When to use a Full Length Die

[JoeBUtah]

I've been loading for my 5R Remington MilSpec (.308) for several months now and some of my brass has upwards of 4 - 5 firings: the original factory + whatever I've loaded. So far I've only used a neck die.

When should I run them through a full length die?

 

[oldfatguy]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I use a body die and bump the shoulders back when the bolt starts to get hard to close, usually after 4-5 firings.

Neck size with a Lee collet die.

OFG

 

[bward]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I bump my shoulders back .001-.002 every firing.

 

[Gene Poole]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I run mine through a modified FL die that only bumps the shoulder back to just what my chamber likes (neck is drilled out to 0.350). Experience has shown me that I'll get a few tight fitting loads after 2-3 firings so I do this every 2nd firing. I neck size with the lee collet die every reload and I anneal every 4th firing.

 

[427Cobra]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I FL everytime, every single preceived benefit of NS only is negated when you show up to the range or a match and your ammo won't chamber.

 

[BuzzBoss915]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

Well, there you go. Pick and choose. Really, the answer is; there isn't a single pat answer.

The safest plan, (for me) is to barely bump the shoulder in a full length die and don't worry about it.

Then again, I have some tight spec chambers and necks and they get Wilson bushing hand dies and it doesn't seem to matter how many cycles?

Everybody has a plan; a system that doesn't work. For Roulette, especially.
BB

 

[aqualung]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

Kind of what BB said.

I F/L size every time, because that's what my buddy who shoots F-class does. He was leading the UK F-Class league all last season, then lost the final round on countback, to come second overall.

With that in mind, I figure if it's good enough for him, it'll work for me!

Factory chamber from out of the Remington factory?? Well I'd say you don't have to go to the Nth degree to get acceptable results.

Now, if you had a speciality chamber, minimum SAAMI spec, user defined throat, blah blah blah... then I'd say take a lot more care, but factory chamber? Don't sweat it.

N

 

[ksthomas]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I FL everytime, every single preceived benefit of NS only is negated when you show up to the range or a match and your ammo won't chamber. </div></div>

Nailed it right there, and that's rock solid advice. In any form of reloading, you need to load for 1) safety, 2) reliability, and 3) accuracy, in that order. Full Length sizing doesn't reduce case life, and the vast majority of case failures will revolve around neck cracking. Head separations are caused by excessive moving of the case shoulders, and that's very easily addressed by the proper use of gages. If you're not using a gage already, start. It'll pay dividends, in both accuracy and case life, I promise.

There's some other things you can play with to enhance case life and accuracy, but Full Length sizing is your friend.

 

[fx77]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

FL every case everytime...push back shoulder .001-.002

 

[1J04]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: fx77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">FL every case everytime...push back shoulder .001-.002 </div></div>

+1 For What It's Worth. Works for me to this point. The help/advice here has given me a ton of insight and confidence. Thanks.

 

[MitchAlsup]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I have never used a FL die, When the shoulder needs a bump, I use a body die and then a NO die afterwards.

 

[JoeBUtah]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

Thanks for the input gents. As BB mentioned, there is no single answer. I haven't had any trouble chambering the rounds so far. But as someone mentioned, showing up at the range for a shoot isn't the best time to find that I do!

The reloading wish list includes some kind of headspace gauge and an ogive type of OAL measuring tool. I think Christmass is going to come a little early for me. I'll tack on a FL die as well.

Thanks again!

 

[BuzzBoss915]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

I made a mistake on an elk hunt in Colorado twenty years ago. Figured I would crimp, since the bullet had a crimping groove but I didn't check and chamber every round. Turned out I had 18 that would chamber and the rest were a little too bulged at the shoulder. Taking a long, expensive trip is not the time to find out you have ammo problems. And yes, I have no problem remembering the exact number that would fit after twenty years. Some lessons are hard, but you don't make that mistake again. BB

 

[JoeBUtah]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

So BuzzBoss- I just gotta ask: Did you fill your tag?

 

[clmayfield]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

You need a headspace gauge to do it right. I have not found FL sizing to limit case life. For me, it is always the primer pockets that go first. I have never had a case neck failure or splitting at the head. The key is to bump back just enough so that the case is about .002" smaller than your chamber.

The good news is that to determine your chamber size, you need to NO size for several firings to allow your brass to fully expand to the chamber's size. You have just done that with the brass you have now, so save a few pieces. If it is not difficult to eject the case, it is probably .001" smaller than your chamber. Bump it back to the point that is is .001" - .002" than this set of brass and you are good to go for FL sizing every time.

You can wear out your brass and reducing accuracy by sizing it too much. I suspect that people who see reduced case life with FL sizing are not setting their dies up properly. BTW... if you follow the directions for the FL sizer, you likely are not setting up your die properly. You have to measure.

 

[Short Round]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

Carter I would hazard to say that the majority of reloaders, other than here, are setting up their dies wrong and according to the maker's directions. I know I did it for years just like the directions said or partial sizing with FL dies.

Only the accuracy nuts and the enlightened are doing it our way. I remember being a bit shocked when I learned I was creating an 8 thousandths headspace gap in my .308 with my RCBS FL dies. But I was following the instructions!

 

[VKC]

Re: When to use a Full Length Die

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I FL everytime, every single preceived benefit of NS only is negated when you show up to the range or a match and your ammo won't chamber. </div></div>

I agree, plus if you have a custom gun with tight chambers, FL resizing doesn't bump back excessively.