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Where's My Working Dog Guys At?

mkollman74

Quo Vadis?
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Minuteman
  • Nov 5, 2009
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    WA, USA
    OK, so I know that what I am after is not likely to be available, but I've never been afraid to ask a silly question... I'm fairly sure we have some folks who are in the know about professional working (protection) dogs here on the site. I know that these dogs are the product of years of love, blood, sweat, and tears from their breeders/trainers. This post is not intended to show any disrespect towards nor devalue those efforts.

    I am simply not in a place to spend tens of thousands of dollars for a "varsity' canine. So, the question is - are there JV dogs out there that would suffice for me and my family. I understand that many times these dogs retire and their handler assumes ownership, but are there retired dogs that would, perhaps, work for me? I'm looking for a protective companion for my wife and two girls. Someone to go running with them, and accompany them on solo hikes, etc.

    Any wisdom from the 'Hide is appreciated.
     
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    I don't know about a potential "retired working dog" that you want to make work again - some are kind of crazy and/or may have PTSD. A good breed, lots of time spent with obedience/socialization and consistent instruction would be my suggestion.
     
    Well, I'm sure there's others here who can give some real expertise on this subject but I trained my dog. That's a huge commitment though, and it takes a ton of consistency to do it to the level you want it to be. I guess it depends on what you truly want. If you want a family dog that will know some commands and protect your family, that's one thing, and that's what I have. If you want a true guard dog for which that is his only purpose, that's something different. I'm not aware of any retired dog situation. Dogs like what you are talking about start at a very young age and are for a particular person usually. To get a legit dog like that you are going to spend several grand on a puppy then pay for training but whoever the dog is going to be commanded by has to participate in that training and know what they are doing too. Having a dog that is capable of doing serious damage or killing is a serious thing too so I'd just make sure you understand what's involved before you do it. That said, when I'm not there my dog gives me a ton of piece of mind that my family is safe. No one is going to come in my house. I'd also make damn sure your wife is ready for the kind of commitment it takes to have a dog like that. I don't think that most are honestly.

    Edit to add: I don't think I could have trained my dog if I had kids then. That was planned sort of to have him and train him before we had our first. Too much time to do that and have little kids.
     
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    I have 2 Presa Canario. Both boys, which is interesting sometimes. 🤣 They come with a naturally suspicious nature, strong owner bond and incredibly intelligent. I'm not sure your exact circumstances, but I highly recommend these. My girlfriend takes both of mine on walks and it would be a rare fool to look sideways at them.

    I've also had a Bordeaux/pitbull and that dog would fight a concrete block if you moved it too quickly. But absolutely gentle with kids and a great dog overall! Any of the Mastiff breeds are highly recommended for visual and auditory deterrence. Having witnessed them fend off the odd misbehaved dog at the park, they also hold up their end of the bargain when it comes to business.

    Well that's more than I planned to write! PM if you want any details or info.

    D
     
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    Great Pyrenees
    Stealth protector.
    Does not look like a protector type dog, is really good with children.
    Never raise your voice (or hand) to someone that owns one, they are very loyal to their *family* if not mis-treated.
    Well documented for taking down bear, cougar, wolf, bad people, etc.
     
    Might be wrong. But after owning one German Shepard I'm done with "aggressive" dogs. She is a constant worry about what she worries about. She is my wife's dog, so she is automatically in the family. My dog is a Chesapeake and earns everything he has. He is my boy and defends his flock, but is docile.

    I hesitate to say anything as it's what everyone who owns an aggressive dog says. "My dog isn't like the rest"
     
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    I think these sorts of conversations need to be taken with several grains of salt. What are your expectations for the dog? What about your wife’s/kid’s? Budget? Well trained dogs are not a cheap investment but in my opinion, well worth it, depending on your use.

    I come from a pointing, bird dog perspective, but have some experience in other working dog types with my Rottie girl. Working dogs are just that, they need a job, and people who put in the time to let em work at the very least. Perishable skills, just like riding a bike or shooting.
     
