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Where are we at with ATF banning braces?

30calDeath

30calDeath

Sergeant
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Minuteman
Aug 23, 2010
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North Idaho
I'd like to form1 my PCC and get rid of the brace on my PCC, if the AFT wants us to register them doesn't that have something to do with form1? I'm just trying to get a free tax stamp outta this honestly. Not sure if that's possible just heard it being discussed before, maybe I'm way off the mark here? Wasn't the AFT supposed to come out saying something by years end?
 
All I can say is that a date has not been formally announced to the FFL community, but we're often the last to know.

In my opinion, this event is highly likely to turn both the Form 1 and Form 4 process into a complete shit show, as the system will not be able to accommodate a few million applications.

If you're looking to SBR your rig, do so right now, pay your $200, and hopefully you can enjoy a <1 month turnaround on the application. My last F1 application was approved in 7 calendar days. That won't happen for months or years after the brace ruling passes.
 
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I don't own any braces, but I'm waiting for the bait and switch. Remember 41P? Turned into 41F and most of us got really screwed
 
30calDeath said:
I'd like to form1 my PCC and get rid of the brace on my PCC, if the AFT wants us to register them doesn't that have something to do with form1? I'm just trying to get a free tax stamp outta this honestly. Not sure if that's possible just heard it being discussed before, maybe I'm way off the mark here? Wasn't the AFT supposed to come out saying something by years end?
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I have a buddy who tracks this constantly and he said sometime in December is what he is expecting.
 
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I started the form 1 for the one A.R. pistol that I have… That was made as a pistol from the manufacturer… and I had them cancel it.

Apparently, if you remove the pistol brace, then there is no longer a question as to whether or not it’s an SBR. So I removed the pistol brace that came with the unit and now I believe it’s no longer an issue.

Done.
 
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For peace of mind and my point of view, do the form 1 now. I read that if the pistol is declared an SBR, legally you can't form 1 an "existing" SBR and the only legal path is an amnesty letter. If they are unable to process these form 4's, taking 7-9 months now, how are they going to manage millions of fm 1's?
 
what braces I don't see no stinking braces I know nothing , nothing .
 
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mark5pt56 said:
For peace of mind and my point of view, do the form 1 now. I read that if the pistol is declared an SBR, legally you can't form 1 an "existing" SBR and the only legal path is an amnesty letter. If they are unable to process these form 4's, taking 7-9 months now, how are they going to manage millions of fm 1's?
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you can take the brace off and throw it away. and magically you have a legal pistol again. Like we all did prior to about 2012? i dont know when Sig braces first cursed us with their presence.
 
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I can’t wait for all of the screaming at the moon that occurs when pistol brace owners realize that; 1) The 4999 form is just a self incrimination worksheet and no matter what they do they will still be regarded as having an illegal SBR and 2) there will not be any ‘free tax stamp’ that comes from this for anyone.

The only answer that we actually have at the moment is that the final rule has not been published, and there is zero clarity until that happens- or doesn’t happen.
 
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I think you’ll find that the majority of brace owners will disappear them one way or another though because they aren’t going to want to pay the tax stamp and SBR because most of them have them to avoid that in the first place. There will likely still be enough people who want to keep their setups and be legal that it will clog of NFA’s system though. So if you want to form 1 I wouldn’t wait until it goes into effect.
 
It's estimated that there are 20-40 million AR style pistols with braces in circulation.

I'm willing to bet that only about 1% of those people that own the AR style pistols with braces even know about the proposed rule.

My AR pistol friends didn't know anything about this until I informed them.

Most gunowners buy a firearm and shoot it a few times then put it in the back of the gun closet or safe and forget about it for a while. About once per year, they will take it out and shoot it at a public range or private one when invited.

Watch the hue and cry go up when several of these "uninformed" pistol brace owners get into trouble and find themselves charged with a felony.

First they came for the machine guns but I did not own a machine gun and did not speak up.
Then they came for the bump stocks but I did not own a bump stock and did not speak up.
Then they came for the "high capacity" magazines but I did not own a "high capacity" magazine and did not speak up.
Then they came for my AR-15 pistol with arm brace. Now there's nobody to speak up for me.
 
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E. Bryant said:
All I can say is that a date has not been formally announced to the FFL community, but we're often the last to know.

In my opinion, this event is highly likely to turn both the Form 1 and Form 4 process into a complete shit show, as the system will not be able to accommodate a few million applications.

