What is "timing the bolt" and why do I want it?
Gunsmithing Timing the bolt on a Rem700
- Thread starter cinosbus
- Start date
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Timing the bolt is basically having the handle forward enough on the bolt body to make sure you utilize the entire caming action available on the action. This is within reason as you need to have a little bit of room between the front of the handle and the bolt recess in the action. This is an often debated subject with some saying you don't need to worry about it unless you are having some unusual extraction issues, to others saying it is paramount and you are a crappy gunsmith if you don't time a bolt to the minimum tolerances.
In my opinion if you aren't having any extraction problems (the bolt lift pulls the fired case from the chamber without any major issues), then you don't need to worry about the timing on your bolt.
DD
Timing the bolt is basically having the handle forward enough on the bolt body to make sure you utilize the entire caming action available on the action. This is within reason as you need to have a little bit of room between the front of the handle and the bolt recess in the action. This is an often debated subject with some saying you don't need to worry about it unless you are having some unusual extraction issues, to others saying it is paramount and you are a crappy gunsmith if you don't time a bolt to the minimum tolerances.
In my opinion if you aren't having any extraction problems (the bolt lift pulls the fired case from the chamber without any major issues), then you don't need to worry about the timing on your bolt.
DD
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Does it have anything to do with how the bolt "jumps" or "bounces" when you pull the trigger?
Does it have anything to do with how the bolt "jumps" or "bounces" when you pull the trigger?
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
no, that is related to the tolerance in the action. It is completely normal for the botl to jump when dry-firing.
no, that is related to the tolerance in the action. It is completely normal for the botl to jump when dry-firing.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
The timing of the bolt also pertains to the position of the bolt handle in relation to the lugs on the bolt. When you close the bolt and the handle stops at rest, the lugs of the bolt should fully engage the lug abutments in the receiver. Ideally, the lugs should land at 12 and 6 in the bolt closed condition. As you open the bolt, the motion of the handle should bring the lugs to 3 and 9, allowing the bolt to move rearward. If the handle is not installed in a manner that allows the lugs to fully engage the abutments, it makes for an unsafe condition. This was illustrated recently in a match when a shooter was airlifted to the hospital due to a bolt that essentially wasn't fully closed because of an improperly timed handle.
The timing of the bolt also pertains to the position of the bolt handle in relation to the lugs on the bolt. When you close the bolt and the handle stops at rest, the lugs of the bolt should fully engage the lug abutments in the receiver. Ideally, the lugs should land at 12 and 6 in the bolt closed condition. As you open the bolt, the motion of the handle should bring the lugs to 3 and 9, allowing the bolt to move rearward. If the handle is not installed in a manner that allows the lugs to fully engage the abutments, it makes for an unsafe condition. This was illustrated recently in a match when a shooter was airlifted to the hospital due to a bolt that essentially wasn't fully closed because of an improperly timed handle.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
That is the other part of bolt timing, but also has nothing to do with the jump when dry-firing.
That is the other part of bolt timing, but also has nothing to do with the jump when dry-firing.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
You're absolutely right on both counts.
You're absolutely right on both counts.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
BTW, that stinker action is pretty damn sexy!
BTW, that stinker action is pretty damn sexy!
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Thanks. I appreciate that....I'm finishing up a couple of magazine builds and cn't wait to get it out there.
Thanks. I appreciate that....I'm finishing up a couple of magazine builds and cn't wait to get it out there.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Correctly timing the Remington 700 bolt handle addresses several different areas but, the main function is primary extraction. This dictates the bolt handle position on the bolt body, regardless of bolt lug clock position. Typical spacing between the bolt handle strap/stop and rear receiver ring is .010", I've seen several 700's with as much as a .030" gap and less than 20% extraction cam contact straight from Remington. The problem is a fired case has to be bumped out of the chamber by the heal of your hand against the bolt handle. Battery cam contact and striker to sear bar handoff / position are also addressed with a properly timed bolt handle. When the primary extraction cam is set properly, the others tend to follow.
