I understand tha lapping rings will relieve stress on scopes. Will it also decrease the ring marks left on rifle scopes? Needless to say, the higher quality rings and base used would also be a determining factor. Kokopelli manufactures alignment bars and lapping bar. Has anyone used this and to what degree of success?
Gunsmithing Lapping rings
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Re: Lapping rings
Lappping is going to create a concentric bed in the rings for your scope to lay in while providing an equal ammount of pressure applied to the scope tube by the rings once tightened to their respective torque. When the rings are initialy installed, especially on a two part base they are not in perfect alingment with one another. This is because of the minimal space allowed between the mounting screws and the bases for clearance. So when we tighten them down, we shift the bases very slightly. There are other variables to consider, but lapping is a good Idea and does not take a long time for what you get. Good luck.
Lappping is going to create a concentric bed in the rings for your scope to lay in while providing an equal ammount of pressure applied to the scope tube by the rings once tightened to their respective torque. When the rings are initialy installed, especially on a two part base they are not in perfect alingment with one another. This is because of the minimal space allowed between the mounting screws and the bases for clearance. So when we tighten them down, we shift the bases very slightly. There are other variables to consider, but lapping is a good Idea and does not take a long time for what you get. Good luck.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim Kobe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You could save yourself a bunch of money by not going with the Kokopelli tools, the alignment rod is a joke. Go to a local maching shop and ask for a piece of one inch drill rod about 10 inches long. </div></div>
I use 1" Drill rod and I had to make my 30MM lap by turning down a piece of 1.250 stock to 30MM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim Kobe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You could save yourself a bunch of money by not going with the Kokopelli tools, the alignment rod is a joke. Go to a local maching shop and ask for a piece of one inch drill rod about 10 inches long. </div></div>
I use 1" Drill rod and I had to make my 30MM lap by turning down a piece of 1.250 stock to 30MM
Re: Lapping rings
Could you explain the procedure when using a one piece alignment rod? My question is how do you tell with a one piece rod if your are aligned, other than eyeballing the overall placemnet in the scope rings? When using a 2 piece bar with flat ends,(not pointed) wouldn't you be able to easier detect any offset, whether up,down or sideways, when the 2 ends are brought together, while resting in the rings?<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AMAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim Kobe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You could save yourself a bunch of money by not going with the Kokopelli tools, the alignment rod is a joke. Go to a local maching shop and ask for a piece of one inch drill rod about 10 inches long. </div></div>
I use 1" Drill rod and I had to make my 30MM lap by turning down a piece of 1.250 stock to 30MM </div></div>
Could you explain the procedure when using a one piece alignment rod? My question is how do you tell with a one piece rod if your are aligned, other than eyeballing the overall placemnet in the scope rings? When using a 2 piece bar with flat ends,(not pointed) wouldn't you be able to easier detect any offset, whether up,down or sideways, when the 2 ends are brought together, while resting in the rings?<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AMAC</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim Kobe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You could save yourself a bunch of money by not going with the Kokopelli tools, the alignment rod is a joke. Go to a local maching shop and ask for a piece of one inch drill rod about 10 inches long. </div></div>
I use 1" Drill rod and I had to make my 30MM lap by turning down a piece of 1.250 stock to 30MM </div></div>
Re: Lapping rings
I have stopped lapping rings. I now bed them like you do an action in a stock. But here again, you need to align the rings as close as possible before bedding them. I am currently out of Devcon. The last two scopes I have bedded were using J-B Weld. It works just fine.
If you decide to bed your scope, be sure you apply the proper amount of release agent. I still prefer KIWI neutral paste wax for a release agent. I buff the first coat off and leave the second coat to dry to a haze.
I use a combination of surgical tubing and bunji cords to tie everything in place. Make sure you get the scope firmly in place to squeeze out most of the epoxy from the bottom of the rings. That way it isn't pointing over the hill when you go to sight it in.
No matter which way you go. double check everything and be careful.
I have stopped lapping rings. I now bed them like you do an action in a stock. But here again, you need to align the rings as close as possible before bedding them. I am currently out of Devcon. The last two scopes I have bedded were using J-B Weld. It works just fine.