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    @BLKWLFK9

    My .02

    Got me a working line German Shepard, worked with him a bunch as a pup, great family dog, his protective instincts do the rest. Never did any type of protective training with him, just taught him to obey 100%.

    Most people don’t want to mess with a 110lb GSD
     
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    How about Belgian Malinois ( Alias - Fur Missile, Maligator, GSD on Crack)? I have 2. Like GSD they have a natural instinct to protect but you must have sound obedience otherwise they can be a handful. My opinion is to get an 8-10 week old pup and train it to be a member of the family. They like to chew so make sure they have plenty of chew toys. This is what I did and never had anything destroyed. One word of caution, pups claws and teeth are like needles and you are the pin cushion. You will have marks on your arms for awhile and coworkers will have fun giving you shit. Just thought you should know if you have children. Last word, make sure you read up and view as many videos as you can to see if this is the breed for you.
     
    I'd suspect you don't have what it takes to take on a retired "working" dog. Sorry but even "retired" dogs need a person committed to their needs.

    My son had a Cane Corso that he got from a family that didn't know what they bought. Dog was a brute that needed a controlling hand (not in an abusive way).
    I have a family friend that has a Belgian Malinois he trained himself from day one. He's constantly asked by Law Enforcement to sell the dog. Dog is treated better than most children I suspect. He even bought a SUV just to have the comfort for the dog when he goes out.
    Another fella I spoke to was a retired LEO with his retired dog. Said the dog is still "in training" to be used to civilian life. The LEO wasn't comfortable yet to have people approach the dog or himself while out in town.

    My honest suggestion: Go volunteer anywhere that you can find that gets you close to "working dogs". That way you honestly know what you are getting into. Then get the family into the same mindset. Your spouse and kids need to know it's not a pet.
     
    Something I think none of us have asked. What level of protection do you want? Hell, a large barking dog will stop most people cold. Ask me how I know. I've seen a lot of people's butts pucker up so tight they crapped out a diamond from that piece of coal because of my mals barks. If you want bite please understand your responsibilities and liabilities. Find a trainer that knows what he's doing to train you and the dog together. Even for obedience with a working dog you need to be trained if you don't have experience with a working dog.
     
    Be warned about the pyrenees...
    Theyre not inside dogs... ever.

    God hasnt built a fence that can hold one, they drool rivers and shed blankets of fur.
    Smarter than they seem, but train differently, they always have a will of their own, and will do as they see best.

    Youll also never have a coyote/racoon problem.
     
    Great Pyrenees
    Stealth protector.
    Does not look like a protector type dog, is really good with children.
    Never raise your voice (or hand) to someone that owns one, they are very loyal to their *family* if not mis-treated.
    Well documented for taking down bear, cougar, wolf, bad people, etc.
     
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    As for working GSDs or Mals trained on bite work, I haven't seen many that would make a good house pet. The bond between the K9 and handler is strong and the costs are high due to the amount of training for both needed.

    I believe you would be better off to find a puppy from a good line and start fresh with a local trainer.
     
    if you’re really interested in going the malinois route, get in contact with “secondchancek9.com”. it’s a rescue organization ran by a retired green beret k9 handler, travis hall. he does great work rescuing and rehoming mal’s. super nice guy that doesn’t mind giving you all the info you will need concerning owning a malinois.
     
    Does my dog protect me?

    No, she doesn't carry a gun, nor does she have opposable thumbs.

    I carry the gun and she watches and listens for things that she percieves to be a threat.

    She's (DNA tested) 1/4 German wirehair, 1/4 Great Pyrenees and her mother was full blooded pit bull.

    At 85lbs, (4.5 years old now) she's not the biggest in her litter. That's reserved for this guy:
    FB_IMG_1540685928108_1540685957826.jpg

    ^^^^^ That's Ziggy at 6 months and 92lbs. He's sweet and about as smart as he looks. 🙂


    The Pyrenees part of her:

    20210706_092719.jpg


    20190708_102728.jpg



    The Wirehair part of her:

    20210509_184351.jpg


    The Pittie part of her is her sweet disposition with a desire to bark and growl at people that come near the door or close to us.