Skunk works,
I looked at your WWW tonight, found it by accident. Good looking rifles.
Correctly timing the Remington 700 bolt handle addresses several different areas but, the main function is primary extraction. This dictates the bolt handle position on the bolt body, regardless of bolt lug clock position. Typical spacing between the bolt handle strap/stop and rear receiver ring is .010", I've seen several 700's with as much as a .030" gap and less than 20% extraction cam contact straight from Remington. The problem is a fired case has to be bumped out of the chamber by the heal of your hand against the bolt handle. Battery cam contact and striker to sear bar handoff / position are also addressed with a properly timed bolt handle. When the primary extraction cam is set properly, the others tend to follow.
Skunk works,
I looked at your WWW tonight, found it by accident. Good looking rifles.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Thanks, I ran across your sight about a week ago. You're doing some good stuff and you're really close to my old stomping ground.
Thanks, I ran across your sight about a week ago. You're doing some good stuff and you're really close to my old stomping ground.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> you're really close to my old stomping ground. </div></div>
Where's that?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> you're really close to my old stomping ground. </div></div>
Where's that?
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I'm originally from Alabama and was stationed in New Orleans for just shy of 5 years.
I'm originally from Alabama and was stationed in New Orleans for just shy of 5 years.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">was stationed in New Orleans for just shy of 5 years. </div></div>
I've heard of that place
I believe he referred to it as "Chocolate City" never been there but know several who have. I doubt I'll be going any time soon. We're up around Shreveport.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">was stationed in New Orleans for just shy of 5 years. </div></div>
I've heard of that place
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I'e been to the chocolate town once since he made that statement and I certainly have no reason to go back. I've spent a bit of time in Shreveport and all along the I20 corridor. Maybe I'll look you up next time I'm down there.
I'e been to the chocolate town once since he made that statement and I certainly have no reason to go back. I've spent a bit of time in Shreveport and all along the I20 corridor. Maybe I'll look you up next time I'm down there.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up?
I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up?
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock63</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up? </div></div>
Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Bolt timing and bolt cam are two different things, they work together but are not the same and unfortunately some are made to think they are and need to be fixed when it could simply be left alone.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock63</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up? </div></div>
Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Bolt timing and bolt cam are two different things, they work together but are not the same and unfortunately some are made to think they are and need to be fixed when it could simply be left alone.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock63</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up?</div></div>
As I stated earlier, this is an often debated issue, but if you aren't having problems why try to fix something? Whether we are talking about lug timing or camming timing, neither of those things will change the accuracy of your rifle to any noticible degree. If you are not having troubles with extraction the distance in front of your bolt handle changing won't make a difference if how your rifle performs. If your lugs aren't engaging fully (This has to do with the location of your handle not foreward and aft, but radially on the bolt body), then it may be worth having the handle moved. That said, lug engagement cannot be determined from the gap in front of your bolt handle. It could be noticed from the wear pattern on the lugs, but it would have to be pretty extreme and would likely be noticible in the handle position as you are inserting the bolt into the action. There would be very little handle movement when lowering the bolt into battery. This is the situation where not enough lug engagement could be dangerous and should be remedied.
Other than that, why try to fix something that isn't a problem?
Dave
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: glock63</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have two remmy 700s, one long action PSS 300 win mag with .028 spacing between the handle and rear receiver ring, and my new SPS .308, wich has .022 spacing. Will I benefit from having these clearances tightened up?</div></div>
As I stated earlier, this is an often debated issue, but if you aren't having problems why try to fix something? Whether we are talking about lug timing or camming timing, neither of those things will change the accuracy of your rifle to any noticible degree. If you are not having troubles with extraction the distance in front of your bolt handle changing won't make a difference if how your rifle performs. If your lugs aren't engaging fully (This has to do with the location of your handle not foreward and aft, but radially on the bolt body), then it may be worth having the handle moved. That said, lug engagement cannot be determined from the gap in front of your bolt handle. It could be noticed from the wear pattern on the lugs, but it would have to be pretty extreme and would likely be noticible in the handle position as you are inserting the bolt into the action. There would be very little handle movement when lowering the bolt into battery. This is the situation where not enough lug engagement could be dangerous and should be remedied.
