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New scope cap introduction

0311 Hesco

0311 Hesco

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Nov 30, 2010
437
2
Ohio
OK, here it goes:
For the past 4 years I have been kicking around an idea for a stronger scope cap. One that didn't have a single, flimsy butt-hinge and made out of a sub-par material. Kudos to the AADMOUNT guys, you definitely make a great product. Not sure when they started making caps but when I was originally mulling over this idea, there were only Butler Crap caps and Leupold aluminium ones. Finally in 2011 I started the provisional patent process with Legalzoom and due to a very busy life I put it on the back burner due to funds and the everyday hustle and bustle of life. Well Now that I have had time to sit and think, I completed the provisional patent and now have a "Patent Pending" status. I cannot take all the credit, I have a friend back home that is kinda my brain trust and we are in this together.

I patiently waited for [MENTION=1217]Kasey[/MENTION] to have his time in the spotlight to let him reveal his awesome new product, and now that it has been unveiled, I would like to humbly introduce my idea. I am really looking for some feedback on this and kinda get some advice on how the best way to get this to market would be, as well as opinions and suggestions.

I have an admiration for the people on this forum; most of you all are willing to help at a moments notice for those in misfortune, quick to assist in all sorts of issues, and definitely opinionated!

Please remember that this is just my first attempt at using AutoDesk Inventor software as well as designing anything on a computer. This is also just my rough draft so to speak, just enough put into it to get it to the patent office. This prototype drawing is pretty basic and already I have a couple ideas to improve it, but I really want the opinion of the masses.

So without further ado, here is my as-of-right-now no named scope cap idea:


This is the scope cap closed. Note the double arms on either side. They are loaded with an extension spring in order to maintain contact between the cap and the base. It's hard to see but the cap itself has a neat little lip on the inside that creates a seal and will be weatherproof when I get done with it.
10p9k7k.jpg


This is what it looks like open obviously, but i want to point out the female threads on the rear of the base. This was originally intended to screw into an adapter then adapt to the various female threads on the end of scopes. I think I will either change it or have the option to just have external threads and thread them specifically for different brands of scope.
of1v8m.jpg


This is a picture of the inside of the cap to better show the lip and the overall design. The sphere shape was utilized to be stronger with less material.
f39vrm.jpg


I intend to make these out of aluminium, however this is still up for debate as well. Hope you enjoy my idea and Lord willing, this can come to fruition some way somehow.
 
"The Submarine Cap"?? Kinda looks like an old sub :)
I think for real tactical consideration it would have to able to be deployed similar to the BC caps.

It's funny you bring this up now as my front BC cap took a shit on me the other day.
 
It will be a rapid deployable system. I was having trouble adding that in with Inventor, but it will have tabs on the 5 and 7 o'clock positions to flip it up quick. We have made a couple physical prototypes and we got that covered I believe.
 
ARD... really? So you can look cool? There is not a single person in here that NEEDS and ARD.

That may be a little harsh but really do you need an ARD when you go sniping paper and steel as 99% of the people on this site do.
 
I'd love to test a prototype for a S&B 5-25x56. I think it's a great idea in a market that is greatly lacking.

And no, an ARD is not a "must have".
 
If you go the thread direct route, how will you index them to line up correctly?
Considering using O-rings on the caps?
I do not see the tabs or mechanism for quick deployment?
Love this project.
 
Those look pretty badass! I would give it a pretty hardy consideration...

3 questions:

1. do you have a "ballpark" price range in mind as of now? Based on the prototype?
2. will these be for both ends of the optic? (im assuming yes)
3. with the spring loaded arms, is the cap going to auto rotate to sit against the outside? (Just asking more or less in how far will the arms open up to prevent failing if the cap somehow slid backwards down the outside of the main body.)
 
Shanerbanner10 said:
ARD... really? So you can look cool? There is not a single person in here that NEEDS and ARD.

That may be a little harsh but really do you need an ARD when you go sniping paper and steel as 99% of the people on this site do.
Click to expand...