    If someone goes by on a bicycle, she usually ignores them.
    Walkers are carefully watched and assessed while she lays.
    Runners get her full attention and she's on her feet.

    At night time, thankfully, she only barks when she hears or sees something.
    Most of the night is spent by the front door. The closer it gets to morning she'll mosey her way to our bedroom door.


    One of the biggest issues with any dog is the family members.
    That's right, the family members cause most of the training and behavior problems with dogs.
    Dogs need to be trained and their commands, whether verbal or hand signals need to be consistent from person to person. Good luck getting everyone on board with that.
    I could go on and on with issues we've had, but suffice to say, I've had to shut down more issues with the kids than with the dog. Kids will do shit they think is harmless fun and cause the dog to misbehave.

    Get everyone on board the same train
     
    I'd get a Mal pup and raise it as a family companion. But please don't get one if you expect it to lounge around all day while you watch tv. They need work and lots of it. Mines sitting here in my office staring at me with ball in mouth and we were just outside 30 minutes ago.
     
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    There are programs to adopt retired working dogs. Some discipline is required, these dogs need jobs whether it is a run in the morning and force fetching during the day to patrolling the pastures later in the afternoons with more force fetching (my Catahoula loves fetch (not a mil working dog but another high drive working breed)). They need jobs to occupy them, they need attention and a lot of it.
    Setting boundaries and being consistent is key imo.
    With all that, I would love to have one. I loved those working dogs in Afghanistan. Whenever I was in a shitty mood in Afghanistan I could go to the kennels and the handlers would let me throw the ball for them. Since then Mal's always hold a special place in my heart.
     
    Try to not take this the wrong way.

    If you're asked here about dogs, then you are not the person to own a Mal or a GS or any other "handful" type of dog. Save yourself a shit ton of trouble and regret.

    Get your wife a lovable lab or something. Labs are a handful as well, but they're a quantum leap below a maligator.

    Ive had dogs my whole life. Never lived without one. I've a Mal right now that does search and rescue work. I love him to death. He's a great worker and would savagely defend my family. He's also the biggest asshole I've ever met and requires constant attention to just be at a manageable level. That manageable level would be considered absurd in someone else's home. I say manageable because he used to be worse, and then s is where we settled. He'll be 5 soon

    Edit to add a bit more: There's no such thing as relaxed. He's pegged at the redline or slightly below at all times. He does sleep but his dreams are likely at 600 frames per second.

    Mals have that GS vocal whiney shit as well.

    Again, I love my dog, but the work I put into them s one I'll not repeat again
     
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    OK, so I know that what I am after is not likely to be available, but I've never been afraid to ask a silly question... I'm fairly sure we have some folks who are in the know about professional working (protection) dogs here on the site. I know that these dogs are the product of years of love, blood, sweat, and tears from their breeders/trainers. This post is not intended to show any disrespect towards nor devalue those efforts.

    I am simply not in a place to spend tens of thousands of dollars for a "varsity' canine. So, the question is - are there JV dogs out there that would suffice for me and my family. I understand that many times these dogs retire and their handler assumes ownership, but are there retired dogs that would, perhaps, work for me? I'm looking for a protective companion for my wife and two girls. Someone to go running with them, and accompany them on solo hikes, etc.

    Any wisdom from the 'Hide is appreciated.

    I'm near sure from your question that you would NOT want you think you want.
    It's going to be a pretty bad idea to get what you are thinking of and may wind up having bad consequences for your family.

    Since you mentioned that your wife and daughters like to go running & on long hikes, I'm going to suggest that getting 2 or 3 Rhodesian Ridgebacks would actually be a good fit.

