Just got a SPS 308 Varmint and was curious to see if anyone has tested one out at long distance as a factory rifle w/ a good scope? I just bought one and plan on shooting it stock till i pick up a PSS stock. Thanks Billy
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Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
i just built up a rifle for a friend
SPS non varmint .308
super sniper stock
badger rings
40 moa nightforce base
nikko stirling 4-16X50 LRX (seccond hand off of my .308)
harris s type bi-pod
factory trigger for now
165 sierra game kings
lapua brass
varget 45.5 grain
cci 200 primers
around 1/2 inch at 100 yards and just scored a 46 out of 50 at 600 meters (at a local tryout for f-class), shooters first time at those ranges.
i built up the rifle with the idear of a solid stock and a well developed round, so i think you will be fine, just spend some time at the reloading bench.
i just built up a rifle for a friend
SPS non varmint .308
super sniper stock
badger rings
40 moa nightforce base
nikko stirling 4-16X50 LRX (seccond hand off of my .308)
harris s type bi-pod
factory trigger for now
165 sierra game kings
lapua brass
varget 45.5 grain
cci 200 primers
around 1/2 inch at 100 yards and just scored a 46 out of 50 at 600 meters (at a local tryout for f-class), shooters first time at those ranges.
i built up the rifle with the idear of a solid stock and a well developed round, so i think you will be fine, just spend some time at the reloading bench.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
As a starter, not a bad choice. Varmint style rifles are really well suited in most ways.
For LR handloading, seek a goal of minimal vertical spread at 200yd and beyond.
Optics are a great discussion. I think money spent on good optics is never wasted, but also, on moderately inexpensive starter optics, the same really should apply.
Somewhere in the future, two things will likely occur. You will have better experience upon which to base an optics upgrade, and you will also acquire a .22LR training rifle.
The starter optics will be familiar and effective on the .22LR. Waiting until you can afford pricey starter optics my be counterproductive, if it significantly delays your actual entry into the LR shooting arena.
This is my opinion, but it's also been my own historic approach to LR comp.
Greg
As a starter, not a bad choice. Varmint style rifles are really well suited in most ways.
For LR handloading, seek a goal of minimal vertical spread at 200yd and beyond.
Optics are a great discussion. I think money spent on good optics is never wasted, but also, on moderately inexpensive starter optics, the same really should apply.
Somewhere in the future, two things will likely occur. You will have better experience upon which to base an optics upgrade, and you will also acquire a .22LR training rifle.
The starter optics will be familiar and effective on the .22LR. Waiting until you can afford pricey starter optics my be counterproductive, if it significantly delays your actual entry into the LR shooting arena.
This is my opinion, but it's also been my own historic approach to LR comp.
Greg
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
Thanks for the tips, next step is get a good stock (foundation).
Thanks for the tips, next step is get a good stock (foundation).
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
I've got the sps varmint 26inch in the H-s pst025 stock H-S bottom metal rifle basic trigger Badger 30moa base NF Hi rings and NF 5.5-22x56 NP-R2 Reticle. Its unbedded in the stock. For me it likes 168 A-max on top of 45gr Varget Lapua brass and 210m primers. With that load im getting 2630fps. Its a solid half moa gun with that load as long as im doing my part. I've shot out to 1200yds with it so far and hit steel. I tried 1540yds but ran out of elevation and had to hold over alot!!!
I've got the sps varmint 26inch in the H-s pst025 stock H-S bottom metal rifle basic trigger Badger 30moa base NF Hi rings and NF 5.5-22x56 NP-R2 Reticle. Its unbedded in the stock. For me it likes 168 A-max on top of 45gr Varget Lapua brass and 210m primers. With that load im getting 2630fps. Its a solid half moa gun with that load as long as im doing my part. I've shot out to 1200yds with it so far and hit steel. I tried 1540yds but ran out of elevation and had to hold over alot!!!
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting!
beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting!
