Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

[mdesign]

Am gathering some components for my 7mm-08 build and I noticed on Alliant's website that of all their rifle powders, only RL15 & 17 are listed as not being temperature sensitive.

RL17 is fairly new to the market and I have seen where some are using it but RL 15 has been around for quite a while.

Wondering what your experience has been with these powders in the diferent temperature extremes? How do they compare with a powder like H4350?

 

[balkandom]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

I use 4350 in my bigger magnums, .375 Wby and .338 Win, and most of my shooting has been in nice (50-80 degree) weather, so I can't comment on it.
RL-15, on the other hand, is one of the staples for my .308 loading, and I've used it from about zero to around 110 farenheit, and it seems pretty consistent all the way through.

 

[Joe-n-TX]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Winter or summer my 168 smk pills do wonders
with 42gns of RE15.

 

[mdesign]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Good to hear. RL-15 looks like it might be just the ticket for my 7mm-08.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Some 308 results with RL-17:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1397801&#Post1397809

Some 6mm results with RL-25:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1661525&#Post1412754

I'll stick to Hodgdon...

 

[XLR]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

These are with a 6.5x47 Lapua with RL17 at 100 yads. This is my first time using RL powders pretty happy at this time. I have only cronographed these once for range data but ES numbers were in the single digits.

 

[mdesign]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some 308 results with RL-17:

Some 6mm results with RL-25:

I'll stick to Hodgdon... </div></div>

That's what I've always thought myself but IMO they need something between Varget and H4350 besides the ball powders that do not shoot well from any rifle I own.

Varget works good, when it can be found, as does H4350 but sometimes the one is a little fast while the other is a little slow.....so I started researching load data, etc and found that the burn rate for RL-15 fit the 7mm-08 very well and that Alliant claims temperature stability for it and 17.

Only testing will tell what works best.

 

[seven mm]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

mdesign

I ran a LSR 708 for a while, varget was too fast and didn't give the speed I was looking for, R15 was/is very close to varget as far as performance out of a 708. I ran 175smk's out of mine with R17. Depending on how long your barrel is you may get R19 to work. I could get decent velocity with it but it ended up being quite compressed. I ended up using R17 as I had a fair bit of it and could get the performance I wanted. Always wanted to run some H4350 but never did.

 

[Michael]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Spent years with varget, then switched to Re15 for two years as a trial.
Went back to varget due to the temp instability exhibited by Re15 and Re19 ( Re17 wasn't out yet).
Re15 moves alot, but not as much as IMR4064, although certainly more than varget, in my experience.

 

[Grump]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Michael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Spent years with varget, then switched to Re15 for two years as a trial.
Went back to varget due to the temp instability exhibited by Re15 and Re19 ( Re17 wasn't out yet).
Re15 moves alot, but not as much as IMR4064, although certainly more than varget, in my experience. </div></div>

How much is "a lot" and how much did 4064 move?

Did/do bullet weights make a difference?

 

[Chanonry]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

This was discussed in a thread recently. More data was kicking about there but...

I chrono'd a 308 re15 load at about 15 degC and exactly 1 degC and got velocities of 2770 and exactly 2700 fps. This seems like a large variation given the data available from manufactures and other testers but it is real data 'cos I measured it.

RE17 is a fundamentally different powder from RE15 and RE19 and it is therefore not reasonable to assume it will behave in a similar way. My load is developing 2600fps with a 200gr bullet at 12 ft and 1 degC. When it warms up I will see what effect it has.

Andy

 

[kyreloader]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Any POI difference?

 

[Goin'Hot]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: XLR</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These are with a 6.5x47 Lapua with RL17 at 100 yads. This is my first time using RL powders pretty happy at this time. I have only cronographed these once for range data but ES numbers were in the single digits.</div></div>

What bullet are you using and what charge weights?

 

[leathel]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: seven mm</div><div class="ubbcode-body">mdesign

I ran a LSR 708 for a while, varget was too fast and didn't give the speed I was looking for, R15 was/is very close to varget as far as performance out of a 708. I ran 175smk's out of mine with R17. Depending on how long your barrel is you may get R19 to work. I could get decent velocity with it but it ended up being quite compressed. I ended up using R17 as I had a fair bit of it and could get the performance I wanted. Always wanted to run some H4350 but never did. </div></div>

Over here in NZ the ADI powders are the easy ones to get, AR2209 is H4350 and I have found that it workes better than AR2208 (Varget)....a full case of 2209 gave 2960fps with 150gr pills in a 24" barrel but was to hot for summer so we settled on 48.5gr and 2830fps

Never tried reloader powders as supply is inconsistant here but I do have RL17 that I am using in my 7mmSAUM so might give it a bash when my next lot of powder arrives

 

[Michael]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

Re15 in my would run 2635 at 55 degrees and 2690 at 95 degrees. the shift from +55 downward is pretty steep.
The same varget load would move about 1/3 of that and no real difference for temps under 55 down to +30F.
IMR 4064 loads I once used had a different data sheet for each 10 degrees F temp shift. Below 50F the decline in velocity is fairly deep.
The change in all three powders is less that farther away from max pressure you get.

All ofthis is Ok if you plan for it; the stuff just does what it does and it becomes our responsibility to know what that is at any given time.

 

[XLR]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

I am using 123 gr scenars with 38.0 gr RL17. 22 inch barrel throws them at 2770 fps.

 

[Chanonry]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kyreloader</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Any POI difference?</div></div>

Eh, can't really say as the tests were months apart and I had been messing about with other ammo.

The test ammo was a Federal load (quoting 2820 fps)and all rounds were from the same batch

 

[brdeano]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some 308 results with RL-17:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1397801&#Post1397809

Some 6mm results with RL-25:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1661525&#Post1412754

I'll stick to Hodgdon... </div></div>

Intersting. My R-17 load in my 243AI has only been chrono'd at about 75* and again at 30*, I lost 20fps in the 45* temp change. 3250 vs 3230 w/moly'd 105's.

 

[Grump]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Michael</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Re15 in my would run 2635 at 55 degrees and 2690 at 95 degrees. the shift from +55 downward is pretty steep.
The same varget load would move about 1/3 of that and no real difference for temps under 55 down to +30F.
IMR 4064 loads I once used had a different data sheet for each 10 degrees F temp shift. Below 50F the decline in velocity is fairly deep.
The change in all three powders is less that farther away from max pressure you get.[snip]</div></div>
I guess then that staying close to original M118 velocities using 175 SMKs instead might help me with my 4064 loads then???

Before switching to CCI 200s, I was getting really, really flat primers using WLRs, with velocities of "only" 2600 from a 22-inch barrel. Some of us here are reporting 2700 with M118LR out of 20-inch barrels, which just makes me wonder.

 

[kombayotch]

Re: Not Temperature Sensitive - RL15 & RL17

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Brad Arnett</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kombayotch</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some 308 results with RL-17:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1397801&#Post1397809

Some 6mm results with RL-25:
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1661525&#Post1412754

I'll stick to Hodgdon... </div></div>

Intersting. My R-17 load in my 243AI has only been chrono'd at about 75* and again at 30*, I lost 20fps in the 45* temp change. 3250 vs 3230 w/moly'd 105's. </div></div>

Air temperature isn't always the best indicator. Unless the rounds are soaked in an exposed manner, at the temperature in question, for a good amount of time, you don't really know the powder is at that temperate. Rounds brought from home in a plastic case, transported in a heated/cooled vehicle will often experience very little change in temperature internally.