Remington Defense (M24 rebuild) makes a decent rifle - 300 yard target attached, would be a 148 6x if in a midrange F class match. Someday I'll figure out how to clean a target.
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Remington Defense (M24 rebuild) makes a decent rifle - 300 yard target attached, would be a 148 6x if in a midrange F class match. Someday I'll figure out how to clean a target.
you can't load the sandbag like you can a bipod. That's crucial for recoil control
My Rem 700 5R will shoot 0.25-0.5" @ 100 yards with 175gr SMKs over 42.2gr of IMR 4064. It is a 0.5" or better shooter with 175gr FGGM.
FH
FH
Flatbush Harry, would you say you would prefer the 20" threaded barrel vs the 24" non-threaded 5R?
I have seen hits at over 1000 yards with a 20" and torn between the 2 choices. I don't think I will ever need to shoot past 1,000 yards, is 24" only benefit higher velocity and longer distances? This would come I to play out past 800 yards or so right?
GWOTArmy7
Outside of Velocity at Longer Ranges, What would be the benefit of going with a 5R in 24" opposed to the 20" version which comes threaded? I would like to reach out to 1,000 yards, but the opportunity and need of such range will be few and far between and I have seen 20" barrels hit 1,000 yard targets. Practically speaking I don't see me needing to shoot more than 800 yards and thats even far. I can decide whether to go with 20" threaded or 24" non threaded (get it threaded possibly) in Rem 700 5R, any suggestions?
Is your 5R a 24" or the 20" threaded?
Mine is a 24" non threaded but I am getting it threaded in the near future. I love the gun. It's closing up finally. Just waiting on getting a lot better scope so I know the optics aren't moving around and making me think it's the gun.
I recently bedded my 5R .308 and last Friday I want to start systematically work up a load for my rifle, starting with a ladder test, and then an OWC test. Using 175 grain SMKs, I loaded up a ladder of 10 charges from 42.0 to 45.6 grains of Varget in 0.4 grain increments. For grins, I loaded another 10 rounds with the standard load that I have used in the past; 43.0 grains of Varget. Since I had the rail and scope removed for the bedding job, I brought it back in the ballpark with German surplus DAG ammo at 100yds, and then I shot 2 groups of 5 using my 43.0 grain loads. The wind was gusting a bit, and the last shot of each group came right a tad, but these are the two groups that I fired. I adjusted the windage slightly between the two groups. These are the best groups that I have shot with this rifle. I ran out of time to move to the 300yd range and set up, so I didn't shoot the ladder. Even though the 43.0 grains of Varget seems to shoot well, I plan to head back to the range and keep refining my load and see where it takes me. My 5R is a shooter. My gunsmith said that some 5Rs will really benefit from a bedding job.
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I just got my 5R assembled and shot it for the first time last weekend. I was pleasantly happy with the results at 100yrds this was with
Some Federal Gold Metal Match 7.62X51 175g.
I am new to precision shooting and I can tell you that my atlas mount after about 20/30 rounds came a little loose and my groups went to crap
I tightened up the knob and the groups tightened right up. (my fault that I didn't tighten up mount - the atlas is a fine bit of hardware!!)
So something must not be right with your reassembly as others have stated. I have not replaced the trigger yet (still running the stock about about 2.5lbs) but
have moved it over to a better stock and had the barrel threaded and braked. I didn't do any break in ran a snake in the bore and started shooting with
a few different boxes of ammo. One of the best groups was from the Federal ammo.
Some Federal Gold Metal Match 7.62X51 175g.
I am new to precision shooting and I can tell you that my atlas mount after about 20/30 rounds came a little loose and my groups went to crap
I tightened up the knob and the groups tightened right up. (my fault that I didn't tighten up mount - the atlas is a fine bit of hardware!!)
So something must not be right with your reassembly as others have stated. I have not replaced the trigger yet (still running the stock about about 2.5lbs) but
have moved it over to a better stock and had the barrel threaded and braked. I didn't do any break in ran a snake in the bore and started shooting with
a few different boxes of ammo. One of the best groups was from the Federal ammo.
