New Build Idea, short.243

[savage110]

Im thinking of starting a new build after I put some glass on my -06, I am seriously considering a .243 and would like to go short, maybe 18 inches if possible. I will probably go for a Manners T2 or MCM A5. Anyone running a setup like this? How far should I be able to get out w/ a .243 w/ a 18inch tube? Or should I stick w/ a 20+ inch barrel? I would like to be able to reach 800+yards with it.
Thanks
-Felipe

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

why you are losing what that cartridge shines in. Long range fast light bullets, chopping it off will only decrease that speed. If you wanna go short, get a 308, if you want to use the 243s potential keep it no shorter than 24

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

A short 243 is still faster than a short 308. I've never had a 243 shorter than 20",but have yet to find reason to cuss a 243 of any kind.

 

[jasonk]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I agree with deadly, but it could be done, I'd not even consider it under 20" though. Not that it wouldn't do it, but speed and high BC is where the 243 shines, why cut its legs out from under it?

 

[brdeano]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

A buddy will have his 18" 243/243AI up and running shortly. It'll be good to see where he ends up speedwise.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I have no clue on barrel length, I was just throwing it out there, I have never messed with a .243 so I am welcome to suggestions. This will not be my primary long range rifle, I was thinking of going the short route so that I could carry it around in the AZ heat for coyote hunting, but I would also like to be able to ring steel at 800 or so, if thats possible.
Thanks and keep throwing Ideas out there, all advice is appreciated!
-Felipe

 

[jasonk]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brad Arnett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A buddy will have his 18" 243/243AI up and running shortly. It'll be good to see where he ends up speedwise. </div></div>

An 18" 243 has crossed my mind a time or two, but more of a 500 yards and in coyote/truck gun, never as an 800-1000 range rifle. I'll be interested in your buddies speeds.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brad Arnett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A buddy will have his 18" 243/243AI up and running shortly. It'll be good to see where he ends up speedwise. </div></div>

Keep me informed please.
-Felipe

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

105's would do 2700fps+.

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Savage, like Jason said, the 243 shines because it launches a light projo at a good speed, but to get that speed where the 243 shines, it needs some barrel to work up. I wouldnt go any shorter than 24. And to Oily's comment about a short 243 still being faster than a short 308, id have to dub that Captain Obvious statement of the night.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

What about a 260? would a short barrel get it to 800? I have been considering the .243, the .260 and also the 6.5x47

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

260 would be a better choice if you are dead set on chopping the tube short. Even with the 260 i wouldnt go any shorter than 22

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

The 105A-Max has a BC of .505 and at 2700fps+ from a stubby tube,it'll happily gobble up real estate.

The myths associated by barrel length affecting velocity,are curiously enough perpetuated by those that shoot the least.

Rather interesting dichotomy there.

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

For conversation,that load is supersonic to 1200yds+.

 

[KYS]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">260 would be a better choice if you are dead set on chopping the tube short. Even with the 260 i wouldnt go any shorter than 22 </div></div>

Have you not watched Franks videos of him shooting an 18" 260 ? Ive got a GAP build in 260 with a 18" barrel and it runs flawlessly. A joy to shoot out to 1000 yards. Even with the shoddy ammo Im using at the moment it shows a lot of promise for when I can get the load perfected, Chad is helping me with all that.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Oily; Just out of curiosity, do you have a 18 inch tube'd 243? wondering where you got the info so fast.
Thanks
-Felipe

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Ky, while i understand its capable, why cut the legs out from under the round? I have short barreled shit to. But i havent seen the video of LL shooting the 260 out to 1K, are you sure that you arent referring to the Gladius?

 

[KYS]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ky, while i understand its capable, why cut the legs out from under the round? I have short barreled shit to. But i havent seen the video of LL shooting the 260 out to 1K, are you sure that you arent referring to the Gladius? </div></div>

check his demo of the Vortex Razor scope. he shoots the new build in that video AND it is the current Snipers Hide build....

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I stated plainly that I've never built one less than 20",but pards shoot shorter in both rifle and of course XP-100's.

Few things quicker than experience.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYshooter338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">260 would be a better choice if you are dead set on chopping the tube short. Even with the 260 i wouldnt go any shorter than 22 </div></div>

Have you not watched Franks videos of him shooting an 18" 260 ? Ive got a GAP build in 260 with a 18" barrel and it runs flawlessly. A joy to shoot out to 1000 yards. Even with the shoddy ammo Im using at the moment it shows a lot of promise for when I can get the load perfected, Chad is helping me with all that. </div></div>
Wasnt that a .308? and yes the gladius is what inspired this build Idea, I just want to keep it cheap, rem sps-v in .243 chopped w/ a surefire break in a MCS-t2 or MCM a5, already have to much cash in my -06
-Felipe

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The myths associated by barrel length affecting velocity,are curiously enough perpetuated by those that shoot the least.

