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Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SniperCJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DODGE268</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That being said, this guy stinks of Soveriegn Citizen. They are a cancer that needs to be removed. They are popping up like mushrooms around here.</div></div>

As do a couple of the guys that have posted on this thread...

Saw a 'great' dashcam video of a Sovereign Citizen and his son killing two cops in Missouri ( i think) with an AK47. Plus the aftermath of that. Bad stuff </div></div>

Really?!?!? Thats your reasoning?

Cause I saw a bunch of cops burn some people to death in waco a few years back. Murder somebody in a subway station in LA not to long ago. Beat a black man retarded in southern california, illegally confiscate personal belongings in new orleans, etc... etc... etc


The whole sovereign citizen thing is a radical movement started sometime in the 70's. The guy in the video was merely exercising his rights....your going to label him a radical?

If we want to look at the fringe behavior we can find examples of it everywhere. But whats disturbing is that you see this guy as a threat who needs to be "stomped out"
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I would also suggest that, you, as LE officers, who are asked to follow and execute orders that you have said you don't necessarily agree with to do the same - publicly - as well as affect change from within your own organizations as well. </div></div>

Your asking those in power to stand up for what they believe in, on the job? That dog won't hunt with many of them and you know it, but I'll give ya props/credit for asking/saying it.
Many in power have two voices, one while on the job and another after hours. These types are the ones who will follow orders no matter what they are, because they are job scared just like many, many, civies. Lackeys an shills come in all forms, and the higher they go the worst many of them get.

Now don't get me wrong there are many power types I socialize with, but to a person they speak with one voice. The also ran's never seem to stay around us very long, for some reason. Then again we don't menace words when the conversations get real either.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Gunfighter14e2</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I would also suggest that, you, as LE officers, who are asked to follow and execute orders that you have said you don't necessarily agree with to do the same - publicly - as well as affect change from within your own organizations as well. </div></div>

Your asking those in power to stand up for what they believe in, on the job? That dog won't hunt with many of them and you know it, but I'll give ya props/credit for asking/saying it.
Many in power have two voices, one while on the job and another after hours. These types are the ones who will follow orders no matter what they are, because they are job scared just like many, many, civies. Lackeys an shills come in all forms, and the higher they go the worst many of them get.

Now don't get me wrong there are many power types I socialize with, but to a person they speak with one voice. The also ran's never seem to stay around us very long, for some reason. Then again we don't menace words when the conversations get real either. </div></div>

You are nuts. Most cops that I work with and know are anything but dogs, lackeys, job scared, and all the crap you posted. Matter of fact, we fight more for your rights than you guys actually do. When we are told to do something that we think is bullshit we voice our opinion to our brass and most of the time they listen, even if it isn't right away. Eventually they listen because most of them also think it is bullshit. You guys fail to realize that when we are off duty, we are the same regular Joe's or Jose's (LOL) as you guys. So it isn't an us vs you guys. We are all in the same boat.

What you guys fail to realize is that some of these stupid things like checkpoints don't come from us, they come from the citizens. So for everyone that is here bitching about the legality of he checkpoints, there are just as many, if not more people asking for more checkpoints. That's why I wrote that instead of taking it out on us, contact the lawmakers and tell them how you feel.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

The guy in this video was not "just a guy excersizing his rights" he is a jackass trying to bait the cops into a confrontation to make a political point on video. You must have missed the whole I think checkpoints are BS part. I don't like them. I don't like going through them, and I don't like working them. I do believe that the SC movement is a cancer. I do believe it needs to be removed before they kill anyone else. I also agree with you that bad cops are a cancer that needs to be removed. I chose to do this job because I enjoy my work. I am a firm believer in the Constitution and do my best to work within the bounds of it. I don't and will not do anything to a citizen that I would not do to a family member. There are alot of good cops out there doing a job that requires us to intereact with people that have nothing better to do than try to piss us off on video. I do not go to work trying to figure out a way to stomp on anyones rights.
Happy Easter everyone.
Patrick
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

Yeah, the guy in the video was a tool, just trying to bait the cops, I get that. I, however, see NOTHING, wrong with that.

Before you jump all into me though, you might ask why I feel like that??? I have very closer family that are LE, and MOST LE has my full support.

The cops here though, are breaking the law too. Three pages, not one person noted that the cops in NV are required ( it is part of the statute allowing the DWI stops ) to post notice of the roadblock ahead. Yeah, they posted it alright, and a man on it to make sure no one put the sign up where anyone can see it. That is CS of the purest, stinkiest kind. I don't blame the video guy for jacking with the cops, when confronted with cops with the ethics demonstrated.

We've got checkpoints in Louisiana too. Many times coming back home from a flight late at night, I get stopped at the same place by the state troopers. Hell, I hunt with some of those guys, we know each other, but I get the same treatment as anyone else going thru the check. I can respect that, but as the video guy said, they catch a lot more DWI suspects on patrol.