Other than that, why try to fix something that isn't a problem?
Dave
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Couldn't be a more true statement. I normally don't find it necessary to mess with timing on a factory rifle. I really only worry about it when I'm fitting a new bolt that has to have the handle attached.
Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Couldn't be a more true statement. I normally don't find it necessary to mess with timing on a factory rifle. I really only worry about it when I'm fitting a new bolt that has to have the handle attached.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle.
When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
That was helpful.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
That was helpful.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
he was being a smart ass man... saying that basically the common answer among tactical wannabes is to put a bolt knob to help extraction while the real issue is bolt cam timing.
he was being a smart ass man... saying that basically the common answer among tactical wannabes is to put a bolt knob to help extraction while the real issue is bolt cam timing.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">he was being a smart ass man... saying that basically the common answer among tactical wannabes is to put a bolt knob to help extraction while the real issue is bolt cam timing. </div></div>
!!!!!!!!EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">he was being a smart ass man... saying that basically the common answer among tactical wannabes is to put a bolt knob to help extraction while the real issue is bolt cam timing. </div></div>
!!!!!!!!EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
I've not been posting here for very long but I have been observing for quite a while. What I've realized (and I'm not speaking on my own behalf here) is that the group on this forum are talentd and diverse. We may not always agree on everything, but we are a bit of a collective of similar attitudes that can contibute effectively to legitimate questions and issues. In other words, everyone brings something to the table at some point that is helpful to someone else. I believe that we do agree that you being a sphincter muscle comes rather naturally and you obviously intend to be offensive and condescending. You may be talented and knowledgable with what you do, and who knows, you may even be better than everyone else, but if you're going to misrepresent yourself to the point that noone wants anything to do with you, why don't you shove the "F" off and go back to the crotch rocket world of rifleshooters. We'll be just fine here without you.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
I've not been posting here for very long but I have been observing for quite a while. What I've realized (and I'm not speaking on my own behalf here) is that the group on this forum are talentd and diverse. We may not always agree on everything, but we are a bit of a collective of similar attitudes that can contibute effectively to legitimate questions and issues. In other words, everyone brings something to the table at some point that is helpful to someone else. I believe that we do agree that you being a sphincter muscle comes rather naturally and you obviously intend to be offensive and condescending. You may be talented and knowledgable with what you do, and who knows, you may even be better than everyone else, but if you're going to misrepresent yourself to the point that noone wants anything to do with you, why don't you shove the "F" off and go back to the crotch rocket world of rifleshooters. We'll be just fine here without you.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Come on Dan, you just got back from a lengthy time out. For someone as talented as you in so many different areas, you'd think you would dazzle us with brilliance and not baffle us with BS.
Come on Dan, you just got back from a lengthy time out. For someone as talented as you in so many different areas, you'd think you would dazzle us with brilliance and not baffle us with BS.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Couldn't be a more true statement.</div></div>
aren't you the guy that promotes swapping out remintion extractors with sako and m16 style extractors?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Skunkworks</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not unless you are having a problem leave it alone.
Couldn't be a more true statement.</div></div>
aren't you the guy that promotes swapping out remintion extractors with sako and m16 style extractors?
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I wouldn't say I "promote" it. I just offer an alternative .
I wouldn't say I "promote" it. I just offer an alternative
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.
Been a problem I've been meaning to get around to, but never think of when I have a few bucks and time to send them off (I hear that if the lugs aren't a problem the handle's can be timed for camming just by getting the smith the bolt and the measurements).
I hope i remember to fix them when I start making some money again one of these days.
I've been tempted to try Dan, but the attitude has been a turnoff since before his vacation (plus he may think poorly of me because of my big knob).
I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.
