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What to use instead of torque wrench?

VermontMarksman

VermontMarksman

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Minuteman
Feb 27, 2010
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Hey guys,

I'm new to the forum, but have been lurking around for quite sometime. Feel free to move this post if it's not in the right spot.

Anyways, in short, I am in need of a torque wrench, but do not have access to one. (I need to tighten down stock screws, base screws, and ring screws) Is there any way besides using a torque wrench to get a proper torque on each set of screws? Would a certain amount of allen wrench/screw driver rotations work? I know the torques I need, just don't know how to do that without a torque wrench. Haha. Thanks.

Ethan
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

All you have to do is make a "click-click" noise with your tongue while you are tightening the screw. Problem solved.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Use grunts ...... 2 grunts on base screws, and action screws, and a half a grunt on the ring screws.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Yeah, thanks for the humor guys. I'm looking for answers that will actually help me though.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

If there are torque specs for something there is probably a reason.

So, get off your lazy ass and go and buy or borrow a freaking torque wrench. Consider what it will cost you when you torque the head right off of a screw and you have to repair, replace or both.

I'll end with that before I start with the name calling.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Ok, I guess I'll find a wrench to borrow. I don't want to pay 50 bucks for a tool I only need once. Take it easy. I never knew I asked such a dumb question. I figured the only dumb questions are the ones that aren't asked.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Not here. Best thicken your skin, my friend. Welcome to the Hide.

And trust me, you might as well just pony up and buy one. I will guarantee that you will use it more than once in your life.

Buying a tool is never a waste of money.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

search using the word torque. you will see that you are not the first to ask and you will see what is out there for wrenches. there is the FAT from wheeler or a few from sears in the craftsman line. they get pricey from there.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I didn't think I needed an inch pound torque wrench but pulled 200+ bones for a Matco. I used it once and I'll use it again. I think if purchased and retained in your inventory, it will be used more than once. 30-60 bucks will save you some headaches.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

If you use a calibrated elbow it will click when you reach the torque value you are thinking about, then you will be good to go. Seriously dude even a cheap torque wrench is better than no torque wrench. It could prevent you from breaking off a screw into your action and then you will be paying somebody a lot more to remove that screw than a torque wrench cost.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: treebasher</div><div class="ubbcode-body">All you have to do is make a "click-click" noise with your tongue while you are tightening the screw. Problem solved. </div></div>

Now that's funny.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pointblank4445</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
And trust me, you might as well just pony up and buy one. I will guarantee that you will use it more than once in your life.

Buying a tool is never a waste of money. </div></div>

This. Never thought I'd use one other than the occasional car repair task. Ended up using it a lot more than I thought. Harbor freight sells them pretty cheap. Under $20 I think. Not going to be extremely accurate but better than nothing.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I'll second sqwirl's recommendation on buying one from Harbor Freight. Mine is pretty cheesy, but checked it against my dad's good one and it was VERY close. You'll use it alot more than you think, but still not THAT often. There's nothing wrong with saving a few bucks on a tool that will work well enough for what you're doing.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Go to AutoZone and see if they have an 1/4" inch pound torque wrench you can rent. They rent tools out to people as long as you leave a deposit. Get a 1/4" adaptor for using whichever bit you need (T15) and you got yourself a bit driver torque wrench.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Yes they do say that there are no stupid questions.....although experience says that there is a an awful lot of stupid people who ask questions.

Welcome to the Hide.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I have a Wheeler FAT torque wrench and it works fine for the purpose you want one for. As was said before a cheap one is better than none.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

well how about changing the question a bit to: ;what to use if no torque rench is not available"? (like at the field)

are there tricks to apporoximate the torque pounds with other methods....I remeber seeing a M14 scope amnufacturer that uses a wrench, soem string and the weight of the rifle to properly torque the scope base...

things like that...
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Your over thinking this. If you are in the field and have to work on the rifle just hand tighten the screws by feel. Avoid using your gorilla grip on the ring screws.

