The regional director of the south east
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Who is that?
Funny Chris is here, we have the Excel Data from Sheldon that outlines all the information regarding these matches over the years - the actual numbers not the, I shoot it and have fun, bullshit
The numbers are MICROSCOPIC today, the people that shoot at least 3 matches a year is tiny... less than 1000 people, in most cases less than 500 people.
Analyzing the numbers you can see they fucked it up royally, look at the number not the anecdotes
Every year I review these numbers, you can see people moving from 200th place to 100th place and when you ask them what they did to move up the leaderboard they tell you , Nothing, went to a match with no pros or very few registered members guys went from 200th place to 100th place and all they did was shoot match with no pros
The numbers are MICROSCOPIC today, the people that shoot at least 3 matches a year is tiny... less than 1000 people, in most cases less than 500 people.
Analyzing the numbers you can see they fucked it up royally, look at the number not the anecdotes
Every year I review these numbers, you can see people moving from 200th place to 100th place and when you ask them what they did to move up the leaderboard they tell you , Nothing, went to a match with no pros or very few registered members guys went from 200th place to 100th place and all they did was shoot match with no pros
Interesting.
Is that data limited to PRS Members?
Or does it include people who shoot PRS Matches but never become PRS Members?
-Stan
Sheldon's data is limited to folks who shoot a minimum of 3 pro-series (2-day) matches during the year. It doesn't count anyone who only shoot 1-2 pro-series matches, or any regional or rimfire series participation regardless of membership status.
The above has been edited with thanks to @Sheldon N for the correction.
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Why move out the people that shoot to have fun? Has match attendance overall decreased?
I know for me, my job requires me to move every 3 years and I have tdy on top of that. I know people that have kids and have to push their time towards that. Matches are a blast and great for training. I can never keep my skills up cause of the work and family commitments I have but it's always nice to go back to a match to test the skills.
I shoot PRS in the Southeast. Mid pack competitor. All the PRS matches in Georgia were 90 -100+ shooters per event (one days and two days). I shot one SC one day match near end of season and it was full too. Shot one 2 day PRS event in Alabama and it was full. All these matches had plenty of "Pros" - the one days and the two days. Not seeing an issue.
I see same core group of about 70 competitors at every GA match. Saw lots of same faces in AL with some people new to me from west of AL. Saw lots of same faces at the SC match with some new to me coming from East of SC. At the last 2 day in GA, I shot with a multiple Pros coming from west coast. I guess GA makes up a bunch of the 500 to 1000 you reference.
And it's tiny, it's more smoke and mirrors than actual statistics because the same people do the same thing over and over again
The top guys will shoot 10+ matches while the majority shoot 1 or 2, the location is bigger metric, like having a the right bowling alley in your home town vs guys who drive.
Overall they show about 5000 shooter, or what should be 5000 shooters, its 3-5x overinflated because of the repetition by members, guys who shoot more than 10 matches are in the top 50, where after #75 it drops like a rock what matches people shoot. So you have 50 guys stacking the numbers to be up in the front, and the rest fall off like a rock and they require the 1x people to fill in the gaps
The top guys will shoot 10+ matches while the majority shoot 1 or 2, the location is bigger metric, like having a the right bowling alley in your home town vs guys who drive.
Overall they show about 5000 shooter, or what should be 5000 shooters, its 3-5x overinflated because of the repetition by members, guys who shoot more than 10 matches are in the top 50, where after #75 it drops like a rock what matches people shoot. So you have 50 guys stacking the numbers to be up in the front, and the rest fall off like a rock and they require the 1x people to fill in the gaps
Numbers don't lie, you can invent all the volume you want, being "Full" is more about location than series. And as long as they stack more inside a smaller circle it looks fine.
But the reality is, less than 500 people are this needle,
But the reality is, less than 500 people are this needle,
I respectfully disagree. I am nobody, a mid pack shooter competing for fun, learn, improve. I shot 6 one day PRS events in 2023, 2 two day PRS events, and 5 one day PRS22 events. I had plenty of buddies out there with me. I missed multiple 2023 events hunting or I would have more.
