Lwrci Repr Mk2?

[A5scott]

Sorry to see such crappy results with the MKII REPRs. I have a MK I 16" heavy barrel that I love. I probably have 5000 rounds thru it, and it had some cycling issues after I had it cerakoted, though I think it's back to good there now. Last time I shot it, I think it was something like 5 moa or worse at 100 yards with Federal xm80. I'll have to do more testing on it, but I think I need a new barrel. I was hoping to get one of the newer REPRs when they add the side charging handle back in, but I want something a little better than 1 moa, and I want to shoot the FGMM 175's to stretch it out to 1000.

My buddy has a Sig 716DMR and that thing is good to 900 gongs with xm80. I'm thinking JP or F&D defense. I need the side charging handle.

Hopefully this gets sorted out for you guys

Scott

 

[DMONEY]

Well my rifle showed up yesterday and after inspection they had indeed replaced the barrel. So I took it out to the range with several boxes of ammo (1-Federal XM80 ball, 2-FGMM 168gr., 1-FGMM 175gr., 1-Hornady Match 168gr., and 2-Hornady Match 178gr.) to see how it would do.

- I started with the XM80 149gr. to get it sited in and then shot groups with the remaining rounds- averaged about 1MOA- It functioned with out issue at gas block position 14.

- Next were the FGMM 168gr. (which on the paper work that came back with the rifle is what they said it was tested with)- averaged just under 1MOA - after each of the first couple rounds the rifle failed to cycle and failed to feed (round jammed between bolt face and barrel extension) the third and forth round at position 14. I turned the gas block to position 16 for another 5 rounds with same results. I then turned gas block to position 18 for another 5 rounds and yet again fail to cycle and fail to feed. I then turn the gas block all the way to position 20 and same results. I then screwed the gas block adjustment screw all the way out and wiped it down and inspected for clogged ports or damage-nothing, it had a little carbon on it but looked fine. screwed back in. I then set to position 16 and put another 5 rounds through it with same results as before, failure to cycle and failure to feed. I tried another 5 rounds at position 20 once more but still the same problems occurred. I then turned to position 0 with the gas off and shot the last 10 rounds by shooting the round then cycling the bolt by hand via charging handle and bolt release in which rounds ejected fine when the charging handle was pulled rearward and it chambered the rounds fine when the bolt release was pushed (best groups with this ammo were a result of cycling by hand).

- Then I moved on to the Hornady Match 168gr. rounds which my rifle previously had several issues with chambering and failing to fire before the rifle was sent to LWRC for repairs.- averaged 1-1 1/4MOA - I set the gas block to position 14 and fired a 3 rounds and then it failed to cycle, I then adjusted the gas block to position 16 and shot the remaining 2 rounds for that groups with no issues. After that I was able to shoot another 3 groups of 5 rounds with no issues what so ever.

- I then moved on to the Hornady Match 178gr. rounds which were by far the most problematic rounds before the rifle was sent in for repairs.- averaged around 3/4MOA - ( best group with this ammo 1/2MOA) With the position still at 16 I was able to shot 8 consecutive 5 round groups no issues what so ever.

- Finally I moved to the FGMM 175gr. - averaged 1MOA (could have been better but quit shooting after 2 groups do to functioning issues)- With the gas block still at position 16 I loaded up 5 rounds and fired a shot and it failed to cycle. I then adjusted the gas block to position 20 with no improvement, just the same issues I had before with the FGMM 168gr. rounds. So I the turned gas block to 0 and shot one more 5 round group with the rifle by cycling it by hand as I ended up doing with the FGMM 168gr. rounds previously. As it did previously, the group shot by manually cycling the rifle was just over 1/2MOA .

