- Thread starter Asiparks
- Start date
Considering both the 3-18 and 1-6 myself.
Have extensively messed with them under the other brand label, Crimson Trace 5 Series. There's a little lash in the clicks but otherwise they're fantastic optics for that money. The CT line had an original MSRP around $2k. I picked a number of them up on fire sale from Midway. Also got a bunch of the lower 2 and 3 series with similarly reduced prices, all are really quite nice. I'd put them around Burris XTR Bushnell XRS kind of optic.
I was going to grab one but the 5x25 with a 34mm tube has only 20 MRAD adjustment ??? WTF?
LOL, who in Brownells thought of this?
www.brownells.com
MPO EXTENDED RANGE ELEVATION TURRET
MPO EXTENDED RANGE ELEVATION TURRET https://www.brownells.com/optics/scopes/rifle-scopes/mpo-extended-range-elevation-turret/
www.brownells.com 
The reticle sucks too IMO
OK $200 question... Eurooptics has the Riton X7 3-18 for $499, slashed from about $1200
. It appears to be materially the same scope as the MPO, but with differently styled turrets and reticles.
Does anyone know if it's the same optical design and glass as the MPO equivalent ?
@ilya ?
www.eurooptic.com
. It appears to be materially the same scope as the MPO, but with differently styled turrets and reticles.
Does anyone know if it's the same optical design and glass as the MPO equivalent ?
@ilya ?
Riton Optics X7 Conquer 3-18x50mm PSR Riflescope 7C318LFIP
FREE SHIPPING on Riton Optics X7 Conquer 3-18x50mm PSR Riflescope 7C318LFIP
Don't know how deep it gopes, but the Riton X7 is Japanese made.OK $200 question... Eurooptics has the Riton X7 3-18 for $499, slashed from about $1200
. It appears to be materially the same scope as the MPO, but with differently styled turrets and reticles.
Does anyone know if it's the same optical design and glass as the MPO equivalent ?
@ilya ?
Riton Optics X7 Conquer 3-18x50mm PSR Riflescope 7C318LFIP
FREE SHIPPING on Riton Optics X7 Conquer 3-18x50mm PSR Riflescope 7C318LFIP
I have the mpo 3-18 and like it. Previously owned a uso 3-17, a steiner m 5x25, and currently have a maven 5x30. I think the mpo is pretty solid for the price. Glass is decent, I'd say equal to the maven I have. It's on my 18in spr build so the reticle makes sense for my use. Overall very pleased with it.
Get the Burris XTR-II illuminated 5-25x50 on sale at EuroOptic for only $650… Philippines built, Japanese glass, 34mm tube, plenty of travel, lifetime “Forever” warranty. Burris bought German optics manufacturer Steiner, and they do share some tech between the brands…Which is a good thing.
Way better scope than the PST Gen2, but have never seen an MPO in person, so no idea on how it compares.
I had the crimson trace series 5 version 3-18. Same manufacturer as the mpo and Riton. It was a solid scope, tracked true. I used it on a lapua for a while and cranked it back and forth from 100 to 1760 yards, never a hiccup, the glass compared well to a dmr2, not great but very usable. My only gripe would be the turrets were easy to turn, good clicks but shallow indexing, they could easily move with a brush of an arm or bump.
Don't know about the japanese glass in the XTR II.Get the Burris XTR-II illuminated 5-25x50 on sale at EuroOptic for only $650… Philippines built, Japanese glass, 34mm tube, plenty of travel, lifetime “Forever” warranty. Burris bought German optics manufacturer Steiner, and they do share some tech between the brands…Which is a good thing.
Way better scope than the PST Gen2, but have never seen an MPO in person, so no idea on how it compares.
I have a 4-20 and the glass is very disappointing.
I have used a 3-15 model quite a bit and found the glass to be very serviceable, much better than my 4-20.
The 5-25 was known for having the worst glass of the entire line.
I have 3, and they’re better than my EP5 which has glass on point with the PST Gen2 5-25x50 I compared it next to.
The first gen XTR-II 5-25 had terrible glass and’s 8 MIL turrets. The newest version has 10 MIL turrets and a tungsten ring around the ocular housing to distinguish it from previous generations.
A buddy just returned his Brownells MPO due to very poor image quality on high magnification. He opted for a refund rather than an exchange and he got it for the sale price plus an additional 10% on top of that and he didn't want a replacement. I haven't personally seen how bad it was for myself but if he's not even willing to consider an exchange it must have been pretty terrible. I did mention it was probably gonna be a POS even being made in Japan due to the questionable JOL facility it was made in shared with Riton, Crimson Trace, Apex Rival, Blackhound, Brownells etc... The made in China of Japan...
I personally wouldn't buy them regardless of how cheap they become. They're like the $2200 Riton X7 Conquer that were selling for $649 that were terribly unreliable low quality Japanese JOL made dogs.
I personally wouldn't buy them regardless of how cheap they become. They're like the $2200 Riton X7 Conquer that were selling for $649 that were terribly unreliable low quality Japanese JOL made dogs.
