I've never got exactly how this works. If your seated long into the lands, wouldn't closing the bolt put enough pressure on bullet to push it make into the case?
- Thread starter jrbet83
- Start date
Re: Seating into the Lands?
If the bullet doesn't have enough neck tension on it, yes it will push back. However, if that bullet is tight in the case, it can be jammed into the lands slightly without being rammed back. Remember, most guys who jam their bullets are only doing so by .01" or so, and copper and lead are malleable enough to accommodate the pressure as long as it doesn't slip in the neck.
If the bullet doesn't have enough neck tension on it, yes it will push back. However, if that bullet is tight in the case, it can be jammed into the lands slightly without being rammed back. Remember, most guys who jam their bullets are only doing so by .01" or so, and copper and lead are malleable enough to accommodate the pressure as long as it doesn't slip in the neck.
Re: Seating into the Lands?
And if you have just enough tension to put it into the lands .010-.015" and then need to clear the weapon without shooting you may extract the case and leave the bullet there in the lands adn fill your trigger up with powder. I chuckle when that happens (because its happening to someone else).
I quit wanting to chase the lands when my 'smith said "Steve, what makes you think that the throat erosion in happening concentrically (sp?)?"
-then there's mag length limitations and such.
-and then there's that short Federal Gold Medal Match ammo that shoots so well in so many different tubes.
I hate reloading, and anything I can do to streamline the process yet stay sub-moa is good. I don't need to chase lands for the rifle to outshoot me and maybe someday when I can shoot the difference while under time and stress constraints I'll revisit the topic.
And if you have just enough tension to put it into the lands .010-.015" and then need to clear the weapon without shooting you may extract the case and leave the bullet there in the lands adn fill your trigger up with powder. I chuckle when that happens (because its happening to someone else).
I quit wanting to chase the lands when my 'smith said "Steve, what makes you think that the throat erosion in happening concentrically (sp?)?"
-then there's mag length limitations and such.
-and then there's that short Federal Gold Medal Match ammo that shoots so well in so many different tubes.
I hate reloading, and anything I can do to streamline the process yet stay sub-moa is good. I don't need to chase lands for the rifle to outshoot me and maybe someday when I can shoot the difference while under time and stress constraints I'll revisit the topic.
Re: Seating into the Lands?
LOL, I have seen guys open a bolt with an unfired round and left the bullet in the gun and extracted the case. He wasn't very happy that day.
Meh, I want to make the best ammo I can for my rifle. That is the very best part of hand loading for a rifle. If I weren't getting a lot of benefit, I would not go to all the trouble of trimming brass etc.
I've got a "dummy" bullet that I use where the neck is very loose with no powder and no primer that I close the bolt on to determine a "starting point" for my micrometer seater.
I close the bolt (easily) on this round and measure it.... then I pull it and set the seating die to make this dummy round the same length.... after that, I back off the lands in 1/1000" etc. for the length I'm trying to get to.
This may not be the preferred method but, it is repeatible for me and, it seems to work.
My ammo just won't group like it's supposed to unless I'm seating really close to the lands. ( at least for the load I'm currently shooting )
LOL, I have seen guys open a bolt with an unfired round and left the bullet in the gun and extracted the case. He wasn't very happy that day.
Meh, I want to make the best ammo I can for my rifle. That is the very best part of hand loading for a rifle. If I weren't getting a lot of benefit, I would not go to all the trouble of trimming brass etc.
I've got a "dummy" bullet that I use where the neck is very loose with no powder and no primer that I close the bolt on to determine a "starting point" for my micrometer seater.
I close the bolt (easily) on this round and measure it.... then I pull it and set the seating die to make this dummy round the same length.... after that, I back off the lands in 1/1000" etc. for the length I'm trying to get to.
This may not be the preferred method but, it is repeatible for me and, it seems to work.
My ammo just won't group like it's supposed to unless I'm seating really close to the lands. ( at least for the load I'm currently shooting )
Re: Seating into the Lands?
I refuse to seat anything into the lands....sooner or later it will bite you in the ass...let the benchrest boys play around with splitting hairs.
I shoot 155 scenars in 4 different .308's and they all shoot great off the lands. I want everything as hassle free as possible out in the field..all it takes is one bullet with a little longer bearing surface than the rest and you've got one stuck in there and powder in your locking ports.