I took the rifle home cleaned it up a bit. Now I will see if they will send me some replacement components for the adjustable gas block or if I will once again have to send them the rifle... Also just a note, When I got my rifle back it was filthy with carbon build up in the break, hand guard, and chamber from not being cleaned after testing. Also the new barrel had tool makers all the way down the flutes were the ball nosed end mill being used was chipped (not a big deal and on a different note it shot great compared to the first barrel that came on the rifle), but for a $4200 rifle I would expect better quality.

update- I just talked to Rodney at LWRC about the issues with the FGMM and he gave me a few suggestions to try out tomorrow to see if I can get it working properly. I will let you all know how it goes

I will wait to comment till after you retest ,,, good luck tomorrow

 

[hossdaniel4]

Do to the weather being so nice this weekend the range was a little to crowded for me to be able to retest the rifle, but they are calling for rain again next weekend so I should be able to get out there and do some more testing then. Sorry for the delay...

 

[BarrettBoy]

My rifle has been at LWRC for all most two weeks for rework/ repair, so hopefully when I get it back it will be squared away. If you get a chance could you try a box of the 178's and let me know how it goes it would be greatly appreciated.

I couldn't find any 178gr at my LGS to try out through the rifle. I'll keep an eye out for them if I stumble upon them somewhere else.
But here are a couple pics of the rig just for fun.

 

[hossdaniel4]

After my previous shooting session where I was checking out LWRC's repair shop work on my rifle (posted above), and spoke with Rodney (LWRC CS) about the issues the rifle was still having. He told me that they do/did all their testing using Federal Gold Medal Match 168gr BTHP and was surprised to hear that when I got my rifle back that the ammo wasn't preforming. We then went through over the phone several ways they trouble shoot the rifles and threw this it was discovered that one of the causes may be that the BCG wasn't sufficiently lubricated (He told me that their rifles like to run with the BCG really wet until completely broken in). So I was able to get out to the range yesterday and give the rifle another try with another box of FGMM 175gr. and a box of Hornady Match 178gr.. When I got to the range the first thing I did was to pull out the bolt carrier group and sprayed it liberally with oil (I'm not a fan of grease on my rifles) until it was dripping, I then reinserted it into the rifle.

- I started with the Hornady 178gr. rounds that worked well for me on my previous trip after my rifle was returned. I loaded four rounds that I had left over from the last shooting session before I sent my rifle in for repair (these were the exact rounds that wouldn't chamber or fire after dozens of attempts with each individual round previously in January posted above) to confirm zero. all four rounds functioned without any issues or hesitation and proved that the zero was good as well. I then loaded up and shot four 5 round groups that averaged about 1MOA, the best goup was about 3/4" and the worst was about 1 1/2" do to a flyer that was my fault the other 4 rounds of the group were touching. If I hadn't thrown the one shot all groups would have been sub-moa.

- I then moved onto the Federal Gold Medal Match that gave me nothing but trouble on my last outing. I loaded up five rounds and proceeded to shoot a group that turned out to be the best of the day coming in at just over 1/2" group but not quite 5/8" and to my surprise it did this without any issues or problems. I then shot three more 5 round groups with only one issue of a double feed on the second round of the second group in which I backed the gas block down one position and solved the problem. The worst group was around 1 1/8" group (my second group with the double feed and adjusting the gas block), but the rest were below 3/4"s.

So now it appears that the rifle may finally be working properly and is just in need of a little more breaking in... but in all honesty at this point I don't really trust it's reliability and will probably sell it. I'm sure it might turn out to be a fine rifle but with our history I doubt I will ever be able to fully trust it. I guess let me know your thoughts on it. I still have a slew of match ammo I bought to try in this rifle but, I'm not that motivated to go to the range and fight it right now

 

[DMONEY]

After my previous shooting session where I was checking out LWRC's repair shop work on my rifle (posted above), and spoke with Rodney (LWRC CS) about the issues the rifle was still having. He told me that they do/did all their testing using Federal Gold Medal Match 168gr BTHP and was surprised to hear that when I got my rifle back that the ammo wasn't preforming. We then went through over the phone several ways they trouble shoot the rifles and threw this it was discovered that one of the causes may be that the BCG wasn't sufficiently lubricated (He told me that their rifles like to run with the BCG really wet until completely broken in). So I was able to get out to the range yesterday and give the rifle another try with another box of FGMM 175gr. and a box of Hornady Match 178gr.. When I got to the range the first thing I did was to pull out the bolt carrier group and sprayed it liberally with oil (I'm not a fan of grease on my rifles) until it was dripping, I then reinserted it into the rifle.