If you are able, check your zero on a rock, etc. that is at approximately 100 meters or whatever you use for a zero.

When you get home you can then take all of the field repaired parts loose, check for damage and re-tighten with your torque wrench of choice. Then recheck your zero again.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Thanks Orion that's more what I was aiming for. Any ideas based on Orion's rewording of the question?
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I have read an article that old man mcmillian never used a torque wrench. Is this true?

There are methods other than a torque wrench. Torque turn method is used on very large bolts in the construction equipment that I have worked on and on certain rod cap bolts in engines.
It is simple. Torque the bolt to x torque (a fairly light torque) then torque it x amount of rotation after that. I have been known to use this similar method on action and ring screws when in the field. I tighten till snug (everything is seated but very little to no torque on the screw) then turn x amount more. Try this with a torque wrench and see how much x amount more turn you need.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Wont apply to stocks but Badger has a good "Im too cheap to buy a torque wrench" system to tightening rings and bases.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vermonter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok, I guess I'll find a wrench to borrow. I don't want to pay 50 bucks for a tool I only need once. Take it easy. I never knew I asked such a dumb question. I figured the only dumb questions are the ones that aren't asked. </div></div>

Do don't think that you'll ever have to remove and replace a scope? Or RE-TORQUE your action screws. Or install a different scope rail.

NO humor was implied-it was absolute sarcasm. Stupid ass question.Not to mention that all you'll get for $50 is a cheap ass chinese POS wrench anyway.

Asking a "dumb" question is one thing-but complaining that someone won't spoon feed you the answer you want is becoming more and more typical around here.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Harbor Freight is your friend.. you can pick one up for cheap under $25
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: beltfed74</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Wont apply to stocks but Badger has a good "Im too cheap to buy a torque wrench" system to tightening rings and bases. </div></div>

confused, what won't apply to stocks?
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

head-smack.gif
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

... not reffering to you Montana, just this whole discussion in general.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

People need to calm down. I am pretty new to torquing things down myself. I just was wondering about an alternative method/trick that would give me something a little more precise than just winging it, using the things I have around the house. I am not looking for a spoon fed answer, just some hints from more experienced shooters. Harbor Freight looks like a good buy, and I will most likely buying one. Even though I won't need it that often, I realize I will need it more than once. Thanks to those who actually helped, not so much from the people being jackasses.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I've never used a torque wrench on a gun (use'em all the time on the cars/trucks). I don't remember breaking a screw, stripping ond out (except on a couple of cheap aluminum scope rings
laugh.gif
.)or breaking the head off one.

I believe you can develop a "feel" for how tight they should be. I've thoroughly taken apart every rifle, shotgun, handgun I own (lots of each) and some of them several times.

One thing I have done on M1A scope mounts is to (once I get them tight enough to suit me) is to put a dab of white paint on the screw and mount as a witness mark.

YMMV. But this works for me/mine but then I make a habit out of doing stuff many folks won't do.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Get the screw or bolt to where it's snug without applying preasure. From there 1/8 rotation would be about 15 in/lbs, 1/4 would be about 40 in/lbs and 1/3 to 1/2 would be 65 in/lbs. I recommend getting a torque wrench fo consistency. I like the Seekonk T-handles in my opinion they are worth the money. Contact Liberty Optics... Scott will take care of you. Get the set if you can swing it.

http://www.libertyoptics.com/index1.html
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vermonter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey guys,

I'm new to the forum, but have been lurking around for quite sometime. Feel free to move this post if it's not in the right spot.

Anyways, in short, I am in need of a torque wrench, but do not have access to one. (I need to tighten down stock screws, base screws, and ring screws) Is there any way besides using a torque wrench to get a proper torque on each set of screws? Would a certain amount of allen wrench/screw driver rotations work? I know the torques I need, just don't know how to do that without a torque wrench. Haha. Thanks.

Ethan </div></div>

Ethan-

If you don't want to buy a torque wrench then don't buy it.

