Rifle Scopes The Vortex blues.

[LRRPF52]

The vortex on the pws started out on my 700 LTR in 308. I moved it to the pws later in life then put a leupold vx3i lrp 4.5-14x on the pws and moved the vortex back to the 700. This scope went back when it was new because it wouldn't group on a known shooter, wouldn't track and the eyebox was very critical. Vortex said the ocular ring was loose. Has tracked fine and held zero ever since, just has black spots in it now.

The one on the win mag has the biggest black spots in it. That gun weighs 13lbs and has a good brake on it. I think we measured recoil on it right at 10 ft-lbs. With a 200gr bullet. So I don't think recoil was it's issue.

Talked to a friend of mine last night. He has one on a 700P in 308, purchased about a year after mine. Said his is doing the same thing.

The brake won’t have anything to do with the resonant wave that propagates through the scope from the initial shock impulse that starts in the chamber and moves outward from there.

I broke an S&B PMII 5-25 doing a lot of accuracy proofing on factory rifles, mostly .308, .300 Win Mag, and .338 LM rifles from range-opening to closing, day-after-day. Side Focus went kaput and image was cloudy, nothing you could do about it but send it to S&B.

The gold standards in durability are NF and Razors for variable power, quality turret, feature-rich rifle optics.

I would look there for the PWS 216.

Other companies will have to prove themselves over many years until we can take them seriously in that department.

 

[aard3]

Back on OP's subject.

I think it's pretty much universally agreed that the Razors are higher quality and more reliable... it's also why they are more expensive. Same with NF, etc... all more expensive than Vortex's lower end stuff.

There are a lot of posts about people sending Vipers and such back... but remember that they are probably one of the best selling tactical scopes on the market... so it stands to reason that even if they have a very low % failure rate, there will be more posts of it because vortex sells so many.

 

[CK1.0]

I sold my Vortex Razor AMG, and my Razor Gen2 and now run Arken Optics.

And there you have it… on topic.

DK

I guess there'll be two of us soon then.

Better turrets, better reticle, better eye box, and the glass and tracking is the same... the $400 scope stays on the rifle, the other one will be in the PX soon.

 

[CK1.0]

To the OP, the fact is that what "budget scope" used to mean, and what it means today in 2021, are so different it's crazy, almost hard to believe.
So crazy in fact that a lot of guys are just going on making pretend that it can't be happening, there's no way some stupid budget scope can hold a candle to their alpha-tier glass that costs 10X as much.

Which makes total sense.
Because at any other time before now, that would be true. And most guys who've graduated to owning/using alpha-tier glass, don't spend much time giving a fuck about or looking through budget scopes... which is why they don't know how wrong they are.

I can think of a few reasons why some guys might think it's funny that I've decided to run an Arken over a Razor... I bet it's a mix of: they think I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about and don't know anything about what "good glass" even means, I'm too poor to buy scopes that cost a couple to more than a few thousand dollars, and/or there's no possible way a the cheaper scope can hang with the more expensive one in any meaningful way. None of those things are true.

Thing is, it's already happened before, in June 2014 when Vortex dropped the Razor HDG2: no possible way some scope made by "that shitty brand Vortex" and priced under $2K could hang with the more expensive stuff from S&B, NF, Leupold, etc...

Wait.. doh.

 

[XP1K]

I've got an ar that lives out in the barn. It's the emergency coyote/bobcat/hawk chicken coop defender. Dpms varmint upper, Anderson lower with assorted parts. Old magpul stock. Currently has a nikon m223 on it. I may try an Arken on it. Since they're cheap.

 

[hypno02]

I won't own a Vortex lesser than a Razor on any kind of weapon I may need to rely on for any reason.

 

[XP1K]

I won't own a Vortex lesser than a Razor on any kind of weapon I may need to rely on for any reason.

I'm starting to feel the same way. Shot a friend's ar with a 1-8 trijicon and I really liked it. May put my 1-6 with the mount up for sale in the near future.

 

[XP1K]

Scopes are headed back to vortex today. Dropped them at the post office this morning. Email they sent me said they're running a 4-6 day turnaround time. We'll see what happens.

 

[XP1K]

Got an email from vortex this morning. Scopes are on their way back.

 

[XP1K]

Got three new gen1 viper pst's in the mail today. Said they replaced two due to damaged tubes from over tightened rings and one for internal condensation.

Fast service, I'll give them that.

So now the big question, since I'm planning on retooling scopes, do I switch to mil or stay moa ? I shot an swfa 20x on my vudoo for a while and I liked mils just fine. Problem is, EVERYBODY I shoot with shoots moa scopes.

 

[Rob01]

Can't complain when you damage scopes and they replace them with new ones. Part of the warranty most forget about. At least you have three new ones now to do with what you want.

 

[hafejd30]

mil or stay moa ?

Nooooo, didn’t even see it coming!!!

Just kidding. Stay MOA if the group you shoot with uses the same. If they want to switch then switch. If you plan to do a discipline where MIL dominates the crowd then go MIL

Both forms of measurement. Both work equally well.

 

[Moose]

I work with and understand MIL and MOA and prefer MIL i just find them easier to work with.It is a good thing to understand MIL and MOA and i do not see any downside to having a working knowledge of both.