Again the numbers don't lie, I have the numbers in front of me, you can disagree all you want, you see one small circle out of a larger picture
Look at the stats last year vs this year see where guys jump the line now because the overall numbers fall, 200th to 100th is a fact of the statistics, people dropping out and picking and choosing matches different than before
I just don't see the allure of looking at these numbers, does this mean prs will die soon? I show up to matches and always have a great time shooting. Getting away from work and eyes through an optic with a gun is therapeutic.
Many people like to bowl too, some join a dart league, others Pool
Grow the sport was a scam, the money was used to enrich people personally vs growing the sport, so in some ways you were scammed... told the Series was designed to do one thing, it was actually designed to help their friends more than the group, that is my point.
They did nothing to improve the sport, they did nothing to grow the overall sport, anything positive that came from the allure of the sport was used to personally enrich a few people, so you tell me. Covid lockdowns should have been reset, the plan should have been modeled after real sports, etc.
They lead you down the path backwards, and told you they would see you further down the road, instead they burned the average guy after about 3 years of raping them. Unrealistic schedules, poorly designed matches, and feeding their friends vs helping the community
You paid for that...
They did nothing to improve the sport, they did nothing to grow the overall sport, anything positive that came from the allure of the sport was used to personally enrich a few people, so you tell me. Covid lockdowns should have been reset, the plan should have been modeled after real sports, etc.
They lead you down the path backwards, and told you they would see you further down the road, instead they burned the average guy after about 3 years of raping them. Unrealistic schedules, poorly designed matches, and feeding their friends vs helping the community
You paid for that...
And don't forget, this entire engine, the Precision Rifle Machine has multiple groups promoting it, what is being said is the biggest one is the biggest load of bullshit for the individual.
There are other varieties, NRL, .22, NOMAD like Competition Dynamics, all which feed the beast, so now filter out this one and see what they are actually doing for you and your money
There are other varieties, NRL, .22, NOMAD like Competition Dynamics, all which feed the beast, so now filter out this one and see what they are actually doing for you and your money
That is true, there are a solid 33% that don't care and that is fine,
But people are clearly asking for better and to be honest they are making plenty to do this right, they just choose to buy houses, cars, and boats vs growing the sport.
Absolutely there is a core group of bowlers who don't care, we do it here, I hit the WYCO league and have been shooting matches albeit under fake names, but I use them too, so I feed the stats.
And while this reality sucks, we still promote it because it's cheap training. But if I see close to 200 new people a year teaching and they see 350 new people, you tell me, one is designed to reach a very limited number of shooters the others is supposed to be the place to go, and only few more go this route vs my route...
My last slide in my class presentation
Again they are not the only machine out there, but look what they are doing for you vs for themselves
But people are clearly asking for better and to be honest they are making plenty to do this right, they just choose to buy houses, cars, and boats vs growing the sport.
Absolutely there is a core group of bowlers who don't care, we do it here, I hit the WYCO league and have been shooting matches albeit under fake names, but I use them too, so I feed the stats.
And while this reality sucks, we still promote it because it's cheap training. But if I see close to 200 new people a year teaching and they see 350 new people, you tell me, one is designed to reach a very limited number of shooters the others is supposed to be the place to go, and only few more go this route vs my route...
My last slide in my class presentation
Again they are not the only machine out there, but look what they are doing for you vs for themselves
Like today,
MDT puts out SOLID content on a weekly basis, where is the content promoting the PRS and are you telling me they couldn't have used K&M in the past to use that facility as a content factory for the PRS ?
Please, they can suck a dick on everything they don't do for the community that is at their finger tips.
Even with the tension between me and PRS, if K&M was a content factory from the start I would have contributed to that effort because it would show at least some form of caring about the community. Instead nothing is done that is not, Go here to Pay me
MDT puts out SOLID content on a weekly basis, where is the content promoting the PRS and are you telling me they couldn't have used K&M in the past to use that facility as a content factory for the PRS ?
Please, they can suck a dick on everything they don't do for the community that is at their finger tips.
Even with the tension between me and PRS, if K&M was a content factory from the start I would have contributed to that effort because it would show at least some form of caring about the community. Instead nothing is done that is not, Go here to Pay me
I've shot them all; cd, prs, Wyco, nrl, 22. All a blast and I'm glad they exist. If people are getting rich for running these events, so be it. It's a pain running these matches and I'll gladly pay someone to run them.
Wyco was great in that they were able to get MD's to align everyone's schedule to different weekends.
