Mark 4 12-40x Spotter - Trouble seeing holes at 300+ Yards

[1911Shootist]

I recently went a little over budget and picked up a blem Leupold Mark 4 12-40 for a decent deal for my first spotting scope. However, it's performance in spotting 6.5 holes on paper at 300-500 yards is less than expected. I'm sure winter conditions didn't help with bright light, cold weather (10-20 °F), lots of snow, lots of thermal gradient visible. Stiff focus in the cold didn't help either.

Are my expectations too high of a spotter? Or was the weather/conditions fighting me? It seems like all the spotters with ranging reticles are lower magnification, lower quality glass, or extremely expensive. I figured the Mark 4 would have enough magnification at 40x to see holes, but the coarse focus made it difficult to really hone in on the paper.

Any other Mark 4 users have similar experience? I almost wonder if mine is more than a cosmetic blem...

I could send this one back if there are other recommendations. Uses are calling corrections in PRS/NRL22 and informal bench paper matches out to 500 yards.

 

[Baron23]

I recently went a little over budget and picked up a blem Leupold Mark 4 12-40 for a decent deal for my first spotting scope. However, it's performance in spotting 6.5 holes on paper at 300-500 yards is less than expected. I'm sure winter conditions didn't help with bright light, cold weather (10-20 °F), lots of snow, lots of thermal gradient visible. Stiff focus in the cold didn't help either.

Are my expectations too high of a spotter? Or was the weather/conditions fighting me? It seems like all the spotters with ranging reticles are lower magnification, lower quality glass, or extremely expensive. I figured the Mark 4 would have enough magnification at 40x to see holes, but the coarse focus made it difficult to really hone in on the paper.

Any other Mark 4 users have similar experience? I almost wonder if mine is more than a cosmetic blem...

I could send this one back if there are other recommendations. Uses are calling corrections in PRS/NRL22 and informal bench paper matches out to 500 yards.

Shoot Splatter Shot targets. I’ve used my Mk 4 to 500 with these and could see 6.5 size holes.

 

[1911Shootist]

Shoot Splatter Shot targets. I’ve used my Mk 4 to 500 with these and could see 6.5 size holes.

I do when I’m target shooting, but our bench matches use official targets.

 

[BCP]

Are my expectations too high of a spotter?

It's a spotting scope not the Hubble.

Most places I have shot you have people marking the targets for you ie working the pits. If you can't do that then it will have to be shoot-n-see type targets or shooting steel.

 

[mike278]

Better glass is better glass, and atmospheric conditions have an effect, but with all things being equal, a larger objective will give you a better chance of seeing the holes at distance. I've seen the math posted somewhere, but there is a physical limit to the size of the object a scope can resolve relative to its objective size. You might try borrowing a scope with an 80/85mm or 100mm objective and see if that will get you what you need.

 

[mike278]

It was bugging me, so I found the math. Resolution(in seconds of arc)=134/diameter of objective in mm. So, it's physics plus atmospherics holding you back. Can't really do anything about atmospherics, but you can get a nigger objective to help with the physics. Ebay, Adorama, BH photo, and others have used 100mm Pentax or Celestron Regals that can be had for relatively cheap. With a decent eyepiece, you get more resolution without taking out a mortgage for a Swarovski or Leica.

 

[carbonbased]

Besides atmospherics, it also going to depend on the raw quality of your eyes.

Couple posts I made.

Best spotting scope for over 1 mile

I'm currently routinely shooting out to 1000 yds. I'm definitely working my way up to 1M, but if my dream world comes true one day...maybe 2M...and where ever I get over time. What's the best spotting scope to see shots at those distances? I see the Swarovski name show up a lot. And should...

www.snipershide.com

What is good magnification range for range spotting scope?

First of all - thank you everyone who has responded to my other question about angled vs straight spotting scope - quite useful. My next question is about magnification range. Few facts I am new to this sport. So far I've been shooting 200 yards (and see 100-200 yards as dominant in my...

www.snipershide.com

I have no actual experience on this, but as mentioned, others who know say the larger the objective = better theoretical resolution.

Or go with a remote video system.

 

[jbuck88]

I think you might be asking too much for that scope in tough conditions. Perfect conditions maybe.

I had the mk4, now the gold ring version, and it offers a lot for what it is. The glass is decent, but it is not near alpha clarity when on the upper range. I was able to use it back and forth with my Hensoldt spotter60 and felt that under 30x it was pretty good. Over that and you could definitely see the difference.

 

[Woodlanddude]

I have utilized one of these to spot at every ASC match for years. They are fine. On a cold winter day you described you can get a lot of mirage. You have to zoom down to get a clearer image.