Really you fucking moron?? Do you think he is just trying to market this thing to internet commandos or do you think maybe he has real life applications in mind?

Go fucking troll somewhere else
 
Shanerbanner10 said:
ARD... really? So you can look cool? There is not a single person in here that NEEDS and ARD.

That may be a little harsh but really do you need an ARD when you go sniping paper and steel as 99% of the people on this site do.
Click to expand...

Compared to many other members on this board who are real deal military snipers, I am only a lowly LE sniper. However something that keeps my position from being given away is an advantage in my book.

So when you say it is only to "look cool", and that their is not one person here that needs it, you make yourself look like a fool.
 
Exo said:
Those look pretty badass! I would give it a pretty hardy consideration...

3 questions:

1. do you have a "ballpark" price range in mind as of now? Based on the prototype?
2. will these be for both ends of the optic? (im assuming yes)
3. with the spring loaded arms, is the cap going to auto rotate to sit against the outside? (Just asking more or less in how far will the arms open up to prevent failing if the cap somehow slid backwards down the outside of the main body.)
Click to expand...

1. I do not have a price range, it would greatly depend on cost of production if we were to tackle that ourselves. I was thinking maybe license it out to an accessory or scope company as well. Just a play on the table we are considering.

2. We are planning for it to be for both ends of the scope, however there will be some models of scopes that it will cause issues with power rings and such. Those would have to be slip on. Still working that out.

3. The arms will have some kind of stop built in to limit just how far they will open. Did that answer you question?


ARD's are too easy, that can be implemented though not a priority right now. In the cases where I have used one, all it does is take away from the clarity of the scope, but I do realize that there are some hard men out there in hard places that would benefit from anti reflection. I was originally assuming that the length of the scope cap base would inherently reduce the reflective properties. I would like to see these caps get into the hands of the military, but we could offer some kind of ARD that sandwiches between the scope and the cap base; if there is a demand for these.

We do intend to have these made for all the big scope makers, then move on to the smaller players. My thoughts on scope caps are similar to putting junk tires on a sports car. Why protect your couple-thousand dollar scope with cheap plastic?
[MENTION=28909]rth1800[/MENTION], We have not gone that far to actually see if they will freeze, however I did make the contact area as small as possible to thwart problems like this. Also, they should be able to index off of the scope, however if that's not the case, we can make the threads press-in and give it a little wiggle room to center it up correctly. We have tossed ideas around gaskets and magnets and other ways of sealing it. We are still exploring all possibilities right now. The tabs for deployment were left off the original drafts. They will be there eventually. They will look and feel similar to the Butler Creek ocular lens cover tabs.
[MENTION=30552]trevor300wsm[/MENTION], when we get to a testing phase, we'll definitely call for volunteers, but that is way down the line. I have a year to get this provisional patent the way I really want it, then apply for the full blown patent. We'll see where this goes.
[MENTION=84870]MrFrankZ[/MENTION] & [MENTION=35454]29aholic[/MENTION], this is what got me thinking on a better scope cap. Too many fails on the Butler Creek's.


I have two other mounting possibilities, one that would essentially tighten down like a hose clamp and the other would be a slip on with a rubber gasket, but I put those ideas to the back because I think the threads are a superior design.
 
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I like it A LOT!!!! It certainly seems like you have something unique and it fills an important role, I'm always worried about getting stuff on my lenses and scratching them... I like the idea of the threads, will there be a way to index the cap so it flips the way you want?
 
Another little tidbit, these will eventually be made for spotting scopes, NVGs, FLIR, and possibly a version for binos in the future. But the first step is getting them on the rifle scopes!
 
I love the design and I love the seal that would make it weather-resistant.

If I'm looking at the picture right, if the end of the cap-body is threaded and screws onto the end of the scope, it somewhat functions as a sunshade? Or does it fit more flush in real life?
 