I bought an MPO 5-25 and sent it back the same day. The reticle didn't bother me. But, worse glass than my 15 year old Bushnell 6x24, and all my SWFA HD scopes, all of which I like. I'm a mid-tier Made in Japan scope guy, but that MPO wasn't cutting it, even at objects at 100 yds on a sunny day.
The Elite 4200 is what you are probably referring to. Worst Japanese glass I currently own is the SWFA SS 20x it's so terrible I don't even use it. Can't believe how much different it really is in clarity or the lack thereof compared to all of my other 10x SWFA SS scopes. I really can't believe that there are actually users who actually like theirs in 20x. Second worse Japanese glass are the Bushnell Elite Tactical 4.5-30x50s and the Elite 6500 version . My Chinese Athlon Ares BTRs literally spanks them.
I picked up one of these recently and compared it to my PST II 3-15 and a couple of my PST II 5-25's. I haven't put a ton of time behind it aside to compare it to my PST II 5-15 and 5-25x. Honestly not sure if I got a return or not, no ring marks, but the battery was already installed and usually most scope manufacturers don't do that. I didn't think to compare it to a Strike Eagle 5-25x but I can pull that off next range trip.
As to the 3-15, the MPO 5-25 not surprisingly is better at 15x than the PST 3-15 is at 15x. Scopes drop off at max power, so the 5-25 is still in the middle of it's range. I might replace my 5-15 with it and call it good or return it, but unless my opinion changes significantly over time I will not be replacing my PST II 5-25's with them. The reticle is a bit odd, but doesn't really bother me.
Clicks are solid/loud but they have a bit of lash in them as someone else mentioned, don't like it, don't hate it, just different. I'd say the clicks are more "solid" when you hit them than the PST ii's, but overall the knob feels "sloppy" between clicks is the best term I can think of. I didn't try a new battery in it, but the illumination is very weak even at max.
Optically compared to a PST II 5-25x at 25x I'd give the nod to the PST, seems to have better color rendition and more detail in the center, pretty similar toward the edges. 20MIL of adjustment is the same as the PST II. The additional elevation knob (losing the zero stop) is interesting, kind of the same game vortex played with the strike eagle where you lose a ton of total elevation travel if you want to use the zero stop.
The other thing I noticed was that I struggled to get it adjusted, reticle focus went fine (infinity parallax vs blue sky), but I found when I adjusted parallax properly, the target plane was noticeably out of ideal focus. I could adjust the target into better focus with the parallax knob but then it of course had parallax movement. I even "de-adjusted" a couple of my PST's and re-adjusted them and they did not have the same issue. I've had scopes that did not have the absolute best target plane image when parallel was adjusted but this was the worst one I've seen in awhile. The eyebox on the PST II seems more forgiving than the MPO at max power. Maybe Brownell's got a bad batch of them and is trying to move them cheap.
Of course optical quality is not everything, if the scope is bombproof and the adjustments are accurate/repeatable that's worth something. Plenty of PST II's have had issues with both.
Just as an update I've had a couple more range sessions with mine and I ended up returning it. Maybe they got some iffy batches and that's why they cut the price way down, but mine really had 3 issues that I ended up returning it for.
First I could not get the parallax and reticle focused in a way I liked, and I've never had this issue with any other scope. If I set the parallax to infinity, looked at a white wall, set the reticle focus, and then went to the target, the target was out of focus when the parallax was set so there was not reticle movement when I shifted my head around. It was significantly out of focus. I bet this is what originally led me above to feel like the PST was optically better at 25x.
Second, this kind of plays into the first, but I could get the target and reticle in focus and the parallax right if I really messed with the reticle focus, essentially I set the parallax so it was right (target was now out of focus), so I messed with reticle focus and it took a lot of adjustment but I could get the target/reticle in focus. The downside was it created a very distorted/fisheye view toward the edges at med to low power.
Third, on higher powers 20+, the reticle is way too thick, it didn't bug me too much at first but it did over time. The dot is okay, but the double open bars cover a huge amount of space, and the "slit" between them is too thin to visually see anything through it anyway even on max power. Now it does make it easier to see the reticle at lower powers, but for me I'm unlikely to ever really dial this thing below 10-12x. Replaced the battery and even on 10 the illumination is almost non-visible on even a bright cloudy day, you can see it's on, but it's not helping you aim. On a full sun day I doubt you'd see it at all.
That said, when it was well focused on target, I'd say optically it was probably a bit better than a PST Gen II 5-25 esp. at 25x (however paralax was an issue then), eye-box seemed a bit more touchy than the PST, seemed to track well and it feels quite solid. If you got one that didn't have the parallax/optical weirdness mine did it would be a really nice optic for $700.
First I could not get the parallax and reticle focused in a way I liked, and I've never had this issue with any other scope. If I set the parallax to infinity, looked at a white wall, set the reticle focus, and then went to the target, the target was out of focus when the parallax was set so there was not reticle movement when I shifted my head around. It was significantly out of focus. I bet this is what originally led me above to feel like the PST was optically better at 25x.
