Premier Spotter when ?

#5
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

We worked very hard with 3 optical designers on the spotting scope project 4 years ago. The engineers also had contacts to source the parts. When we started building them we quickly realized the system wasn't up to par and we refused to continue.
Some of the scopes did get made and found their way into some of the "cheap" catalogs.
I think at the time our design was a bit ahead of its time as far as what optical/mechanical manufacturing abilities vs. the cost factor.
We were using prisms and you would have had a projected reticle (Gen II) press a button and the reticle would disappear. We had problems keeping the system in line and the subtensions accurate.

That said the project is not totally shelved, but has been moved to the back burner for a bit so we can expand our scope line a bit.
Thanks for your interest,
Paul
 
#6
Re: Premier Spotter when ?


Now is a good time , as there is not a lot spotters out there with reticles & goos glass , Opps , just one Zeiss Spotter 60 , and they are un-willing to update their reticle apttern in the Spotter60 or at the very least offer the Finn Spotter reticle eye piece or a version of it .

Cheers Chris

I need a good Spotter , have a good Laser RF sorted , maybe next yr or 10yrs from now .
 
#8
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Was that only 4 years ago? I thought it was longer, interesting, heck it seems like it's been 4 years since the Premier scopes were first announced. I must be getting old. </div></div>

Maybe it was more like 5 or 6. It's me that is getting old...LOL...can't keep track of time with all this stuff going on.

Chris,
I am going to throw it out there at our next meeting and see how it flies. I will let you guys know.
regards,
Paul
 
#10
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Well I brought it up and Chris has not forgotten that we need a spotter. There are some tentative drawings and thoughts on paper but that where it stands right now.
If anyone is going to be at SHOT stop by and give me your thoughts on what you would like to see. Everyone else drop me an email with some ideas and we will go from there.
Right now the only thing we know is it will have a Gen II in it.

Thanks,
Paul
[email protected]
 
#13
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Paul,

Spotter would be nice but don't slow down production of the 3X15 hunting scope. Looking forward to it VERY soon. Love my Heritage but the smaller version would make it perfect for me. I'm getting wimpy in my old age and need a smaller, lighter package.

Take care. Paul P.
 
#14
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

A smaller Premier 3-15??? More details please.

Also, since there's about zero chance I will make it to SHOT I will express my interest here in the spotter. A projected reticle sounds interesting and challenging. I would be happy with either Gen II reticles, but prefer the XR.
 
#15
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

MacDaddy,
The 3-15 hunter will be out in time for SHOT (or at least is on schedule to be). Based upon our 3-15 optaical design for the Heritage it will weigh less (24oz), have a 30mm tube and the turrets will be hunting style(able to be adjusted) w/dust covers. Paul, I have your note hanging up here at my desk, I won't forget about you.

468shot,
The spotter will most likely start out w/ a Gen II but once we get the projected thing down the sky is the limit w/ reticle design. Like I said, this is only just us throwing things around right now and I have duly noted your preference to the Gen II.
Keep in mind that again we might be able to think this up but opto/mechanicals might still not be where they need to be to manufacture at a reasonable cost for all.

Thanks,
Paul
 
#18
Re: Premier Spotter when ?


How about a 30x eye piece , just like the FinnArmy one made by Zeiss for there normal spotting scopes ?

RE the Spotter new design , forget the GenII , use something like the Zeiss FinnArmy T crosshair & L measuring , and add some numbers onto it .

Also design it like the Zeiss Spotter with eye piece on the bottom of the design .

Later Chris
 
#19
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Hi Paul i am looking for a spotter right now and was considering a USO but if you have the plans started the Gen2XR would be the reticls i want as it will match my Premier 5-25 with that reticle and will likley buy another soon for my next rifle i am building.

What power are you thinking off? i would love something from the 20 to 50 power if variable or at least 30 power if it is going to be fixed power and mabe wide angle?

What are you thinking on the design? straight eyepiece? and a single unit or interchangable eyepieces?
 
#20
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Chris F,
We could put whatever reticle we wanted in it. BUT the first would be a GEN II as the spotter would be part of the line up of Premier scopes and our customers would want the reticle in the spotter to match the reticle in their rifle scope. Then like I said we could put whatever we wanted in it if the customer is willing to pay the user cost for the patented reticle design.
I am not sure but I think Zeiss's body design is patented so we could not copy.