    IF:
    You make sure to get at least 2 of them
    You plan to have them live in the house with you as part of the household, sleep with you, hang around you etc.
    You will get them as puppies and train them well
    You will be sure to socialize them around humans to a great extent from the time they are puppies going forward.
    You, your wife and your daughters all are fit, in good shape, can exercise and run hard, and have a decent amount of strength.
    You can devote plenty of time each day to being with them.
    All of your family are on the same page with being consistent with training, commands and positive behaviour reinforcement.
    You are comfortable with big dogs and are not going to be scared by big dogs, and are able to confidently play with them.
    You don't have any cats or other small animals or smaller dogs that will be in your house / yard
    You have a decent back yard with a good high fence and can put in a large dog door so they can go in and out as needed.
    You understand that food, medicine, vet bills and such will not be cheap due to the size of the dogs.
    You understand that they will have a 9 to 12 year lifespan (unless you are really an outlying case).
    You understand that for large, heavy dogs, you need to have plenty of soft cushions or mattresses or such for them to lay on as lying on hard surfaces for a long time will cause them problems.
    They don't tend to like confined spaces and tend to be more comfortable with as much open space around them as possible.

    The positives if all the above fit:
    They make great house dogs, their short hair means minimal mess.
    They can almost house train themselves if given free access to a dog door and outside
    They only bark for the most part if something out of the ordinary catches their attention
    They are safe to be around and highly unlikely to ever hurt you or your friends / guests / visitors you introduce.
    (note that rough play with a big dog is going to give you a few scratches just because humans are thin skinned and nails scratch it. Also if you hand feed them you have to understand and pay attention so you don't still have your fingers in their mouth when they go to start chewing the food).
    They are very loyal and courageous, and will naturally want to protect you and put themselves between you and any perceived threat.
    They are very intelligent and learn commands and routines well.
    Typical of the large hound breeds, they play / exercise hard then crash hard when done, so you don't need to worry about them being always on like many of the shepherd breeds.
    They are very affectionate (especially the males) and will love to curl up in bed with you or sit beside you on the couch.

    If your wife and daughters are out running or hiking with 3 of them and at least 1 or 2 are intact males, chances are nothing you'd come across will get through them.
    (now if you are expecting a complete wolf pack to attack you or a Grizzly bear, then you best be carrying guns, or having a whole pack of some much more dangerous dogs with you, that have armoured collar plates on).
     
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    Try to not take this the wrong way.

    If you're asked here about dogs, then you are not the person to own a Mal or a GS or any other "handful" type of dog. Save yourself a shit ton of trouble and regret.

    Get your wife a lovable lab or something. Labs are a handful as well, but they're a quantum leap below a maligator.

    Ive had dogs my whole life. Never lived without one. I've a Mal right now that does search and rescue work. I love him to death. He's a great worker and would savagely defend my family. He's also the biggest asshole I've ever met and requires constant attention to just be at a manageable level. That manageable level would be considered absurd in someone else's home. I say manageable because he used to be worse, and then s is where we settled. He'll be 5 soon

    Edit to add a bit more: There's no such thing as relaxed. He's pegged at the redline or slightly below at all times. He does sleep but his dreams are likely at 600 frames per second.

    Mals have that GS vocal whiney shit as well.

    Again, I love my dog, but the work I put into them s one I'll not repeat again
    That's exactly right. That's why I said what I did and others have said the same. It's a huge commitment to have a large working breed dog. My Akita is 150lbs, well he's 149 last time at the vet. You have to have a dog like that well trained or you just have a walking lawsuit. Mals are bad ass dogs, but are higher energy than Akitas. It's really serious commitment to get a dog like that and if you are gone a good amount your wife had better be as all about it as you are, or you are just going to have a problem dog and a problem wife too.

    The amount of time I put into that dog in the first 2 years is just ridiculous, and he went everywhere with me for 2 years to do it. That's not an easy thing to do, but it's required. I can't stress the wife situation enough. A lot of guys think they will get the dog snd train it and many do, but then they leave the dog at home when they are gone and the wife can't deal with it because the wife wasn't in on all the training. My wife was with it.... until we had kids. That shit went out the window when we had our first. Fortunately, I have a lower energy dog but it's very very difficult for a female to deal with a 150 lb or a 80 lb dog by themselves if the dog doesn't want to do something. We also have rules for when dad is gone about how things are done. It's just a whole lifestyle commitment that I don't think most are really ready for.
     
