Is there a particularly high quality product that is designed, engineered, produced and then sold from China?

[chevy_man]

That is your opinion, and it's highly debatable. I don't have time to debate, but what I do have is industry experience directly with Honda.

I think my anger with Honda comes from the size of my hands and the lack of places I can fit them.

I keep buying full sized trucks because I fix them myself on jack-stands in my garage. If I had a lift and a bunch of jacks I'd probably hate imports less.

And timing belts. Fuck belts. Give me a double roller chain damnit! Wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't an 8 hour job.

 

[Jgunner]

And, yes. There is one I can think of:

View attachment 7342169

Norinco. The first major Chinese import into the USA.

Still one of the best AK's out there.

Sirhr

How come you didn’t show a pic of the one with that cool thumb through stock?!?

 

[E. Bryant]

I don't disagree. But the gap's still there and it opens up the longer you keep your car.

Be careful with that last assumption. There are indeed a select number of Japanese products (like the current Land Cruiser) that are engineered to last far longer than most vehicles. But your average Honda or Toyota sedan? Based upon experience managing a fleet of random company cars (mostly GM and Honda, with a sprinkling of Toyota, Ford, and Chrysler), the typical Japanese car provides less trouble out to 200,000 miles or so, and then several things will start failing in short succession. The American car will simply suffer random failures throughout its life - a water pump here, an HVAC blend door there, wheel bearings and frozen caliper slider pins always. Overall per-mile costs support the Honda or Toyota right up until they run into that wall.

Think about it. You're a chief engineer for a mainstream passenger car, and are given the task of achieving a target life (typically 15 years/250k miles with the exception of wear items and a few parts like brake pipes, alternators, and fuel pumps) but at the lowest possible cost (because profit is necessary). You'd accomplish this task to perfection if every part survived the specified life and then simultaneously failed at 250,001 miles, right? And if you were to trust a group of engineers to execute this task, would they come from Honda or GM? This is just an interesting thought exercise and not intended to suggest that this is actually what happens (life is just a touch more complex), but you should come away with the general concept.

And what was the intended topic of this thread?

 

[E. Bryant]

Focus on Trucks is a failed strategy as production numbers for Detroit , including trucks dropped by a couple of million in a decade while other manufacturers increased thier output by similar and world market grew from 60 to 72mio vehicles , SUVs are more exportable but not all models ( US largest exporter being BMW is telling enough, US plants for Euro manufacturers make over 3 million cars in the United States, accounting for 27+% of total US production. ). Trucks only really export to ME are incompatible with other markets.

Why all this concern about what can be exported and what can't? The fact of the matter is that there is one successful global manufacturer - Toyota. Companies like VW and Renault-Nissan build and sell a huge number of cars, but they really don't make any money doing it. Some of this is because they have poor strategy and execution; some of it is because they are basically jobs programs for socialist states. But the bottom line is that it's extremely hard to compete in every market; many of those markets aren't profitable (and that includes wide swaths of the European and US markets), and competing everywhere burns immense amounts of capital.

VW spent something like $50-60 billion to develop, tool, and launch its MQB platform. Assume that the platform remains viable for 6-8 years, and it's still a huge cash burn (like, 4 years of corporate EBIT big). They'd probably make more money by developing a smaller number of vehicles for a smaller number of markets, which is largely the Honda strategy. But they wouldn't sell as many cars, and that seems to be a corporate directive.

 

[308pirate]

Americans don't like to drive the shitboxes that sell in foreign markets and there's little money to be made on them where people do buy them.

 

[accurate obsession]

The Clapper, or is it just the clap

 

[brianf]

almost all "glass coatings" are produced in china because of the heavy metals and toxic chems

most but not for a few brands send their lenses for final polish and coating in china

i think china is #1 or #2 in the world in producing the actual polishing machines

several of the most well known camera, telescope, and rifle scope companies do the same

i was surprised when i saw the list a year or so ago

yes i hate the Chinese as well, but they actually do make some real products

 

[Mr.BR]

Yes you would be surprised how much 'chinesium' is even in higher-end in optics and optics made for the military.

 

[Mr.BR]

At 2019 estimate they reckon savings due to MQB platform to be 2-5% in manufacturing depending on car model and 20+% in the development of each new model (they have 220) , they are touting savings up to 19billion$ a year (although that might be BS,just to get a big paycheck for the bosses)

MBQ platform might be the big leap forward ?, VW group makes 220+ modes in 90 factories sure some more standardization will save costs. Lifespan will be much longer than 8 y , some of the models built in US and China are on 16Y old platform, and when they are done with it they can sell it to Tesla-like its newest and best thing after mom's pancakes. Chinese regulatory cycle is cca 8y behind European while American was 12y but could be more if deregulation is the norm so the platform could be valid much much longer on markets outside Europe. Eurocrats constantly legislate new higher standards that costs manufacturers lots of $$ but end of the day tech they develop can later on be introduced to less demanding markets with no development cost for that.

Actually looking at the consolidation happening in European Carmakers i would be surprised if brands outside VW don't start using MQB for their lineups , cheaper than developing own MQBs.

As for some companies making less cash like PSA , Renault you have to consider that they make a lot of really cheap cars (most sold models are 10-15K$) and on the other end of the scale you have Porsche that is making $$$ with smaller numbers of high value-added cars.

 

[_Windrider_]

Is the thread title rhetorical? China has NEVER designed anything they didn’t steal first.

 

[ManUtdManiac]

Certain types of processors. We either can't produce them, or don't produce them(because we can't make them for enough of a profit). Two places in the world they're made: China and Taiwan. Explains why we're so supportive of Taiwan being independent, right? If you want a Magneto Speed for $350, kestrel 5700 for under $1000, most Vortex scopes, or a Labrador for less than $1000 you're preventing the US's independence of this crucial technology. You want us to continue to go to war to stabilize the Middle East, keep supporting big oil companies and enjoying gas at $2 a gallon.

It's always amazed me that the WalMart shoppers are the loudest opponents of "the fer'iners".

it is precisely the behaviour of children. No perception or concept of consequences to their actions or thought. I want cheap shit, I don't like foreigners, I want made in USA, but I want unions, I want cheap shit... oh and I hate Communists but I support a president who uses centralized economic policies like tariffs, subsidies that support whole industries and motivates inefficient practices and that are totally anti-free market or capitalist (but I also hate welfare programs...) and runs up the national debt like it's a game to see who can make it the biggest... bigly! It's a word be-otch!

 

[Mr.BR]

Exactly !!

Remember Chinese make cheap shit because that is what you are buying,if you want high-end stuff they can make that as well. Like it or not they are a manufacturing superpower no one comes even close of course there are a couple of industries where they are not jet competitive but the number of those industries is shrinking by the day.

When you think you have some edge over Chinese in the long term just take a peek at the daily news, you have a bunch of human trash running the show across most major cities for a couple of months now , i don't see that changing anytime soon this shit will continue till its too cold to protest around. Do you think any one of these folks is/will be a productive member of society anytime soon?
And then there is the financial side , 24% of folks income are now goverment handouts , gov is handing out trillions $ every 5-6 weeks like its chump change