If you're looking to SBR your rig, do so right now, pay your $200, and hopefully you can enjoy a <1 month turnaround on the application. My last F1 application was approved in 7 calendar days. That won't happen for months or years after the brace ruling passes.
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10-4! I will do that, thanks for the heads up.
 
wade2big said:
Discussing how to roll over even before your masters and their hired guns with a badge threaten you with imprisonment and death. That’s obedience right there. Back the blue in the land of the free.
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I get what you are saying but I'll be SBR'n all my stripped lowers so I'd be going form1 anyways so I guess what you are saying doesn't even apply to me, but I appreciate the kind words!
 
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Longshot231 said:
It's estimated that there are 20-40 million AR style pistols with braces in circulation.
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The number keeps growing everytime someone posts an estimate, but it's definitely not anywhere that large. The total number of ARs in circulation in the US is around 20M by MSM estimates, and I'd be surprised if braced pistols were more than a few percent of that.

They are still popular enough to be considered "in common use", and there are definitely enough to dork up the eForms system for a long time to come.
 
E. Bryant said:
The number keeps growing everytime someone posts an estimate, but it's definitely not anywhere that large. The total number of ARs in circulation in the US is around 20M by MSM estimates, and I'd be surprised if braced pistols were more than a few percent of that.

They are still popular enough to be considered "in common use", and there are definitely enough to dork up the eForms system for a long time to come.
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Of your couple percent that are braced pistols, I would guess only a couple percent will form 1? So about 8000 new form 1s?

I thought it was 40-50k applications per month now? I don't think this SBR influx is going to be any more of a hindrance than tax refund money purchasers influx.
 
The whole “free tax stamp” thing came from the thought that current pistol owners could be granted amnesty through ‘voluntary’ Form 1. It was speculation and nothing more, so I highly doubt that’s what ends up happening.

But as others have said, there will be no clarification until there is clarification.
 
I don't have any pistol braced firearms, but if it's like anything else this would be a "tack on charge". For example if you rob a liquor store with a braced pistol they will charge you with all of that and then add on another charge for the firearm. I mean who after all will be sympathetic to a guy that robs a liquor store?

On the other hand if they even attempt to start charging random people for it they will lose their ass in court. I can see the defense attorney going through a school house rock video in open court explaining how a bill becomes a law.
 
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E. Bryant said:
The number keeps growing everytime someone posts an estimate, but it's definitely not anywhere that large. The total number of ARs in circulation in the US is around 20M by MSM estimates, and I'd be surprised if braced pistols were more than a few percent of that.

They are still popular enough to be considered "in common use", and there are definitely enough to dork up the eForms system for a long time to come.
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you make a good point here, and I believe that estimate came from the National Shooting Sports Foundation originally. My guess is they had AFMER data from ATF for that estimate.
 
Well, given that companies like Daniel Defense make OEM Form 1 pistols w/ braces… I’m going to assume that there are a number of pistols with braces out there.

Of course, the solution is simple… remove the brace.
 
The solution is even more simple…

Either A.) Wait and see what happens, or B.) Call your senators to vote yes on the SHORT Act (or whatever it’s called) that would eliminate all SBR/SBS/AOW’s from the NFA registry, and removes barrel length restrictions for firearms, therefore their stupid new rule change means absolutely nothing.

And yes, I know voting is pretty futile most times, but we do have the House for the next couple years, and the Dems lost their majority in the Senate thanks to Krysten Sinema leaving the Dem party to become independent, so there is a small glimmer of hope.
 
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Charger442 said:
Of your couple percent that are braced pistols, I would guess only a couple percent will form 1? So about 8000 new form 1s?

I thought it was 40-50k applications per month now? I don't think this SBR influx is going to be any more of a hindrance than tax refund money purchasers influx.
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I feel unqualified to make a good swag on compliance rate, but if you've got something like 1M braced pistols (5% of all ARs, which seems high) and there's 20% compliance rate (maybe way too high largely because normies aren't plugged into esoteric gun news), then it's 200,000 new Form 1s. Probably not catastrophic (there are approximately 2500 eForms of all type processed each day), but it could be enough to snarl up Form 1s for several months.

Generally speaking, I don't view the NFA branch as being a particularly robust system that would be tolerant of any significant disruption.
 
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alamo5000 said:
I don't have any pistol braced firearms, but if it's like anything else this would be a "tack on charge". For example if you rob a liquor store with a braced pistol they will charge you with all of that and then add on another charge for the firearm. I mean who after all will be sympathetic to a guy that robs a liquor store?
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That depends. If he was stealing their stock of Southern Comfort, I would pardon him. Then award him the Medal of Freedom.
 
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