Wild Bill,
I really can't tell you more as it is still in it's infancy of design. When I know something is written in concrete I will let you know. Again this is probably a year or so out so if you need a spotter go with the USO as they are pretty nice.
Thanks,
Paul
 
#21
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

I was talking with my brother in law about someone needing to build an "affordable" spotting scope simialr to the hendsolt or leupold in size with reticle for makeing calls. Affordable is $1000-$2000 IMO. $5G is a bit much.
I like the idea of having the reticle on the outer edges in a spotting scope. Get it out of the way so I can spot, then use it for measuring.
Another thing mentioned to possibly help the price stay down is a 2 power scope. For example 20x with a doubler for 40x. 60x is almost always to much for spotting.
 
#22
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

How about just an eyepiece with a Gen II reticle that fits a Kowa Prominar? That would be less risk than a full on spotter and allow users to put together a best of breed scope. I think it would be a for sure sell. I don't know what the margins are on eye pieces, but I imagine they are pretty thick and you could probably charge a premium. If you were to charge a premium on the whole spotting scope, you might put yourself in the Spotter 60 territory.

I think the people here are asking for this because they don't want to shell out for a Spotter 60.
 
#23
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I think the people here are asking for this because they don't want to shell out for a Spotter 60. </div></div>

Yep!!
 
#24
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Paul, I want a good FFP variable spotter with a reticle (GenIIXR would be great). I really don't care if the reticle can be turned off.

Am I alone in this?

While the technology sounds cool, im not sure if its worth the R&D dollars.

I could be in the minority though.
 
#25
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about just an eyepiece with a Gen II reticle that fits a Kowa Prominar? That would be less risk than a full on spotter and allow users to put together a best of breed scope. I think it would be a for sure sell.</div></div>

Big +1 on this.
 
#27
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Michael Aos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about just an eyepiece with a Gen II reticle that fits a Kowa Prominar?</div></div>

That sure sounds like a good idea. </div></div>

it's a terrible idea. Much better to make on for the Zeiss spotters first... ahem...
 
#28
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it's a terrible idea. Much better to make on for the Zeiss spotters first... ahem... </div></div>

Since I already have a Zeiss Diascope 65 and DON'T have a Kowa Prominar, I like your idea even better!
 
#29
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

there is genius to my madness (and self interest...). But seriously, if such a product became available it would become an instant must have purchase. I love the Gen II Mil-dot.
 
#30
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

If Premier would make a Gen II eyepiece for the Kowa Prominar, I would buy 100 of them. The Prominar Kowas stack up to any spotter in the world, but the lack of a reticled eyepiece just rubs me as PC BS.

There are two families of Kowa spotters, the 88/77mm and the 60/66/82mm and so just two eyepieces would need to be designed.

If you want me to pull strings at Kowa to get eyepiece specs let me know

Scott
 
#31
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LibertyOptics</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If Premier would make a Gen II eyepiece for the Kowa Prominar, I would buy 100 of them. The Prominar Kowas stack up to any spotter in the world, but the lack of a reticled eyepiece just rubs me as PC BS.

There are two families of Kowa spotters, the 88/77mm and the 60/66/82mm and so just two eyepieces would need to be designed.

If you want me to pull strings at Kowa to get eyepiece specs let me know

Scott </div></div>


Scott, if anyone had some juice with Premier you would. As a very happy Premier and Kowa owner, this is an idea whose time has come. Maybe a phone call is in order???
 
#34
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Guys, all I can do is ask Chris.

I know that we want to get away from any dealings with anybody elses product but our own. We can control our design, not someone elses. There are also other factors involved but dare say that we probably won't do the lens thing- sorry.
We want to put out a tactical spotter to compliment our tactical line of scopes. Hence using the Gen II or XR.
We are a small company and have to pick and choose our battles accordingly.
Gugubica,
we have talked about that also, but one of our military groups had asked for the on and off reticle so that is why we had looked at it. I don't know if there is still interest from those people or not. That is Chris's call.
Thanks for all the suggestions, please keep them coming as I keep a tally of what you guys ask for and I present it at our R&D meetings. Your voice is heard but thats all I can do. I don't have the final say in matters such as this.
Thanks,
Paul
 
#36
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: LibertyOptics</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If Premier would make a Gen II eyepiece for the Kowa Prominar...</div></div>

I would buy one for my 66mm spotter. I'm in the market for a variable eyepiece since I now only have a fixed 30x wide angle. It sure would be nice to get one with the Gen II reticle.
 
#37
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

if i could get a Gen2XR reticle on a 25 power wide angled Kowa eyepiece that would be awsome heaps run the 77mm scopes here it would mean that anyone could chose the straight or angled eyepiece spoter with the correct size and then just have another eyepiece.