Been a problem I've been meaning to get around to, but never think of when I have a few bucks and time to send them off (I hear that if the lugs aren't a problem the handle's can be timed for camming just by getting the smith the bolt and the measurements).
I hope i remember to fix them when I start making some money again one of these days.
I've been tempted to try Dan, but the attitude has been a turnoff since before his vacation (plus he may think poorly of me because of my big knob).
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
</div></div>
Funny, over 30% of the replacement handles offered on your site are "tactical"........
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
</div></div>
Funny, over 30% of the replacement handles offered on your site are "tactical"........
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Funny, over 30% of the replacement handles offered on your site are "tactical"........ [/quote]
I should add pics of handles/knobs that I tested on personal OTC/LR/Hunting rifles 30+yrs ago.
Delrin/Phenolic/Titanium/Magnesium to name a few materials.
I thank those that tap/drill/glue/rivet/screw/solder on handles & knobs on a daily basis.
These painted components take too much prep.
Funny, over 30% of the replacement handles offered on your site are "tactical"........ [/quote]
I should add pics of handles/knobs that I tested on personal OTC/LR/Hunting rifles 30+yrs ago.
Delrin/Phenolic/Titanium/Magnesium to name a few materials.
I thank those that tap/drill/glue/rivet/screw/solder on handles & knobs on a daily basis.
These painted components take too much prep.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot not too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
</div></div>
It's very possible you could have a timing issue, but there are a couple of other things that would need to be checked as well. I'll be out of touch for a week or so due to a move to Montana, but I don't think William at LA Precision or Randy at R&D Precision would mind answering a few questions about it if you hit 'em up.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot not too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
</div></div>
It's very possible you could have a timing issue, but there are a couple of other things that would need to be checked as well. I'll be out of touch for a week or so due to a move to Montana, but I don't think William at LA Precision or Randy at R&D Precision would mind answering a few questions about it if you hit 'em up.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much..
And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much..
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arcangel 4:16</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much.. </div></div>
Yeah, you lucky sucker.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arcangel 4:16</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much.. </div></div>
Yeah, you lucky sucker.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.</div></div>
The click at the top of the bolt lift you describe is often times a brass/sizing issue and not a timing issue. Does the rifle do this with new fired brass or only after two or so firings? I had to change to a small base die in my 6BR to eliminate the click, all is fine now. Also, brass that’s been fired and sized numerous times will start to loose its elasticity. Brass does get worn out at some point and then it's time to replace.
The extraction cam timing issue will cause you to have to bump the handle to the rear after full bolt lift to extract the fired case out of the chamber. After firing, leave the case in the chamber, lift the handle and see how much cam contact you actually have. Less than 50% will eventually give you problems..
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.</div></div>
The click at the top of the bolt lift you describe is often times a brass/sizing issue and not a timing issue. Does the rifle do this with new fired brass or only after two or so firings? I had to change to a small base die in my 6BR to eliminate the click, all is fine now. Also, brass that’s been fired and sized numerous times will start to loose its elasticity. Brass does get worn out at some point and then it's time to replace.
The extraction cam timing issue will cause you to have to bump the handle to the rear after full bolt lift to extract the fired case out of the chamber. After firing, leave the case in the chamber, lift the handle and see how much cam contact you actually have. Less than 50% will eventually give you problems..
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arcangel 4:16</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much.. </div></div>
Yeah, you luck sucker. </div></div>
Thanks guys, this has been a long time coming. I'll catch up with you guys in a week or so.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Arcangel 4:16</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And a big congrats Mike on your move to Montana! We cant wait to see the new builds so dont enjoy the scenery too much.. </div></div>
Yeah, you luck sucker.
Thanks guys, this has been a long time coming. I'll catch up with you guys in a week or so.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
What part of MT are you moving to?
DD
What part of MT are you moving to?
DD
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
The new shop is in Columbia Falls and the residence is in Kalispell.
The new shop is in Columbia Falls and the residence is in Kalispell.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
oh ok, way up there... beautiful country though!
DD
oh ok, way up there... beautiful country though!
