Sidearms & Scatterguns Mark 23 vs USP T
- Thread starter MisterMoad
- Start date
I had a Usp and I really loved it. I still regret letting her go. However I still own a Mark 23 and it is by far my favorite handgun of all time. It is just off the charts. People will rag on it saying it is huge and heavy. They are half right it is huge. It's not heavy my full size 1911 is much heavier. The other knock is that it is expensive. It is but if you like it who cares. If I were you I would get the Mark you will try to itch that scratch with lesser handguns and I can tell you first hand it doesn't work.
It's what fits your hand & intended purpose. The MK23 is designed as an offensive handgun, large & not easily concealed if that is a concern. The MK23 is no doubt an excellent handgun but for most people the USP & Tactical will perform the same task. That being said I have four (4) USP's. One tactical and a USP with a Jarvis barrel. The MK23 could be used to tow a trailer if need be and commands a heavy price.
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Money no object, get both...and their cans.
Depends on the intended use: if it's a range toy Mark 23, for carry the USP-T would probably be more practical because of its size.
There is nothing quite like a crew served pistol that is the Mark 23, however. You really have to handle and shoot one to appreciate it.
For suppressors, only the respective KAC ones are "approved" for the Mark 23 or USP-T. In addition to dimensional differences between the suppressors, the Mark 23 barrel is threaded M16 Right hand which is unique to the Mark 23, and the USP-T and other HKs being M16 Left Hand...
KAC supressor lead times are lengthy and it will probably be at least a year before you get your stamp.
If the pistol has to be a HK that can be suppressed, I would suggest looking at the HK45CT and HK45T as other potential candidates, too. The Light LEM variants on both HK45s are good.
Depends on the intended use: if it's a range toy Mark 23, for carry the USP-T would probably be more practical because of its size.
There is nothing quite like a crew served pistol that is the Mark 23, however. You really have to handle and shoot one to appreciate it.
For suppressors, only the respective KAC ones are "approved" for the Mark 23 or USP-T. In addition to dimensional differences between the suppressors, the Mark 23 barrel is threaded M16 Right hand which is unique to the Mark 23, and the USP-T and other HKs being M16 Left Hand...
KAC supressor lead times are lengthy and it will probably be at least a year before you get your stamp.
If the pistol has to be a HK that can be suppressed, I would suggest looking at the HK45CT and HK45T as other potential candidates, too. The Light LEM variants on both HK45s are good.
You're probably right. I've owned a USP-Tactical and getting rid of it was one of my biggest regrets. I always drooled over the Mark when I had that USP. I imagine I'd wish I had a USP if I owned the Mark. Might as well get both.
My wife is gonna kill me.
Having been around and shot a mk23 more times than I can or want to count as well as owning a usp tact in 9mm. That damn mk23, I found it about useless (due to my small girl hands and how big and heavy it is) in most situation. Is it a great gun, FUCK yes; there is abso-fucking-lutely no doubt about it! However that damn thing could be used as a wrecking ball even miley cryus couldn't handle. This is also coming from a guy that has tiny little girl hands... was issued a mk25 and loved that damn thing. I have never liked shooting 45 (say what you want I like my 9mm), but if that's your thing and a mk23 gets your pants tight, fuck me and everyone else and get your pants nice and tight, then give everyone the cock salute of a lifetime with that mark23.
My suggestion would consist of this: 1) What is your intended use of this firearm?... Waitttt that question doesn't count cuz both pistols will work very well for just about anything (unless using as wrecking ball in which mk23 wins). 2) What makes your pants the tightest on a scale of 1 to Kate Hudson, a mk23 or a usp tact tricked out with can??
Now its just up to you to decide.
My suggestion would consist of this: 1) What is your intended use of this firearm?... Waitttt that question doesn't count cuz both pistols will work very well for just about anything (unless using as wrecking ball in which mk23 wins). 2) What makes your pants the tightest on a scale of 1 to Kate Hudson, a mk23 or a usp tact tricked out with can??
Now its just up to you to decide.
I initially purchased a Mk23 when they first came out and tried really hard to like it. It is bolshy, not particularly well balanced and well, 'bolshy' best describes my experience with it. I do have large hands, but even so, I found the pistol somewhat cumbersome, even though it was quite accurate. When the opportunity to trade it for a new .45 Tactical and .45 Expert came up, I jumped on it.
In retrospect, I should have bought these in the first place.
In retrospect, I should have bought these in the first place.
I have both the mk23 really shine when you are shooting it longer ranges. 50 yard you can see the difference on paper if your not shooting those ranges the ups tac will service you just as well. It's cheaper,smaller and has the same safety and decocker set up as a standard usp the 23 does not. I have 3 mark23 and 2 tacticals love them all
Guy I knew had a .40 USP. He loved it, and I shot it and handled it and it was a very nice pistol indeed. Better built than the Glocks, which is about all I own/use for semi pisolllllllll. Lots of folks like the various USP's, no, they love them in fact. I wouldn't mind owning one. Conversely, I've never heard of ANYONE really like the Mk23 for practical purposes. It's just too damn big is the usual complaint. How would you carry it?
And what about the FN .45? Isn't it a nice pistol with much of the Mk23 features in a smaller package, or am wrong here? I know they come in kits, in cases with spare mags, suppressor, reflex and night sights, etc.