How many of you ever called in a DWI, I know you had almost been run off the road by a drunk, what did you do about it, other than cuss and throw a finger? I think our society will be a lot better, if we are involved, rather than just sitting back and letting someone else clean up the unsavory bits for us. The poster earlier hit that right on the head. Ultimately, I think it is LE that should be working WITH us, not FOR us, to help keep order in our society.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You are nuts. Most cops that I work with and know are anything but dogs, lackeys, job scared, and all the crap you posted. Matter of fact, we fight more for your rights than you guys actually do. When we are told to do something that we think is bullshit we voice our opinion to our brass and most of the time they listen, even if it isn't right away. Eventually they listen because most of them also think it is bullshit. You guys fail to realize that when we are off duty, we are the same regular Joe's or Jose's (LOL) as you guys. So it isn't an us vs you guys. We are all in the same boat.

What you guys fail to realize is that some of these stupid things like checkpoints don't come from us, they come from the citizens. So for everyone that is here bitching about the legality of he checkpoints, there are just as many, if not more people asking for more checkpoints. That's why I wrote that instead of taking it out on us, contact the lawmakers and tell them how you feel. </div></div>

Were did I say All or Everyone?
You used the word most not all, so that leaves out many just within your department alone.
I am from Alabama, but Reading comprehension is within my grasp.

Now to your rights, comment. Fact, I know nothing about enforcing the law, however I do know a little about Enforcing/Projecting, this country's will power.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KChen986</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nobody seems to pay attention to the case I cited:

The Supreme Court UPHELD under the Fourth Amendment, the use of checkpoints for DUI in 'seizing' citizens under a 3 prong test (government interest, degree of intrusion, and efficacy of method). Although, some states have declined to follow the floor set by the Supreme Court (as is their right).

So unless Nevada explicitly prohibits such, Mr. I-know-my-rights was WRONG about this: States have the right to set up check-points and briefly detain you for a DUI investigation. He did have a right to not say anything, but any such detention amounted more to a terry stop than the 'illegal detention' he keeps prattling on about.

Furthermore, in special circumstances, such as in rail way accidents or Mexican border checkpoints, the State is permitted to depart from a requirement of 'individualized suspicion' before executing a terry stop.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Our precedents have settled that, in certain limited circumstances, the Government's need to discover such latent or hidden conditions, or to prevent their development, is sufficiently compelling to justify the intrusion on privacy entailed by conducting such searches without any measure of individualized suspicion

Nat'l Treasury Employees Union v. Von Raab, 489 U.S. 656, 668, 109 S. Ct. 1384, 1392, 103 L. Ed. 2d 685 (1989)</div></div>

In sum: A DUI checkpoint is 'REASONABLE' under the Fourth Amendment as Interpreted by the Interpreters of the Constitution. What we're seeing here isn't a blatant violation of constitutional rights, but rather a guy who wanted to give the authorities a hard time under the guise of asserting his rights.

</div></div>


I too am amazed that more comments have not been made about the Supreme Court's interpretation of the standard of reasonableness as related to temporary seizures. Instead, this discussion seems to still follow the course of the dumbass in the video who thought it was best to fight for his rights along the side of the road. Even if checkpoints are not permitted in Nevada the guy is a dumbass. How is giving some cop a hard time going to help his cause? Why not fight the lawmakers not the cops.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pok</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slapchop</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You guys can argue that the guy was well within his "rights" and that he did nothing wrong due to the fact that the cop backed down and he went on his way.

Me personally, his refusal would have raised my level of suspicion and trust me there are 101 ways to legally make that guy comply. The problem I saw was cops that don't know the law and don't know what they can or CAN'T do. Lots of cops are also intimidated by video cameras which I find hilarious. If you know your job and do it well, the footage will work against most idiots like this.

Everyone sees videos like this and they love to shout "rah rah rah" "Amendments this, constitution that". If I had a penny for every time I've heard someone say "you can't violate my rights, haven't you heard of the constitution"? Yet when questioned on the very documents that they love to toss around, they all of a sudden get a deer in the headlights look. Most people can't even spell amendment or know how many there are, much less what they stand for.

If you can't be bothered with DWI checkpoints then the simple solution is to not drive. </div></div>

I think your obvious bias has clouded your judgement. Imagine, if you can, that you are not a LEO.

The driver will not get famous from this. I think his intent was to show people that they need not comply to unnecessary harrassment. <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">Most people dont know that police have no right to stop you and detain you without a specific reason.</span></span> Most people think that they must simply do as they are told. I am not anti LEO, and dont mean to sound like I am. Sometimes LEOs need this explained to them as well. Years of doing these things re-enforce the behavior until everyone believes that it is justified, because it has always happened this way.