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting! </div></div>
I hope your joking about the 168s and 600 yards. Its not like I'm on the other side of the world either were the "laws of physics" don't apply. Many guys and I see great results with 168s at 600 and farther. For instance I have a 168 load that's a laser but is only going 2200fps. That put is just super sonic at 600 and I still managed a 582-13x at a 600yrd ftr comp. They fly just fine, so long as you keep them supersonic. Again I hope your joking.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting! </div></div>
I hope your joking about the 168s and 600 yards. Its not like I'm on the other side of the world either were the "laws of physics" don't apply. Many guys and I see great results with 168s at 600 and farther. For instance I have a 168 load that's a laser but is only going 2200fps. That put is just super sonic at 600 and I still managed a 582-13x at a 600yrd ftr comp. They fly just fine, so long as you keep them supersonic. Again I hope your joking.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
I've seen 168s make repeated hits at 1k and that is only 200ft asl. They were not supersonic though. Luckily it wasn't a windy day as well..
I've seen 168s make repeated hits at 1k and that is only 200ft asl. They were not supersonic though. Luckily it wasn't a windy day as well..
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
yeah, I just did the same thing - bought a SPS varmint and put a zeiss 6.5-20 on it and went to 1000 yards. then got a new stock and a nightforce. http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2084426
they shoot really well for factory barrels. get one. you'll be pleased with the $600 spent.
as for 168gr - I just got back from the range and hit 1100 yards with a prvi match 308 168gr. wind was blowing 20mph too. just have to compensate a lot. I hit 1100 about 15 times and then went back to 1000 for another 20 rounds.
yeah, I just did the same thing - bought a SPS varmint and put a zeiss 6.5-20 on it and went to 1000 yards. then got a new stock and a nightforce. http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2084426
they shoot really well for factory barrels. get one. you'll be pleased with the $600 spent.
as for 168gr - I just got back from the range and hit 1100 yards with a prvi match 308 168gr. wind was blowing 20mph too. just have to compensate a lot. I hit 1100 about 15 times and then went back to 1000 for another 20 rounds.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting! </div></div>
I hope your joking about the 168s and 600 yards. Its not like I'm on the other side of the world either were the "laws of physics" don't apply. Many guys and I see great results with 168s at 600 and farther. For instance I have a 168 load that's a laser but is only going 2200fps. That put is just super sonic at 600 and I still managed a 582-13x at a 600yrd ftr comp. They fly just fine, so long as you keep them supersonic. Again I hope your joking. </div></div>
I can take you to the target where more than one person had this happen. It does tend to be pretty windy there, but there seems to be an elevation line where they decide to fly and decide to die.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shooter21</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beretta989, I don't know how you managed to get 168s to fly past 600, as everyone I'm this area can't. In fact, some have even pulled them out of target frames sideways at 700, but that's your story not mine. Billy Jack, a good stock is imparative to an accurate rifle. If you get a stock with aluminum V-blocks or solid blocks period, bedding is not really necessary. With pillars, glass bedding is necessary. As Greg said, good glass is a good investment. If you are on a budget, Falcon Menace, Vortex (on the mid and higher end), Weaver tactical, bushnell tactical, and Super Sniper. If you are not on an extremely tight budget, go with Nightforce, US Optics, Schmidt & Bender, Vortex Razor HD, and Hensholdt. Good luck with your shooting! </div></div>
I hope your joking about the 168s and 600 yards. Its not like I'm on the other side of the world either were the "laws of physics" don't apply. Many guys and I see great results with 168s at 600 and farther. For instance I have a 168 load that's a laser but is only going 2200fps. That put is just super sonic at 600 and I still managed a 582-13x at a 600yrd ftr comp. They fly just fine, so long as you keep them supersonic. Again I hope your joking. </div></div>
I can take you to the target where more than one person had this happen. It does tend to be pretty windy there, but there seems to be an elevation line where they decide to fly and decide to die.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
I just made a deal on a HS precision 5R stock. I figure it is a really good stock, really wanted a PSS stock, but couldn't locate one, but the 5R stock looks the same, just shorter. Thinking of getting a 223 SPS tactical and putting it on the 5R stock and eventually getting the PSS stock I really want.
With that said, is a 10X42 SWFA Super Sniper a good scope? I was going to go w/ a Leupold Varmint or Burris, but started reading good stuff on SWFA's scopes?
Thanks
I just made a deal on a HS precision 5R stock. I figure it is a really good stock, really wanted a PSS stock, but couldn't locate one, but the 5R stock looks the same, just shorter. Thinking of getting a 223 SPS tactical and putting it on the 5R stock and eventually getting the PSS stock I really want.
With that said, is a 10X42 SWFA Super Sniper a good scope? I was going to go w/ a Leupold Varmint or Burris, but started reading good stuff on SWFA's scopes?