Wyco was great in that they were able to get MD's to align everyone's schedule to different weekends.
One I would consider is Archery here in the US they are huge and foster growth and education, with the inclusion of the .22 series and events it can be nearly an exact model in many ways.
I mean come on, they don’t even have a standardized Officiating class, like a PRS Official is not there to rule. Why aren’t ROs standardized with an education system. Have one documented PRS RO to show and run the rest that are spun up.
Instead they defer any fault by avoiding responsibility- it’s always the other guys fault. We don’t do that, but they’ll rule on it.
It’s easier to shutdown comment and slide away, under a cloud of threats.
I mean come on, they don’t even have a standardized Officiating class, like a PRS Official is not there to rule. Why aren’t ROs standardized with an education system. Have one documented PRS RO to show and run the rest that are spun up.
Instead they defer any fault by avoiding responsibility- it’s always the other guys fault. We don’t do that, but they’ll rule on it.
It’s easier to shutdown comment and slide away, under a cloud of threats.
I don't really know what the PRS can do to limit this. Guys who have the means will shoot more matches. Unless the rules change to average of all matches with min 3, it will continue. It's good for the sport guys shoot a ton of matches. It makes it worth all the effort to the MDs who put out significant financial risk to host these matches. Alot of matches are still selling out and most of the ones they aren't are either in low density populations or towards end of season when kids go back to school and hunting season starts.
It's about effort. Those who put in more effort be it shooting matches, training, dry firing tend to be the better shooters. The shooters and level of competition have gotten so good that you can't really phone it in and expect to place. You have to put in the work. No matter what the sport is those who work hardest tend to get rewarded.
PRS misleading people about numbers really only matter for advertisers. And I'm sure those companies can parse all that data for themselves and decide from there.
Archery is an Olympic sport and has a worldwide following. It can be shot from todlers to old people. The cost is small fraction to get the equipment needed and the coat to practice is almost free. The cost to compete other than travel is almost free. My best bud is a pro shooter and I've been to Vegas world's a few times, am buddies with a team usa outdoor guy.
You have government funneling millions around the globe into promoting the sport.
For 5k you can buy all of the best equipment on the planet with no reoccurring cost, matches almost everyday locally ( lots of shops have indoor ranges with leagues).
It's just not comparable at all. If prs was an Olympic sport with over 100 nations supporting it would be way bigger.
Parents can get their kids into Archery for a much lower cost and the whole family can shoot together. It's just not comparable.
Just a quick clarification, the spreadsheet data includes both PRS members and non-PRS members, anyone who shot a 2 day Pro-Series match. It's based on a cut paste of the results which includes everyone even if they aren't a member.
This whole thread confuses me. 
PGA tour and Liv golf
the good parts, not the crap parts of the past few years
would be awesome to see pro-am Friday's where the pro's shoot with
and train sponsor reps and people willing and wanting to learn from the pro's.
Thank you!
Since this has become a sidebar commentary on the state of precision rifle competition, I'll give my perspective.
I only track the pro series matches on my spreadsheet because there are WAY too many 1 day centerfire and rimfire matches for me to track.
Looking at my own region there are 3 pro series matches per year within a 6 hour drive. The number of sanctioned and non-sanctioned 1 day centerfire and rimfire matches I could shoot a year in the same radius is probably 40-50. There is a much larger contingent of shooters out there having fun and competing that don't want to incur the cost/effort of a two day match. While there are a good number of attendees who frequent the one day matches, maybe only 1/3 of those will ever attend a two day match.
The number of unique shooters shooting pro-series matches in the US is about 2,000. Based on what I see in my region the estimated number of ~6,000 total unique national competitors seems fairly accurate once you add in rimfire and one-day matches and both PRS members and non-members.
The number of shooters participating in the sport has been fairly constant over the past 5 years looking at pro-series matches. Down a bit from 2019, then back up this year. There are pretty consistently about 700 total shooters attending 3 matches or more in a year, the last 5 years running.
It's a small sport and it's likely always going to be. It's expensive, somewhat high barrier to entry in terms of base level skill required (ie being able to even hit a target at 500 to 1000 yards). Venues are hard to find, match directing is hard work and it's a small group of people who make the sport happen by actually running matches. Match locations are usually not convenient to access, often requiring hours of drive time. I have tons of friends who like shooting guns and who I've invited, but it's a big leap to spend the money and commit the time to actually participate. And on a broader level the long-term winds of societal change aren't going to do any favors to grow the number of people participating in shooting sports.