To debate whether driving is a right or privilege is moot. People in this country (no others need be discussed as it is off topic) are supposed to be free to come and go as they please. It is not up to the wishes of a community, to restrict free citizens to make themselves feel safer.

The law of the land is the constitution. To violate this is to BE a criminal </div></div>

Actually what most people DON'T know is that the police have EVERY right to stop and question anyone without any specific reason. For all you internet lawyers, it's called a consensual stop and it's tied into the common law right of inquiry. As a citizen you can tell the cop to fuck off and simply walk away. That is of course provided you don't live in one of the 24 states that have enacted the "stop and identify statute" which states that when stopped by a police officer you're obligated to give him/her your name and basic pedigree information if he or she has a reasonable suspicion that you were involved in or committed any form of crime/infraction. Refusing to do so is a crime. Alabama, Arizona, Colorado, Georgia, Kansas, Louisiana, Montana are just a few of these states with such ordinances on the books.

In Terry V Ohio (1968) the U.S. Supreme court ruled that a person can be stopped and briefly detained by a police officer based on a reasonable suspicion of involvement in a crime.

Now I'm manning one of these check points and a guy rolls up and refuses to comply with simple commands, it gets me thinking, is he trying to mask an alcoholic odor? He won't lower his window, why so he can hide his bloodshot eyes? Is he so inebriated that he can't even process what I'm asking him to do. Now my level of suspicion escalates and I can take action in order to determine whether or not he is DWI. We gotta do our jobs don't we? I mean I wouldn't let a guy who I suspect might be driving under the influence to go through just because he cries "I know my rights". How tragic would it be if the guy was drunk and killed someone 3 miles down the road because he intimidated the cops with his street lawyer nonsense.


Do I agree with DWI checkpoints? Yes and no. They're a hassle to everyone involved, especially the public that gets caught up in them but at the same time if it helps to grab a few drunks off the road then it's time well spent IMHO.

What I don't need is some tool, looking for a fight, making everyone's life that much harder. Lucky for that guy, the cops didn't seem to have a good working knowledge of the law.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

If a checkpoint is legal in your state based on your state laws and you do not like it then maybe you can speak to your elected officials to make that change. Going after the police officer on the street level is like being difficult with the 17 year old kid at the movie theater for the ticket prices being to high. I want this guy to film a video standing in front of his house holding up a piece of paper to a truckload of firefighters saying they have no right to come on his property as his house is burning.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Last time I checked, driving was a privilege NOT a right.</div></div>

I've heard that since HS driver's ed and I still disagree. If it were a privilege the authorities could deny or revoke your DL on a whim...no reasonable cause needed.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Come on everyone, let's get with the program.

DUI checkpoints are simply a way to keep us all safe from the scourge of drunk driving.

If you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear.

In fact, I think we would all be safer if we were forced to wear a helmet when driving. Heck, race car drivers do.

And just to be careful, maybe we should have a tracking device in our cars, so we could be found if necessary. To keep everyone else safe.

Heck, if we save just one person, it's worth it.

Again, this is all simply to keep us safe from ourselves and hey, if we are not doing anything wrong, there is nothing to fear, right? </div></div>

Spoken like a true follower/sheep. There is no way for me to say,explain,or draw out a picture that your gonna understand what the bigger problem is here. FREEDOM!!!

Just because someone says "its for your own safety" doesn't mean its for your own safety. How many times have you said something to someone else that sounded real good to them but you had ulterior motives. THATS what is going on here. Do you REALLY believe the government is out there trying to help you?-rhetorical.

Smoking is bad-for their own good...put a tax on tobacco
Seat belts- is for their own good...double the fines
Global warming-for the environment...lets make them GREEN
There are plenty more examples...just a few I can think of right now. Money is the bottom line NOT your safety. Only thing you are to them is a source of payment...bottom line.




Until I do something wrong , leave me the hell alone. That includes random checks of any kind. Brain washing has deffinately been proven to work...just look around .
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RebelYell</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Come on everyone, let's get with the program.

DUI checkpoints are simply a way to keep us all safe from the scourge of drunk driving.

If you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear.

In fact, I think we would all be safer if we were forced to wear a helmet when driving. Heck, race car drivers do.

And just to be careful, maybe we should have a tracking device in our cars, so we could be found if necessary. To keep everyone else safe.

Heck, if we save just one person, it's worth it.

Again, this is all simply to keep us safe from ourselves and hey, if we are not doing anything wrong, there is nothing to fear, right? </div></div>

Spoken like a true follower/sheep. There is no way for me to say,explain,or draw out a picture that your gonna understand what the bigger problem is here. FREEDOM!!!