- I started with the Hornady 178gr. rounds that worked well for me on my previous trip after my rifle was returned. I loaded four rounds that I had left over from the last shooting session before I sent my rifle in for repair (these were the exact rounds that wouldn't chamber or fire after dozens of attempts with each individual round previously in January posted above) to confirm zero. all four rounds functioned without any issues or hesitation and proved that the zero was good as well. I then loaded up and shot four 5 round groups that averaged about 1MOA, the best goup was about 3/4" and the worst was about 1 1/2" do to a flyer that was my fault the other 4 rounds of the group were touching. If I hadn't thrown the one shot all groups would have been sub-moa.

- I then moved onto the Federal Gold Medal Match that gave me nothing but trouble on my last outing. I loaded up five rounds and proceeded to shoot a group that turned out to be the best of the day coming in at just over 1/2" group but not quite 5/8" and to my surprise it did this without any issues or problems. I then shot three more 5 round groups with only one issue of a double feed on the second round of the second group in which I backed the gas block down one position and solved the problem. The worst group was around 1 1/8" group (my second group with the double feed and adjusting the gas block), but the rest were below 3/4"s.

So now it appears that the rifle may finally be working properly and is just in need of a little more breaking in... but in all honesty at this point I don't really trust it's reliability and will probably sell it. I'm sure it might turn out to be a fine rifle but with our history I doubt I will ever be able to fully trust it. I guess let me know your thoughts on it. I still have a slew of match ammo I bought to try in this rifle but, I'm not that motivated to go to the range and fight it right now

You really hung in there / gave it a real chance to prove its self / more then i would have done with the amount of money and time you invested .... agree sounds like it could be a shooter ,, JMO.... i would rather have a 1 moa gun that goes bang every time ... trust gone / gun gone sale it .... thanks for all the info and updates

 

[hossdaniel4]

You really hung in there / gave it a real chance to prove its self / more then i would have done with the amount of money and time you invested .... agree sounds like it could be a shooter ,, JMO.... i would rather have a 1 moa gun that goes bang every time ... trust gone / gun gone sale it .... thanks for all the info and updates

Yeah that's the way I look at it as well. My priorities with firearms in order go - 1=Reliability 2=Accuracy 3= Ruggedness 4=Cost. I was hoping this would be as reliable and tough as my ak's but as accurate as a bolt gun... I shot a sr25 that was a 1/2MOA repeatedly with handloads and factory and I've seen posts from obr owners that are getting about the same, but I just don't completely trust DI rifles for long term abuse. Oh well I guess I will just have to wait longer.

 

[tkdiver1]

I just ordered one of these and then of coarse I found this thread. I can still refuse it when it arrives and just pay for shipping both ways. Would you suggest I do that? Or should I take a chance knowing that they will stand behind it if its not right?

 

[hossdaniel4]

It depends on what your looking for in a rifle. If you want a piston rifle HK makes the MR762a1 (which I was originally going to buy, but I wanted a 20" barrel for longer range shooting) that is a great rifle, but only comes with a 16" barrel. There's also LaRue Obr's if you don't mind Di rifle. If I had a chance to do it all over (+$7000 on rifle,scope, ammo, ext., and months of weekends) I would probably have gone with the MR762a1, which wouldn't have been able to do much past 1000 yrds but it would have preformed with out issues. The MkII R.E.P.R.'s IMHO are just to picky with ammo to be called a true "battle rifle" its more of an over priced hunting rifle with a whole lot of money sent on its' advertisment by LWRC's sales force. Not to bash LWRC but it seems that they spent more time and money on the MkII's advertisement and looks instead of making a rifle that actually preforms. Where back ten years ago if you bought a "MkI", those things work great and have proven themselves over the years to be reliable and trust worthy.
If it was my money I would go else where and save a couple hundred dollars and get a better product out of the box, but that's just the lesson I learned and my opinion...

