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POF-USA going out of business?

KillShot

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Minuteman
May 25, 2010
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Tulsa, Oklahoma
After viewing a YouTube video and seeing someone make reference to POF supposedly 'going out of business', I tried a Google search and found a bit of info. I read a few posts on the said forum that suggested POF is going out of business.

Does anyone know anything about whether or not this bit of information is accurate? For further information, check the link below.

(Yeah, I know I should consider the source but I wanted to find out if there's any validity to this story/accusation/assumption.)


Link - Article Source

Maricopa County Civil Court Case(s) against POF-USA.

http://www.superiorcourt.maricopa.gov/do...e+Factory+Inc++
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

I have not heard that.

In the first link the OP wonders whether POF may be going out of business. That's just someone wondering.

The second link is to a court case. It's just a court case, and one that is being arbitrated to boot.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Robert Hogan and Frank DeSomma were long time friends and closely tied in the manufacturing process of POF's product and are now becoming exapmles of why that doesn't always work out.
That part is true.
I really don't think its very cool that Hogan is now claiming POF's design for their own at all, but we'll have to see how that all wrings out in the end.

As for the rest of the speculation, I hope you don't believe everything you see on the internet.....

I no longer work or shoot for them, but wish them only the best. I just decided against continuing to shoot a gasgun in boltgun oriented cometitions. I still believe they have the best piston platform going.

 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

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Felix at AV guns posted a video about Hogan Manufacturing's products.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back in February 2011, we ordered 30+ .308 Gas Piston rifles from Hogan Manufacturing. They were to be manufactured with all POF-USA features, accessories, parts and quality. The conditions of the order were very simple. We would pre-pay the order in full and in good faith. Delivery time would be 3-5 weeks barring any unforeseen circumstances. All 30+ rifles should have been delivered by the end of March 2011, give or take a week. Failure to comply with this agreement/delivery date would result in our prepayment being refunded. Simple? Yeah, you might think that.
Unfortunately that was not the case. Hogan Manufacturing "kindly" sent us 14 rifles and they arrived on May 26, 2011. That was 60 days past the original and only delivery time we had been given. No problem. We were happy to get the guns and were hoping that the rest of the order would arrive shortly thereafter. Simple? Yeah, you might think that.
We opened the boxes to inspect the first 14 rifles and were immediately in total disbelief. Hogan Manufacturing send us 14 rifles that were a far cry from the outstanding quality we are used to from POF-USA. We immediately contacted Robert Hogan, owner of Hogan Manufacturing and Michael Freight, head machinist of Hogan Manufacturing to express our concerns on these rifles and the next batch. Well, we were told that the rest of the guns were 8-12 weeks out because they did not have the C.R.O.S. (Corrosion Resistant Operating System) in the upper receiver. As Hogan Manufacturing simply neglect it to do what we ordered!!! The C.R.O.S. is one of the most unique features that sets POF-USA apart from the rest and was a key requirement in our original order. Furthermore, there were no roller pins in the bolt carriers as stated in our original order. We were told by Robert Hogan that they could not get the roller pins. Well, why didn't anyone let us know? One quick call, email or even a text message? Nothing. Another key component left out of the production. That is something you should let your customer (us) know right away before proceeding.
We had gone over all of this with Robert Hogan personally and have his agreement in writing as to what we had on order and what we were going to receive and when... Simple? Yeah, you might think that.
So we did what any dealer would have done in our shoes. We salvaged 3 of the 14 rifles and sent 11 back to Hogan Manufacturing. We also requested a refund minus the cost of the 3 rifles we kept. We did not cancel our order. We just requested our money back until they were able to produce what we originally agreed on. Simple? Yeah, you might think that.
Robert Hogan has told us in so many words that they do not have time to deal with us and has cancelled all of our orders. He also stated that he will refund us our money when they have money in about 2 weeks.. That was in May.. Yeah, good luck with that. I've heard that before. We are almost in July and don't expect a resolution anytime soon. I've heard that pictures are worth a thousand words. Here are a few pictures that speak volumes on behalf of Hogan Manufacturing. You be the judge!</div></div>
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Everyone ordering "pof's" off desertfox01's "group buy" and other ads should see Felex's video, because desertfox01 is a Hogan employee selling for them.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Everyone ordering "pof's" off desertfox01's "group buy" and other ads should see Felex's video, because desertfox01 is a Hogan employee selling for them. </div></div>

Why so?
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

I have had my suspicions about BOTH companies for awhile now. I've decided to stay away from POF & Hogan's. In my business you can't be too careful about who you support, and I've heard too many bad things about both companies to stay away from them.

That's just my personal input on the situation.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Well, for what it's worth, I have a buddy who paid POF for a P308 back in January and he is STILL WAITING for it. Everytime he calls and asks about the delay, they assure him it's only going to be 'one more week' and give him some excuse like 'the rails are being anodized' or whatever else they can come up with.

When he ordered the rifle, he was told they were on an 8-week turnaround. His 8-week turn around should've ended in the first week of March. At the present time, he is still being given excuses and empty promises. To make matters worse, they've refused to refund his money and said they would discount the price by $50. If they would've been up-front with him from the beginning and let him know that it could be six months or more before he would receive shipment of his rifle, I doubt this would be such a problem. However, had they done that then I'm sure he would've spent his money elsewhere and they don't want to lose the business but after the way they've handled this whole situation, I don't see him spending money with POF ever again.