Just because someone says "its for your own safety" doesn't mean its for your own safety. How many times have you said something to someone else that sounded real good to them but you had anterior motives. THATS what is going on here. Do you REALLY believe the government is out there trying to help you?-rhetorical.

Smoking is bad-for their own good...put a tax on tobacco
Seat belts- is for their own good...double the fines
Global warming-for the environment...lets make them GREEN
There are plenty more examples...just a few I can think of right now. Money is the bottom line NOT your safety. Only thing you are to them is a source of payment...bottom line.




Until I do something wrong , leave me the hell alone. That includes random checks of any kind. Brain washing has deffinately been proven to work...just look around .</div></div>


Again, bravo!
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slapchop</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pok</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slapchop</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You guys can argue that the guy was well within his "rights" and that he did nothing wrong due to the fact that the cop backed down and he went on his way.

Me personally, his refusal would have raised my level of suspicion and trust me there are 101 ways to legally make that guy comply. The problem I saw was cops that don't know the law and don't know what they can or CAN'T do. Lots of cops are also intimidated by video cameras which I find hilarious. If you know your job and do it well, the footage will work against most idiots like this.

Everyone sees videos like this and they love to shout "rah rah rah" "Amendments this, constitution that". If I had a penny for every time I've heard someone say "you can't violate my rights, haven't you heard of the constitution"? Yet when questioned on the very documents that they love to toss around, they all of a sudden get a deer in the headlights look. Most people can't even spell amendment or know how many there are, much less what they stand for.

If you can't be bothered with DWI checkpoints then the simple solution is to not drive. </div></div>

I think your obvious bias has clouded your judgement. Imagine, if you can, that you are not a LEO.

The driver will not get famous from this. I think his intent was to show people that they need not comply to unnecessary harrassment. <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">Most people dont know that police have no right to stop you and detain you without a specific reason.</span></span> Most people think that they must simply do as they are told. I am not anti LEO, and dont mean to sound like I am. Sometimes LEOs need this explained to them as well. Years of doing these things re-enforce the behavior until everyone believes that it is justified, because it has always happened this way.

To debate whether driving is a right or privilege is moot. People in this country (no others need be discussed as it is off topic) are supposed to be free to come and go as they please. It is not up to the wishes of a community, to restrict free citizens to make themselves feel safer.

The law of the land is the constitution. To violate this is to BE a criminal </div></div>

Actually what most people DON'T know is that the police have EVERY right to stop and question anyone without any specific reason. For all you internet lawyers, it's called a consensual stop and it's tied into the common law right of inquiry. As a citizen you can tell the cop to fuck off and simply walk away. That is of course provided you don't live in one of the 24 states that have enacted the "stop and identify statute" which states that when stopped by a police officer you're obligated to give him/her your name and basic pedigree information if he or she has a reasonable suspicion that you were involved in or committed any form of crime/infraction. Refusing to do so is a crime. Alabama, Arizona, Colorado, Georgia, Kansas, Louisiana, Montana are just a few of these states with such ordinances on the books.

In Terry V Ohio (1968) the U.S. Supreme court ruled that a person can be stopped and briefly detained by a police officer based on a reasonable suspicion of involvement in a crime.

Now I'm manning one of these check points and a guy rolls up and refuses to comply with simple commands, it gets me thinking, is he trying to mask an alcoholic odor? He won't lower his window, why so he can hide his bloodshot eyes? Is he so inebriated that he can't even process what I'm asking him to do. Now my level of suspicion escalates and I can take action in order to determine whether or not he is DWI. We gotta do our jobs don't we? I mean I wouldn't let a guy who I suspect might be driving under the influence to go through just because he cries "I know my rights". How tragic would it be if the guy was drunk and killed someone 3 miles down the road because he intimidated the cops with his street lawyer nonsense.


Do I agree with DWI checkpoints? Yes and no. They're a hassle to everyone involved, especially the public that gets caught up in them but at the same time if it helps to grab a few drunks off the road then it's time well spent IMHO.

What I don't need is some tool, looking for a fight, making everyone's life that much harder. Lucky for that guy, the cops didn't seem to have a good working knowledge of the law.
</div></div>

You are only helping my point. All of your quotes note that a LEO has the right to stop or detain when there is a reasonable suspicion of a crime being commited. Driving along a highway is not a criminal act, there is no justification for a stop. A consensual stop is not a right, because it can be refused. It is basically agreeing to have a conversation with each other.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pok</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You are only helping my point. All of your quotes note that a LEO has the right to stop or detain when there is a reasonable suspicion of a crime being commited. Driving along a highway is not a criminal act, there is no justification for a stop. A consensual stop is not a right, because it can be refused. It is basically agreeing to have a conversation with each other. </div></div>

Save your breath. He's already said he will be one of the ones coming to take your guns when the government says its OK.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RebelYell</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Come on everyone, let's get with the program.