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    I don’t have any direct experience here, just an anecdote from a friend of mine. His family just moved to the mountains outside Denver and now has to worry about his kids being lunch for the critters roaming the area. There’s a world class German Shepard breeder in the area so they put a deposit down and got a female puppy(probably a year ago now) with the intent of sending her to all the classes to turn her into the kids’ guardian. After about 6 months he said it was obvious she wouldn’t need much training to be exactly what they wanted, she naturally watched after the kids and would protect them from anything.

    Maybe just get a working dog puppy and send them to a few basic training classes. That’s kind of what I’d like to do, just haven’t gotten to it yet.
     
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    The best bang for your buck and one that wont make you want to shoot your dog and then yourself, would be getting a barky little dog that will bark if they hear a gnat fart. That alerts you so that you can do the protecting. Im telling you now, if you haven't/wont listen to the podcast i posted, you do NOT want a true working dog nor a dog that feels comfortable putting teeth on people. If you can't afford the $10K-25k professionally selected and trained dog or if you dont want to make dog training a life engrossing hobby, then dont do it. I trained dogs (PSD's dual and single purpose/personal protection dogs/bite sport dogs) for years and still have working dogs. Only reason is b/c i know wtf im doing and what to expect. Major is 9 years old and still full of piss and vinegar and gets his ass kicked weekly by me for doing some dumbass puppy shit. Get a dog that is the least liability as possible, one that fits your day to day lifestyle, and one that loves your family and your family will love it.

    We just got a new puppy 2 weeks ago. A miniature schnauzer. She is cool as fuck, small, easy, fun, etc.. All of the things working dogs aren't. Get something cool, dude; not something you will soon regret.
     
    Try to not take this the wrong way.

    If you're asked here about dogs, then you are not the person to own a Mal or a GS or any other "handful" type of dog. Save yourself a shit ton of trouble and regret.

    Get your wife a lovable lab or something. Labs are a handful as well, but they're a quantum leap below a maligator.

    Ive had dogs my whole life. Never lived without one. I've a Mal right now that does search and rescue work. I love him to death. He's a great worker and would savagely defend my family. He's also the biggest asshole I've ever met and requires constant attention to just be at a manageable level. That manageable level would be considered absurd in someone else's home. I say manageable because he used to be worse, and then s is where we settled. He'll be 5 soon

    Edit to add a bit more: There's no such thing as relaxed. He's pegged at the redline or slightly below at all times. He does sleep but his dreams are likely at 600 frames per second.

    Mals have that GS vocal whiney shit as well.

    Again, I love my dog, but the work I put into them s one I'll not repeat again
    I like labs but they can be pains in the rear sometimes.

    It ultimately comes down to what you want and the energy you can put forward to working your dog to give it a good quality of life.

    If something happened to my crazy Catahoula I would probably look for another Catahoula, Rhodesian Ridgeback or Belgium Malinois. I really enjoy a high energy, high drive dog as long as I can direct and control that drive.

    I currently have three dogs one is my Catahoula that is an amazing little kiddo and is like a bull in a china shop, he is a lot of fun and my running buddy. My other one is a Malinois/Lab 50/50 cross, super smart, actually too darn smart, protective, plotting, and has the worst traits of both a lab and a malinois but still a very loyal kiddo (to a fault) that can't let me out of his sight most of the time (separation anxiety). When he is with me, he watches me and watches who is around me (he is very protective). He has had to slow down because of his hips.
    My third dog is an Alaskan village/sled dog, she is just crazy. But, she could pull a light leader sled with a 150lb man for miles by herself when she was younger.
     