If in the future you need someone to test one out on a Nightforce 2.5-10x42 just let me know... Lol.... Currently using AADMOUNT caps so I could compare..... I have a variety of Valdada Ior scopes as well but realize they're not real popular on the hide...
 
Yes, it will function as a sunshade as well. The length of the prototype in the drawing is 50mm long.
 
29aholic said:
Really you fucking moron?? Do you think he is just trying to market this thing to internet commandos or do you think maybe he has real life applications in mind?

Go fucking troll somewhere else
Click to expand...

Pretty awesome that we just jump to calling people fucking morons around here. Well done.

rbdub474 said:
Compared to many other members on this board who are real deal military snipers, I am only a lowly LE sniper. However something that keeps my position from being given away is an advantage in my book.

So when you say it is only to "look cool", and that their is not one person here that needs it, you make yourself look like a fool.
Click to expand...

I said 'not a single person' in reference to the 99% of people here who are not LEO/Mil. To be fair if we look at the number of members here and actually think about the ~1 percent'ers (give or take a few), they are truly few and far between. There are 109,000 member here how many do you think are actually qualified snipers/marksmen/'whatever your department calls you guys these days'? I would guess that's a small percentage of that 109,000 people.
Is an ARD helpful for those who may need it (LEO/MIL).. ABSOLUTELY, I do not disagree with you there. Are they required, my opinion says no... for most situations. As you said though anything that gives you an advantage is a plus. For the military in today's world is an ARD required? That is mission dependent, but definitely a good thing to have regardless. From my time serving both domestically and overseas I can tell you on a first hand basis I did not see many of our guys using them (mostly fielded m110's with premiers w/o ARD's).

I am just a vet who has a little trigger time behind my belt from my time serving and a recreational shooter. I don't know much compared to many on this forum and am not afraid to admit when I am wrong.

So lets recap - my original comment, maybe a little harsh... yes, I have no problem admitting when I am wrong. I, honestly, didn't think about this product being submitted for LEO/Mil uses. I jumped the gun, my bad.
That being said - lets be honest does anyone in the CIVILIAN world NEED an ARD? Simple answer - absolutely not. Hence my ~99% comment.
Could marketing an ARD make the inventor/engineer/etc more money with people other than the LEO/MIL crowd? Absolutely, specifically because of those guys that just want to be 'cool', costa likers and such.

0311 Hesco said:
Yes, it will function as a sunshade as well. The length of the prototype in the drawing is 50mm long.
Click to expand...
Quick comment on the actual product in questions - The caps themselves, I really like the idea. I'm surprised caps (in general) have taken so long to be made more robust and just an overall better design. I, however, do not care if there is a spring loaded version or quick whatever version since (hopefully) most people will hopefully be smart enough to pull the caps up or off before getting into a shooting position. Always intrigued by inventors, designers and engineers! Good stuff, looking forward to a product review sooner or later, hopefully sooner!
Just a thought - have you thought about serrations on the sides of the 'arms'? May make it a little easier to grab in inclement weather?
 
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You might be able to run it as a kickstarter.com project. Many wonderful ideas has come to life that way.

You could do them in abs plastic also.

Great idea. For the future version could you add a bubble level. It would be an ideal place to have it.


...
If you snooze it - you loose it
 
I am kicking around the idea of tabs/serrations (like on the M&P pistol frames) on the side of the arms itself, but I think that might have to wait until I have a working copy of this prototype.

Keep the ideas flowing gents!
 
Interesting



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Rather than make the arms spring loaded with machined parts, you could make them out of heavy duty rubber (like rubber bungee strap material). Less cost and easier to make. It would probably hold the cap snug enough (provided you had the inner ridge you mentioned) you wouldn't need anything else to hold the cap on.
 