DUI checkpoints are simply a way to keep us all safe from the scourge of drunk driving.

If you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear.

In fact, I think we would all be safer if we were forced to wear a helmet when driving. Heck, race car drivers do.

And just to be careful, maybe we should have a tracking device in our cars, so we could be found if necessary. To keep everyone else safe.

Heck, if we save just one person, it's worth it.

Again, this is all simply to keep us safe from ourselves and hey, if we are not doing anything wrong, there is nothing to fear, right? </div></div>

Spoken like a true follower/sheep. There is no way for me to say,explain,or draw out a picture that your gonna understand what the bigger problem is here. FREEDOM!!!

Just because someone says "its for your own safety" doesn't mean its for your own safety. How many times have you said something to someone else that sounded real good to them but you had anterior motives. THATS what is going on here. Do you REALLY believe the government is out there trying to help you?-rhetorical.

Smoking is bad-for their own good...put a tax on tobacco
Seat belts- is for their own good...double the fines
Global warming-for the environment...lets make them GREEN
There are plenty more examples...just a few I can think of right now. Money is the bottom line NOT your safety. Only thing you are to them is a source of payment...bottom line.




Until I do something wrong , leave me the hell alone. That includes random checks of any kind. Brain washing has deffinately been proven to work...just look around .</div></div>


Again, bravo! </div></div>

You two idiots might want to take a gander at the use of SARCASM
wink.gif
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

I'm pretty sure Tigerbikes was being facetious but was taken as being serious.

edit: yeah, what he ^^^ said...
crazy.gif
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: smokshwn</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KillShot</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RebelYell</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tigerbikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Come on everyone, let's get with the program.

DUI checkpoints are simply a way to keep us all safe from the scourge of drunk driving.

If you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to fear.

In fact, I think we would all be safer if we were forced to wear a helmet when driving. Heck, race car drivers do.

And just to be careful, maybe we should have a tracking device in our cars, so we could be found if necessary. To keep everyone else safe.

Heck, if we save just one person, it's worth it.

Again, this is all simply to keep us safe from ourselves and hey, if we are not doing anything wrong, there is nothing to fear, right? </div></div>

Spoken like a true follower/sheep. There is no way for me to say,explain,or draw out a picture that your gonna understand what the bigger problem is here. FREEDOM!!!

Just because someone says "its for your own safety" doesn't mean its for your own safety. How many times have you said something to someone else that sounded real good to them but you had anterior motives. THATS what is going on here. Do you REALLY believe the government is out there trying to help you?-rhetorical.

Smoking is bad-for their own good...put a tax on tobacco
Seat belts- is for their own good...double the fines
Global warming-for the environment...lets make them GREEN
There are plenty more examples...just a few I can think of right now. Money is the bottom line NOT your safety. Only thing you are to them is a source of payment...bottom line.




Until I do something wrong , leave me the hell alone. That includes random checks of any kind. Brain washing has deffinately been proven to work...just look around .</div></div>


Again, bravo! </div></div>

You two idiots might want to take a gander at the use of SARCASM
wink.gif
</div></div>

LMFAO +1 and in before the lock!
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RebelYell</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...anterior motives.</div></div>

Ulterior </div></div>

Thank you for the correction, Word Officer.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KIMO</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm pretty sure Tigerbikes was being facetious but was taken as being serious.

edit: yeah, what he ^^^ said...
crazy.gif
</div></div>

Oh...lol...then I apologize Tiger. I myself use sarcasm a lot. Then we are on the same sheet of song, as my old sergeant would say. But there are others out there that do in fact agree with what you said. Again...I apologize.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But your claim that the U.S. is becoming more and more like the Soviet Union is both offensive and stupid. You're completely full of shit.</div></div>

I call it as i see it. Its your hide on the line anyway what do i care whether you are able to grasp and assess the situation you're in as a nation. Some got it ages ago, some just recently and some will never at least not until "the shower starts". So happy barking and biting and good luck with wagging your tail...
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EventHorizon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A police officers job is as far from easy as it is close to being vital. All the more reason for such a high profile, high impact profession to be filled by those who are concerned with protecting the rights of citizens from infringement by their own as they are in enforcing the law.

That might not be the traditional job of the police but as we have seen recently, the brass, in cooperation with local government have ordered the rank and file to engage in illegal search and seizures. I am here referring to New Orleans.

