
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Kamerad

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I remember the term ‘fine China’. Haven’t heard it in some years.
 

E. Bryant

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Nothing immediately comes to mind at the consumer level, although some friends were early adapters of Huawai and ZTE phones (well before the recent shitstorms). Not sure if those count, since they were running Android OS. Similarly, there is a Lenovo device on my lap right now; once again, that runs an American OS.

In a variety of industries, there are numerous Chinese products "under the hood" so to speak (or somewhat more literally if we're talking about the automotive world).

China is probably going to kick the world's ass when it comes to lithium-ion batteries. Much of the design technology was acquired from the outside (they bought A123), but indigenous companies like CATL are doing some pretty solid work of their own.

Much as Japan made its leap forward when it evolved beyond making cheap knock-offs of American products - Sony's innovations in the consumer electronic space being a great example - I suspect that we'll see something come out of China in the next 5-10 years that will establish it as the world leader in a new segment. We might also need to redefine what "product" means in this case, because it's quite possible that something happens in a field like AI that doesn't result in a tangible item that one can hold in one's hand (an autonomous vehicle software "stack" would be a good example of this).

And, yes. There is one I can think of:

View attachment 7342169

Norinco. The first major Chinese import into the USA.

Still one of the best AK's out there.

Sirhr
I'm not a fan of Chinese products, but I would happily buy a variety of Norinco products if they were still available for import.
 
Last edited:

E. Bryant

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Certain types of processors. We either can't produce them, or don't produce them(because we can't make them for enough of a profit). Two places in the world they're made: China and Taiwan. Explains why we're so supportive of Taiwan being independent, right? If you want a Magneto Speed for $350, kestrel 5700 for under $1000, most Vortex scopes, or a Labrador for less than $1000 you're preventing the US's independence of this crucial technology. You want us to continue to go to war to stabilize the Middle East, keep supporting big oil companies and enjoying gas at $2 a gallon.

It's always amazed me that the WalMart shoppers are the loudest opponents of "the fer'iners".
China still lags behind much of the world when it comes to IC manufacturing, although they are making more investment in manufacturing capital than anywhere else in the world (I wouldn't be surprised if they were spending more than the rest of the world combined). South Korea, Taiwan, and Japan remain the big players. The US does a good job of designing silicon and Intel still does the majority of its wafer fab in the US, but we've become obsessed with the idea of the "fabless" business model - design it here, but let some other country does the dirty work of actually manufacturing it.

The sad thing is that US-made silicon really isn't that much more expensive; it's not like we've got a bunch of union workers getting paid $28/hour to craft it by hand. Our $699 Kestrel might go to, I dunno, $725 if we forced the use of domestic components. Much of the cost of such an item is in the software, and the distribution chain is, shall we say, somewhat less than optimized (each dollar in additional cost at the BOM level might translate into $5-10 in additional price at the retail level by the time everyone applies their markups). It's not like we're talking about something like a Amazon Fire stick with razor-thin margins where pennies matter.
 

lariat

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There are some electronic components that I buy that are good, but the consistency is all over the place, and that makes them WORSE than bad. I have been burned several times from multiple companies. When we test their products we find that many items do not match the advertised specs. Complaining might get you your money back but no real help, understanding or care that their poor product impacts the end user. I haven't found anything that was an original idea from the ground up that came from China; it seems like innovation is not a part of the Chinese brain space that is acutely developed or the government so discourages it that it manifests itself in the workplace, which gives them only cheap prices as their competitive factor.

We have started pulling out of China altogether and either buying in the USA/US allies or making it. I want to have everything in that state within in the next year. Internal components included, and that is the difficult part. Currently I am pushing on the question about why it cannot be made in-house profitably. Everything that cannot made here goes first to US players and then US allies, but only after the question of where they get their raw materials - that throws a number of people out. As it stands now, control of the supply chain is critical; anyone doing business with China at this point (manufacturer or consumer) has a large risk in their chain that probably needs to be mitigated as we go forward into the future, given the bipartisan agreement regarding exposure to the PRC. Things are only going to escalate.

China hasn't invented anything since gunpowder. The rest has been acquired. They are not known for original ideas, but they can grab the concept quickly once it is explained to them. And then they will make it and undercut the originator in the marektplace. I have direct experience with this.
 
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MtnCreek

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I think the last thing the chinese actually came up with on their own was black powder.
 

Blue Sky Country

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I can think of one thing!

My favorite holiday is 4th of July & it wouldn't be complete without Chinese Fireworks. I've been working in PA lately and stopped in a fireworks store to get loaded up for the 4th. Every single thing in there from sparklers to the biggest mortars are all made in china.


This is precisely why the PRC government is SO terrified of revolution or the mere omens of it. It takes but a slight bit of tweaking, and fireworks factories, both commercial (30%) and household (70%), can be turning out far more fun and interesting stuff far faster than wheat can be harvested...
 
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Blue Sky Country

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I think the last thing the chinese actually came up with on their own was black powder.

Social credit system... Also around the same time as black powder. Called wu kou, or "residence permit". If you want to live in a fortified city or hold certain jobs, your personal credit report must show that you had made certain sacrifices to the state. Basically "service guarantees citizenship". Military service with an honorable discharge earns you full elite status. If this sounds like Chinese society is basically a living, real life example of a video game world, it really is...
 
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Fig

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There are some electronic components that I buy that are good, but the consistency is all over the place, and that makes them WORSE than bad. I have been burned several times from multiple companies. When we test their products we find that many items do not match the advertised specs. Complaining might get you your money back but no real help, understanding or care that their poor product impacts the end user. I haven't found anything that was an original idea from the ground up that came from China; it seems like innovation is not a part of the Chinese brain space that is acutely developed or the government so discourages it that it manifests itself in the workplace, which gives them only cheap prices as their competitive factor.

We have started pulling out of China altogether and either buying in the USA/US allies or making it. I want to have everything in that state within in the next year. Internal components included, and that is the difficult part. Currently I am pushing on the question about why it cannot be made in-house profitably. Everything that cannot made here goes first to US players and then US allies, but only after the question of where they get their raw materials - that throws a number of people out. As it stands now, control of the supply chain is critical; anyone doing business with China at this point (manufacturer or consumer) has a large risk in their chain that probably needs to be mitigated as we go forward into the future, given the bipartisan agreement regarding exposure to the PRC. Things are only going to escalate.

China hasn't invented anything since gunpowder. The rest has been acquired. They are not known for original ideas, but they can grab the concept quickly once it is explained to them. And then they will make it and undercut the originator in the marektplace. I have direct experience with this.
Not hard to do when you're a communist and don't place any value on human life. I wonder how much more profit you could make if payroll were your smallest expense way behind your utility bills? Anything is possible with free, limitless labor.
1591194720207.png
 

Lesch

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The only way anything of remote quality to come out of china is if you have your people standing over them. They have no clue what to do or why in manufacturing. A good friend if mine works for Foxconn, the one that had to put nets around to keep people from jumping to their death to get away. He is in quality and says even with a complete team there to over see things. The failure rate is still 20% or more. To the kung foo as long as it looks like what it should, that is all that is needed. It doesnt mater to them if it works or not. I have dealt with them making engine parts and it is insane what they do. You can not talk sense into them. It like trying to educate a liberal. They keep going back to how they want to do things.