Thanks
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
The Super Snipers are great scopes. I personally have one and it works great. You'll be happy with the 10x until you have $$$ to upgrade to better glass.
The Super Snipers are great scopes. I personally have one and it works great. You'll be happy with the 10x until you have $$$ to upgrade to better glass.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
^I have definitely heard alot of great things about these scopes, in fact, I decided to get one til I can afford the $$$ for a Luppy or something, but I can't decide of I want the 10x or the 16x...
^I have definitely heard alot of great things about these scopes, in fact, I decided to get one til I can afford the $$$ for a Luppy or something, but I can't decide of I want the 10x or the 16x...
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
I have a heavy varmint 26" barrel one. It has a 12 twist and is looong throated. It is hard to load rounds that are "close to the lands". If you do, they won't fit in the magazine. My 155 grain Lapua Scenars need to be loaded at 2.94" to touch the lands! And the AICS magazine on the stock I bought has a max round length of 2.88". I loaded rounds from 2.88" to 2.94" each .01" increments and the longer they get, the more accurate they are. 1" moa at 2.88" on up to 1/2"moa at 2.94"! The best factory ammo has done is 7/8" moa (Buffalo Bore 175's).
So I am losing accuracy by not being able to load close to the lands. I intend to get a new barrel that will have tighter throat and I can load close to the lands and still fit in the magazine.
I have a heavy varmint 26" barrel one. It has a 12 twist and is looong throated. It is hard to load rounds that are "close to the lands". If you do, they won't fit in the magazine. My 155 grain Lapua Scenars need to be loaded at 2.94" to touch the lands! And the AICS magazine on the stock I bought has a max round length of 2.88". I loaded rounds from 2.88" to 2.94" each .01" increments and the longer they get, the more accurate they are. 1" moa at 2.88" on up to 1/2"moa at 2.94"! The best factory ammo has done is 7/8" moa (Buffalo Bore 175's).
So I am losing accuracy by not being able to load close to the lands. I intend to get a new barrel that will have tighter throat and I can load close to the lands and still fit in the magazine.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
Shooter 21 that was not a story but Truth. I have put 8 rounds out of 13 On a steel target that measured 19.5 x 27 inches At 1200yds. From my 100 Zero it took 54moa of elevation and 5moa of right wind.
Shooter 21 that was not a story but Truth. I have put 8 rounds out of 13 On a steel target that measured 19.5 x 27 inches At 1200yds. From my 100 Zero it took 54moa of elevation and 5moa of right wind.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
Although not your exact setup... I started with a stock LTR shooting 175 SMKs with a SS scope. The setup performed great (MOA or better) to about 1100-1200 yards (with a density altitude of 7000 ft). Average MV at 2650FPS.
I've had a 10x and 20x SS scope. I'd recommend the 16x if I were to get another. No complaints at all with the SS scope.
Although not your exact setup... I started with a stock LTR shooting 175 SMKs with a SS scope. The setup performed great (MOA or better) to about 1100-1200 yards (with a density altitude of 7000 ft). Average MV at 2650FPS.
I've had a 10x and 20x SS scope. I'd recommend the 16x if I were to get another. No complaints at all with the SS scope.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
For the most part, the bullet is effected by gravity, drag, temperature and wind. The 168 will travel accurately only as as far as it is stable. As it looses steam it will begin to fly erratically and then tumble. I've never seen a 168 tumble at in the vicinity of 600 yards. Usually, I see evidence of erratic flight while servicing targets in the pit for shooters on the 1000 yard line. The problem is shooters with M14's loaded with M852.
I like the 168 for 600 yard mid range over the 175 as it produces less recoil. Less recoil means more consistent control over the rifle from trigger pull until the bullet exits the barrel. With less divergence in angle/arc of bore at rest and bore at bullet exit I am assured of less angular error. The concept of using a lighter bullet for less recoil is applicable to LR, yet, the 168 just looses too much velocity with its relatively low B.C., even from barrels which are relatively long, to be seriously considered for LR.
Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities.
For the most part, the bullet is effected by gravity, drag, temperature and wind. The 168 will travel accurately only as as far as it is stable. As it looses steam it will begin to fly erratically and then tumble. I've never seen a 168 tumble at in the vicinity of 600 yards. Usually, I see evidence of erratic flight while servicing targets in the pit for shooters on the 1000 yard line. The problem is shooters with M14's loaded with M852.