There is also a high level of commitment to get really good at the sport. Personally I see more shooters getting better and better and putting in real work to get there. Statistically, even the midpack shooters are hitting more targets year over year, and my own perspective is that matches aren't getting easier. I see more small targets than ever at the matches I attend and more expectation that you need to hit all of them if you want to be competitive. I also see an increase in time pressure, more movement and more complexity in stage design. While the top 300 shooters are rising in skill level to be able to do this, it does make it more challenging for new competitors. Hence, why many people enjoy just having fun in the 1 day matches.
I only track the pro series matches on my spreadsheet because there are WAY too many 1 day centerfire and rimfire matches for me to track.
Looking at my own region there are 3 pro series matches per year within a 6 hour drive. The number of sanctioned and non-sanctioned 1 day centerfire and rimfire matches I could shoot a year in the same radius is probably 40-50. There is a much larger contingent of shooters out there having fun and competing that don't want to incur the cost/effort of a two day match. While there are a good number of attendees who frequent the one day matches, maybe only 1/3 of those will ever attend a two day match.
The number of unique shooters shooting pro-series matches in the US is about 2,000. Based on what I see in my region the estimated number of ~6,000 total unique national competitors seems fairly accurate once you add in rimfire and one-day matches and both PRS members and non-members.
The number of shooters participating in the sport has been fairly constant over the past 5 years looking at pro-series matches. Down a bit from 2019, then back up this year. There are pretty consistently about 700 total shooters attending 3 matches or more in a year, the last 5 years running.
It's a small sport and it's likely always going to be. It's expensive, somewhat high barrier to entry in terms of base level skill required (ie being able to even hit a target at 500 to 1000 yards). Venues are hard to find, match directing is hard work and it's a small group of people who make the sport happen by actually running matches. Match locations are usually not convenient to access, often requiring hours of drive time. I have tons of friends who like shooting guns and who I've invited, but it's a big leap to spend the money and commit the time to actually participate. And on a broader level the long-term winds of societal change aren't going to do any favors to grow the number of people participating in shooting sports.
There is also a high level of commitment to get really good at the sport. Personally I see more shooters getting better and better and putting in real work to get there. Statistically, even the midpack shooters are hitting more targets year over year, and my own perspective is that matches aren't getting easier. I see more small targets than ever at the matches I attend and more expectation that you need to hit all of them if you want to be competitive. I also see an increase in time pressure, more movement and more complexity in stage design. While the top 300 shooters are rising in skill level to be able to do this, it does make it more challenging for new competitors. Hence, why many people enjoy just having fun in the 1 day matches.
With all due respect to the HMFIC, I’ve seen all this before. IHMSA. People bitched and griped, some said the entire world would line up to shoot if we would go back to the old way, others said, take away my scope and I can’t see the target so I’m quitting. (Think PRS changing rules limiting people to shooting unmodified wooden stocked Remington 700’s built no later than 1985 and using only SFP Leupold VX4’s)
Problem is that it’s hereditary, especially in sports that are hard. And no one on this forum can’t say that the typical PRS style match, isn’t a hard, physically demanding of and requiring a ton of acquired skills. And it’s expensive.
What can be done. Well, we could make it easier for seniors, cause everyone here, if he or she is lucky is gonna be a senior, sooner or later. That was done in IHMSA. Still did not work. However, at least it was tried. (Is this a conflict of itnerest since I am 75 and still like to try my hand at matches?).
Something else; Make it cheaper. Well that’s the real elephant in the room.
Its not the rifles, not the reloading, not even the match fees (though they are rather pricy) its the overall cost combined with the travel. Checked out hotels lately, maybe stopped for fuel; food?
Go to a match that‘s 200 miles away. if your vehicle gets 20mpg it’s 20 gallons at 3+ bucks a gallon. Hotels? For a two day match, we are talking 3 nights at anywhere from a buck and a quarter to a buck and a half. $375 to $450. Food, breakfast and dinner $30 a day. (And that’s if the MD provides lunch) Add at least 200 for match fees, 200 rounds of ammo, it adds up. That’s easily 7 to 8 hundred a 2 day weekend. And folks are griping because more of us don’t attend more than a couple 2 day matches a year.