 

[chevy_man]

Wait. 7-8 year old scopes, replacing them under warranty, and you want to move away from them ? Wtf is wrong with you ?

Maybe, just maybe, he's sick of using the warranty?

I have much older and sometimes cheaper scopes than the vipers I had. The vortex ones are the only ones I needed the warranty.

I have sold all my vortex stuff to people like you who don't care that it will break, only that it will be fixed.


I did wear out a Sightron. It was 18 years old and the windage spring broke. They sent me an S-tac (roughly $500) to replace the 18 year old SII (I paid $225 for it).

There are others out there that match the vortex warranty on legitimate broken parts, but they won't let you send in the one you tried to use as a hammer being an idiot.

 

[iceng]

I have no issue dropping coin on quality gear. If you buy typically cheap Chinese junk, then that's on you. I have a razor HD gen2, put it through way more that I should have, and it's still spot on and tracks perfectly. I have a NF NSX, which has been back for warranty due to parallax issue. And had to pay for it. And this was years ago when it was less than 4 years old. Still had to pay, even freight.

I had a look through multiple top tier scopes a while back, and had the chance to buy basically anything I wanted. I got a March. Weirdly, that got warrantied, and now I run a Leupold mk5HD. Almost got a ZCO, but didn't quite do what I wanted (at the time).

 

[Schütze]

Maybe, just maybe, he's sick of using the warranty?

I have much older and sometimes cheaper scopes than the vipers I had. The vortex ones are the only ones I needed the warranty.

I have sold all my vortex stuff to people like you who don't care that it will break, only that it will be fixed.


I did wear out a Sightron. It was 18 years old and the windage spring broke. They sent me an S-tac (roughly $500) to replace the 18 year old SII (I paid $225 for it).

There are others out there that match the vortex warranty on legitimate broken parts, but they won't let you send in the one you tried to use as a hammer being an idiot.

Did you miss this on purpose?

Said they replaced two due to damaged tubes from over tightened rings

Vertical split rings perhaps?

"Maybe, just maybe, he's sick of using the warranty?"

Everybody should be grateful about getting these replaced with NEW ones, how can you not see it this way?

 

[Rob01]

Because it’s cool to hate Vortex. Lol

 

[DangerRanger]

Swfa.

 

[chevy_man]

Did you miss this on purpose?



Vertical split rings perhaps?

"Maybe, just maybe, he's sick of using the warranty?"

Everybody should be grateful about getting these replaced with NEW ones, how can you not see it this way?

Yeah, that shouldn't be warranty.

If you crush your scope with rings, that's on you. I've yet to ever crush one, and I wouldn't expect any company to fix my screw up for free.

 

[XP1K]

Did you miss this on purpose?



Vertical split rings perhaps?

"Maybe, just maybe, he's sick of using the warranty?"

Everybody should be grateful about getting these replaced with NEW ones, how can you not see it this way?

The scopes weren't damaged. Wish I would have took pictures. I've used a wheeler fat wrench on my optics religiously and I don't get carried away. They were vertical split rings though. Warne quick release.

Even if they did get squeezed a little I fail to see how that makes the coating flake off the glass internally. And what about the one with water in it ?

I am grateful to vortex for replacing them. Been nice if they would have upgraded me to the gen2.

As luck would have it it looks like I'll be running vortex again for a little while. Botched machine work on the heads of my truck have now cost me an additional 3k of engine work.

 

[XP1K]

The one that fogged up. This scope saw maybe 100 rounds through an m1a then it went on a vudoo.

 

[chevy_man]

The scopes weren't damaged. Wish I would have took pictures. I've used a wheeler fat wrench on my optics religiously and I don't get carried away. They were vertical split rings though. Warne quick release.

Even if they did get squeezed a little I fail to see how that makes the coating flake off the glass internally. And what about the one with water in it ?

I am grateful to vortex for replacing them. Been nice if they would have upgraded me to the gen2.

As luck would have it it looks like I'll be running vortex again for a little while. Botched machine work on the heads of my truck have now cost me an additional 3k of engine work.

They botched the machine work and you're the one buying new heads?

Need to find a machine shop with the vortex warranty...

 

[supercorndogs]

Didn't sound like he had to buy new anything there chief. Sounds like he sent in some old scopes and they sent him some brand new ones.

 

[Schütze]

But they didn't send Gen2 ones, so they are a horrible company LOL

 

[XP1K]

But they didn't send Gen2 ones, so they are a horrible company LOL

Never said they were horrible. But they would have been outstanding if they'd upgraded lol. Especially considering when I bought those scopes new they were $950 a pop and now they can be had for $450-500.

Turnaround time from when I mailed them off to when I had new scopes in my hands was nine days. That's pretty good service if you ask me. Regardless of what kind of stuff they turn out.

Personally I think vortex should drop everything under the pst line and focus on more quality rather than quantity. If they would do that they could sell more scopes and better scopes at a better price because then they wouldn't have to cover all the free scopes they send out to replace the junk.

 

[srt-4_uk]

I had Honda repair my 2010 Accord. Fuckers didn't even give me a 2021. Especially considering what I paid in 2010 vs what they go for now

 

[BCP]

Put em on ebay and spend a little extra for bushnell tacticals or used nightforce. Or maybe find some swfa scopes they are decent and not expensive.