If you decide to bed your scope, be sure you apply the proper amount of release agent. I still prefer KIWI neutral paste wax for a release agent. I buff the first coat off and leave the second coat to dry to a haze.
I use a combination of surgical tubing and bunji cords to tie everything in place. Make sure you get the scope firmly in place to squeeze out most of the epoxy from the bottom of the rings. That way it isn't pointing over the hill when you go to sight it in.
No matter which way you go. double check everything and be careful.
Re: Lapping rings
I can see where this is a great idea if done properly as you suggested. The only down side would be if you just got your scope and want to shoot it right now. You know how it is when you get a new toy. Thank you for the idea, I really think it's a good one.
I can see where this is a great idea if done properly as you suggested. The only down side would be if you just got your scope and want to shoot it right now. You know how it is when you get a new toy. Thank you for the idea, I really think it's a good one.
Re: Lapping rings
I purchased my alignment sets from Midway. The sets were made by Wheeler. They work fine for me. It has two pieces with points for checking alignment. And one long piece for lapping. The long rod is harder than just regular stock. So it does not wear as quickly. And is has a handle and lapping compound. They weren't very expensive, since I caught them on sale.
I purchased my alignment sets from Midway. The sets were made by Wheeler. They work fine for me. It has two pieces with points for checking alignment. And one long piece for lapping. The long rod is harder than just regular stock. So it does not wear as quickly. And is has a handle and lapping compound. They weren't very expensive, since I caught them on sale.
Re: Lapping rings
I bought both the 1 inch and 30MM lapping tool from Sinclair Intl.Its a quality tool and comes with helpful instructions. Pete
I bought both the 1 inch and 30MM lapping tool from Sinclair Intl.Its a quality tool and comes with helpful instructions. Pete
Re: Lapping rings
I glass the mounts to the receiver.
This is easy with a one piece.
This takes some skill with a two piece, to get the mounts co planar, co linear, and parallel or 20 moa down from the bore.
Weaver rings that have been lapped, I take off and throw away.
I glass the mounts to the receiver.
This is easy with a one piece.
This takes some skill with a two piece, to get the mounts co planar, co linear, and parallel or 20 moa down from the bore.
Weaver rings that have been lapped, I take off and throw away.
Re: Lapping rings
Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I glass the mounts to the receiver.
This is easy with a one piece.
This takes some skill with a two piece, to get the mounts co planar, co linear, and parallel or 20 moa down from the bore.
Weaver rings that have been lapped, I take off and throw away.
</div></div>
Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I glass the mounts to the receiver.
This is easy with a one piece.
This takes some skill with a two piece, to get the mounts co planar, co linear, and parallel or 20 moa down from the bore.
Weaver rings that have been lapped, I take off and throw away.
</div></div>
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have stopped lapping rings. I now bed them like you do an action in a stock. But here again, you need to align the rings as close as possible before bedding them. I am currently out of Devcon. The last two scopes I have bedded were using J-B Weld. It works just fine.
If you decide to bed your scope, be sure you apply the proper amount of release agent. I still prefer KIWI neutral paste wax for a release agent. I buff the first coat off and leave the second coat to dry to a haze.
I use a combination of surgical tubing and bunji cords to tie everything in place. Make sure you get the scope firmly in place to squeeze out most of the epoxy from the bottom of the rings. That way it isn't pointing over the hill when you go to sight it in.
No matter which way you go. double check everything and be careful. </div></div>
i also heard bedding is a better way to go so
my last scope was bedded to the rings and i will do it from now on, no matter what rings i use.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have stopped lapping rings. I now bed them like you do an action in a stock. But here again, you need to align the rings as close as possible before bedding them. I am currently out of Devcon. The last two scopes I have bedded were using J-B Weld. It works just fine.
If you decide to bed your scope, be sure you apply the proper amount of release agent. I still prefer KIWI neutral paste wax for a release agent. I buff the first coat off and leave the second coat to dry to a haze.
I use a combination of surgical tubing and bunji cords to tie everything in place. Make sure you get the scope firmly in place to squeeze out most of the epoxy from the bottom of the rings. That way it isn't pointing over the hill when you go to sight it in.