Maybe a stupid question, but what is your twist rate. I also went through 7 different types of ammo before I found what mine liked. I now load 178gr AMAX with 44.0gr IMR4064 2.815 COAL with hornandy match brass. I shoot sub MOA at 100 which isn't saying much. But it is what it is.
The standard Remington 700 Milspec with the .308 5R barrel has a twist rate of 1:11.25. I don't believe that the OP has changed barrels.
This is impossible! 5R's are .5 MOA all day long as long as the shooter does their part...
I hear the sarcasm, but I've seen stock 5R's outshoot custom rifles at the same time.
Can't say they all are, or they can do it "all day long", but there are some that are shooters from the factory.
I have two Rem 700 .308s, a SPS Varmint glass-bedded and free-floated in a Bell & Carlson A5 stock and a factory-Cerakoted 5R mounted in an AI AX chassis by the guys at Mile High Shooting Accessories (as good a shop as I've ever dealt with). Both shoot 0.5" 5-shot groups at 100 yds with .308 Win FGMM 175gr but do poorly (1.5-2"+) with 7.62x51 FGGM with the same 175gr SMK bullet. I developed a load that I think is pretty close to the .308 Win FGMM using 42.5gr of IMR 4064 under the 175gr SMK and CCI BR2 primers. These loads also do 0.5" or better out of the 5R.
My immediate thoughts are:
1. Try .308 FGMM ammo instead of 7.62x51, using both 168gr and 175gr loads
2. Check the torque of the action screws (I'm assuming the 5R came in the B&C M40 stock)
3. Check to see if the barrel is free floated (I always use a $1 bill on my cheaper rifles but, as your setup is almost $2,000, I might use a $10 or $20 bill for precision measurement...j/k)
4. Try shooting from a bench...shooting prone off a bipod with a suitable rear bag should be very close to the results from a bench, but you may notice a difference
5. With respect, have another shooter with good ability check to see if there is any operator error involved
6. Shoot it some more and don't be fanatical about cleaning. I find my rifles need to be fouled and will then shoot 200+ rounds accurately between cleanings. Indeed, I only clean my bolt action rifles when I notice accuracy degrading.
BTW, I do find I get very nice 4-shot groups frequently and then screw up with a 5th round flyer...Don't confuse operator error with ammo or rifle capabilities...but don't discount all flyers as caused by you instead of the rifle or the load. That's what makes this stuff fun and interesting.
Good luck and best wishes,
FH
My immediate thoughts are:
1. Try .308 FGMM ammo instead of 7.62x51, using both 168gr and 175gr loads
2. Check the torque of the action screws (I'm assuming the 5R came in the B&C M40 stock)
3. Check to see if the barrel is free floated (I always use a $1 bill on my cheaper rifles but, as your setup is almost $2,000, I might use a $10 or $20 bill for precision measurement...j/k)
4. Try shooting from a bench...shooting prone off a bipod with a suitable rear bag should be very close to the results from a bench, but you may notice a difference
5. With respect, have another shooter with good ability check to see if there is any operator error involved
6. Shoot it some more and don't be fanatical about cleaning. I find my rifles need to be fouled and will then shoot 200+ rounds accurately between cleanings. Indeed, I only clean my bolt action rifles when I notice accuracy degrading.
BTW, I do find I get very nice 4-shot groups frequently and then screw up with a 5th round flyer...Don't confuse operator error with ammo or rifle capabilities...but don't discount all flyers as caused by you instead of the rifle or the load. That's what makes this stuff fun and interesting.
Good luck and best wishes,
FH
Even if it never gets any better great shooting, congrats.
I bought a 5r here in Australia and love it. I cleaned it put down 30 rounds of what ever ammo was reasonably cheap then cleaned it. Next outing I used outback ammo 165sgk and 168smk and landed group that resembled clovers and better right on top of each other at 100m. I have a two piece Burris mount, leupold rings and a budget 6-18 redfield. I shoot off a Remington (or whoever makes it for them) bipod with my fist propping up the rear of the stock.