I definitely like the idea of the anti-cant bubble on the rear cap. This is something that I think we should, can and will include. At the very least we could make it an option based on the shooters choice. I also want to thank everyone for all your positive feedback.
 
instead of springs I would look at maybe something made out of a soft rubber as would seal it up from water and if freezing would not be as affected. using threads from the scope to mount will dictate very many different sizes and threads to be made, plus the indexing issue. plus would have to take the scope off most rifles to put them on as the tabs wouldn't clear the barrel. could use an adaptor to fit general size and save on sizes or go with thin plastic insert with thin fins on it for a cheap easy squeeze lock that wont mar the scope.
 
Shanerbanner10 said:
ARD... really? So you can look cool? There is not a single person in here that NEEDS and ARD.

That may be a little harsh but really do you need an ARD when you go sniping paper and steel as 99% of the people on this site do.
Click to expand...

You have apparently never been predator hunting during the day.

Yes a quality cap with an ARD in it would awesome. I'm tired of using panty hose.
 
Does anybody make caps that you just push one button or flip one thing and both ends open ?
Sorry if i ask dumb questions on this site,, im new to some of this.
 
I think a spacer system (think silencer mount shims) or a 2 part system with a set screw (think circular polarizer for camera lens that you could lock) would be better to index the cap.
 
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I give you credit for trying to make a product that is well made and durable.

Some of the things you need to consider, which are factors that impact me are as follows:

- When opened, lays flat against the scope, doesn't conflict with cycling the bolt i.e. Contact with thumb, fingers, bolt knob or handle.

- Doesn't obstruct view of the turrets when open.

- Allows you to adjust ocular focus and zoom without conflict. Doesn't obscure focus index mark.

- Low profile, allowing mounting on objective where there is minimal clearance between barrel and scope bell.

- Doesn't catch on gear or webbing whether open or closed.

FYI, I have converted most of my S&B scopes to the Tenebraex caps as I was sick of the BC caps constantly failing (Objective), or not being able to swing the direction of cap opening (Ocular). They're not perfect, but work best for my purposes and preference of operation.
 
Alpine 338 said:
I give you credit for trying to make a product that is well made and durable.

Some of the things you need to consider, which are factors that impact me are as follows:

- When opened, lays flat against the scope, doesn't conflict with cycling the bolt i.e. Contact with thumb, fingers, bolt knob or handle.

- Doesn't obstruct view of the turrets when open.

- Allows you to adjust ocular focus and zoom without conflict. Doesn't obscure focus index mark.

- Low profile, allowing mounting on objective where there is minimal clearance between barrel and scope bell.

- Doesn't catch on gear or webbing whether open or closed.

FYI, I have converted most of my S&B scopes to the Tenebraex caps as I was sick of the BC caps constantly failing (Objective), or not being able to swing the direction of cap opening (Ocular). They're not perfect, but work best for my purposes and preference of operation.
Click to expand...

These are definitely aspects we are looking at and considering. Like I said before, the sizes and dimensions are all first draft and the edges on a lot of the concepts need to be knocked off still.

Thanks for the input, that's good feedback.
 
Thank you for your patience!

montana3gunner -"Rather than make the arms spring loaded with machined parts, you could make them out of heavy duty rubber (like rubber bungee strap material). Less cost and easier to make. It would probably hold the cap snug enough (provided you had the inner ridge you mentioned) you wouldn't need anything else to hold the cap on."

This all day long^


Alpine 338-

"Some of the things you need to consider, which are factors that impact me are as follows:

- When opened, lays flat against the scope, doesn't conflict with cycling the bolt i.e. Contact with thumb, fingers, bolt knob or handle.

- Doesn't obstruct view of the turrets when open.

- Allows you to adjust ocular focus and zoom without conflict. Doesn't obscure focus index mark.

- Low profile, allowing mounting on objective where there is minimal clearance between barrel and scope bell.

- Doesn't catch on gear or webbing whether open or closed."

And this^

I don't know if we talked about this years ago or not, but its very ambitious and the goal of a better scope cap is a worthy goal! Good luck.
 