No matter which way you go. double check everything and be careful. </div></div>
i also heard bedding is a better way to go so
my last scope was bedded to the rings and i will do it from now on, no matter what rings i use.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slurpin dog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
</div></div>
Weaver style.
Once rings are lapped, they are customized for the errors in that installation.
I like Weaver rail type mounts to be glassed to the receiver in a fixtured way, so that the mounts are co linear, co planar, and either parallel to the bore or 20 moa lower. This is easy with once piece rails, and harder with two piece mounts.
I want to be able to move a scope and rings from rifle to rifle, and be on the paper, and no bind.
This puts me at odds with gunsmiths building $20k Mausers like jewelry. They want tight fit between mount and receiver to be filled with solder, not epoxy. Then they send it to the engraver.
This puts me at odd with Benchrest who move a scope from rings and rifle to rings and rifle. They want a one piece mount, lapped rings, and glass inside the rings. Then they want a San Francisco bathhouse paint job.
I am trying to build light weight, long range rifles, that are functional. I am building tools for men, not jewelry for pussies.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slurpin dog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
</div></div>
Weaver style.
Once rings are lapped, they are customized for the errors in that installation.
I like Weaver rail type mounts to be glassed to the receiver in a fixtured way, so that the mounts are co linear, co planar, and either parallel to the bore or 20 moa lower. This is easy with once piece rails, and harder with two piece mounts.
I want to be able to move a scope and rings from rifle to rifle, and be on the paper, and no bind.
This puts me at odds with gunsmiths building $20k Mausers like jewelry. They want tight fit between mount and receiver to be filled with solder, not epoxy. Then they send it to the engraver.
This puts me at odd with Benchrest who move a scope from rings and rifle to rings and rifle. They want a one piece mount, lapped rings, and glass inside the rings. Then they want a San Francisco bathhouse paint job.
I am trying to build light weight, long range rifles, that are functional. I am building tools for men, not jewelry for pussies.
Re: Lapping rings
Clark This puts me at odds with gunsmiths building $20k Mausers like jewelry. They want tight fit between mount and receiver to be filled with solder said:
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I'll be sure to pass the word along to the other "pussies".. </div></div>
So far, I am my only paying customer.
Builds for others are pro bono.
What does it all mean?
"Form follows function" does not sell well...except at Sniper's Hide, where like with the Marines, "Get'r done" resonates.
a "safe queen" rifle
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I'll be sure to pass the word along to the other "pussies".. </div></div>
So far, I am my only paying customer.
Builds for others are pro bono.
What does it all mean?
"Form follows function" does not sell well...except at Sniper's Hide, where like with the Marines, "Get'r done" resonates.
a "safe queen" rifle
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slurpin dog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
</div></div>
Weaver style.
Once rings are lapped, they are customized for the errors in that installation.
So when you mount your scope and rings which do you final (torque) tighten first, crossbolt or ring screws? Where I'use dedicated scopes, thought lapping would be the best prcedure to follow so as to keep as near perfect alignment as possible, whether or not beding scope to rings.
I like Weaver rail type mounts to be glassed to the receiver in a fixtured way, so that the mounts are co linear, co planar, and either parallel to the bore or 20 moa lower. This is easy with once piece rails, and harder with two piece mounts.
I want to be able to move a scope and rings from rifle to rifle, and be on the paper, and no bind.
This puts me at odds with gunsmiths building $20k Mausers like jewelry. They want tight fit between mount and receiver to be filled with solder, not epoxy. Then they send it to the engraver.
This puts me at odd with Benchrest who move a scope from rings and rifle to rings and rifle. They want a one piece mount, lapped rings, and glass inside the rings. Then they want a San Francisco bathhouse paint job.
I am trying to build light weight, long range rifles, that are functional. I am building tools for men, not jewelry for pussies. </div></div>
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Clark</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: slurpin dog</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Weaver rings, are you referring to style or manufacturer? Have you found lapping rings cause more problems than fixed?
</div></div>
Weaver style.
Once rings are lapped, they are customized for the errors in that installation.