So not the flashiest rig overall and I'm definatly no marksman but getting results I'm pleased with at 100m and the 360m which is our ranges max. Hopefully get to stretch its legs further soon.
So I do believe they are a good rifle even though I've read a lot of people saying they are experiencing issues. Hang in there and maybe give a few different slugs a go I hope your luck changes
So not the flashiest rig overall and I'm definatly no marksman but getting results I'm pleased with at 100m and the 360m which is our ranges max. Hopefully get to stretch its legs further soon.
So I do believe they are a good rifle even though I've read a lot of people saying they are experiencing issues. Hang in there and maybe give a few different slugs a go I hope your luck changes
I've had a stock 5R MilSpec, 300 Win Mag for a year now. I can not get groups with Federal Ammo. However loading 200 grain Nosler Accubond in Wnchester cases with Fed 215 M Primers and 69 grains of IMR 7828SSC produced dime sized groups at 100 yards.
my 308 is exactly the opposite. it was touchy with length with the smks and does not care what length i run the 178 a max. and loves varget.
another thing to check with reassemble is that the magazine box is not binding. just open up your floor plate and make sure that metal between it and your action has a little bit of wiggle
another thing to check with reassemble is that the magazine box is not binding. just open up your floor plate and make sure that metal between it and your action has a little bit of wiggle
My 5R will shoot 65% of 5 shot groups under 1 MOA with 10% under 1/2 MOA. No groups are over 1.5 MOA. It likes Nosler 168 CC over 41.6 grains of IMR 4064 in Winchester commercial brass FL sized with Forsters' NM die. Federal 210M primers start things off. I use a cheap Nikon Buckmatser 6-18 x 40mm scope mounted with Burris Signature rings. There is the Atlas bipod up front and a StraightLaced shooting bag on the rear. My targets are 0.475" dots printed by an empty 308 case with cork shelf liner sized and super glued to the case head.
I call my 5R a 1 MOA out-of-box rifle.
I call my 5R a 1 MOA out-of-box rifle.
I have a 5r that will shoot with my gradous 7rm at 100. Maybe I got lucky, but I have recorded every group it has ever shot, and including load development groups it has averaged .6inches. Excluding all the groups for load development it is averaging sub half Moa with lots of 5 shot groups in the .2s and .3s with the load it likes ( FGMM brass, cci br2, 45gr of varget and 175 SMK). The 7 rm Gradous will of course average sub half moa, around 0.3 to 0.4 for all recorded groups with 180 hybrids.
I say sell it and try another one. They all might not average half moa but most are a lot better than what you are getting. Skip the break in cleaning regiment, you probably damaged the throat or crown doing that. Use a Dewey rod, brass jag, rod guide, and run a few patches with hoppes after a box of ammo, then just shoot and enjoy. I clean mine every 300 rds or so. It's been almost a year since I cleaned it last since I haven't shot that rifle much lately and I got it out of the safe this morning to check zero for deer season. Shot a .3 inch group, checked velocity at 2700 and put it away.
Like I said, don't throw good money after bad. Torque the action screws to 65 in-lb, make sure it isn't your scope, and if that doesn't work Sell it and get another one.
I say sell it and try another one. They all might not average half moa but most are a lot better than what you are getting. Skip the break in cleaning regiment, you probably damaged the throat or crown doing that. Use a Dewey rod, brass jag, rod guide, and run a few patches with hoppes after a box of ammo, then just shoot and enjoy. I clean mine every 300 rds or so. It's been almost a year since I cleaned it last since I haven't shot that rifle much lately and I got it out of the safe this morning to check zero for deer season. Shot a .3 inch group, checked velocity at 2700 and put it away.
Like I said, don't throw good money after bad. Torque the action screws to 65 in-lb, make sure it isn't your scope, and if that doesn't work Sell it and get another one.