Ill toss in my 2 cents worth, if possible due to the construction, thickness and the lip/recess, maybe machine into flip cap portion the curve to match the objective/ocular lens size in order to lower its profile while keeping it snuggly in place when open. Excuse my poor skills on paint..



I'm on the fence with the use of rubberised retention arms having seen them break or tear on the night weapon sights and TI lense caps, robust is great but again simplicity is always welcome so if replacements easily fitted and readily available its not a war stopper.

Great Idea mate and looking forward to seeing it come to fruition.

JJ
 
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Thanks for the feedback gents. This is exactly the stuff I was looking for. [MENTION=86588]fj40cody[/MENTION], he is my accomplice in all this and my brain trust. The rubber bands on the side of the cap had come to mind and I quickly dismissed them. I think it was because I was worried that it would have too much free movement. The way we have it, the arms will control the unwanted movements (left and right) of the cap itself. Sort of utilize the strength of the base. Maybe we will revisit that possibility.

Keep it coming y'all. I am locked in this cell block I call Pakistan for another couple months and then we will hit this idea hard. My goal is to have a working prototype in the next 8-10 months. At least a proof-of-concept model.
 
Definitely a spot in the market for this. I think the ruggedness and the double arms are your best marketing point so I think you should steer away from rubber bands. I'm currently running a Tenebraex Ard that threads directly onto my Nightforce ATACR with a Tenebraex objective cover. Seems more sturdy than the BC caps but having said that I run BC caps on my other rifle and have had no problems with them. I would definitely buy a rugged cover that threads directly to my scope with an incorporated ARD. I'd buy another for my spotting scope aswell. I guess your challenge is maintaining the spring function of the arms while keeping their bulk down. Can't wait. Good luck!
 
I'd like to see it as a clamp on piece, not friction like the BC caps. Split the ring long ways and use two 10-32 bolts. Would also be easier than making so many different threaded pieces. It would be great in that on the ocular you could still adjust eye piece focus and the power ring, like on my Steiner 5-25, without the cap interfering. It looks like the arms will have a good amount of travel so it should be able to work on different length eye pieces.
 
You are definitely correct on the clamp to attach them. This is something I was going to incorporate for the rear cap. It will be a great way to get the caps on more models and into the spotting scopes. Just like the level bubbles options for every application it the goal.
 
This looks good, I have stopped using BC caps as they suck and break, before getting fancy with ARD and a cappuccino attachments please, please, please make them robust. Right now I use the bikini caps which are not the best but they are durable
 
One of the challenges i see is when they are open they sit above the scope bell, the main reason lots of butlers and others get broke is pushing the rifle thru a barricade and smacking the scope cover... one idea would be to make it easily detachable when that sitation is going to present itself (not just unscrew it but maybe have the arms on some sort of a detent system).

great idea.
 
Hey guys , sorry I didn't read all the posts but could you use a 3D printer to make them if your using some sort of plastic? A 1ft x 1ft printer is $1200 in Australia so probably $300 in the states. I'm sure a member here is a machinist that could help with metal part construction.
 
Jester308 said:
Ill toss in my 2 cents worth, if possible due to the construction, thickness and the lip/recess, maybe machine into flip cap portion the curve to match the objective/ocular lens size in order to lower its profile while keeping it snuggly in place when open. Excuse my poor skills on paint..



I'm on the fence with the use of rubberised retention arms having seen them break or tear on the night weapon sights and TI lense caps, robust is great but again simplicity is always welcome so if replacements easily fitted and readily available its not a war stopper.

Great Idea mate and looking forward to seeing it come to fruition.

JJ
Click to expand...

Make the side arms 2 piece and fit an internal spring so they can slide in and out yet the spring pulls them back together so it provides a tight seal on the front and top. Just an idea from a diesel mechanics perspective
 
That was the idea.


Yowie said:
Make the side arms 2 piece and fit an internal spring so they can slide in and out yet the spring pulls them back together so it provides a tight seal on the front and top. Just an idea from a diesel mechanics perspective
Click to expand...
 
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