So when you mount your scope and rings which do you final (torque) tighten first, crossbolt or ring screws? Where I'use dedicated scopes, thought lapping would be the best prcedure to follow so as to keep as near perfect alignment as possible, whether or not beding scope to rings.
I like Weaver rail type mounts to be glassed to the receiver in a fixtured way, so that the mounts are co linear, co planar, and either parallel to the bore or 20 moa lower. This is easy with once piece rails, and harder with two piece mounts.
I want to be able to move a scope and rings from rifle to rifle, and be on the paper, and no bind.
This puts me at odds with gunsmiths building $20k Mausers like jewelry. They want tight fit between mount and receiver to be filled with solder, not epoxy. Then they send it to the engraver.
This puts me at odd with Benchrest who move a scope from rings and rifle to rings and rifle. They want a one piece mount, lapped rings, and glass inside the rings. Then they want a San Francisco bathhouse paint job.
I am trying to build light weight, long range rifles, that are functional. I am building tools for men, not jewelry for pussies. </div></div>
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scout67</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I purchased my alignment sets from Midway. The sets were made by Wheeler. </div></div>
I got the same kit. Cheaper 30mm rings seem to actually benefit from the lapping, you can see the compound 'cutting' into the rings at irregular points as you check during the process.
The two sets of badgers I checked and the seekins rings I put on my last rifle required no work at all. I like precision machining.
No experience with 1" rings.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: scout67</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I purchased my alignment sets from Midway. The sets were made by Wheeler. </div></div>
I got the same kit. Cheaper 30mm rings seem to actually benefit from the lapping, you can see the compound 'cutting' into the rings at irregular points as you check during the process.
The two sets of badgers I checked and the seekins rings I put on my last rifle required no work at all. I like precision machining.
No experience with 1" rings.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Borg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For those that bed rings, how thick a bedding do you go, .010?
And what's your process? </div></div>
Personally I try to use very little. How much is actually used is entirely up to the rings in question. I use a polished steel rod either 1" or 30mm and tie it into place after the epoxy is put into the ring bottoms. I tie it in place with either latex rubber surgical tubing or bunji cords. Or a combination of both. The rod is suppossed to bottom out against the high spot in the bottoms of both rings. I usually break it loose after 18 to 24 hours so I can trim up the exess that squeezes out with an Exacto knife. I color the exposed edges of it with a Sharpie permanent marker.
If you choose to go this route, remember to use a good release agent.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Borg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For those that bed rings, how thick a bedding do you go, .010?
And what's your process? </div></div>
Personally I try to use very little. How much is actually used is entirely up to the rings in question. I use a polished steel rod either 1" or 30mm and tie it into place after the epoxy is put into the ring bottoms. I tie it in place with either latex rubber surgical tubing or bunji cords. Or a combination of both. The rod is suppossed to bottom out against the high spot in the bottoms of both rings. I usually break it loose after 18 to 24 hours so I can trim up the exess that squeezes out with an Exacto knife. I color the exposed edges of it with a Sharpie permanent marker.
If you choose to go this route, remember to use a good release agent.
Re: Lapping rings
Or burris signature series rings solve all your problems. Their only draw back is you have to slide the scope off the rails if you dont want to take them apart to swap the scope to another rifle. I have used them in all apps including cheytacs with no issues... The zee series even have offset inserts that allow you to adjust up to 20 moa in any direction.
Or burris signature series rings solve all your problems. Their only draw back is you have to slide the scope off the rails if you dont want to take them apart to swap the scope to another rifle. I have used them in all apps including cheytacs with no issues... The zee series even have offset inserts that allow you to adjust up to 20 moa in any direction.
Re: Lapping rings
I currently have the Burris Signature rings on my 300 WinMag. They work well for what they are. I don't jump out of airplanes with it. Nor does it lead any kind of a hard life of any kind. For a hard living work rifle I would use something else. I'm kind of partial to Badger equipment. But they also get either lapped or bedded.
While there is nothing WRONG with the Burris rings. In my opinion, and that's all it is, they don't really feel solid. But in real life they have functioned very well. It all boils down to what you're comfortable with and what you can afford. The end user is all that has to be satisfied with whatever product he uses.