</div></div>

while this is true, when cuttin the tube shorter, <span style="font-weight: bold">you are giving up velocity</span>, but you can get that back. Run a hotter load, but that has its drawbacks as well....
less brass life,torch a throat quicker, blowing primers.

When chopping a tube short, you are gaining things such as handiness and better presentation of the rifle, but you give up things as well. This sport is a give and take thing. You have to weigh the costs of what would best suit you.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

My Bad Oily, should have caught that. Anyone have any experience w/ the 6.5x47 at 800yds?
-Felipe

 

[KYS]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage110</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My Bad Oily, should have caught that. Anyone have any experience w/ the 6.5x47 at 800yds?
-Felipe </div></div>

nice sig line......

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYshooter338</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ky, while i understand its capable, why cut the legs out from under the round? I have short barreled shit to. But i havent seen the video of LL shooting the 260 out to 1K, are you sure that you arent referring to the Gladius? </div></div>

check his demo of the Vortex Razor scope. he shoots the new build in that video AND it is the current Snipers Hide build....

</div></div>

i understand that and i know that it can get there with that 18 inch tube, but they werent shootin out to 1K in that video

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The myths associated by barrel length affecting velocity,are curiously enough perpetuated by those that shoot the least.

</div></div>

while this is true, when cuttin the tube shorter, <span style="font-weight: bold">you are giving up velocity</span>, but you can get that back. Run a hotter load, but that has its drawbacks as well....
less brass life,torch a throat quicker, blowing primers.

When chopping a tube short, you are gaining things such as handiness and better presentation of the rifle, but you give up things as well. This sport is a give and take thing. You have to weigh the costs of what would best suit you. </div></div>

Balance/handling reliably bears the most fruit and handy/dandy done right,leaves little to want for. Does an 18" 243 horn me up? Nope...but that isn't because it's performanced is paled to paltry levels.

I've a difficult time dropping below a 20" tube(on anything centerfire),due solely to noise. For those willing to make that concession,I couldn't say with a straight face that the 243Win stoked with upper echelon BC's is going to puke,mainly because it doesn't.

Few hate long tubes more than I,as I've been through the 30" Phase and have seen the light. I'm a fan of practical portability housed within a great handling and well balanced rifle,if only because tools of that ilk are the most well rounded.

I'm comfy with a low ES,LRF and turrets.

 

[KYS]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A short 243 is still faster than a short 308. I've never had a 243 shorter than 20",but have yet to find reason to cuss a 243 of any kind. </div></div>

What are your thoughts on an "ultimate" 243 barrel length also factoring in running a suppressor with this rig ?

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Cans don't call me,so I don't dabble too deeply in such things.

I'd gun as much tube as you could,to keep the tube at no more than 24" of length,with your particular can affixed and deal with the give/take associated.

Downrange performance will assuredly be intact and then some.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

So Oily Owl, the .243 in a 20 inch tube config. would be ideal in your point of view?
-Felipe

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I'd not want more than 24" of tube,the particular can is going to skew how you get there.

Do I have faith in a 20" 243? More than you could fathom.

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

again, its about weighing your pros and cons, chop it short, gain handiness and presentation, and save some weight. But you also have to run hotter loads with effects on barrel life, brass life and such. Longer tube heavier and less handy, run milder loads that will perform the same as the "hot" loads in a shorter barrel, better barrel life. Its all up to you. What you want to give and take.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'd not want more than 24" of tube,the particular can is going to skew how you get there.

Do I have faith in a 20" 243? More than you could fathom. </div></div>
Understood, No can for me though, damn gov. doesnt allow Canucks living in the US to have those neat little noise reducers.
-Felipe

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Im thinking maybe 22inch would be ideal then, dont want to have to get the barrel switched out after a few thousand rounds
-Felipe

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Less factoring a can,few things are sweeter than a 22" 243AI.

In a Halibut Rifle blueprint,of course.

 

[deadly0311]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

do you reload?

 

[KYS]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I shoot remington low recoil 260 out of mine and it does just fine. It matters on your barrel and what your willing to run as far as handloads. You can give and take but set up the right way you dont have to hobble yourself with worrying about hot loads and such, save that for the weekend hookers.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: deadly0311</div><div class="ubbcode-body">do you reload? </div></div>
Yes, I will be reloading for this rifle.

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Barrels are cheap and meant to be shot out.

Happiness is a pile of shot out tubes,that batted uncanny connect percentages during their life.

I like to lean on shit.

 

[WGM]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Less factoring a can,few things are sweeter than a 22" 243AI.