I like the 168 for 600 yard mid range over the 175 as it produces less recoil. Less recoil means more consistent control over the rifle from trigger pull until the bullet exits the barrel. With less divergence in angle/arc of bore at rest and bore at bullet exit I am assured of less angular error. The concept of using a lighter bullet for less recoil is applicable to LR, yet, the 168 just looses too much velocity with its relatively low B.C., even from barrels which are relatively long, to be seriously considered for LR.
Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's handier than others. I think it's more of a handicap than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities.
</div></div>
I have a friend with the same rifle as I have, surgeon, AICS, 20" Kreager vs my 24" and I see no difference out to 500. Can't wait to see how they compare at a 1000.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's handier than others. I think it's more of a handicap than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities.
</div></div>
I have a friend with the same rifle as I have, surgeon, AICS, 20" Kreager vs my 24" and I see no difference out to 500. Can't wait to see how they compare at a 1000.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
There is no need to "justify" the 20" barreled SPS Tactical, <span style="font-weight: bold">if</span> you bought it for the right reasons. Someone looking for a long range match rifle should buy something else. Those looking for an accurate, affordable training and/or field rifle should consider the SPS Tactical. You know what they say about people who assume, Sterling Shooter?
The SPS Tactical is a great choice for beginner marksmen who need to learn the fundamentals of shooting. New shooters should be less concerned with hitting 1000 yards than being accurate from 100 to 600 yards. For them, the SPS Tactical makes sense. Upgrade the stock, add a few accessories and a suppressor, and you have a rifle that EVERY shooter can fall in love with.
It is also a great rifle for more experienced shooters, who know enough to see the value of the SPS Tactical for what it really is; a short to mid range tactical rifle of great quality and accuracy. I prefer to own a well rounded collection of firearms. Having a match rifle, or an expensive custom rifle doesn't fill the hole that a rifle like the SPS Tactical fills in my arsenal.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
There is no need to "justify" the 20" barreled SPS Tactical, <span style="font-weight: bold">if</span> you bought it for the right reasons. Someone looking for a long range match rifle should buy something else. Those looking for an accurate, affordable training and/or field rifle should consider the SPS Tactical. You know what they say about people who assume, Sterling Shooter?
The SPS Tactical is a great choice for beginner marksmen who need to learn the fundamentals of shooting. New shooters should be less concerned with hitting 1000 yards than being accurate from 100 to 600 yards. For them, the SPS Tactical makes sense. Upgrade the stock, add a few accessories and a suppressor, and you have a rifle that EVERY shooter can fall in love with.
It is also a great rifle for more experienced shooters, who know enough to see the value of the SPS Tactical for what it really is; a short to mid range tactical rifle of great quality and accuracy. I prefer to own a well rounded collection of firearms. Having a match rifle, or an expensive custom rifle doesn't fill the hole that a rifle like the SPS Tactical fills in my arsenal.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
I guess only getting 2700 fps out of my SPS Tac with 178 amax's has really handicapped me at 1000yard matches. Funny, in winds of 12mph at 3-4 o-clock, I still managed 546-7X. But then again I'm just worried about looking cool.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
I guess only getting 2700 fps out of my SPS Tac with 178 amax's has really handicapped me at 1000yard matches. Funny, in winds of 12mph at 3-4 o-clock, I still managed 546-7X. But then again I'm just worried about looking cool.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
I guess only getting 2700 fps out of my SPS Tac with 178 amax's has really handicapped me at 1000yard matches. Funny, in winds of 12mph at 3-4 o-clock, I still managed 546-7X. But then again I'm just worried about looking cool.</div></div>
My perspective is based on reality. If you're getting the velocity you claim from a 20 inch barrel, you'd get more from a 26 inch barrel. For LR that would mean better scores. BTW, I shoot a 20 inch barreled .223 with irons in LR Service Rifle competition. My average score,93%. I also shoot a 26 inch barreled .308 with irons in LR. My average score,98%. My point is the 20 inch barrel is indeed a handicap at LR. In addition, using irons, there's a sight radius issue with the shorter barrel.