I currently have the Burris Signature rings on my 300 WinMag. They work well for what they are. I don't jump out of airplanes with it. Nor does it lead any kind of a hard life of any kind. For a hard living work rifle I would use something else. I'm kind of partial to Badger equipment. But they also get either lapped or bedded.
While there is nothing WRONG with the Burris rings. In my opinion, and that's all it is, they don't really feel solid. But in real life they have functioned very well. It all boils down to what you're comfortable with and what you can afford. The end user is all that has to be satisfied with whatever product he uses.
Re: Lapping rings
Check out the Kokopelli alignment bar I referred to at the beginning And see if you agree with his theory of pointed alignment bars, and why his is more accurate. Makes sense to me. See what you guys think. www.kokopelliproducts.com <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jayne</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Check out the Kokopelli alignment bar I referred to at the beginning And see if you agree with his theory of pointed alignment bars, and why his is more accurate. Makes sense to me. See what you guys think. www.kokopelliproducts.com <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jayne</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
scout67 said:
Re: Lapping rings
I swear by Burris Signatures.
I swear by Burris Signatures.
Re: Lapping rings
Vic's right on this one. Bedding your rings works well as does lapping and from my experience it does not make a lot of difference on the brand of ring, the alignment is never perfect.
I also use Burris insert rings on some of my rifles. Not as robust as some but functional just the same. Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available.
Vic's right on this one. Bedding your rings works well as does lapping and from my experience it does not make a lot of difference on the brand of ring, the alignment is never perfect.
I also use Burris insert rings on some of my rifles. Not as robust as some but functional just the same. Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it.
okie
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it.
okie
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it.
okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it.
okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope.
Re: Lapping rings
Victor, if the .300 Win Mag you are referring to is the same one I handled on my visit, it is a thing of beauty. Nice rifle.
Victor, if the .300 Win Mag you are referring to is the same one I handled on my visit, it is a thing of beauty. Nice rifle.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it. okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope. </div></div>
Sorry, I must be simple minded. The only way I can see something like this would work is if the ring inserts were angled down back to front and the back ring raised slightly, same thickness on both. If you only vary insert thickness and change nothing else, the scope will be slightly bent because the top of the ring with the thin insert will pull down on the scope. You may gain some moa of elevation but you'll be shooting through a bent scope.
okie
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it. okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope. </div></div>
Sorry, I must be simple minded. The only way I can see something like this would work is if the ring inserts were angled down back to front and the back ring raised slightly, same thickness on both. If you only vary insert thickness and change nothing else, the scope will be slightly bent because the top of the ring with the thin insert will pull down on the scope. You may gain some moa of elevation but you'll be shooting through a bent scope.
okie
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nashlaw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, if the .300 Win Mag you are referring to is the same one I handled on my visit, it is a thing of beauty. Nice rifle.
</div></div>
David,
Same rifle. Thanks for the compliment. For what it is, I love it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nashlaw</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Victor, if the .300 Win Mag you are referring to is the same one I handled on my visit, it is a thing of beauty. Nice rifle.
</div></div>
David,
Same rifle. Thanks for the compliment. For what it is, I love it.
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it. okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope. </div></div>
Sorry, I must be simple minded. The only way I can see something like this would work is if the ring inserts were angled down back to front and the back ring raised slightly, same thickness on both. If you only vary insert thickness and change nothing else, the scope will be slightly bent because the top of the ring with the thin insert will pull down on the scope. You may gain some moa of elevation but you'll be shooting through a bent scope.
