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New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

H

hollowpoint

Private
Full Member
Minuteman
Dec 4, 2011
65
0
40
Westfield, MA
#1
Putting together my first rifle build. Savage 93r17tr (.17hmr) or Savage Mark II tr (.22lr) I live a mile away from the savage factory so I'm set on one of those 2 rifles.

I am looking to get a trainer rifle. The range I have access to goes out to 300yards. This rifle will be almost exclusively a paper puncher. My question is there any training benefit to working with either round? Yes I know .22lr is cheaper, but I am leaning towards .17hmr as it is inherently more accurate. As I have minimal shooting experience I like that if I shoot well it will group well and if shoot poor it will show that on paper.
 
#4
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

Roughly how many rounds do you think I would put downrange in an hour with a bolt gun? Obviously it will differ a lot from person to person, but a rough figure? My logic is that I will probably be able to get out for about 2 hrs a sunday, maybe a couple hours on saturday. Figure an average of 3 hrs a week shooting roughly how many rounds would that be?

a box of .17gr hornady is 9.99 on midsouth shooters supply, is the savings going to be big enough shooting .22lr to add up to that much a year?
 
#5
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

First gun I bought was a savage 17. Kept it a few months and sold it to a friend. Went and bought a 22, much quieter, cheaper ammo, much more available match ammo.
 
#6
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

I have had 2 .17 HMR's They are fun but i found my self shooting the .22 more because of the cost of shooting. But Im a broke ass shooter.... so if you can afford to shoot a .17 all the time by all means do it
 
#13
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hollowpoint</div><div class="ubbcode-body">with a bolt how many would you say you average down range in an hour? roughly. </div></div>
To answer your question, I go through about 50 rounds an hour on most occasions.

But this all depends on how you shoot. I have gone through as little has 25 rounds in an hour, and on the other side I have put over 500 rounds down range in a hour. How many rounds you put down range in an hour all depends on your mentality.

To answer the thread question, I would recommend the 17 hmr.

I take me time when I am shooting my training rifle to make sure I am performing the fundamentals and learning from my mistakes. I also take a VERY long time to follow through and continue to check my target through my scope after every shot. I prefer the 17 hmr due to my personal experience of the rounds ability to obtain quarter inch groups at 100 yards. When I see a round fly even an inch in any direction off center, I know it was my fault and not the rifle or the ammo. The ammo is more expensive but I have found that it boost my confidence during training to shoot the 17 hmr and having more confidence allows me to push myself farther/harder. Just my .02 cents.

Good luck and I am sure you won't go wrong with either caliber!

Shoot Straight,
Josh
 
#15
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Solo Silhouette</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
hollowpoint said:
The ammo is more expensive but I have found that it boost my confidence during training to shoot the 17 hmr</div></div>

The point of a trainer rifle is to be able to get more trigger time for significantly less money that a centerfire rifle.

If 17hmr cost more than 223 whats the point?


I, however, believe the 17 is a superior round. Just look at the ballistics at 300 or even 500 yards.

A 22lr is dropping 620 inches at 500 yards, a 17 is dropping less than half that. If only gravity was the problem...
Click to expand...
 
#16
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

Buy them both!! In all seriousness if you only have access to 300y, definetly buy the 22lr. It will be much more challenging (definition: fun). Also you get around 10 boxes of 22lr for the same price as 1 box of 17hmr. I own each and use my 22 as my trainer (MKII TR) and my 17 gor squirrels, bobcats and less than 150y coyotes.

Hope this helped as it was a bastard to do on my iphone.
 
#17
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

My shooting style would probably aligns with solo's. I typically shoot slow and check each hole. (right now i shoot a muzzle loader. so it's reaaaalllll slow.)

how challenging is .22lr at 300 yards?
 
#18
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hollowpoint</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My shooting style would probably aligns with solo's. I typically shoot slow and check each hole. (right now i shoot a muzzle loader. so it's reaaaalllll slow.)

how challenging is .22lr at 300 yards? </div></div>

Wind is the biggest factor. It will kill either round.

This is a "target" i shot today at 300. Took me 4 shots to get on target. Light wind. Dad shot and I spotted, I could actually see the 22s in flight. Im not sure that the "group" size is indicative of the rifles potential, my dad isnt well versed in the mechanics of the precision rifle.
sheetmetal.jpg


My savage mkii needed 15.4 mils to get on target from a 50yd zero. Roughly 166 inches of drop. More than 1 second flight time. Oh and since the CCIs are subsonic its stupid quiet.

300yd.jpg

Target was at the tree line.

Pretty freaking fun
 
#19
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

I have never shot paper at 300, i have a 10x12inch steel target at 275 and I have to be on my game to hit it 10 of 10 shots. when its painted fresh and i take my time to shoot a group it looks to be about 4 inches with 5 shots. other than that i have not tried groups yet....