The citizens MUST have the right and knowledge to say NO to the police when they are wrong. The police MUST know that dissent does not default to criminal behavior or probable cause for 'harassment'. </div></div>

I am obviously not from the States but we have the same police check points here in NZ and don't ever question it -it annoys the shit out of me as a sober responsible citizen being held up at the pleasure of the police while they fish to get their quotas -not saying they dont catch a few people but hardly a reason to halt the mostly legal citizens going about their day .
I think what EventHorizon has written in this forum is so on the mark !!!!!!!!! Government and Police often forget their place and become dictators and bullies rather than seeing the will and rights of the citizens is served well
- now in saying that our police in NZ could probably be helped by better and harder laws that get real offenders ofF the street for longer or punish offenders so they dont want to offend again -one example in the last two weeks a multi millionaire just shot his wife point blank with 12g and got 10 years - It appears our police have quotas on the roads but call it something else and our judges have to watch out how much time they can sentence a criminal to as they have to think about the costs of incarceration .

By the way I thought the Shanksters video was a good example of an American citizen asserting his "rights" and it was his rights that were being questioned -lets get this correct , if he was within his rights to do this there should be zero negativity toward him -if not he was lucky he didn't have his window broken and given a good Rodney King LOL
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This thread has gone from gay to Charley Sheen gay. </div></div>

Yet, you still return.

I can see where this thread might cause you conflict, deciding between doing what's right and doing what you're told. It's a tough choice (for some).
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RADcustom</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This thread has gone from gay to Charley Sheen gay. </div></div>

Yet, you still return.

I can see where this thread might cause you conflict, deciding between doing what's right and doing what you're told. It's a tough choice (for some). </div></div>

It isn't tough at all for me. I always try to do the right thing. Why don't you do the same? Instead of bashing cops because of some laws you think that are stupid, why don't you address them with the lawmakers or your own fellow citizens who want/asked for these stupid laws. People who take it out on the cops, like the jackass on the video are a bunch of pussies.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

This thread would be a lot more fun if we were in a bar drinking a beer instead of pissing on each other on the internet.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SniperCJ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Exercising one's rights and purposely showing up at a known DWI checkpoint with a video camera to intentionally aggravate the cops is another.

We will likely aggravate you back. </div></div>

Maybe thats the problem "we" as you say shouldn't be against us, more with us.. Police nowadays are dumb for the most part, Its a great job that pays good with good benefits and gets respect from the community. With thats being said, they will and can hire the dregs of society to fill the minority and just plain fill the gaps.. Most cops haven't even held a gun up until the the academy and need way more firearms training. Knowing the laws and having respect for the constitution should be the number 1 priority to the police.. My dad is a retired cop as is my uncle.. The old school cops were a lot more intelligent IMO.. The cop should have just called his Watch commander and had him deal with it.. Threatening him to arrest him when he comes back is plain bullying..

IMO..
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: chansen49</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Threatening him to arrest him when he comes back is plain bullying.. </div></div>

Naaaa, threatening to arrest him was just plain stupid. Dont make promises you cant keep.

I definately disagree that cops are dumber today. Educationally, theyre smarter. Most PD's have at least some college requirements and theres a trend toward requiring a degree.

However street smarts is a totally different matter. Lotta new cops are dumb in that respect. Few have firearms training. Few have been in very many confrontational situations, and few have been in physical confrontations. Common sense is sorely lacking. The sense of entitlement is rediculous. None of them feel they should have to work weekends, evening shifts or manditory overtime to cover shortages. Sorry, thats what new guys do. Despite what you think, we dont owe you anything.

Sorry to derail the thread on that point. Well, not really...it needs rerailing
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RADcustom</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pok</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You are only helping my point. All of your quotes note that a LEO has the right to stop or detain when there is a reasonable suspicion of a crime being commited. Driving along a highway is not a criminal act, there is no justification for a stop. A consensual stop is not a right, because it can be refused. It is basically agreeing to have a conversation with each other. </div></div>

Save your breath. He's already said he will be one of the ones coming to take your guns when the government says its OK.

</div></div>

Bump
smile.gif
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just don't be surprised when a kid with a computer science degree and arms the diameter of a garden hose shows up to handle a serious problem you called about. Oh yeah...he's never been in a fight (not even in junior high), he's terrified of the pistol in his holster, and he has horrible interpersonal skills because he's spent the last several years playing Call of Duty. He wasn't "weeded out" in the Academy or during training because they weren't allowed to. He's a great report writer though and will be able to accurately document everything that happened to you...after the bad guy disarms him and runs off with your stuff. </div></div>

But that's exactly what some of these guys on this thread want. They want a bunch of pussy cops to be their servants. Weak Law Enforcement = More Crime.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tip em over</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Where's the second video? </div></div>

<object width="425" height="350"> <param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/aGRqlFw3RI0"></param> <param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param> <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/aGRqlFw3RI0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"> </embed></object>
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rugger1330</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> mental illness. </div></div>

So standing up for your rights and protesting an abuse of power is now a mental illness? Funny, I don't remember seeing that in the DSM IV.

 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: High Binder</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rugger1330</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> mental illness. </div></div>

So standing up for your rights and protesting an abuse of power is now a mental illness? Funny, I don't remember seeing that in the DSM IV.