 

[DMONEY]

THERE IS HOPE ....... https://barrett.net/firearms/rec10

 

[jag09]

If you want a Piston Rifle with a barrel over 16" check out PWS. Long Stroke Piston rifle, with the option for 16" and 20" in 308 and 20" in 6.5CM
Also freedommunitions had a sale on their complete lower currently and that will give you a coupon for a nicely discounted upper, which is what I did.

 

[hossdaniel4]

Not a fan of Barretts accuracy (it's good just not great) but we will see how they turn out.

If I were worried about budget I'd go with Ruger's SR-762 before PWS, no offense. The SR-762 is a nice gun I have nearly bought a couple times just not quite there on accuracy although many folks have proven then to be consistent 1.5MOA rifles which if nice for the price and reliability is also really good with these. But I prefer all my rifles to shoot 1MOA or better. And if its only a 1MOA gun I'm not paying over $1000 and its got to be reliable. I have several rifles that I have tested for 2-3k rounds without cleaning without issues before cleaning and adding to the family. Maybe the repr MkII will make it there but so far with all the issues I've had with the first +400 rounds it will take a bit more time for me to want to mess with it (considering that I have now only had 1 session out of many where I did not have to fight the rifle).

 

[A5scott]

Have you looked at F&D defense? They have been on my radar for a while, seen one in person, from a hide member.

Scott

 

[hossdaniel4]

Well I have taken the rifle out a couple more times and it seems that so long as the bcg is heavily oiled the rifle finally works properly. I have since put a few boxes of IMI match, Hornady Black, and Hornady Supermatch. All Hornady rounds have proven to shoot sub-moa . The IMI Match boxes of ammo did not do so well best groups were just over 1" at 100 yards (IMI Match ammo were 7.62x51 rounds and so far none of the 7.62 Match ammos have preformed very well) . It seems the rifle definitely prefers 308 over 7.62 .

 

[Tracker33]

I purchased a LWRC C.S.A.S.S. late last year (brand new sealed from the factory). I have had the same exact issues as hossdaniel4 describes using similar processes to evaluate the rifle and trying to cure the ails of my LWRC. I carefully broke the barrel in and accuracy was poor and inconsistent as well. I had multiple failure to feed events with different magazines. Magpuls were the worst and KAC mags worked slightly well. I also sent my rifle back to LWRC. They replaced the barrel since they found the original chamber was rough cut per their documentation.

Received the rifle back from LWRC with non-suppressed gas block set to 14. Have been using a NightForce 2.5-10 and Geissele mount. Accuracy results remain poor at 100 yds. There is very little consistency in the patterns of where shots hit. Best shot groups (rare occurrence) were about 3" at 100 meters unsuppressed. Suppression improved accuracy to some extent but accuracy remains poor with best shot group closing to about 2" at 100 meters with this group size being a rare occurrence. Tried various quality Match ammo with 168gr BTHP Hornady or 168gr BTHP PPU Match producing the "best" results.

A few months ago I purchased a HK MR762A1 with a OSS Suppressor unit. The combined price was the same as what I paid for the LWRC CSASS alone. Suppressor is in FFL jail. Using the same scope and mount on the HK MR762A1, and same ammo, I achieved sub MOA at 100 meters with very little barrel break in occurring.

The LWRC has been an expensive disappointment. I approached it with an open mind. LWRC customer service is good with respect to communication and willingness to try and address my concerns. Given one trip to the factory for a brand new gun occurred and the results improved only slightly, I am extremely disappointed with the LWRC CSASS. I am stepping away from it and will give it one more chance in the future. If the rifle performs as it has in the past, I will likely communicate my concerns in writing to LWRC in a professional manner, and will sell the rifle at a loss. So far, this has been a horrible and expensive lesson.