Frankly, everyone attached to this sport ought be Damn Glad, 80% of us even attend any matches every year.
If some people take advantage to run up their rating. it happens, it’s a game and it’s gonna happen. Not good, but people have been ”sorta” cheating like this since games were invented. Want fair? They got a great one in Shreveport, Louisiana, every October.
My solution, everyone quit bitchen. the only way to make this thing live is attend what you can, encourage friends who think they like it, and make under used equipment available to beginners. Its one hell of a lot easier to hit targets with a well balanced, .5 MOA rifle that shoots a 6 or 6.5 anything, tha whacking away at targets with the ole .30-06 in a 1980’s wooden stocked Remington with a 3x9 Leupold.
That’s all I’m gonna say about this, I’m going to bed, crucify me if you must, but like I said, its gonna happen, so sit back and enjoy the ride while its still running.
Gotta ad, that @Sheldon N said much of the same but got posted just before mine.
Problem is that it’s hereditary, especially in sports that are hard. And no one on this forum can’t say that the typical PRS style match, isn’t a hard, physically demanding of and requiring a ton of acquired skills. And it’s expensive.
What can be done. Well, we could make it easier for seniors, cause everyone here, if he or she is lucky is gonna be a senior, sooner or later. That was done in IHMSA. Still did not work. However, at least it was tried. (Is this a conflict of itnerest since I am 75 and still like to try my hand at matches?).
Something else; Make it cheaper. Well that’s the real elephant in the room.
Its not the rifles, not the reloading, not even the match fees (though they are rather pricy) its the overall cost combined with the travel. Checked out hotels lately, maybe stopped for fuel; food?
Go to a match that‘s 200 miles away. if your vehicle gets 20mpg it’s 20 gallons at 3+ bucks a gallon. Hotels? For a two day match, we are talking 3 nights at anywhere from a buck and a quarter to a buck and a half. $375 to $450. Food, breakfast and dinner $30 a day. (And that’s if the MD provides lunch) Add at least 200 for match fees, 200 rounds of ammo, it adds up. That’s easily 7 to 8 hundred a 2 day weekend. And folks are griping because more of us don’t attend more than a couple 2 day matches a year.
Frankly, everyone attached to this sport ought be Damn Glad, 80% of us even attend any matches every year.
If some people take advantage to run up their rating. it happens, it’s a game and it’s gonna happen. Not good, but people have been ”sorta” cheating like this since games were invented. Want fair? They got a great one in Shreveport, Louisiana, every October.
My solution, everyone quit bitchen. the only way to make this thing live is attend what you can, encourage friends who think they like it, and make under used equipment available to beginners. Its one hell of a lot easier to hit targets with a well balanced, .5 MOA rifle that shoots a 6 or 6.5 anything, tha whacking away at targets with the ole .30-06 in a 1980’s wooden stocked Remington with a 3x9 Leupold.
That’s all I’m gonna say about this, I’m going to bed, crucify me if you must, but like I said, its gonna happen, so sit back and enjoy the ride while its still running.
Gotta ad, that @Sheldon N said much of the same but got posted just before mine.
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You are way off for match fee. The first match of 2024, The Leupold Steel Classic has gone up to $325 and there are 20 squads of 12 so far = $80k. Put on a few 2-day matches and some 1-days alongside and the numbers rack up pretty quickly.
Me too. It was the dry January weather this year that persuaded me it’s worth going back.Ridiculous... But I'll still be there! Mostly for the food.
Hahahaha sadist for 2023 into 2024, I see...
I think I was still seeing mud come out of my tripod legs throughout the whole 2023 season.
Well said. I am both, and all (Almost) everything people are talking about. Midpacker, Old (Senior), do a ton of matches, have fun, watch a certain group rise, bitch and yet, I still do it, going on year three, not burning out soon.
Is K&M My favorite place to shoot? Probably not, but, it sure it nice and Shannon (And Team) sure did a nice job, with his money, our money, whomevers.
Oh, and I did hear that the Floriduh matches are four (4) per year per Venue this year. (How this whole thread got started).
I hear there are some Lab Radars available.