You don't need it to install any of the rifle parts to get them to work, simply tighten them snug by hand. Your rifle will still fire and most likely not have any real problems. You may or may not get repeatable accuracy... if you want that then buy the wrench.

eta-

This sport requires more than just the rifle and ammo to play. You are going to need tools to upkeep your gear and training to sharpen your skills. So welcome to the hide, there's lots of info here and you may run into some salty dogs but that's just the nature of life.

Enjoy and post some pics of your exploits.


 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Hi Ethan:

It's worth buying the wrench(es). You don't just need it once. You should use it regularly. I am in VT (lamoille county) and can help you if you want.

If you are doing this for a living, you should set/check your torques every time you shoot. If you are a serious target shooter, same deal. If you are setting up a deer rifle, it's less critical but good practice when you first put the scope on.

On a more theoretical note... it is possible to set torques using Allen wrenches and experienced hands or a scale. Before torque wrenches, specific poundages were set using tools that had finger grooves at specific distances from the center of rotation. Constant pull set very accurate torque. You could calculate it, get yourself some Allen's, mark finger positions and get good at setting up the exact torque. This is how head bolts and rod bolts on a lot of cars were done in the early days. But it took a lot of experience to be able to set the exact torque using this method. Better to buy the wrench from Brownell's or Midway.

Email me at rpreid at pshift dot com and I'll be glad to help you out. am doing some AR work for some guys from Dept this weekend so can help you out if you like.

There are no dumb questions. Only silly answers.

Cheers,

Sirhr.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I'll counter the whole Harbor Freight crowd here by saying
A cheap wrench isn't always better than no wrench.

I was of the same impression when I started out. I needed one to torque action screws and scope mounts, so I got the HF one for around $20. When it came, it wasn't even zeroed out. I don't recall what it was set on, but it was not zeroed, and probably like that for God knows how long. So I check it out and seemed to work fine. One day I upgraded to a USO and got some better rings as well. Everything came and I went to mount it up. As I tightened the first ring to the base, I didn't get a click....no click...no click...SHNAP!! ruined brand new rings. Good thing Warne has good CS. HF sure doesnt.

It's your money, but I wish I had bought a FAT for $50.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: beltfed74</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Wont apply to stocks but Badger has a good "Im too cheap to buy a torque wrench" system to tightening rings and bases. </div></div>

confused, what won't apply to stocks?

</div></div>

They tell you to tighten the ring and base screws(8-40/6-40) about as tight as you can get holding the small end of the allen wrench and the 1/2 screws 90 degrees past finger tight. I think thats the way it goes, its posted places on the net if you want to google it.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I've always went by once the bolt stops, go 1/8 a turn then quit. I do that on everything
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

i am all about harbor freight too, but not for this wrench. one guy said he returned 4. thats too much. sears is in every town and they have several to choose from
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I've always just used my fingers to tighten the various screws. IMHO (and it is quite humble compared to the experience of some on here admittedly), there is a happy torque zone between not-tight-enough-to-withstand-recoil and not-even-god-could-remove-this-screw. This zone is easy to feel (for me at least) with a standard 2-3 inch hex or torque key, and I'm pretty sure I can apply a similar amount of torque fairly consistently.

There may be benefits to having exactly 65 in lbs or whatever of torque on your various scope mounting screws, but I and my rifles can shoot straight enough without such precision. The exception to that might be action screws, although my reservation applies there too.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

i use the fatwrench and it seems to work decently... atleast im happy with the results
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Vermonter please excuse the dumb asses on here that think they know everything, must be a bunch of dump ass cops. I would buy a cheap torque wrench from harbor freight. All your going to do is tighten some screws on a gun or scope. It would be better than nothing. Don't buy a expensive tool that will be dead nutz. Your looking for consistancy more that dead on a certain number.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

I've been using a harbor freight click-type torque wrench for a while now. Once my enlistment is up in July and I go over to the contracting side, I'll likely spring for some of the seekonk t-handles, but only because I'll have a nice income shift and won't be constrained as much financially.
wink.gif
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 260aics</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Vermonter please excuse the dumb asses on here that think they know everything, must be a bunch of dump ass cops. I would buy a cheap torque wrench from harbor freight. All your going to do is tighten some screws on a gun or scope. It would be better than nothing. Don't buy a expensive tool that will be dead nutz. Your looking for consistancy more that dead on a certain number. </div></div>

While I still think his first sentence is pinnacle of ignorance. I am going to change my tune and say that in this situation he is 100% right about the torque wrench.