DD
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.</div></div>
The click at the top of the bolt lift you describe is often times a brass/sizing issue and not a timing issue. Does the rifle do this with new fired brass or only after two or so firings?
<span style="color: #FF0000">Don't know. I've been running the same weight sorted LC Match since before this particular rifle was rebarreled last year. A few more firings with the brass I have and I'll be on to the Lapua I've been saving up.</span>
I had to change to a small base die in my 6BR to eliminate the click, all is fine now. Also, brass that’s been fired and sized numerous times will start to loose its elasticity. Brass does get worn out at some point and then it's time to replace.
The extraction cam timing issue will cause you to have to bump the handle to the rear after full bolt lift to extract the fired case out of the chamber. After firing, leave the case in the chamber, lift the handle and see how much cam contact you actually have. Less than 50% will eventually give you problems..
<span style="color: #FF0000">I shot 34 rounds today and I didn't have any issues. I may be recalling when I was was neck sizing only, but switched earlier this year to FL sizing only earlier this year for consistency. I completely forgot to look at the cam surface as I removed a spent round-I'll try to remember at the local match this Sunday to check.</span>
</div></div>
Thank you for the input Mr Roscoe, I'll be in touch if the problems persist.
The red responses above are referring to my main rifle, my 308 with an Obermeyer chamber.
If I recall correctly I've been neck sizing in the other 700 (my 7-08 silhouette rifle), but I haven't been shooting it recently. It too will be switching over to light FL sizing for all reloading.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wnroscoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm begining to think I may need a fix-I often need to whack the handle up at the end of its lift on rounds that are neither hot nor too tight going in. Come to think of it both my 700's are like that.
I'm scared to measure the gap, but I know its alot on both, and neither cam until the very last part of the lift.</div></div>
The click at the top of the bolt lift you describe is often times a brass/sizing issue and not a timing issue. Does the rifle do this with new fired brass or only after two or so firings?
<span style="color: #FF0000">Don't know. I've been running the same weight sorted LC Match since before this particular rifle was rebarreled last year. A few more firings with the brass I have and I'll be on to the Lapua I've been saving up.</span>
I had to change to a small base die in my 6BR to eliminate the click, all is fine now. Also, brass that’s been fired and sized numerous times will start to loose its elasticity. Brass does get worn out at some point and then it's time to replace.
The extraction cam timing issue will cause you to have to bump the handle to the rear after full bolt lift to extract the fired case out of the chamber. After firing, leave the case in the chamber, lift the handle and see how much cam contact you actually have. Less than 50% will eventually give you problems..
<span style="color: #FF0000">I shot 34 rounds today and I didn't have any issues. I may be recalling when I was was neck sizing only, but switched earlier this year to FL sizing only earlier this year for consistency. I completely forgot to look at the cam surface as I removed a spent round-I'll try to remember at the local match this Sunday to check.</span>
</div></div>
Thank you for the input Mr Roscoe, I'll be in touch if the problems persist.
The red responses above are referring to my main rifle, my 308 with an Obermeyer chamber.
If I recall correctly I've been neck sizing in the other 700 (my 7-08 silhouette rifle), but I haven't been shooting it recently. It too will be switching over to light FL sizing for all reloading.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
That was helpful. </div></div>
Seriously.
The professionals here already answered the mans post several times over.
I've considered sending work to you to be tig welded because you seem to be good at what you do. But being good at tig welding doesnt make up for being a dick.... it's bad for business man. You must be rich and not care
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HateCA</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DANS40X</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When you can't extract a case from your out of time bolt/handle,send it out to have one of those Louisville Slugger Baseball bats added to replace the existing bolt knob.
Problem Solved!!!!!
Don't forget to have the abomination/abortion screws added to decorate the handle. </div></div>
That was helpful. </div></div>
Seriously.
The professionals here already answered the mans post several times over.
I've considered sending work to you to be tig welded because you seem to be good at what you do. But being good at tig welding doesnt make up for being a dick.... it's bad for business man. You must be rich and not care
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I quit Nk sizing years ago and started FL sizing just for the consistency you get on bolt closure and cartridge shoulder position in the chamber. Accuracy is just as good, maybe even slightly better.