)))Very well said and accurate. I have been competing 3 years and I also see 1) smaller targets, 2) more movement, 3) 12 round stages, 4) more complex target arrays all to separate the top from midpack. Coming back for 2024!
Hear me out. Fight Promotions.
Current precision rifle formats focus exclusively on tournament style matches, which works, but if you're a midpack shooter, you're competing for... midpack placement. And at that point, are you actually feeling like you're competing with anyone in particular?
Rather than a tournament, I'd love to see things go the route where you pit a shooter against a shooter with identical props and identical ranges, and make it a spectator sport where you make money off the spectators/venue/food sales/side events/local business advertisements, etc. Offer a real prize that's known beforehand, and actually tempting. Have promotion titles to fight for, etc.
Title sponsors could scout out crowd pleasers and talent from regional matches, so that there's a reason to compete in regional tournament style matches.
There are always big shot promotions like UFC, but there are the underdog promoters too - Invicta, Fierce Fighting Championship, etc. Even if a guy isn't good enough to get picked up by a legit promotion like UFC, a shot at a local title belt that you can defend and make a bit of cash on would be an incentive to improve, start a local shooting school/gym based on your achievements, and... grow the sport.
3 years of benchrest barricade with nothing to show for it other than a few local podiums and 50% cert off a prize table that's already been cherry picked, and -$15k wears on people. There are a lot of old timers in my region that don't shoot anymore, despite rocking the "pro" scene prior to 2020, and it looks like most are tired of the drama, tired of running matches for a bunch of whiny b!t#3$, and tired of massive time commitments, especially if you step up to the national level.
My region had a match going on about 4 times a month, and the guys who won the region are the guys who could go to all of them, and get an average score high enough to crowd out other match winners and put it all into the finale. Most of the matches were 30 or under attendance-wise, and the amount of match winners for the season was kind of ridiculous.
Adding to things, beginning as a regional PRS shooter in 2021, I was surprised to learn that the sport almost died in my region, despite having new shooters, because running matches sucks, and MDs would rather shoot than put on a course of fire and get whined at because the tire was bouncy, or there was a sage brush in the way if you took an easy shooting position vs the harder one.
I'm friends with one of the local MDs who ran the finale this year for the region and he made the point that there are so many matches nowadays (he specifically pointed at the sheer number of NRL22 X-matches in Utah in 2023) that have prize tables, that it's getting harder and harder to get prizes for the tables. Any mid pack shooter is going to note that in the last three years, the prize tables are looking more and more meh. Hornady PRC's prize table in 2023 was a lot more sparse than in 2021. NRL's last match at Rifles Only's prize table (2022) was quite a bit more sparse than in 2019.
As the number of shooters grows, what does retention look like? What does match design look like? What rewards are we getting other than "cheap practice", especially if match fees continue to rise along with cost of components? Have we grown the sizes and rewards of shooting in anything other than Open?
But above all - if there's no element of spectatorship, or a way to monetize from anything other than the participants, is it really that much of a sport?
If my introverted misanthropic self could run a rifle series it would not allow any competitors to see the scores of any other competitors.
At the beginning and end of the season you would shoot the exact same match with the exact same gear. All other matches in-between are up to you. Five matches total.
At the end of the series, your first match and last match hit percentages are compared, and you get some kind of something based on a percentage of improvement.
“The Improvement Series” would never make money, but would push the mindset I value, which has nothing to do with prize tables or jerseys.
-Stan
At the beginning and end of the season you would shoot the exact same match with the exact same gear. All other matches in-between are up to you. Five matches total.
At the end of the series, your first match and last match hit percentages are compared, and you get some kind of something based on a percentage of improvement.
“The Improvement Series” would never make money, but would push the mindset I value, which has nothing to do with prize tables or jerseys.
-Stan
Looking at local fight promotions and gyms - local promotions help promote local fighters, who often go on to open their own gyms, or instruct at local gyms. It's not uncommon for BJJ gyms to host an event pitting their fighters against those of other gyms. If Nothern Utah Precision Rifle club were a "gym" that offered training and paid a "title" holder of some division to offer training, it'd even open up the possibility of pitting one club against another club. It would also allow you to offer tournament style matches with teams and let you test not just your barricade benchrest skills, but also your communication, or anything else you wanted to do. Above all, and to Lowlight's point, it would grow the sport.