If you're pissing and moaning about the cost of a $20 wrench vs. a $100 wrench....or whether to buy one at all, you probably have a rifle to match these spending habits. Just spare all of us the pain when you want to ask how to push your Remmy 710 out to beyond a thousand.

Garbage in Garbage out
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

Just tighten the f&@ckin screws by feel. How did any of us make it through life without properly torqing every screw we came across? Gun screws are no different.

Small screws use small wrenches and big screws use big ones, the rest will pretty much work itself out. It just needs to be tight enough to do the job and not come loose. I'm confident you can manage.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pointblank4445</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If there are torque specs for something there is probably a reason.

So, get off your lazy ass and go and buy or borrow a freaking torque wrench. Consider what it will cost you when you torque the head right off of a screw and you have to repair, replace or both.

I'll end with that before I start with the name calling. </div></div>

A tool for a tool.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?


I consider myself a new guy's advocate here on the hide. If you'll ignore rude, confrontational, and asinine comments here on the hide you can learn TON's of things on this subject, and shooting in general. It's individuals that give those responses, it's not the rule of thumb for this site as a whole.

For torque: yeah, using a torque specific tool is the best way, but you might be a total broke ass like myself and have to choose whether you have a torque wrench, or ammo, but don't have the $ for both like me!

If you don't go the wrench route, just "snug" everything up after you have oiled the threads and if you can put a dab of grease under the bolt/screw HEADS as this is where the vast bulk of the friction occurs.
Your better off to go a little light than too tight when going by feel to tighten a fastener. Oiled threads & greased head give the best possible feel.

I'm happy to help anyway I can. Don't let the jerks run you off.
Tres <-- Machinist & The new guy's advocate here on the Hide.
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Vermonter</div><div class="ubbcode-body">People need to calm down. I am pretty new to torquing things down myself. I just was wondering about an alternative method/trick that would give me something a little more precise than just winging it, using the things I have around the house. I am not looking for a spoon fed answer, just some hints from more experienced shooters. Harbor Freight looks like a good buy, and I will most likely buying one. Even though I won't need it that often, I realize I will need it more than once. Thanks to those who actually helped, not so much from the people being jackasses. </div></div>

I am by no means the most experienced shooter out there, but I have a lot of experience with tools. Trying to "correctly" torque a screw/nut/bolt without a torque wrench is like trying to drive a screw with a hammer: the result will not be good.
There may be some experienced guys out there who can "torque to feel", but that feel is gained from experience,and I'm sure they broke more than a few screws in the process of gaining that experience.
The bottom line is, if you're going to get into "precision" shooting, details make all the difference. You need to be as precise as possible if you hope to get the most out of your equipment. Precision = torque wrench
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 260aics</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pointblank4445</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If there are torque specs for something there is probably a reason.

So, get off your lazy ass and go and buy or borrow a freaking torque wrench. Consider what it will cost you when you torque the head right off of a screw and you have to repair, replace or both.

I'll end with that before I start with the name calling. </div></div>

A tool for a tool. </div></div>

Ah, a personal attack bearing no significance on the quote provided. Very nice, sir. I can't wait to see what other helpful contributions you provide. And I also await what cheap shit you intend to sell on post #51. Good Day
 
Re: What to use instead of torque wrench?

if you want to shoot long range on the cheap might as well give it up or play vidio games is a damm spendy sport or life there I said it wash my mouth out with soap guys but its true you can buy a nice 308 and shoot it lots and you will enjoy and get better at it but it will cost you 20 % of your paycheck in the longrun sorry
 
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