okie </div></div>
Okie,
There is set of thinner and thicker rings with it. While you put the thinner on in the front on the bottom the thick one will be on top and vise versa with the rear. The outside of the is radiused so they can be moved inside the metal part so not to cause stress on the scope. If you look at a set it will make perfect sense.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Victor N TN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: okiefired</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: mdesign</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Actually, you can run a thinner insert in the front and thicker in the back an build a little MOA into your scope base. Just an option for some of the shooters that have an older or different action where an incline base is not available. </div></div>
So are both the inserts angled downward back to front? Thinner up front and thicker in the rear would only cause the rear ring to clamp tighter and posibly pull down on the scope actually sightly bending it. okie </div></div>
The Burris Signature rings I used on my 300 WinMag had several sets of inserts with it. It was possible to build in several minutes of angle. I don't remember the exact number. But they swiveled to let them move without binding the scope. </div></div>
Sorry, I must be simple minded. The only way I can see something like this would work is if the ring inserts were angled down back to front and the back ring raised slightly, same thickness on both. If you only vary insert thickness and change nothing else, the scope will be slightly bent because the top of the ring with the thin insert will pull down on the scope. You may gain some moa of elevation but you'll be shooting through a bent scope.
okie </div></div>
Okie,
There is set of thinner and thicker rings with it. While you put the thinner on in the front on the bottom the thick one will be on top and vise versa with the rear. The outside of the is radiused so they can be moved inside the metal part so not to cause stress on the scope. If you look at a set it will make perfect sense.
Re: Lapping rings
just use burris univerial single dove tail rings with plastic inserts and forget all that stuff. you can adjust your moa with the diffrent plastic inserts to.
just use burris univerial single dove tail rings with plastic inserts and forget all that stuff. you can adjust your moa with the diffrent plastic inserts to.
Re: Lapping rings
NotAGuru. from your post; "the outside of your ????? is radiused"? I think you left out a word, wht is radiused? Never looked at these so this is a learning experience for me. Thanks.
okie
NotAGuru. from your post; "the outside of your ????? is radiused"? I think you left out a word, wht is radiused? Never looked at these so this is a learning experience for me. Thanks.
okie
Re: Lapping rings
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bob koch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just use burris univerial single dove tail rings with plastic inserts and forget all that stuff. you can adjust your moa with the diffrent plastic inserts to. </div></div>
What have we been talking about?
okie
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bob koch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just use burris univerial single dove tail rings with plastic inserts and forget all that stuff. you can adjust your moa with the diffrent plastic inserts to. </div></div>
What have we been talking about?
okie
Re: Lapping rings
Sorry to further hijack this thread but decided to post these pics anyway.
I no longer have this set up but it worked fine when I did. Hopfully they will provide an explanation.
The plastic inserts are rounded on the outside and the rings are rounded on the inside. There are diffent sized inserts so that you can adjust elevation and or windage without putting any stress on the scope.
Sorry to further hijack this thread but decided to post these pics anyway.
I no longer have this set up but it worked fine when I did. Hopfully they will provide an explanation.
The plastic inserts are rounded on the outside and the rings are rounded on the inside. There are diffent sized inserts so that you can adjust elevation and or windage without putting any stress on the scope.
Re: Lapping rings
BINGO! Thank you TN. Sorry for the hijack.
okie
BINGO! Thank you TN. Sorry for the hijack.
okie
Re: Lapping rings
when you guys lap your rings, how much material do you take off? Do you keep going until you have a uniform amount of material taken out over the entire ring surface? I have tried it a few times and at the start you can definitely see the high spots, but I often wondered when to stop. Usually, I keep going until all the high spots are gone and I can see that the entire surface has been effected.
when you guys lap your rings, how much material do you take off? Do you keep going until you have a uniform amount of material taken out over the entire ring surface? I have tried it a few times and at the start you can definitely see the high spots, but I often wondered when to stop. Usually, I keep going until all the high spots are gone and I can see that the entire surface has been effected.
Re: Lapping rings
Veezer,The instructions that came with my Sinclair tool says to try for 75% contact on the bottom half of the rings.I have had a few that had more than that to start,and I tried to get 100%.Had one set that I did for someone that was so bad that I made him buy something different.Bedding would have solved his problem,but I was out of it.Sometimes you use what you have! Pete
Veezer,The instructions that came with my Sinclair tool says to try for 75% contact on the bottom half of the rings.I have had a few that had more than that to start,and I tried to get 100%.Had one set that I did for someone that was so bad that I made him buy something different.Bedding would have solved his problem,but I was out of it.Sometimes you use what you have! Pete
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