</div></div>

May not be a mental illness but, protesting to someone who can't do shit about it seems dumb as hell. Why not take it to his legislators? Nevada has the right to put an end to check points.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 999yards</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: High Binder</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rugger1330</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> mental illness. </div></div>

So standing up for your rights and protesting an abuse of power is now a mental illness? Funny, I don't remember seeing that in the DSM IV.

</div></div>

May not be a mental illness but, protesting to someone who can't do shit about it seems dumb as hell. Why not take it to his legislators? </div></div>

Protesting, in the past at least, has shown to be more effective at spurring legislative change than visiting your legislators...

If you don't stand for something you'll fall for anything.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: paulosantos</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just don't be surprised when a kid with a computer science degree and arms the diameter of a garden hose shows up to handle a serious problem you called about. Oh yeah...he's never been in a fight (not even in junior high), he's terrified of the pistol in his holster, and he has horrible interpersonal skills because he's spent the last several years playing Call of Duty. He wasn't "weeded out" in the Academy or during training because they weren't allowed to. He's a great report writer though and will be able to accurately document everything that happened to you...after the bad guy disarms him and runs off with your stuff. </div></div>

But that's exactly what some of these guys on this thread want. They want a bunch of pussy cops to be their servants. Weak Law Enforcement = More Crime. </div></div>

Utter bullshit! If that's your take-away from this thread then you have missed the point on a breathtaking scale.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wadevb1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The guy is making an important point. I'm a citizen first and a cop second.

I do have issues with check points.</div></div>

Thats what we want...cops that remember that they are citizens first and cops second. Men,not little boys on a power trip.

Remember "Power tends to corrupts. Absolute power tends to corrupt absolutly". What we are saying is that 'we the citizens' are entrusting you with power. It is our responsibility to see that that power is not corrupted. We do that by exercising our rights.

It aint personal, We just treasure our freedom and aim to keep it safe from any enemy, foriegn or domestic. If you corrupt the power we entrust you with then you, shall we say, put yourselves, in the place of the enemy.

We dont want it that way. We are trusting you.

Think about it.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

My niece was killed on her 16th birthday by a drunk driver.

I respect the 4th amendment but I also say that if you have not been drinking they are not going to bust you or waste your time.

I'm OK with the checkpoints myself.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

Let me put it another way. As a citizen I consider my self 'backup'. Active Duty is 1st line of defense. Reserves, National guard second. LE third. Armed citizen 4th/Back Up. You guys should remember that.

If your pinned down in a militia ambush and i come around the curve do you want me to

A) Pull my M1A out of the tool box and lay down cover fire so you can get to safety?

or

B) Turn my truck around and high tail it because youve acted like a prick so many times?

Think aabout it.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: wadevb1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The guy is making an important point. I'm a citizen first and a cop second.

I do have issues with check points.</div></div>

Thats what we want...cops that remember that they are citizens first and cops second. Men,not little boys on a power trip.

Remember "Power tends to corrupts. Absolute power tends to corrupt absolutly". What we are saying is that 'we the citizens' are entrusting you with power. It is our responsibility to see that that power is not corrupted. We do that by exercising our rights.

It aint personal, We just treasure our freedom and aim to keep it safe from any enemy, foriegn or domestic. If you corrupt the power we entrust you with then you, shall we say, put yourselves, in the place of the enemy.

We dont want it that way. We are trusting you.

Think about it. </div></div>

If you read the comments by the cops on this thread, including myself, all or most of us have said that we don't particularly agree with the checkpoints ourselves and we have addressed that with our bosses. What we don't appreciate is the assholes like the guys on the video who take it out on us, when we don't want anything to do with it in the first place. So in essence we are all pretty mug in agreement, just not in how some people are going about it.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Slapchop</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> That is of course provided you don't live in one of the 24 states that have enacted the <span style="font-weight: bold">"stop and identify statute"</span> which states that when stopped by a police officer <span style="font-weight: bold">you're obligated to give him/her your name and basic pedigree information if he or she has a reasonable suspicion that you were involved in or committed any form of crime/infraction. Refusing to do so is a crime</span>. Alabama, Arizona, Colorado, <span style="color: #FF0000"><span style="font-weight: bold">Georgia</span></span>, Kansas, Louisiana, Montana are just a few of these states with such ordinances on the books.</div></div>

Georgia....Really...? Can you give me the OCGA Statute that describes this "Stop & Identify" law...? I can stop anyone I think is involved in a crime.....however, they are under no obligation to speak to me at all. About the best course I would have would be to arrest them for "Obstruction".....but I can't find the "Stop & Identify" statute....??
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

It seems like a lot of the attitudes in this thread don't like their authority questioned. This theme plays through the whole thread.