Don't get me wrong, this topic is by no means a POF bashing thread. I absolutely love my P308 and wouldn't trade it for any other semi-auto platform on the market, however, it makes me wonder how such a company can stay in business when they consistently make empty promises.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

wow this looks like a seriously fucked up mess. so pumped that i bought a upper/lower/rail/buttstock from the group buy, luckily mine seems to look like it is in pretty good condition and i am using a aftermarket bcg and charging handle so hopefully that will solve the grooving problem.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

I bought three gen III recivers from desertfox along with three of the triggers and three sets of KNS pins. one of the ambi bolt release paddles was out of spec and caused the screw that retains it to break. I contacted POF and they said they would not cover my recivers because Hogan was not an authorised dealer of POF rifles. I then PM'ed Desertfox and let him know my issue. He told me to ship the reciver with the stripped broken screw and jammed ambi release back for repair. I sent it in and recived it back in about a week after it got to Hogan. Hogan also sent me three sets of ambi bolt release paddles and hardware to be sure I did not have any other issues, which so far I have not.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Wow im glad I didnt buy into the POF family of guns,watch there value sink,because two guys cant get along.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

This is sad news. I had ordered an upper last Dec with a 6-8 week leadtime, and ended up cancelling my order in May.

Looks like this was the problem with delivery. Wish they could have just told me that, but I guess they have their reasons why they can't/won't.

Hope that everything gets sorted out because I still want to run one someday.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

I gotta say, all this really worries me. I mean, what happens if I need warranty work done on my rifle but the company has gone out of business? Essentially, I would have to send it to someone like G.A. Precision and have it switched over to a GAP-10, and I'm not saying that like it's a bad thing. I just really like my POF.

I am left to wonder if I should purchase a spare piston setup in case something goes wrong with my rifle? Should I try to get rid of it as quickly as possible, for fear that POF is going under and I need to find something else?

*sigh* I dunno what to think at this point...
frown.gif
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

POF's had a long history of long waits on product, this is nothing new nor is it an indication of their solvency or lack of.

I am not "on the inside" or privvy to any inside info with regard to the company anymore, but I think a concerned owner could call and talk to them directly if they felt so inclined.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Wow, first I order 240 rounds of 175 grain 308's from USAammo and then I get pm's saying people have had problems with FTF, messed up OAL's, jamming etc etc.

Then I see this thread while I'm only $400 away from paying off my 20" P308... Whats next?

I have heard about a lot of problems but I hope they get things straightened out.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Here's something I found this morning, which may shed some light on why POF is taking so long to ship, such as having to find another shop to manufacture the parts since Hogan is no longer involved.

Click the thumbnail image.

 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

This post sucks balls. Not one..not one bit of comment that came directly from the company in question. Go back and do some proper research and post that after you insure it is accurate from the company standpoint on whether or not they are going out of business. Jeezus H, WTF am I wasting my time here in this thread instead of doing more important Pre Cal homework?
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Switch,
Just because the company wont comment doesn't mean there isn't truth to the matter. Enron didn't say they were going broke either.

The fact is the Hogan, the brains behind POF, split with POF. Now does that mean POF is GOOB? No, but since Hogan was their parts manufacturer, it's going to be hard for them to find another supplier. Why did Hogan split? That, is where your answer lies.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Mike, much appreciation for shedding some light on this for the POF owners instead of trolling the topic like the guy before you. It sure gives us all something to think about in regards to our rifles.

 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

Here's what we know
*Hogan made many components for POF.
*Hogan no longer makes parts for POF.
*POF is being sued by Hogan.
*Hogan is being counter sued by POF.
*Hogan no makes rifles that are virtually externally indistinguishable from POF.
*POF has problems filling orders for products.

Here is what people are saying.
*Hogan is producing rifles with poor quality lacking all the features of POF.
Hogan representatives said POF is out business/going out of business at the shot show.

Here are the questions these facts and statements raise.
*What is the future of both companies?
*Who will service the rifles?
*If I place an order with either company what will I get and when?
*Is it an ethical practice to market virtual clone a product you where contracted to manufacture/make parts for?

In my opinion this stinks, I believe that POF is a among the best adaptations of the AR platform. I can not currently spend the money on either for different reasons; being Sued for non payment and not being able to deliver product is a sure sign that a company is not healthy, I have serious reservations about the practice of a company contracted to make parts using the reputation/design of the contractor to market it's product.

For now I will wait and see I'd hoped that POF would build a 6.5 Grendel/LBC/Sporter and I was seriously contemplating a .308 now I am looking at H&K more money poor customer service and not American made fat chance of a 6.5.
 
Re: POF-USA going out of business?

According to someone on a page dedicated to POF and other piston AR's on Facebook, POF isn't going anywhere and although he won't go into details, he sounds like an insider. I will post exactly what he said when I get home from work this afternoon.

Oh, and for what it's worth, POF is still shipping rifles. I have a couple buddies on Facebook who received their rifles from POF this month. You can also find new P308 rifles on Gunbroker now from Avgunshop.com.