I have a G21, 13rds. .45ACP and it's cheaper and does the job extremely well, in addition to being practical, even if it is on the large, chunky side.
If you want longer range, harder hitting, 15rds., full-size, something both practical AND a great range toy, the Glock G20SF 10mm is really hard to beat, and it's one of my favorite pistols. Shoots flatter and shoots a lot farther than .45, more MV and KE. Lighter loads are good defense loads and practice loads. If you wanna suppress it, Bar-Sto makes phenomenal fitted barrels and there's a few good cans that can handle 200 or 220gr. 10mm subs, which also have greater cross-sectional density, translating to greater penetration vs. .45. 10mm is a very flexible cartridge. Just something to consider, particularly if you handload. You could likely get this and a .45 USP for the price of the Mk23, you know.
Just my opinion.
And what about the FN .45? Isn't it a nice pistol with much of the Mk23 features in a smaller package, or am wrong here? I know they come in kits, in cases with spare mags, suppressor, reflex and night sights, etc.
I have a G21, 13rds. .45ACP and it's cheaper and does the job extremely well, in addition to being practical, even if it is on the large, chunky side.
If you want longer range, harder hitting, 15rds., full-size, something both practical AND a great range toy, the Glock G20SF 10mm is really hard to beat, and it's one of my favorite pistols. Shoots flatter and shoots a lot farther than .45, more MV and KE. Lighter loads are good defense loads and practice loads. If you wanna suppress it, Bar-Sto makes phenomenal fitted barrels and there's a few good cans that can handle 200 or 220gr. 10mm subs, which also have greater cross-sectional density, translating to greater penetration vs. .45. 10mm is a very flexible cartridge. Just something to consider, particularly if you handload. You could likely get this and a .45 USP for the price of the Mk23, you know.
Just my opinion.
Comparing the FN 45 & any HK is apples & oranges. I had a new FNP 45 go kaboom in my hand (defective gun). The "new" FNX 45 had /has some magazine problems with the point being both the FNP & FNX handguns have some issues and FN has horrible magazine availability. Customer service absolutely sucked in my case. Glock & HK are light years ahead of FN.
The Mark 23 is a niche weapon. For the price of it you can buy a good 1911, or a USP, or even a HK45C with a few extra odds and ends. There is damn near zero aftermarket support for it, in part because of it's price, and the amount of people who are interested in it is very small, so there is no demand for any company to really make anything for it. It's size also limits it to be carried in any type of concealed role, not that you couldn't though, just that some end up finding something smaller than a 5.87" barrel. The sights(both the front and rear) are small, really small, and there are a ton of companies out there who make sights for the USP, but I haven't seen anybody who has full production going on for any Mark 23 sights. The size is, as was already stated, a pain when firing, and I have large hands too. It won't help either if you fire it barehanded, and, after many rounds of firing, you might come to asking yourself if it would be beneficial to stippling your $2000(what I paid) pistol. That is probably not going to happen.
Now the above had to be said. There are some good points. When I had mine, other people at the range would have their target on the 25 and 50 yard line. My target was on the 75. I could hit it too, not as well as on the 50, or even the 25 yard ranges, but it was still cool nonetheless to be able to fire that far and still hit the silhouette. Grouping it was great, but when I bought mine new, a shop made 1911 at that time would have better accuracy then the Mark 23, at around the same price. Then again it wasn't designed to shoot any bullseye competitions with. The recoil system is good, in that it works. I've never had an issue with it. The O-ring idea is okay, but I have my own doubts on it.
Finally, I think H&K discontinued them. I called them up about it some time ago, and they said they did, but they still make parts for it. The supply chain is still in place for those who do have on. H&K said they could sell them direct (when I called them), or you can go over instead to hkparts.net.
In conclusion, I would say that you make a list of jobs for your handgun, for what you want it to do, not what you want your handgun to do for you.
Now the above had to be said. There are some good points. When I had mine, other people at the range would have their target on the 25 and 50 yard line. My target was on the 75. I could hit it too, not as well as on the 50, or even the 25 yard ranges, but it was still cool nonetheless to be able to fire that far and still hit the silhouette. Grouping it was great, but when I bought mine new, a shop made 1911 at that time would have better accuracy then the Mark 23, at around the same price. Then again it wasn't designed to shoot any bullseye competitions with. The recoil system is good, in that it works. I've never had an issue with it. The O-ring idea is okay, but I have my own doubts on it.
Finally, I think H&K discontinued them. I called them up about it some time ago, and they said they did, but they still make parts for it. The supply chain is still in place for those who do have on. H&K said they could sell them direct (when I called them), or you can go over instead to hkparts.net.
In conclusion, I would say that you make a list of jobs for your handgun, for what you want it to do, not what you want your handgun to do for you.
My brother had one do that to him, fortunately he wasn't hurt worse than a sore hand and some plastic slivers in his face. FN refunded him for the cost of the gun and paid the bill from the ER without a fuss.
I did not get injured bad, slightly burned hand & it blew the ambi safety off. I was lucky not getting hurt but not so lucky getting my handgun repaired. I had to return it to FN on my dime and waited a while to get it back.
Well I had a kaboom in my new FMP-45....
Your ruptured case looks familiar, his did the same type of thing but his gun was destroyed. The magazine was blown out the bottom and the frame split. I always suspected it wasn't in complete battery when it happened as, like yours, the pressure was way too high when the case started to extract.
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