I refuse to seat anything into the lands....sooner or later it will bite you in the ass...let the benchrest boys play around with splitting hairs.
I shoot 155 scenars in 4 different .308's and they all shoot great off the lands. I want everything as hassle free as possible out in the field..all it takes is one bullet with a little longer bearing surface than the rest and you've got one stuck in there and powder in your locking ports.
Re: Seating into the Lands?
+1
I have enough so it will not move back but seat in the lands
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: palmik</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If the bullet doesn't have enough neck tension on it, yes it will push back. However, if that bullet is tight in the case, it can be jammed into the lands slightly without being rammed back. Remember, most guys who jam their bullets are only doing so by .01" or so, and copper and lead are malleable enough to accommodate the pressure as long as it doesn't slip in the neck. </div></div>
+1
I have enough so it will not move back but seat in the lands
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: palmik</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If the bullet doesn't have enough neck tension on it, yes it will push back. However, if that bullet is tight in the case, it can be jammed into the lands slightly without being rammed back. Remember, most guys who jam their bullets are only doing so by .01" or so, and copper and lead are malleable enough to accommodate the pressure as long as it doesn't slip in the neck. </div></div>
Re: Seating into the Lands?
Seating the bullet into the lands is also known as "soft seating". In other words, you have very little neck tension, usually less than .002". Then you seat your bullets "long", which could be anywhere from .010" to .030". When you close the bolt the bullet will push back and seat.
Like others have said, there is a danger that if you have to clear your weapon on the line for a cease fire, you could end up with powder spilling if your bullet gets stuck. I always soft seat my bullets and know many others that do. I would do a test with a dummy round at home to see if your bullet sticks when the bolt is opened.
Loading bullets away from the lands is called "jumping" the bullets and there are many proponents of that camp as well.
Seating the bullet into the lands is also known as "soft seating". In other words, you have very little neck tension, usually less than .002". Then you seat your bullets "long", which could be anywhere from .010" to .030". When you close the bolt the bullet will push back and seat.
Like others have said, there is a danger that if you have to clear your weapon on the line for a cease fire, you could end up with powder spilling if your bullet gets stuck. I always soft seat my bullets and know many others that do. I would do a test with a dummy round at home to see if your bullet sticks when the bolt is opened.
Loading bullets away from the lands is called "jumping" the bullets and there are many proponents of that camp as well.
Re: Seating into the Lands?
for what it's worth, my current load is .010 off the lands but, if it shot better jammed, I'd be shooting it that way. LOL
for what it's worth, my current load is .010 off the lands but, if it shot better jammed, I'd be shooting it that way. LOL
Re: Seating into the Lands?
I've good luck with 0.05 off the lands. Have had no need to get up in the lands. I've been using Hornady A Max, Hornady spire point, and Sierra matchkings. Nothing but excellent results when you find that perfect powder charge.
I've good luck with 0.05 off the lands. Have had no need to get up in the lands. I've been using Hornady A Max, Hornady spire point, and Sierra matchkings. Nothing but excellent results when you find that perfect powder charge.
Re: Seating into the Lands?
Once I find a good powder charge with a 0.010" jam, I run a seating depth ladder by backing the bullet out in 0.020" steps - then fine tuning. For the last two loads I've worked up the best accuracy came at 0.045" and 0.070" off the lands. You never know what's going to happen 'til you give it a try.
Chops
Once I find a good powder charge with a 0.010" jam, I run a seating depth ladder by backing the bullet out in 0.020" steps - then fine tuning. For the last two loads I've worked up the best accuracy came at 0.045" and 0.070" off the lands. You never know what's going to happen 'til you give it a try.
Chops
Re: Seating into the Lands?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jwoolf</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LOL, I have seen guys open a bolt with an unfired round and left the bullet in the gun and extracted the case. He wasn't very happy that day. </div></div>
I'm guilty of that one. I was checking to see how the bullet/brass combo chambered. The brass ejected, the bullet decided to stay in the chamber, and the powder went everywhere!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jwoolf</div><div class="ubbcode-body">LOL, I have seen guys open a bolt with an unfired round and left the bullet in the gun and extracted the case. He wasn't very happy that day. </div></div>
I'm guilty of that one. I was checking to see how the bullet/brass combo chambered. The brass ejected, the bullet decided to stay in the chamber, and the powder went everywhere!