Second, this kind of plays into the first, but I could get the target and reticle in focus and the parallax right if I really messed with the reticle focus, essentially I set the parallax so it was right (target was now out of focus), so I messed with reticle focus and it took a lot of adjustment but I could get the target/reticle in focus. The downside was it created a very distorted/fisheye view toward the edges at med to low power.
Third, on higher powers 20+, the reticle is way too thick, it didn't bug me too much at first but it did over time. The dot is okay, but the double open bars cover a huge amount of space, and the "slit" between them is too thin to visually see anything through it anyway even on max power. Now it does make it easier to see the reticle at lower powers, but for me I'm unlikely to ever really dial this thing below 10-12x. Replaced the battery and even on 10 the illumination is almost non-visible on even a bright cloudy day, you can see it's on, but it's not helping you aim. On a full sun day I doubt you'd see it at all.
That said, when it was well focused on target, I'd say optically it was probably a bit better than a PST Gen II 5-25 esp. at 25x (however paralax was an issue then), eye-box seemed a bit more touchy than the PST, seemed to track well and it feels quite solid. If you got one that didn't have the parallax/optical weirdness mine did it would be a really nice optic for $700.
The newer production 5-25s I had looked wayyyyyyyyyy better than than the first production 4-20 and 3-15 I had.
Do you think the clarity is better, or does 20x show the flaws in the glass better...
I got one each of the MPOs over the Labor Day sale. $629.99 each - I couldn't turn it down.
Both scopes function perfectly and don't have any of the mechanical problems noted by others. The 3-18 is just a little yellow at the edge of the glass and seems to have different coatings when held beside the 5-25, but both scopes are crystal clear out to full mag. I havent put them on the range yet, but I'm itchin to. Japanese scopes for that price - I'll take it, and I'm happy so far.
Both scopes function perfectly and don't have any of the mechanical problems noted by others. The 3-18 is just a little yellow at the edge of the glass and seems to have different coatings when held beside the 5-25, but both scopes are crystal clear out to full mag. I havent put them on the range yet, but I'm itchin to. Japanese scopes for that price - I'll take it, and I'm happy so far.
They use outdated Japanese glass standards which may have been acceptable15 years ago but not by today's standards and it really shows in the 16x and especially the 20x. Their 10x or 12x would be the max magnification I'd recommend buying.
Sounds like you got lucky, a friend of mine retuned his brand new 5-25x MPO due to very bad unacceptable chromatic abheration on it's higher magnification. He also was surprised to notice how little total elevation travel it had which made it really unusable for his long range shooting needs.
At the price you can only be so picky. If you want top tier glass it’s not going to come in under $1K or even $2K. I’ll take an MPO with its shortcomings over anything else in its price range.
For really long range, a 40 MOA mount is a must - A 40 MOA mount causes the scope to zero almost at the bottom of it's adjustment range giving you about 18 MILs of useable adjustment. My 6.5 CM reached 1000M with 9.8 MIL, giving me enough adjustment to reach beyond effective range.
I have an MPO 5-25x56mm and I absolutely love it. I am very, very happy I picked it. I thought I myself got a good deal on mine, but this is even better. Anyone who needs a scope, jump on it. If I had the money to buy a 3-18 just for future use, I'd do it just on General Principle.
I found them and then the next day when I was considering purchasing one - or perhaps many different options at the time, you guys know how that works- it went down to $899.99 , $100 off. AND , I had randomly Googled up a 10% off and Free Shipping (if you spent some amount that I was going to be way over anyway) ... so I basically got a set of hi-quality TPS/TSR rings for free, plus an extra bit of discount and free shipping.
This deal is even better - and I absolutely *love mine* ... I get it - as I have said many times before ... there are people who have much nicer rifles than my UPR, and much nicer scopes than my MPO ... Are $3500-$5000 S&Bs really cool? Sure are. Even those top-tier NF & Leupold etc. But , you go with what you can afford and WITH ONE SINGLE EXCEPTION, someone on this forum who said the same stuff in his Brownells website review, I've never seen but ONE DUDE complain about these scopes. Every other single person loves them and like me, think they are way better than their pricetag. I myself love mine.
I found them and then the next day when I was considering purchasing one - or perhaps many different options at the time, you guys know how that works- it went down to $899.99 , $100 off. AND , I had randomly Googled up a 10% off and Free Shipping (if you spent some amount that I was going to be way over anyway) ... so I basically got a set of hi-quality TPS/TSR rings for free, plus an extra bit of discount and free shipping.
This deal is even better - and I absolutely *love mine* ... I get it - as I have said many times before ... there are people who have much nicer rifles than my UPR, and much nicer scopes than my MPO ... Are $3500-$5000 S&Bs really cool? Sure are. Even those top-tier NF & Leupold etc. But , you go with what you can afford and WITH ONE SINGLE EXCEPTION, someone on this forum who said the same stuff in his Brownells website review, I've never seen but ONE DUDE complain about these scopes. Every other single person loves them and like me, think they are way better than their pricetag. I myself love mine.