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Mine shoots 168 and 175 FGMM around 0.5 moa all day long and when I got to hand loading I can group it down to around 0.3moa. It took around 500 rounds to break in the barrel and I did end up replacing the HP stock for a McMillan, didn't improve accuracy too much. I have heard of a few bad barrels though, if you have a bore scope I'd take a look at the rifling, but in general these are pretty good production barrels. Try different ammo, it could be a bad batch of ammo or perhaps your 5R doesn't prefer 7.62x51 and prefers 308 WIN
I was fortunate that my new 700 SPS TAC in 308 shot well from the beginning, but I never shot it straight out of the box. Before the first shot was fired, I installed a Timney 510, bedded a one-piece Leupold steel base to the receiver and placed the action in a B&C 2958 aluminum block stock. The only load I have shot with it is Federal .308 168 GMM and once I had a few boxes through it, it has remained a .6 MOA or better rifle.
On another note, unless done with the right tools (coated one piece rod, proper fitting jag, bore guide, etc.) and with extreme care, cleaning a bore can do more harm than good. After range sessions I only run wet patches of #9 through the bore (gently and carefully) until they come clean. I will occasionally run a few patches bore paste through, but I never crank away up and down the barrel like I'm sawing a piece of wood. I have less than 80 rounds through the rifle now and it has settled into the .6 MOA or better range quite nicely.
In terms of "accuracy declarations" I base such determinations on what the rifle will consistently produce at different distances on different days. Since mine is not intended as a bench rest competition rifle, I'm not sure if shooting 20+ rounds in succession is a realistic measure (though that is certainly a demanding test). If I shoot a handful of 5-shot groups during a range session and if the worst group is no larger than the worst groups from previous sessions, then that will be what I consider the "every day accuracy" to be. Over my last three sessions with the rifle spanning over a year, .6 MOA has been about as bad as I have seen with the pricey factory Federal GM load. Though I have seen more than a few groups well under .5 MOA, I can only go by what the worst I can expect.
In the end, what a rifle is capable of is the culmination of many factors, many of which you have control over. The results I have gotten with my sample might be quite different than someone who took the same rifle out of the box, slapped a scope on it (not saying that is the case here) and headed to the range with some surplus 150 grain FMJ ammo.
Due to the huge array of accessories and extensive knowledge base of how to set up a 700 and get it to shoot well, it should be no surprise that many can get excellent results without having to rely on a custom gunsmith. As with all things in life, YMMV.
On another note, unless done with the right tools (coated one piece rod, proper fitting jag, bore guide, etc.) and with extreme care, cleaning a bore can do more harm than good. After range sessions I only run wet patches of #9 through the bore (gently and carefully) until they come clean. I will occasionally run a few patches bore paste through, but I never crank away up and down the barrel like I'm sawing a piece of wood. I have less than 80 rounds through the rifle now and it has settled into the .6 MOA or better range quite nicely.
In terms of "accuracy declarations" I base such determinations on what the rifle will consistently produce at different distances on different days. Since mine is not intended as a bench rest competition rifle, I'm not sure if shooting 20+ rounds in succession is a realistic measure (though that is certainly a demanding test). If I shoot a handful of 5-shot groups during a range session and if the worst group is no larger than the worst groups from previous sessions, then that will be what I consider the "every day accuracy" to be. Over my last three sessions with the rifle spanning over a year, .6 MOA has been about as bad as I have seen with the pricey factory Federal GM load. Though I have seen more than a few groups well under .5 MOA, I can only go by what the worst I can expect.
In the end, what a rifle is capable of is the culmination of many factors, many of which you have control over. The results I have gotten with my sample might be quite different than someone who took the same rifle out of the box, slapped a scope on it (not saying that is the case here) and headed to the range with some surplus 150 grain FMJ ammo.
Due to the huge array of accessories and extensive knowledge base of how to set up a 700 and get it to shoot well, it should be no surprise that many can get excellent results without having to rely on a custom gunsmith. As with all things in life, YMMV.