Does anyone know if this can be done to an existing eyepiece? mabe premier could just have the eyepieces disasembled then have them etched with the cross hair then resale them to us end users?

This wouyld get Premier ito the spotter market a lot faster and there is no need to reinvent the wheel..

i was seriously looking at another Kowa but want a reticle in the spotter.
 
#38
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Carter Mayfield</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How about just an eyepiece with a Gen II reticle that fits a Kowa Prominar? That would be less risk than a full on spotter and allow users to put together a best of breed scope. I think it would be a for sure sell. I don't know what the margins are on eye pieces, but I imagine they are pretty thick and you could probably charge a premium. If you were to charge a premium on the whole spotting scope, you might put yourself in the Spotter 60 territory.

I think the people here are asking for this because they don't want to shell out for a Spotter 60. </div></div>

Excellent idea
 
#39
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

The design of the overal concept , ie the Z optical path is patented , PLEASE , no , because its just a upside down Leupold spotter , and I see no difference really between that and the Porro bino design , nothing new .

All I want is really 2 options , and IF Zeiss , would pull finger people would have 2 good options at different price points ( 2.5 & 5k ), just make the Finnarmy 30x reticle available AGAIN , and just change the current mildot L reticle , to one that has 1 & 1/2 mil hash marks , and its DONE .

RE GenII , get over IT , and LOOK forward , If you are that bent on your own rifle reticles , at least use a more appropiate one , like the XR .

Move forward , I see the L & T as the best or a combination of them both , its that simple , I am after something just like what I used to plot/take grig references off map , like the army protactors etc .

Later Chris

 
#41
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Don't hold you breath kids, you may suffocate...


<span style="text-decoration: line-through">How long has the moa/moa Heritage been promised now and as yet is still unobtainable?</span>-out now I hear.

I'd love an eyepiece with a GenII reticle for my Kowa 612, don't get me wrong. I just wouldn't wait on PR, even when they give time frames.
 
#42
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How long has the moa/moa Heritage been promised now and as yet is still unobtainable?</div></div>
The MOA/MOA 5-25x56 Heritage is ready to go and can be ordered through any dealer.
 
#43
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: David S.</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">How long has the moa/moa Heritage been promised now and as yet is still unobtainable?</div></div>
The MOA/MOA 5-25x56 Heritage is ready to go and can be ordered through any dealer. </div></div>

Very cool, I like the reticle. It did take a little longer than first proposed.
 
#44
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Hi Scott any way you can find out about the gen2XR reticle being able to be etched into Kowa eyepieces? i would be ordering one for sure. we heed another option and i realy would like a Gen2XR reticle in my spotter otherwise i will have to get a US optics reticle that is close not ideal but it would be an option.
I would love it if you had the pull to get both companies on the same drawing board mabe it would be all be able to be done at Kowa with Premiers input? the 25 power wide angle lense for the Kowa is a perfect candidate or the fixed 30 power?
 
#45
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Why in God's name would anyone want a Gen 2XR etched into a spotting scope? The Christmas tree is an excellent design for a rifle reticle and insanity for a spotter. The best equivalent would be some sort of a grid of dots, but I think that would be too busy.

I like the idea of a Gen 2 reticle that is off center to give a clear view through the center of the view. The Spotter 60 has a very nice reticle for spotting... it is a grid but not busy as all the coordinates are off to the side except for the center view.

As to whether Premier does this... their call. If someone else does this first, they will sell a lot, Gen 2 reticle or not. In fact, the combo of a Kowa + reticle is pretty hard to beat. I understand given the company's history the trials and tribulations of building a product around another product. If there is something wrong with the Kowa spotter, some customers might blame the eyepiece, etc. There would most likely be little notification of design tweaks from Kowa that would impact the integration of the eyepiece. It might not be the thing for PR, but a hungrier company will probably do it and sell a bunch.
 
#46
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

It's baffling that no one has put out an affordable spotter with a grid-type reticle to compete with the Leupies. There is definitely a demand for it. I would love to have a Premier spotter to compliment the Premier scopes I own.

I agree with Cater, while I love the Gen2 XR in by rifle scopes, it would not be the best choice in a spotter.
 
#47
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

Personally I think something like the Hensoldt spotter reticle with half mil marks wold be nice cause it dosent crowd the center of the optic but still gives a good reference for calling shots and spotting trace. But thats just my opinion.
Ben
 
#48
Re: Premier Spotter when ?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: gugubica</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I really don't care if the reticle can be turned off.</div></div>

OK, after serious reflection and testing...I changed my mind. An electrostatic (or whatever) reticle that could be flipped on after you watch trace/impact would be tits.

I want one.
 
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