 

[JeffLebowski]

Have you looked at F&D defense? They have been on my radar for a while, seen one in person, from a hide member.

Scott

You might research how they conduct themselves online, on this very forum.

 

[hossdaniel4]

I purchased a LWRC C.S.A.S.S. late last year (brand new sealed from the factory). I have had the same exact issues as hossdaniel4 describes using similar processes to evaluate the rifle and trying to cure the ails of my LWRC. I carefully broke the barrel in and accuracy was poor and inconsistent as well. I had multiple failure to feed events with different magazines. Magpuls were the worst and KAC mags worked slightly well. I also sent my rifle back to LWRC. They replaced the barrel since they found the original chamber was rough cut per their documentation.

Received the rifle back from LWRC with non-suppressed gas block set to 14. Have been using a NightForce 2.5-10 and Geissele mount. Accuracy results remain poor at 100 yds. There is very little consistency in the patterns of where shots hit. Best shot groups (rare occurrence) were about 3" at 100 meters unsuppressed. Suppression improved accuracy to some extent but accuracy remains poor with best shot group closing to about 2" at 100 meters with this group size being a rare occurrence. Tried various quality Match ammo with 168gr BTHP Hornady or 168gr BTHP PPU Match producing the "best" results.

A few months ago I purchased a HK MR762A1 with a OSS Suppressor unit. The combined price was the same as what I paid for the LWRC CSASS alone. Suppressor is in FFL jail. Using the same scope and mount on the HK MR762A1, and same ammo, I achieved sub MOA at 100 meters with very little barrel break in occurring.

The LWRC has been an expensive disappointment. I approached it with an open mind. LWRC customer service is good with respect to communication and willingness to try and address my concerns. Given one trip to the factory for a brand new gun occurred and the results improved only slightly, I am extremely disappointed with the LWRC CSASS. I am stepping away from it and will give it one more chance in the future. If the rifle performs as it has in the past, I will likely communicate my concerns in writing to LWRC in a professional manner, and will sell the rifle at a loss. So far, this has been a horrible and expensive lesson.

Tracker33 Just for shits and giggles if you get a chance back out your gas block adjustment screw all the way and make sure that none of the rings gaps are aligned with one another. And try using an excessive amount of oil on the bolt carrier group (I wasn't kidding when I said that mine as to be dripping with oil when I shoot it other wise it will have issues), when you go to put it in the rifle it should look like you just pulled it out of a fish tank. I also try turning your gas down to between 4-9 position (which ever is the lowest position that it will still cycle on) and it should help tighten your groups a bit. When I have mine up to 14-16 with the new barrel it shoots 3"-4" groups but at the lower setting they go to sub-moa. But that's just my $.02 hope you can get it figured out. And if not call up Rodney at LWRC he might know some other things you can try.

 

[CharlieK27x]

I know this is an old thread. But I’m really surprised by all the issues people are having with these rifles. I have a C.S.A.S.S this I picked up from a friend of mine (he bought it new) he put about 200 rounds threw it and I have run about 600 and neither one of us had any malfunctions of any kind. And I’m getting about 1 - 1.5”groups at 100 yards out of it. (The groups in this photo are all over the target a bit. But that’s me not being able to get comfortable, not the rifle.)
I’m running it with a 3.5 ACOG, and Atlas bipod. I swapped out the SSA-E trigger for an SSA (I see this more as a 600 yard battle rifle so the SSA-E was too light for my purpose) and I swapped out the muzzle break for a Surefire WarComp. (Way to much noise and Concussion from the break) this is a 16” barrel. And yes I spray painted it green. I hated the Tungsten color it was from huge factory.
The only ammo eith of us have used in it is 150 grain Lake City ball. So no high speed ammo. No serious magnification and still doing pretty well. I’m super happy with it.
I’m running it with Magpul 20 rounds G3 Pmags