I also sell Remington's at the store where I work part-time. I sell plenty fitted with the 20 inch varmint barrel. Folks buy them to satisfy their notion of what could get the job done at LR, their notion of LR is considerably closer than 1000 yards. These folks want to get into LR on a budget. They also want a "tactical" look. The look is what is most important to these buyers.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: flyboy</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Regarding the 20 inch SPS, I know some folks have a notion that it's the ticket to their shooting success; but, these shooters should not expect it will get any bullet nose-on as far as would be possible with a longer barrel. And, for better results at LR the shooter should consider something like a 24 or 26 inch barrel and a 175 grain bullet.
Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
I guess only getting 2700 fps out of my SPS Tac with 178 amax's has really handicapped me at 1000yard matches. Funny, in winds of 12mph at 3-4 o-clock, I still managed 546-7X. But then again I'm just worried about looking cool.</div></div>
My perspective is based on reality. If you're getting the velocity you claim from a 20 inch barrel, you'd get more from a 26 inch barrel. For LR that would mean better scores. BTW, I shoot a 20 inch barreled .223 with irons in LR Service Rifle competition. My average score,93%. I also shoot a 26 inch barreled .308 with irons in LR. My average score,98%. My point is the 20 inch barrel is indeed a handicap at LR. In addition, using irons, there's a sight radius issue with the shorter barrel.
I also sell Remington's at the store where I work part-time. I sell plenty fitted with the 20 inch varmint barrel. Folks buy them to satisfy their notion of what could get the job done at LR, their notion of LR is considerably closer than 1000 yards. These folks want to get into LR on a budget. They also want a "tactical" look. The look is what is most important to these buyers.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lucky_Number49</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
There is no need to "justify" the 20" barreled SPS Tactical, <span style="font-weight: bold">if</span> you bought it for the right reasons. Someone looking for a long range match rifle should buy something else. Those looking for an accurate, affordable training and/or field rifle should consider the SPS Tactical. You know what they say about people who assume, Sterling Shooter?
The SPS Tactical is a great choice for beginner marksmen who need to learn the fundamentals of shooting. New shooters should be less concerned with hitting 1000 yards than being accurate from 100 to 600 yards. For them, the SPS Tactical makes sense. Upgrade the stock, add a few accessories and a suppressor, and you have a rifle that EVERY shooter can fall in love with.
It is also a great rifle for more experienced shooters, who know enough to see the value of the SPS Tactical for what it really is; a short to mid range tactical rifle of great quality and accuracy. I prefer to own a well rounded collection of firearms. Having a match rifle, or an expensive custom rifle doesn't fill the hole that a rifle like the SPS Tactical fills in my arsenal.
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Your argument is persuasive.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lucky_Number49</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sterling Shooter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Shooters justify the twenty inch barrel SPS, claiming that it's <span style="font-style: italic">handier</span> than others. I think it's more of a <span style="font-style: italic">handicap</span> than others. I also think the shooters who buy this sort of rifle are somewhat succumbing to the perceived cool appearance of the rifle rather than its capabilities. </div></div>
There is no need to "justify" the 20" barreled SPS Tactical, <span style="font-weight: bold">if</span> you bought it for the right reasons. Someone looking for a long range match rifle should buy something else. Those looking for an accurate, affordable training and/or field rifle should consider the SPS Tactical. You know what they say about people who assume, Sterling Shooter?
The SPS Tactical is a great choice for beginner marksmen who need to learn the fundamentals of shooting. New shooters should be less concerned with hitting 1000 yards than being accurate from 100 to 600 yards. For them, the SPS Tactical makes sense. Upgrade the stock, add a few accessories and a suppressor, and you have a rifle that EVERY shooter can fall in love with.
It is also a great rifle for more experienced shooters, who know enough to see the value of the SPS Tactical for what it really is; a short to mid range tactical rifle of great quality and accuracy. I prefer to own a well rounded collection of firearms. Having a match rifle, or an expensive custom rifle doesn't fill the hole that a rifle like the SPS Tactical fills in my arsenal.
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Your argument is persuasive.
Re: Stock 700 SPS V 308 expectations
I want the 20 inch barrel because it will be carried on my back till needed, the m4 will handle everything close. Yes, my setup has to be carried I like to be prepared when things start to take a "change" about freedom.
I want the 20 inch barrel because it will be carried on my back till needed, the m4 will handle everything close. Yes, my setup has to be carried I like to be prepared when things start to take a "change" about freedom.
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