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    Here's my 2. The one sitting is a rescue and she will be 7 next month. I got her 4/21 and is extremely chilled. I think she just appreciates a good home with food and treats. It was obvious she had training and is a good alarm system. I know she will defend. So she stays home and has the job of guard and protect the house and wife. The one on the bench is almost 2-1/2yr intact male. I got him when he was 10 weeks in 4/20. He goes everywhere with me and has the job of guarding my truck during the day while out on calls. He does his job well and has startled some people. If you are serious about going down this path I will recommend a few books you read first - Schutzhund Obedience Training in Drive by Sheila Booth, Der Schutzhund (The Protection Dog) by Helmut Raiser translation by Armin Winkler, Team Dog by Mike Ritland. After that find a good trainer of working dogs, not the local pet training foo foo dog school. These are great animals to have and if you have the time/commitment for them they are a joy. But please know what you are getting into.
     

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    Great Pyrenees
    Stealth protector.
    Does not look like a protector type dog, is really good with children.
    Never raise your voice (or hand) to someone that owns one, they are very loyal to their *family* if not mis-treated.
    Well documented for taking down bear, cougar, wolf, bad people, etc.
    Very hard to keep contained, need large acreage to roam.
     
    A dog is only as good as the amount of time you're willing to invest. I trained a German shepherd one time, 4-30-45 minute sessions a day for 5 . months. Best dog I ever had. Others were taught rules and boundaries, but didn't have the time to devote full training. They watched over my grandkids, the female would herd them, and no running allowed, lol.
    I currently have 2 rescue rottweilers that are gentile giants, look intimidating in the yard, but the only command they respond to is come.
     
    I have a pair of giant schnauzer males, absolutely a fantastic dog for what you’re looking for. Very smart and easy to train. extremely athletic and loyal as any dog on the planet. Plus no shedding, but you will need to have them groomed regularl.
     
    Might be wrong. But after owning one German Shepard I'm done with "aggressive" dogs. She is a constant worry about what she worries about. She is my wife's dog, so she is automatically in the family. My dog is a Chesapeake and earns everything he has. He is my boy and defends his flock, but is docile.

    I hesitate to say anything as it's what everyone who owns an aggressive dog says. "My dog isn't like the rest"
    I have owned many, from German Shepherds to beagles to border collies to black labs and the mutts in between.

    German Shepherds are the true nanny dogs and will protect your kids as their own. They will create a special bond to the strongest member of the family as they are a their Alpha pack leader. In my case growing up that was my mom.

    You didn't fuck with me as a kid with the German Shepherd around, she was literally a life saver. Later as an adult, my lab mix was the same way as he was a black Old Yeller.

    Stay away from the pits or pitbull mixes.
     
    Sigh….. I can already hear the haters flaming but.

    A pit bull…..

    Medium size and short fur. Shedding minimal, inside dog with a big bark. Extremely family oriented. The size, muscular build and huge jaw muscles stop people in there tracks. They don’t drop huge horse size piles of shit and take less feed.

    If you get one get a rescue puppy. GET A PUPPY!!! TRAIN AND SOCIAL IT! Make sure plenty of kids play with it. THIS IS IMPORTANT.

    We have had 3. Our 2nd ( pit ) has been the best family dog out of the 10 dogs we have had ( not all pits ).

    A few things I’ll add here specific to the ones we have had.

    These dogs will cue off from you. If you take off after something they will too. Be aware and cautious about this. The dog is a dog and can misinterpret things. This is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY AND FAULT IF IT HAPPENS. Spend time with and train them. I’ll give a few examples.

    One of our cats bit my daughter hard enough to draw blood. I went after the cat fast and hard chasing her. The dog saw this as a cue and joined the chase. He got to her first and I though he has going to eat the cat. Any other time before or after that he was completely fine with the cat. ( Our first pit ). He is by nature extremely submissive and passive. If you raised your voice at him he would go sit in a corner or piss himself. My point here is he was not aggressive at all until he saw her get injured and me go after the cat.

    Pit #2.