I really appreciate the bar statement. I would be willing to bet if this was a bar scene it wouldn't be long before it was well known your what your career was, that's the way it works around here anyway.

It is pretty telling that whoever disagrees with certain posters view point is a "jackass" "asshole" "bomb thrower" or "mouth frothers" I can't remember them all, which pretty much validates my first statement. Your attitudes/statements re-affirm a lot of the issues that have been addressed here.

It seems that many opinions tend to gather around the idea that respect comes with or because of the uniform.

But I really don't know much, I'm basically a second class citizen compared to some here.

 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goldie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Let me put it another way. As a citizen I consider my self 'backup'. Active Duty is 1st line of defense. Reserves, National guard second. LE third. Armed citizen 4th/Back Up. You guys should remember that.

If your pinned down in a militia ambush and i come around the curve do you want me to

A) Pull my M1A out of the tool box and lay down cover fire so you can get to safety?

or

B) Turn my truck around and high tail it because youve acted like a prick so many times?

Think aabout it. </div></div>

If your moral compass makes you even <span style="font-style: italic">consider</span> basing your decision on saving the life of another HUMAN BEING because of them "acting like a prick so many times in the past", then by all means.....turn around.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I really appreciate the bar statement. I would be willing to bet if this was a bar scene it wouldn't be long before it was well known your what your career was, that's the way it works around here anyway.
</div></div>

You need a bar to figure out who's a cop in this thread? It's obvious "Detective" is not in your job title.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SLINKY ERT</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I really appreciate the bar statement. I would be willing to bet if this was a bar scene it wouldn't be long before it was well known your what your career was, that's the way it works around here anyway.
</div></div>

You need a bar to figure out who's a cop in this thread? It's obvious "Detective" is not in your job title. </div></div>

Try reading the thread before you post.
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It seems like a lot of the attitudes in this thread don't like their authority questioned. This theme plays through the whole thread.....It is pretty telling that whoever disagrees with certain posters view point is a "jackass" "asshole" "bomb thrower" or "mouth frothers" I can't remember them all, which pretty much validates my first statement. Your attitudes/statements re-affirm a lot of the issues that have been addressed here.</div></div>

You have a serious problem with reading comprehension. You're both projecting and assuming things that aren't there. </div></div>

Please correct me
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Texagator</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Texagator said:
You have a serious problem with reading comprehension. You're both projecting and assuming things that aren't there. </div></div>

Please correct me </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">First, I and at least some of the other police officers in this thread have stated that they do not support checkpoints like the one being discussed here.</div></div>

That is not what the topic of discussion has been about, or questioned.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Second, it's not about disagreement or questioning of authority.</div></div> That is what this whole damn thread has been about.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Police officers experience that almost daily in real life. It's about the overt and intentional disrespect being displayed here.</div></div>
At which point was there disrespect shown?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The comparisons to Nazis and Soviet totalitarianism are disrepectful to both American LE and the real victims of those regimes.</div></div> NO disagreement here

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The presumption that the police, and the LE members of this forum, are the unthinking attack dogs of some statist regime is both ignorant and insulting.</div></div>
I didn't think individuals in this forum had been singled out, and until certain statements had been made, this thread was about rights, not necessarily the police.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All of this reckless rhetoric is what I am referring to when I reference those spewing it as "bomb throwers" and "mouth frothers." Because that's what they are. They're not really thinking about the gravity of their statements or the disrespectfulness thereof.
</div></div>
Is it not reckless to have LE members spouting off about retaliatory actions?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">See this article about disrespect for police officers written by an American police chaplain who lived under a European, totalitarian regime.
</div></div>
Honestly, if one were to state that either civilian or LE are completely innocent, you're fool or a liar.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I always treat people with dignity and respect, even on the Internet, until they prove they don't deserve it. When someone starts honestly claiming that American police officers are the same as Nazis or Stalinist goons, they don't get any more respect from me.
</div></div> Agreed
Click to expand...
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Please correct me </div></div>

We've been trying to correct you, but you dont seem to comprehend what we're saying. I'll try again...

If some guy wanders into a checkpoint, which I also am not a fan of by the way, and exercises his rights as we have discussed here, I might be a little miffed, but hey whatever. I'm not going to make false threats to arrest him, nor further hamper his movement unless I really think he is impaired, which I could most likely determine through the little conversation through the window.

If he intentionally seeks out a checkpoint with a video camera in an effort to 'prove a point' or aggravate the cops, Michael Moore style, then he's an asshole.

And youre not invited to the bar either. You'd just stir up shit instead of having a civil spirited conversation.

By your logic, Timothy Treadwell didnt deseerve to get eaten by the grizzly bear either huh?
 
Re: Vid Of Guy Not Consenting to DUI Checkpoint

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Teggy1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
At which point was there disrespect shown?
</div></div>

Try reading the thread before you post.
 
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