In a Halibut Rifle blueprint,of course. </div></div>


that's exactly what this is ...

it's everything you could want it to be, and then some ... fucking amazing rifle in every respect.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I like to lean on shit. </div></div>
New SIG!

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WGM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Less factoring a can,few things are sweeter than a 22" 243AI.

In a Halibut Rifle blueprint,of course. </div></div>


that's exactly what this is ...

it's everything you could want it to be, and then some ... fucking amazing rifle in every respect. </div></div>
Nice rifle man, Though I think it would look better in a 18 inch or 20inch tube config.
-Felipe

 

[WGM]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage110</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WGM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Less factoring a can,few things are sweeter than a 22" 243AI.

In a Halibut Rifle blueprint,of course. </div></div>


that's exactly what this is ...

it's everything you could want it to be, and then some ... fucking amazing rifle in every respect. </div></div>
Nice rifle man, Though I think it would look better in a 18 inch or 20inch tube config.
-Felipe </div></div>

this rifle balances better than a Cirque du Soleil acrobat ... 22" tubes don't get in the way any more than a 20 incher ...

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WGM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Savage110</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: WGM</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: OilyOwl</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Less factoring a can,few things are sweeter than a 22" 243AI.

In a Halibut Rifle blueprint,of course. </div></div>


that's exactly what this is ...

it's everything you could want it to be, and then some ... fucking amazing rifle in every respect. </div></div>
Nice rifle man, Though I think it would look better in a 18 inch or 20inch tube config.
-Felipe </div></div>

this rifle balances better than a Cirque du Soleil acrobat ... 22" tubes don't get in the way any more than a 20 incher ... </div></div>
Not saying it doesnt work, I guess im just into the whole short tube thing right now.
-Felipe

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

Any more input, anyone?
-Felipe

 

[Wild_Bill]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

OK i have a mate with a Mohawk and factory 18" barrel it is a plain noisy piece of crap to shoot. unless you are running a can i would lot go under 20" with 22-24 being better, The reason for this is the 6mm bore requires slower powders to gain the balistic performance with the heavy 105 or 107gr projectiles then the slower powder requires a longer barrel to gain the performance from as the expansion ratio is a lot different to a 308. will an 18" 243 make 1000 yards yes it will but i would not like to shoot or own it if you feel the need of having a 18" barrel get a 7mm08 or a 260 at the smallest but even better a 308, there is another thread with a guy running 47gr Varget in his 308 and 175gr MatchKings because he has a short barrel but now is trying to get the velocity that is normal out of a 24-26" barrel and as stated above down hot rod it to get extra velocity it is plain out stupid and dangerous, if you need the shorter barrel you will lose velocity and live with it,

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

I rebarreled my 600 Mohawk 6mmRem to a famous Pink 25-284Win at 23".

'15 is just fine with 105's in 243,as it is in 260,7-08 and 308.

For conversation.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

by '15 im going to have to assume your talking about reloader 15 powder???
-Felipe

 

[OilyOwl]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

There is no other.

 

[savage110]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

How many grains are you running behind the 105 Amax?
-Felipe

 

[dontstrokeme]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

IMO, I would buy the 243 Win Varmint rifle and have the factory tube cut back to 18", then when you can't get the velocity you want or the cuncussion is too loud. You can rebarrel it with a custom barrel, unless you can get the heavies to shoot in the factory 243 barrel you might need a fast 1-7" twist to run the heavy 243 bullets anyways.

That is basicly what I am doing with my 7-08 Varminter, cutting to 18", rechamber for 162AMAX and mounting a Badger Thruster break. If the barrel can't get the velocity I need then I might try the 7-08AI and see if I can pick up a little speed. And when I put a Rock or Krieger on it I will know wether I can run 18" again or if I need to go 20".

The factory barrel is a cheap tester to find out just howw terrible the short barrels do.

Also when I was deciding on going short barrel, I looked alot at the difference between SSP loads with a 15" barrel and rifle loads with a 26" barrel.....I saw .4gr of IMR4064 changing 200FPS for 9" of barrel with the 7mm-08. My hope is that with a 18" barrel I can get 2500+FPS with 162AMAX and IMR4064.....that would stay supersonic to 1300 yards no problem for me.

But I always think that if you have to crank the turret, what's another few clicks. I would gladly trade a few inches of drop for the handeling of a 18" barrel.

 

[gliechty]

Re: New Build Idea, short.243

The 260 rem. /6.5 Creedmoor shine all the way down to 18". 140 class bullets with a BC of .585 and up at 2750fps.

I will have a 7-08 rem 18" up and running in the next couple of weeks. 162gr AMAX with a .625 BC. Hoping for 2750 fps.

I will let you know.

BTW, all of the above mentioned will beat a 2750 105gr 243 at .505 BC. That is 308 175gr performance.