    She was about a year old when we got pit #3 as a puppy. After a few weeks they had an extremely solid bond between them. If our oldest dog ( Brittany ) got too rough with the puppy she would stand between them with her head dropped lower in a submissive type stance. ( Kinda like asking the Brittany to please stop or ease up ). She is very protective of the puppy.
    Now with that in mind, the puppy, being a puppy, decided it was going to stick its head between some stair railing and got stuck. The puppy freaks barking and whining ( in distress ), my wife runs upstairs, both my girls run to the puppy as do I. The older pit gets there as everyone is trying to get the freaked out puppy unstuck. The dog cues. And bites. THE PUPPY. The puppy she loves and protects. She interpreted us attacking the puppy and adds her support to the cause and she got an opening. Wife is pissed. Kids are pissed. I was not. She served the role we wanted her to. Protect the family. She just misinterpreted the situation. I corrected her in her mistake ie exerted my dominance as being the alpha of the pack that attacking a member of the pack will not be tolerated.

    Point being. Dogs are dogs and it’s our responsibility to train and teach the behavior we want.

    #2 is smart. She knows how to open doors. Kinda funny to use and our guests. Not so funny to the ups and postman. I have found the delivery drivers frozen halfway up our driveway in a stare down with the dog.
    You see, she is smart. She will sit at the door and wait until they are halfway to the door before she opens it and runs outside. That way the are well with the electric underground fence. She will the run out there and sit about 10-15 feet in front of them. Hilarious to us….not so much to the delivery guy. Now the fedex driver is s different story. He just keeps walking towards her and starts talking to her. Drops off the package and pets her. ( He has been told she is friendly and to just ignore her but be mindful of her tongue and tail because she will jump and lick him. )

    Last example..

    All 3 puts seems to like to sleep under the covers at night. They will rotate sometimes at night from the 2 kids beds and ours. #2 was under our covers one night. About 2am a cat knocked something over that made a big bang that woke me up. The dog went into full whoop ass mode. I have never seen a dog clear the covers off the bed and hit the floor as fast as her. Full out loud as she could barking a few time and running as fast as she could. Her first stop, kid #1 bed room for a quick sweep. From there through the family room and through the kitchen ( about this time I have made it out of need a d to the hallway) then straight down the stairs to kid #2’s bedroom and to sweep the basement. She then runs back upstairs to the front door and waited for me to open it as she whined. Out the front door and did a security sweep around the house then back inside and straight back under the covers. This was a truly impressive sight to see and a surprise to me that she was that thorough.

    Btw. I got these 2 pits for the exact same reason you are. To protect my 2 girls and wife.

    Oh yeah. And when we go on hikes or walking in crowds you would be amazed at how the crowds make room for you based purely off the muscular build and look of the dogs.

    Anyways. Enough from me.

    Best of luck in your choice.
     

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    I'd suspect you don't have what it takes to take on a retired "working" dog. Sorry but even "retired" dogs need a person committed to their needs.

    My son had a Cane Corso that he got from a family that didn't know what they bought. Dog was a brute that needed a controlling hand (not in an abusive way).
    I have a family friend that has a Belgian Malinois he trained himself from day one. He's constantly asked by Law Enforcement to sell the dog. Dog is treated better than most children I suspect. He even bought a SUV just to have the comfort for the dog when he goes out.
    Another fella I spoke to was a retired LEO with his retired dog. Said the dog is still "in training" to be used to civilian life. The LEO wasn't comfortable yet to have people approach the dog or himself while out in town.

    My honest suggestion: Go volunteer anywhere that you can find that gets you close to "working dogs". That way you honestly know what you are getting into. Then get the family into the same mindset. Your spouse and kids need to know it's not a pet.
    I too have a friend with a Cane Corso; they're somewhat new to the USA and it was a rescue. But, you really have to be dominant. Said owner not dominant and that dog has serious (had?) problems with basic commands and was more stubborn than a mule. Kinda ugly too. But, I dare say it would mess you up if it charged you - no doubt.

    Glad to see nobody is recommending a Doberman...one of only breeds that truly scares me. So, so unpredictable (of the one's I've stumbled across in life sure seemed that way).