I have made 9 out of 10 shots at 500 on a 30inch steel round target. Hell of alot of fun!
 
#20
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: clayne_b</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I have made 9 out of 10 shots at 500 on a 30inch steel round target. Hell of alot of fun! </div></div>
Jealous! how much elevation?
 
#21
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: cpt. obvious</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Solo Silhouette</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
hollowpoint said:
The ammo is more expensive but I have found that it boost my confidence during training to shoot the 17 hmr</div></div>

The point of a trainer rifle is to be able to get more trigger time for significantly less money that a centerfire rifle.

If 17hmr cost more than 223 whats the point?


I, however, believe the 17 is a superior round. Just look at the ballistics at 300 or even 500 yards.

A 22lr is dropping 620 inches at 500 yards, a 17 is dropping less than half that. If only gravity was the problem...</div></div>
I agree with you there Cpt. Obvious. The 17 is more expensive to shoot than the 22 and if that is the main reason why you are getting a trainer, than the 22 is your rifle. Also, the 22 is more tougher to shoot at longer distances and/or windy days making it more challenging to hit your target.

IMO, I feel like the 17 hmr is worth the extra coin to shoot due to better ballistics and my experiences of superior accuracy. I am also the type of guy that has to have multiple purposes for a rifle in order to purchase it and I strongly believe that the 17 hmr is a better trainer/pest control rifle than the 22 for me.

I own both a Savage 93r17 and a Ruger 10/22. Both are great rifles and my safe wouldn't be complete without either of them.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: hollowpoint</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> how challenging is .22lr at 300 yards?</div></div>
I find shooting at 300 yards with a 22 is definitely challenging to say the least! For me, shooting at 300 yard with any gun is challenging! haha. I don't have a lot of experience past 200 yards but I am sure that someone else will chime in with more experience than I have.

Shoot Straight,
Josh
Click to expand...
 
#22
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

And great shooting there Cpt. Obvious!

This thread is making me want to go stretch the legs on my rim fires and see what they can do!

Shoot Straight,
Josh
 
#23
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

This thread is helping my decision making a lot, thanks for all the input.

I would love to shoot all day everyday but realistically I will probably be able to sneak away for about 1-2 hours a week on Sunday when my wife is napping.

If I'm putting 50-150 rounds downrange I'm looking at 10-30 bucks a week. Average lets say 20 bucks x 50 weeks and I'm looking at 1k a year on ammo. And that's if I get out every week, with the snow in Massachusetts I know that's not happening. That's acceptable to me.

This is going to be my primary rifle for a while so I would rather have the better ballistics of the .17hmr as well as in the beginning I think the accuracy will really help me hone my skills.

That being said if I do find myself with more time and wanting to shoot more I'm going to have to buy the 22 eventually. I think it would be good to switch to when I get boringly good with the .17 for the added challenge. As I see it I will be working my way up to being able to shoot the 22 at 300yds!

I'm 85% on the .17hmr, anybody have any arguments to change my mind?
 
#24
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr


If 17hmr cost more than 223 whats the point?

In mass we can only use 22lr or smaller on coyotes, so that limits the caliber. If I get to the point where I feel I'm good enough to take the shot humanely I'm sure my brother in law will not have a hard time twisting my arm to take me out hunting with him. Also the centerfire rifles are considerably more expensive than the rimfire.

All the points about the .22 and shooting more are valid, I am definitely getting both, it is more of a "if i can only have one for the next year or so and i'm just starting out which do i buy" thread i guess.
 
#27
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

My experience and comments on the whole cost of shooting things is this. If you want to buy ammo for a 22lr that will even come close to keeping the groups as small as the 17hmr at 100yards and beyond, your going to be buying the $12-$20 match grade ammo. So there is no cost saving in ammo. Yes you can buy a brick of cheap ammo for $12, but what is the point if your shots don't go where you want? I mean isnt the point of a trainer to get you to have better form and be a better shooter? How can you do that when your trying to run ammo that doesn't group well?


So in my opinion 17hmr wins hands down. The ammo is all $9-$15 for a box of 50 and all provide no problem to practice to 300 yards without running out of scope adjustment, or using Kentucky windage. And instead of cherry picking targets where all the heavens lined up for a good target, you can be consistent and get improved results through practice. But that is just my opinion.
 
#29
Re: New Shooter - .17hmr trainer or .22lr

I declare .22lr the winner. I just ordered a savage mkii fv-sr.
Logic behind the decision:

I have 300 yards to shoot at, the .22lr will be a much more realistic training round for long range shooting than the 17hmr will at that distance.

The cost of ammo is an obvious factor, I just picked up 1400 rounds of all different types of ammo to see what the gun likes and don't feel bad about it.

In the end the hmr ammo is just too expensive to do a ton of shooting. I wanted to like it as a trainer bc it is so accurate, but in the end i can't justify the cost and the head wins out. 22lr is the smarter choice.
 
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