I quit Nk sizing years ago and started FL sizing just for the consistency you get on bolt closure and cartridge shoulder position in the chamber. Accuracy is just as good, maybe even slightly better.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Me too.
Wouldnt neck size unless it is for a Bench gun.
I used to neck size after the first loading with my old 7mag about 3 years ago. Shot great, but 60% of my loads would close alittle tight, and it shot just as good when I switched to FL sizing.
Havent neck sized since then. Been doin pretty good on groups.
Me too.
Wouldnt neck size unless it is for a Bench gun.
I used to neck size after the first loading with my old 7mag about 3 years ago. Shot great, but 60% of my loads would close alittle tight, and it shot just as good when I switched to FL sizing.
Havent neck sized since then. Been doin pretty good on groups.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
do you guys completely full length size, or do a shoulder bump like suggested by the how to thread in the reloading section?
DD
do you guys completely full length size, or do a shoulder bump like suggested by the how to thread in the reloading section?
DD
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AZPrecision</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Me too.
Wouldnt neck size unless it is for a Bench gun.</div></div>
I FL size especially on my BR Rifle's, 6BR & 6Dasher
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: AZPrecision</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Me too.
Wouldnt neck size unless it is for a Bench gun.</div></div>
I FL size especially on my BR Rifle's, 6BR & 6Dasher
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
Send your bolt to Nathan Dagley (I personaly would send the whole reciever to that they can both be hand fitted and work like they are supposed to) Nate does awsome work and is very exacting in what he does , he understand exactly what it takes to make the bolt and reciever mesh to work flawlessly.
He is a very humble God fearing man thats work means the world to him , you'll be hard pressed to deal with a more laid bach caring person?
Several custome rifle builders use him exclusivly as wel as at least on custom action builder.
http://www.straightshotgunsmithing.com/
Check out the link , he has some videos explaining bolt timing and tig welding the handels
Send your bolt to Nathan Dagley (I personaly would send the whole reciever to that they can both be hand fitted and work like they are supposed to) Nate does awsome work and is very exacting in what he does , he understand exactly what it takes to make the bolt and reciever mesh to work flawlessly.
He is a very humble God fearing man thats work means the world to him , you'll be hard pressed to deal with a more laid bach caring person?
Several custome rifle builders use him exclusivly as wel as at least on custom action builder.
http://www.straightshotgunsmithing.com/
Check out the link , he has some videos explaining bolt timing and tig welding the handels
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">do you guys completely full length size, or do a shoulder bump like suggested by the how to thread in the reloading section?
DD </div></div>
I have a gauge I made with my reamer and barrel drop. I Shoulder bump back .0015" with my FL die.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave ©</div><div class="ubbcode-body">do you guys completely full length size, or do a shoulder bump like suggested by the how to thread in the reloading section?
DD </div></div>
I have a gauge I made with my reamer and barrel drop. I Shoulder bump back .0015" with my FL die.
Re: Timing the bolt on a Rem700
I just bump back a thou or two (Stoney Point Headspace comparator).
I don't shoot groups worth a darn, so I can't tell the difference (actually shoot better under match type stress usually).
After thinking about it I came to the conclusion that a little concentric bump each loading should be actually less stressful on the brass than squishing the neck repeatedly and then having to do a big squeeze on the case later.....
Thanks again with the clarification on the timing issues-I'll make a note to throw in my ammo to check the camming Sunday!
I just bump back a thou or two (Stoney Point Headspace comparator).
I don't shoot groups worth a darn, so I can't tell the difference (actually shoot better under match type stress usually).
After thinking about it I came to the conclusion that a little concentric bump each loading should be actually less stressful on the brass than squishing the neck repeatedly and then having to do a big squeeze on the case later.....
Thanks again with the clarification on the timing issues-I'll make a note to throw in my ammo to check the camming Sunday!
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