    Speaking of Pit Bulls. When my Labrador was living with his first rescuer I was visiting (a friend rescued it). Lab had a pit bull mix living with him too. One night I was trying to go to the bathroom; but door was shut. I opened door and the dogs who were on the bed came at me like I was their favorite treat. Who was leading the pack? The Lab. I was completely shocked by that. And once I took him, he definitely had some characteristics of a protector.

    But, yes, I know...the kind of defense you get from a Labrador would be for them to tell the bad guy robbing your house where the safe is, or perhaps distract them enough by demanding to be pet and given treats that you can get a bead on the intruder.
     
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    Skip the retired dogs. Usually they are sent home with their partner, or put down. A carefully bred and selected American Bulldog, Boxer, or large Labradoodle, among others, will have those characteristics. I had a Boxer/American Bulldog mix, that was the most intelligent, protective, sweetest, most playful dog I've ever known. At 75lbs, muscles rippling, he was intimidating, but not truly aggressive. There are lots of breeds that fit your bill, but dogs are like a box of chocolates... Lol
     
    try to find and join a schutzhund or related club or group. learn to judge and handle that type of dog. all breeds vary somewhat and they're all dogs. decide what you want/need and be prepared to spend a lot of time and thought to training. if you are going to have a dog that is going to bite or be trained or is trained to do so,then you will need very competent help as an agitator/helper aka target.
     
    You should also understand the medical commitment to a retired working dog. Normal Vet services are expensive, as the dog ages these cost can and will go up significantly. From ACL issues, back issues, osteoarthritis, dental, etc. MRI's here run $2800-3500, just standard x-rays $200-$500+. We have been dealing with a combo osteoarthritis in the elbow and foot issue with our GSD now since Dec '21. We are averaging about $600/mo without special testing, just Vet and meds, 9+/- rescue GSD.

    Our first GSD was a German import Schutzhund III that. He was brought in for a PD and wasn't aggressive enough for them. He was an unbelievable family dog. Buying him was a big stretch in 1984. Today, I wouldn't even guess.

    On the comment above on the Schnauzer's. I picked up a Mini that was lose on the street after a Christmas party one night. Our other street rescue had passed about 6 months earlier and we hadn't been able to get another dog. This little guy adopted us before we got home. I stopped to pick up food as we had given everything away. Someone started walking up behind me as I walked in the store. He went nuts barking and growling in the SUV. We had him almost 15 years. If a man walked up to my wife, he would get between them and "work" the man a few steps further away to keep distance. It was funny to watch. Most people didn't notice it. He would sit with my mom and keep her calm as she declined due to dementia. He was another incredible dog.
     
    I could never imagine trusting a pitbull with my kids. Or other people's kids. As the poster said above all it takes is 1 misunderstanding and they snap.

    I had one get aggressive with my kids while we're playing on the beach and thankfully I was there.
     
    i had a mal that was obedience trained and she was still too much. we have a 200 acre field behind the house id run her everyday. my problem was my wife has cats inside and her prey drive was just too much. i ended up finding a k9 officer who was also a dog trainer that trained her for a search and rescue dog. She was the sweetest and most loyal dog ive ever owned. wouldve been perfect if not for the POS cats in the house.
     

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    i had a mal that was obedience trained and she was still too much. we have a 200 acre field behind the house id run her everyday. my problem was my wife has cats inside and her prey drive was just too much. i ended up finding a k9 officer who was also a dog trainer that trained her for a search and rescue dog. She was the sweetest and most loyal dog ive ever owned. wouldve been perfect if not for the POS cats in the house.
    My Catahoula went blasting through the woods next to our house (about 45 acres) because he saw a cat. He had stickers all over him that I had to pick out from the thorn bushes down here. Once he launches it is almost impossible to stop him. I do various things with them to include sledding in Louisiana when we had the winter storm that also hammered Texas.
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    Lots of good advice/perspective. I think I have what I need. Those of you with experience have pretty much confirmed what I suspected. Thanks all.