And yet matches are still selling out at a national level. Local participation is higher than ever even with way more matches out there.
If you put on good matches people will come. If you don't, they won't. It's really that simple. Want a crack at good prizes? Shoot better. The prizes tables aren't as deep but plenty of matches have awesome prizes if you finish top 10/20. Hell WAR gave away like 10 rifles in the last match. Other matches i won't name have shittir prize tables and are not as fun matches to shoot and they get shittier attendance. The market will decide. The worst ones have shit prize tables and then only let you walk once. They keep all the other prizes that were donated specifically to that match. Then a year later you see a cert that expires in a month.
But that doesn't change the fact put on good fun matches have a good prize table and people will come from all over.
You funny….Want to be Superman, let bullets bounce off your chest better, want to be an all pro NFL quarterback, throw football better, want to be movie starlet, be prettier,
So, what amount of practice, working out, buying the best equipment is going to make a fellow or lady PRS or AG Cup Champion? What about you, I seemed to have missed you on the Shooter’s Mindset broadcast this past weekend.
Fact is, not all of us, young and old are going to be shooting as good or better than Ben Gossett or Andy Slade. Its not gonna happen. In fact, looking at a typical bell curve of human abilities, 50%, no matter how hard they try, how much they work, how much they spend are never going to be better mid-pact and many lower.
So, to say, “shoot better” is seriously like saying; “want to be Superman, have bullets bounce off your chest better.”
Other than the local finale and the PRS Great Lakes Regional finale held here ever 2-3 years, Wisconsin hasn't had a prize table in 5 seasons. Yet we have gone from 40 shooters per month to over 100.
If you put on a good match with a good CoF and good environment, people will shoot the match regardless of the prize table.
If you put on a good match with a good CoF and good environment, people will shoot the match regardless of the prize table.
Getting gud is a product of time spent either practicing, or shooting matches. Most casuals have a family, other hobbies, limited funds, etc. and can't/won't make the sacrifice to prioritize that much shooting to "shoot better". And let's be real, the bottom 75% of these matches are mostly casuals that are never going to actually "shoot better" because they've prioritized hunting, family, work time, other hobbies, etc. over dedicating themselves to walking a prize table someday and walking away with... a Strike Eagle or Bushnell Forge binos, possibly even a 30% Vortex cert from Eurooptic.
You sound like a bitch. Complaing about not be able to get better while feeling entitled to better stuff from prize table. Want to know how Gossett or slade or anyone else with a bullet gets that good? They put in the work. They didn't just wake up one day and magically become amazing shooters. No one wins their first match. Even the best shooters from years past are getting pushed out of the way becuase they do not train and put in the work like the current winners do.
It's PRS not the NFL. It doesn't require athletic ability or amazing hand eye coordination or being genetically gifted. You only get better by working harder and paying attention to the details. It's a game of making the least mistakes...not how many lbs you can bench, your 40 time or putting a ball in a hoop.
So yea.....if you want better prizes then shoot better. Outwork the next guy if you want it. You sound pathetic and a defeatist to be honest. With that attitude you will always suck.
I am neither bitchin or complaining but the fact is that shoot better wont work if the natural talent is not there. Not everyone has the skills and never will.
Frankly I don’t give a shit about your little prize table. In fact it’s a bit stupid in a way. Giving away products to quality shooters, they dont need or want or are products by a company in direct competition to the shooters sponsor. So, they wind up on ebay or gunbroker. If you’re gonna give something, give CASH. thats what the top shooters need. As for the rest of us, the real prize is accomplishing goals.
Caveat, prizes aimed at helping shooters in need or are new in the sport and under equipped have value,
You still funny, win stuff by magic. (because all the work and money and time spent in the world isn’t going to make 4500 of the registered PRS 5000 shooters reach the highest level). We all best be looking at what is gonna work for the rest of them. Without roots, the strongest tree is gonna die.
My figures are a guess, wasting good electrons frying me because 4500 or 5000 isn’t correct is just that a total waste of perfectly good electrons.
Regardless how how anyone feels the top 5-10 shooters in the world still need full time jobs because there is no real money to be made.
This is a game! Only real money being made is by the PRS
This is a game! Only real money being made is by the PRS
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